*frowns*
That's rather harsh. A shame you feel that way.
Advice and Trust [NGE]
That's rather harsh. A shame you feel that way.
Cae Lumis
Chief Director of Shinra Archaeology Department
- Location
- Southern New Jersey
Personally, I'm in the middle in regards to the Rebuild Series. The Original Rebuild pretty much was a direct adaptation of the first 5 episodes of NGE (Sadly they drop poor Jet Alone, though from a narrative stand point, dropping it makes sense in order to keep flow), so story telling wise it makes sense since they had to change very little from the source material. In Rebuild 2.0, I see it as setting up the new subplots and showing that the Rebuild Series would take it's own direction towards a different ending from where the TV Show ended. This is why I forgave things such as Asuka putting far more of an attempt to be nicer towards Shinji, Shinji trying harder to be friends with Rei, and the weirdness such as the Key of Nebuchadnezzar, Golgotha Base making the Dummy Plug, the Mark.06, Mari's abrupt introduction, etc... because I trusted 3.0 would explore where these plot threads would go and provide answers (or at least vital hints with 4.0 giving the clear answers) to these mysteries.
Had 3.0 continued in a normal fashion and picked up DIRECTLY where 2.0 left off, the story ideas and concepts introduced in 2.0 might have been explored far deeper, giving a far more satisfying pay off for their introduction... and this is why I hate 3.0. It commits the sin of completely disregarding MOST of the subplots introduced in 2.0 and for inexplicable reasons changes a vast majority of the main casts traits without explaining why. I get it from a symbolic standpoint why this is done (i.e. so that we're just as clueless as Shinji is, and thus feel far more sympathetic for him and his plight/ confusion), but this carries the risk of having to not only answer for 2.0 changes (which it didn't), but having to explain the changes made in 3.0 in 4.0 (one can only hope 4.0 makes a satisfying resolution to the subplots in 2.0 AND the changes we see in 3.0... one can only hope).
In short, 3.0 made a radical change, and thus we have to put blind faith in GAINAX that they'll give us satisfying answers in the 4th movie over why things changes so much... and because they broke that trust in 3.0 by changing what they started in 2.0 drastically, it's hard to put faith in them (and by extension Anno) in doing just that.
Had 3.0 continued in a normal fashion and picked up DIRECTLY where 2.0 left off, the story ideas and concepts introduced in 2.0 might have been explored far deeper, giving a far more satisfying pay off for their introduction... and this is why I hate 3.0. It commits the sin of completely disregarding MOST of the subplots introduced in 2.0 and for inexplicable reasons changes a vast majority of the main casts traits without explaining why. I get it from a symbolic standpoint why this is done (i.e. so that we're just as clueless as Shinji is, and thus feel far more sympathetic for him and his plight/ confusion), but this carries the risk of having to not only answer for 2.0 changes (which it didn't), but having to explain the changes made in 3.0 in 4.0 (one can only hope 4.0 makes a satisfying resolution to the subplots in 2.0 AND the changes we see in 3.0... one can only hope).
In short, 3.0 made a radical change, and thus we have to put blind faith in GAINAX that they'll give us satisfying answers in the 4th movie over why things changes so much... and because they broke that trust in 3.0 by changing what they started in 2.0 drastically, it's hard to put faith in them (and by extension Anno) in doing just that.
- Location
- United States
I still haven't watched 3.0 myself (though I do know what happens). I want to wait until the last movie comes out, on the off chance that it doesn't have a horribly depressing end. It's taking a huge risk I suppose. But I just can't bear the thought of watching 3.0 knowing what kind of note it ends on.
I had the same hesitancy in watching EOE. Though after much thought on the matter, I've decided that EOE ends on a slightly hopeful note. People can return if they want. If they don't, then they might be happy in Tangland. Shinji is reunited with Asuka, and they both have the chance to make better choices.
That being said, its going to be a long journey for both of them, and anyone else who comes back. One can only hope that Instrumentality has been life changing and eye opening enough to lead to positive changes. It could be argued that anyone who chooses to return to reality might also have the willpower and strength of heart to better themselves. Shinji and Asuka of course have many issues to solve within themselves and with eachother. Asuka's frostily delivered closing comment "I feel sick/How disgusting" clearly indicates that Asuka is still (very rightfully) angry with Shinji after the 'incident in room 303' and (presumably) being strangled by him. But she did caress his face before that. Not much to go on really, but it's the closest thing to real affection she's shown Shinji. I see it as her showing him how she feels and a sign that she may be willing to be more open with him in the future. Of course, it was also meant to placate him, since he was strangling her again. Still, I think it was genuine, but her closing line was meant to show that DESPITE how she felt, she was still mad at him for what happened before, and that Shinji is not off the hook for his misdeeds against her. That's what I took from EOE anyway.
I had the same hesitancy in watching EOE. Though after much thought on the matter, I've decided that EOE ends on a slightly hopeful note. People can return if they want. If they don't, then they might be happy in Tangland. Shinji is reunited with Asuka, and they both have the chance to make better choices.
That being said, its going to be a long journey for both of them, and anyone else who comes back. One can only hope that Instrumentality has been life changing and eye opening enough to lead to positive changes. It could be argued that anyone who chooses to return to reality might also have the willpower and strength of heart to better themselves. Shinji and Asuka of course have many issues to solve within themselves and with eachother. Asuka's frostily delivered closing comment "I feel sick/How disgusting" clearly indicates that Asuka is still (very rightfully) angry with Shinji after the 'incident in room 303' and (presumably) being strangled by him. But she did caress his face before that. Not much to go on really, but it's the closest thing to real affection she's shown Shinji. I see it as her showing him how she feels and a sign that she may be willing to be more open with him in the future. Of course, it was also meant to placate him, since he was strangling her again. Still, I think it was genuine, but her closing line was meant to show that DESPITE how she felt, she was still mad at him for what happened before, and that Shinji is not off the hook for his misdeeds against her. That's what I took from EOE anyway.
- Location
- United States
Good Lord, that post snowballed a bit. It went from a comment about 3.0 and a comparison to EOE to a full ramble about my feelings on the end of EOE.
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Ranma-sensei
Sorcerer
- Location
- Citrix Receiver
- Pronouns
- Weatherdependent
That might have been right here in this thread; only a few pages ago, we were talking about how logical it would be for 1-3 to have happened inside Shinji's mind during Instrumentality.
LilithPrime
Shadow Cabal Team Mom
It's like you're in my head...
Get out of there, it's crowded enough already!
It's like you're in my head...
Get out of there, it's crowded enough already!
This isn't even the thirty-third time I've been accused of telepathy...
Hexokinase
contrarian for the sake of being contrarian
- Location
- Urban Labyrinth
As someone who actually likes the Star Wars prequels, I don't know what to think of this. :|
Heh. That would be giving Anno too much credit.
I think that's a bit of hopeful thinking, given how Shinji and Asuka are characterized in EoE, and how we only get to see Shinji's adventures in tangland. The movie is so open to interpretation it's frustrating. To quote LittleKuriboh: "by the way, the movies are all bullshit. Don't pretend that you understand the ending!" I'm pretty sure any way to look at Eva (especially EoE) except taking everything at face value is itself flawed.
IIRC, I saw it on Evageeks. Though I may have put a spin on the actual information given how disappointing Rebuild 3.0's plot is.
Well, I don't think the Star Wars prequels are as bad as the internet seems to think they are. Granted, they have bad pacing, bad plot holes, and poor characterization (describe Queen Amidala without referencing her appearance, job, or relatives - now do the same for Princess Leia by comparison).
Still the Star Wars prequels have a core of potential to them - which is why they are so disappointing. They could, and should, have been better.
Rebuild is much the same way.
No, that was me, here in this thread. I've actually posted it in more detail over in the EVA thread at TVTropes before. Along with my analysis of Asuka and Shinji as Jungian symbolism of the anima and animus for each other.
- Location
- United States
Hopeful thinking perhaps, but it's not invalid either. Given just how open ended it is, I believe that personal interpretation is all the more necessary. I choose to be an optimist in my interpretation.
That being said, I acknowledge that my interpretation is just that, an interpretation. A theory, and (I wont deny it) a bit of hopeful thinking. The inverse posibility, that both of them are beyond help and will always be doomed to suffer in their private hells, unable to reach out and comfort one another or even understand one another is also possible.
About only seeing Shinji in Tangland though, Asuka does go through a psychoanalytical experience similar to the one Shinji experiences in Episodes 25 and 26. We only saw a glimpse of it, in comparison to Shinji's, but presumably, everyone DOES go through one in Instrumentality. For the record, I consider Episodes 25 and 26 to be happening in tandem with EOE, not long after the completion of Third Impact. Other than the glimpses of her Instrumentality experience in 25 (or 26?), there's no telling what she might have seen or experienced. All of that can only be guessed at, and is entirely up to personal interpretation.
As you see staggering number of candidates and Gendo still runs NERV so he delegated to most qualified subordinate. Sometimes I wonder how they manage to function with so few people knowibg what they are doing. Conspiracy is one thing but...
Personally I dropped Rebuild movies after second one, just watched it and didn't want more. Nothing I heard make me want to watch third one.
Cae Lumis
Chief Director of Shinra Archaeology Department
- Location
- Southern New Jersey
Personally, I'm waiting for 4.0, AND... depending on if GAINAX and Anno and all the hype is true that 4.0 will have a happier ending then EOE, I'll buy both 3.33 and 4.44 and watch them both in one go. That way, 4.44 can wash away the despair 3.33 will likely induce... if all the word about it is indeed true that is.
If 4.0 makes EOE look like a fun time at Disney World.... well... I'll let you guys know what my plan B will be...
Probably watch both anyway cause I have no life.. that or play Ace Combat 7, whichever comes first lol
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- Location
- Spain
You're not missing out on much, really. I'll watch 4.0 for pure virtue of wanting to see how GAINAX gets out of that hole.
Expectations are low, though. Hopefully, I'll be pleasantly surprised.
BlackAeronaut
Scaring people witless since 1980
- Location
- A state of mind where it is always ****ing Monday.
OMFG, do you guys not see it? It's a reboot within a reboot! They're finally doing it! TIME LOOP SHENANIGANS ARE GO!
MarqFJA87
Proud member of Ala Iridia
- Location
- Saudi Arabia
... Exactly why are you guys so persistently discussing the merits of the Rebuild movies vs the TV series here, when its only connection to the thread topic is that it's about the same franchise (i.e. no connection to the actual fic)?
BlackAeronaut
Scaring people witless since 1980
- Location
- A state of mind where it is always ****ing Monday.
Because it's more germane to the topic than whether Asuka is a Redhead or a Brunette?
Hexokinase
contrarian for the sake of being contrarian
- Location
- Urban Labyrinth
because @Strypgia is taking his sweet time with the next update so we have to find a meaningful way to pass the time?
In all seriousness, it started if the fic could incorporate stuff from Rebuild now that canon is out the window.
- Location
- National Capital Region, USA
I've got to tell you though, this is the TV Series with occasional bits of the manga patched into it where there are gaps, such as with Kaji's back story. Rebuild really doesn't enter into it.
MarqFJA87
Proud member of Ala Iridia
- Location
- Saudi Arabia
Well, this is partly why I raised the topic of Asuka's potential reaction to something that happened in canon that she probably does not know, and which she kinda would consider as something that is important to know.
That's alright. I can sympathize with how you'd see it as requiring less time and effort, compared to how to fit Mari's character into the story (you need to figure out her impact on the canon and then on your own premise).
Is that even a question?Asuka is the fiery redhead trope personified...
Cae Lumis
Chief Director of Shinra Archaeology Department
- Location
- Southern New Jersey
Asuka is the fiery redhead trope personified...
Do I dare.... do I dare open this proverbial Pandora's Box? Yes... yes I do.
This'll be fun
*hums Ode to Joy*
Allow me to present the following:
and the piece of resistance... this issue of them of not being able to pick a hair color and stick with it has been ongoing since the bloody proposal!
The short answer is yes, Gainax has a history of not making up their minds about Asuka's hair color.
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- Location
- Seattle, Washington
- Pronouns
- He/Him
Whoa, so Asuka had Hikari's freckles at first. That'd have been a interesting design choice if they'd stuck with that, as the freckles make her seem a bit younger and girl-ish, which would have been at odds with Asuka's desire/drive to be a adult.
Stargrave
Wine-drinking evil
- Location
- The White City
That, or Asuka's an immigrant from Jojo's Bizarre Adventure.