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Puella Magi Adfligo Systema

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[X] Kaizuki

I was gonna say a whole thing, but Kaizuki's post more or less summed it up sufficiently, so I'll go with that one, until Vebyast puts together his Franken-vote, I guess.

Huh, so this is how I finally stopped lurking? Interesting.
 
Onmur said:
Everybody currently on this bandwagon:

@Racoras, @defenestrator, @Spector29, @Spectral Waltz, @Higure, @Demojay, @Redshirt Army, @Faraway-R, @query, @Shadowhisker, @Romka, @cmwatford

Due to what I've writen in the above post, I believe we can't restrain Hijiri without Gemming her. I had the impression Saki's magic didn't allow teleports in PMAS, but I see I've misread.

Hijiri seems to be literally teleporting.

If we want to restrain her ourself, we probably needed to hit her the past update; right now, unless we can 'shock' her somehow, the only way to stop her ourselves is to gem her.

Otherwise, it seems she'll get away.

Maybe we can call "Mami!" and see if she's got an ace up her sleeve. :confused: She did have a Ribbon on Hijiri, at least!

Unless Saki's teleport has short range (which wasn't the case in PMKM), Hijiri'll get away. We can't actually restrain Hijiri now that she's mid-teleport, if we're not willing to risk triggering her issues by Gemming.
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I gave you my vote back when you were planning to gem her, so this doesn't really change anything for me. Honestly, I think people are overconcerned by the prospect: There's a big difference between someone going unconscious and finding out they were...well, dead, basically...and finding a room full of human bodies lined up on display.
 
I stand by my vote to Gem Hijiri. She has set herself as an enemy, and she is in the process of escaping. That puts her in a different category than a subdued prisoner.
 
Hrm...

Hijiri bunnycat ideas:

[*]Kyubey may not have told you some things when you contracted. Your gem is the seat of your consciousness now. If it goes black, your life as a magical girl, and as a human being, will end. If you are ever more than 100 meters from it, you will lose connection to the rest of your body. Be careful. Greater knowledge of the system can be gem blackeningly unpleasant.

QBtruth for Mami's protection.


[*alt] Grief Earplug Mami. Witchbomb Hijiri.

Current vote:

[x]Kaizuki
 
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@Kaizuki

Consider possible edits?

Since time is of the essence in case Mami does have an ace up her sleeve (maybe that Ribbon will do something :V ), maybe the first line of the vote should be just that? Mami and Sabrina have a pretty strong connection going on; we can use that.

Also, if Hijiri's gone, we should focus on taking down Miss Witchbomb Threat ASAP.

We can telepathy after that.

My own take/re-write on what to say to Hijiri; hopefully it adds something. We don't need to be too specific on wording, I think; we can leave that to Firn.

[ ] Signal Mami for help.
-[ ] If Hijiri gets away, put it out of your mind momentarily.

[ ] Take down and capture Anri ASAP.
-[ ] Use overwhelming speed, force, and defense (solid Grief). Accept Mami's support.
-[ ] Mami stays out of hearing range.

[ ] Once Anri is down, knock her out so she can't drop bombs.

[ ] Once the action is done:
-[ ] Telepathy Hijiri: Fnish your though about Hijiri needing to work for it; nobody will hand her own life on a silver platter. Re-affirm she can have her own life if she deals with her issues rather than lashing out or running away; shift the blame to where it belongs (KB).
-[ ] Telepathy your group: Apologize for losing Hijiri; you weren't prepared for a teleport, and don't understand why she didn't use it earlier. You could have stopped her, but not without excessive force. Report on Anri.
 
Okay, serious question is serious.

Can we behead her, or otherwise disable her body beyond hope of natural recovery? Do people think we have time for that?

If she is going to lose her shit over being "turned off," then we might actually cause less trauma by eliminating her the old fashioned way and then healing her.
 
Higure said:
Okay, serious question is serious.

Can we behead her, or otherwise disable her body beyond hope of natural recovery? Do people think we have time for that?

If she is going to lose her shit over being "turned off," then we might actually cause less trauma by eliminating her the old fashioned way and then healing her.
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Moral/trigger issues aside, Hijiri's literally a streak of lightning right now.

That's why we can't [ ] Restrain her nor [ ] Shock her out of her spell, and the vote got split between [ ] Gem and [ ] Let go.
 
Onmur said:
-[ ] Telepathy Hijiri: Fnish your though about Hijiri needing to work for it; nobody will hand her own life on a silver platter. Re-affirm she can have her own life if she deals with her issues rather than lashing out or running away; shift the blame to where it belongs (KB).
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This bit seems unpleasantly controlling/terms dictatingy. Lashing out can work to drive away the people preventing you from living your life depending on circumstances. So can running away. Her life would still be hers if she did either of these things.

"Reaffirm the possibility of an independent, peaceful life in Asunaro if she's willing to claim it" maybe?
 
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Either Hijiri is beyond all hope, or she isn't.

If there's a chance that she might eventually give us an opportunity to help, we can't risk that by hitting her trauma button.

If she is beyond all hope of reason, and letting her go leads to her trying to kill people, odds are it means we'll just have to track her down again (only this time we'll be less merciful).

As far as I can see, letting her go, though potentially a poor choice, is less likely to backfire than gemming her.
 
[x] Onmur

I'm not okay with letting her go. She's been misleading us the entire time we were talking to her, and she's a danger to herself and others. Especially to others. I'm not okay with turning her loose on an unsuspecting populace.
 
Conjured Blade said:
This bit seems unpleasantly controlling/terms dictatingy. Lashing out can work to drive away the people preventing you from living your life depending on circumstances. So can running away. Her life would still be hers if she did either of these things.
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The bitter smile indicates, to me, that lashing out and running away isn't her first choice. That sounded less like "You can't do this because I have to do it myself" and more "You can't do this because it's impossible". Which is where we come in, and why I'm fairly sure that this is a setup for specifically my current vote - doing the impossible, for the good of everyone, is Sabrina's thing.
 
Reiterate: Anri is a Witchbomb threat, if maybe not a big one.

We should overwhelm her by attacking her with overwhelming force, and overwhelming speed sufficient velocity, and be overwhelmingly tough to counter her very powerful guns and tricks.

Telepathying Hijiri, the Pleiades can wait until the fight is over. Socialing Anri can wait longer than that; we should make sure to restrain her and make sure she can't talk/telepathy. Probably knock her out.

I'm really hoping Hijiri doesn't teleport to Anri then teleport away with her. :| If Anri is still far enough, not even Mami will catch them then.

Conjured Blade said:
"Reaffirm the possibility of an independent, peaceful life in Asunaro if she's willing to claim it" maybe?
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If Hijiri doesn't deal with her problems, even if she were to go away and the Pleiades not go after her, both Hijiri and Niko would live looking over their shoulders, waiting for each other to pop up and TAKE REVENGE/SEND BACK TO DOLLHOUSE.

The problem doesn't get solved by running away.
 
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Onmur said:
Also, if Hijiri's gone, we should focus on taking down Miss Witchbomb Threat ASAP.
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Eh, there's zero reason we can't simultaneously telepathy her and move to Anri. Less than zero reason, even.

Onmur said:
[ ] Take down and capture Anri ASAP.
-[ ] Use overwhelming speed, force, and defense (solid Grief). Accept Mami's support.
-[ ] Mami stays out of hearing range.
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I'll take it.

Onmur said:
[ ] Once Anri is down, knock her out so she can't drop bombs.
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But... we can't talk to her then? Am I missing something? I've been monofocusing on Hijiri on the assumption that anything to do with Anri was less important as long as it involved attacking her.

Onmur said:
-[ ] Telepathy Hijiri: Fnish your though about Hijiri needing to work for it; nobody will hand her own life on a silver platter. Re-affirm she can have her own life if she deals with her issues rather than lashing out or running away; shift the blame to where it belongs (KB).
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See, the point of this is that virtually everything negative about Niko that Hijiri believes is sourced from Kyubey. I... honestly, I don't like the "she has to work for it" business, because Hijiri's belief is that she can't reconcile staying in her life as she wants with Niko's existence going by what she's heard. The only work she can do there is... violent.

What Hijiri needs to do is to question her own preconceptions and, well, frankly, push past Kyubey's bullshit. Her idea that she can't have the peaceful life w/ her family that she wants is utter bullshit given what we know -- but it's bullshit she views as Madokami's truth. See where I'm going with this?



Editing vote: overhauling the "bag Anri" section. No other meaningful changes.

[X] Let Hijiri go.
-[X] ... unless Mami can stop her with ribbons, in which case, emphatically do not stop Mami from stopping Hijiri with ribbons. (If this happens, immediately break to voting. Absolutely no pauses.)
-[X] Reply to Hijiri via telepathy: I think you'll find that the "can's" and "cant's" of the world are very different from how Kyubey would imply them to be. Lying by omission has been the majority of his job since before the dawn of history, not that he'd characterize it that way.
[X] Take down and capture Anri ASAP.
-[X] Use overwhelming speed, force, and defense (solid Grief). Accept Mami's support.
-[X] Mami stays out of hearing range.
[X] Telepathy the Pleiades, Sayaka, Mami: Hijiri, it would seem, has the entire powerset, including teleportation and fast transit. Why she didn't just break that out the first time you have no idea, but you completely failed to anticipate it and you had no way to stop her without excessive force, which... you don't think Niko would have wanted. Anri is caught and has the clear seed with her.
 
Eh, I can see the merits for either letting her go or gemming her so I'm happy either way.

Though I will be mightily annoyed if she doubles back and starts shooting at us or the others.

Or runs off specifically to recruit more girls.
 
Everyone! Thank you for a quest that got me reading! Posting to you from 0326am on Dec 13, whenever this moves out of embargo, let me ask you all for a moment of indulgence.

While it isn't my goal to vote at this juncture, given that my presence consists solely of reading myself in for a week, it might be well for me to contribute to the discussion. My meta here is that we Quest to "produce a group authorship" in a non-equal partnership.

The choice of how to deal with crisismode!Hijiri comes down to a missed branch in earlier goal direction. In some way, our trip to Asunaro has been overwritten by a larger plot element. We might now consider it our purpose to get Hijiri on the team. She is not yet mired in her canon plot position, so we can affect a change. WoG has stated that our Overpowered status is leading towards a situation that requires such. And the basic principle that Sabrina has settled on is saving the world, and saving one little girl, they are equivalent. Past precedent saw us embark on the easier(!) task of re-framing Oriko's worldview, and exploring the reality of her on our team. Going forward, we need to avoid sidelining any 'villains' at all, because whenever we are able to muster the ability, they are also able to become our allies. Firnagzen is bending over backwards to allow you to attempt this path. Someday there will be a Dirty Dozen of Puella Magi, just watch for it. Toward that end, "recruit teens with attitude" has to be the way to do it.

Instead of the big(er) wall of text, I'll get right to the rest. Considering the kind of girl who is running away right now? Be the sempai she needs, not the sempai she deserves. Hard Verbal interrupt. Some form of "I need you! If you go now, I'm following!" Back it up with Action. Hijiri has to know something about her destination, right? It's somewhere in city limits. Not going to make the next fight finish without you. How to do this? Three easy choices... MamiTracker, and Sayaka comes to help you teleport there, after your moment of tipping the scales against Anri. Or plot-relevant and dangerous. Handoff to allies. Give up combat , and either actually hug the lighting, or get your Dive software up, and push your magic into her teleport magic, much as you did with Mami and her ribbons. Will yourself to travel next to her. It could result in Deep Communication. Or Deep Migraine. But it gives you a way to bypass months of awkward therapy, and find the mutual honesty position right now. Might even end her spell before launch, as a bonus. Another Mahou Shoujo with Connection themed powers... just your type?

I will respond with longer form analysis and agenda, should there be a person interested. Sabrina's win scenario is left incomplete like this, and needs to be filled in. Will be back approx 24 hours.

TL;DR While in a Magical Girl Plot, acting APPROPRIATELY sometimes will help, so find a good way to ACCEPT the real Hijiri, and get her to feel it. Think about it.
 
AuraTwilight said:
Oh I'm sure Niko would LOVE if we did that.

No.
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You're not wrong, but pissing off Niko isn't on the same tier as "Hijiri snaps" and "a significant threat is allowed to escape." Admittedly, it's not completely clear how dangerous she can really be, but antimagic is a credible threat.

That said...
Onmur said:
Moral/trigger issues aside, Hijiri's literally a streak of lightning right now.

That's why we can't [ ] Restrain her nor [ ] Shock her out of her spell, and the vote got split between [ ] Gem and [ ] Let go.
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This clarifies things nicely, so it's moot.
 
Thought brought on by Kaizuki mentioning Niko might not condone our means of holding her

[Q] Let Hijiri Go
-[Q] Telepathy her that you doubt Niko would approve of what we would need to do to hold her

random thought from the night watch....
Adhoc vote count started by DB_Explorer on Dec 13, 2017 at 8:27 AM, finished with 379 posts and 46 votes.
  • [X] Let Hijiri go.
    -[X] ... unless Mami can stop her with ribbons, in which case, emphatically do not stop Mami from stopping Hijiri with ribbons. (If this happens, immediately break to voting. Absolutely no pauses.)
    -[X] Reply to Hijiri via telepathy: I think you'll find that the "can's" and "cant's" of the world are very different from how Kyubey would imply them to be. Lying by omission has been the majority of his job since before the dawn of history, not that he'd characterize it that way.
    [X] Take down and capture Anri ASAP.
    -[X] Use overwhelming speed, force, and defense (solid Grief). Accept Mami's support.
    -[X] Mami stays out of hearing range.
    [X] Telepathy the Pleiades, Sayaka, Mami: Hijiri, it would seem, has the entire powerset, including teleportation and fast transit. Why she didn't just break that out the first time you have no idea, but you completely failed to anticipate it and you had no way to stop her without excessive force, which... you don't think Niko would have wanted. Anri is caught and has the clear seed with her.
    [x] So she's giving up because her perfect life can't be handed to her on a platter? It'd be ironic if it weren't so pathetic. She needs to try harder if she wants to achieve her goals.
    [x] After that, broadcast, including to Hijiri: Let her go. She's not going to try anything.
    [x] Hand tracking of Anri off to another sensor suite - grief telescope, more focused Mami ribbons, something else - and disconnect so Mami can start getting back up to speed.
    [x] Fade back to buy time.
    [x] Tell the Pleiades to form a perimeter.
    [X] One action: Take Hijiri's Gem.
    -[X] If she's still in range afterwards, restrain her.
    -[X] If that fails, if feasible, quickly ask Mami to go after her and to call for help (Sayaka, Pleiades).
    [X] Gem Anri as soon as she's in range. Rush her if she stops moving towards us.
    -[X] Create an opening first: Examples: Ask Mami to distract her; blind her with Grief light (flashbang style); catch her with your Grief Fog; etc..
    -[X] If Anri gets away, Oriko, Kirika and Sabrina will deal with her.
    [X] No speechifying; no battlefield therapy. If you capture Hijiri, just tell her we're all gonna have to wait until she cools down, stops lashing out, and is willing to talk. For real, this time.
    [x] Gem her
    [X] Fully encase her in Grief, pulling from all of the Grief that's immediately available closest to her. Yank her Soul Gem--though don't take it out of range. She'll only lose the connection if she teleports out herself.
    [x] "I think I was also created by someone's wish, Hijiri. I was hoping we'd be able to connect over that. Please stay and we can work this out together"
    [X] One action: Catch Hijiri with Grief.
    -[X] If that fails, quickly ask Mami to go after her and to call for help (Sayaka, Pleiades).
    [X] Gem Anri ASAP.
    -[X] Create an opening first: Examples: Ask Mami to distract her; blind her with Grief light (flashban style); catch her with your Grief Fog; etc..
    -[X] If Anri gets away, Oriko, Kirika and Sabrina will deal with her.
    [X] No speechifying; no battlefield therapy. If you capture Hijiri, just tell her we're all gonna have to wait until she cools down, stops lashing out, and is willing to talk. For real, this time.
    [X] null
    [X] One action: Catch Hijiri with Grief.
    -[X] If that fails, quickly ask Mami to go after her and to call for help (Sayaka, Pleiades).
    [X] Gem Anri as soon as she's in range.
    -[X] Create an opening first: Examples: Ask Mami to distract her; blind her with Grief light (flashban style); catch her with your Grief Fog; etc..
    -[X] If Anri gets away, Oriko, Kirika and Sabrina will deal with her.
    [X] No speechifying; no battlefield therapy. If you capture Hijiri, just tell her we're all gonna have to wait until she cools down, stops lashing out, and is willing to talk. For real, this time.
    [X] Cause Hijiri physical pain.
    -[X] If that fails, if feasible, quickly ask Mami to go after her and to call for help (Sayaka, Pleiades).
    [X] Gem Anri as soon as she's in range. Rush her if she stops moving towards us.
    -[X] Create an opening first: Examples: Ask Mami to distract her; blind her with Grief light (flashbang style); catch her with your Grief Fog; etc..
    -[X] If Anri gets away, Oriko, Kirika and Sabrina will deal with her.
    [X] No speechifying; no battlefield therapy. If you capture Hijiri, just tell her we're all gonna have to wait until she cools down, stops lashing out, and is willing to talk. For real, this time.
    [X] Any vote that doesn't involve deliberately hurting a 14 year old girl.
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