Paths of Civilization
- Thread starter Academia Nut
- Start date
- Original
- Location
- Mists of Albion
We have a casius belli and they are beings dicks to everyone else.
If you show an uppity douchbag his place in the world you're the one who stands up to the bully, not the bully
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No, they're using a trade advantage. Literally exactly what they should be doing.
Hyacinthium
Writing about sad cannibals as we speak.
- Location
- Bedroom
- Pronouns
- He/Him
i saw that as a kind of innuendo as well tbh
"Talk mysticism to me."
Also, it sounds like we will have an opportunity to build a colony up north. @Academia Nut , while I doubt we'll be able to afford it anyways, there is no way we can safely make that decision without a new map and estimates on travel times. Can we get one soonish?
- Location
- Mists of Albion
No, instead of letting traders use them as an in between naturally, they are using their navy to force it to make a profit.
That's aggressive and helps them to threaten our trade dominants which will cause us some major issues if they succeed.
Next turn we create major docks and prep for a vassalising attempt, we could solidify our hegemony over the entire Not!Black sea
- Location
- indeterminate, possibly non-existent
- Pronouns
- Any
[X] [Curr] Yes, in Valleyhome
[X] [Horse] Openly allow but regulate it (-1 Religious Authority, potential stability loss)
[X] [Infra] Build aqueduct in Sacred Forest (-4 Econ, +4 Econ Expansion, increased True City threshold)
[X] [Hero] Provide sponsorship (Main Study Tailings under Mystic Hero, possible Legitimacy loss, possible Religious Authority loss)
[X] [Horse] Openly allow but regulate it (-1 Religious Authority, potential stability loss)
[X] [Infra] Build aqueduct in Sacred Forest (-4 Econ, +4 Econ Expansion, increased True City threshold)
[X] [Hero] Provide sponsorship (Main Study Tailings under Mystic Hero, possible Legitimacy loss, possible Religious Authority loss)
[X] [Curr] Yes, in vallyhome
[X] [Horse] Openly allow but regulate it (-1 Religious Authority, potential stability loss)
[X] [Hero] Provide sponsorship (Main Study Tailings under Mystic Hero, possible Legitimacy loss, possible Religious Authority loss)
[X] [Infra] Build aqueduct in Sacred Forest (-4 Econ, +4 Econ Expansion, increased True City threshold)
[X] [Horse] Openly allow but regulate it (-1 Religious Authority, potential stability loss)
[X] [Hero] Provide sponsorship (Main Study Tailings under Mystic Hero, possible Legitimacy loss, possible Religious Authority loss)
[X] [Infra] Build aqueduct in Sacred Forest (-4 Econ, +4 Econ Expansion, increased True City threshold)
- Location
- Illinois
[X] [Curr] Yes, for everyone (Stability loss?, Other effects?, establishes currency)
[X] [Horse] Openly allow but regulate it (-1 Religious Authority, potential stability loss)
[X] [Infra] Build aqueduct in Sacred Forest (-4 Econ, +4 Econ Expansion, increased True City threshold)
[X] [Hero] Provide sponsorship (Main Study Tailings under Mystic Hero, possible Legitimacy loss, possible Religious Authority loss)
Following the advice of our hero. No offense guys, but I trust the woman who solved our plague issues to be a better admin than you.
[X] [Horse] Openly allow but regulate it (-1 Religious Authority, potential stability loss)
[X] [Infra] Build aqueduct in Sacred Forest (-4 Econ, +4 Econ Expansion, increased True City threshold)
[X] [Hero] Provide sponsorship (Main Study Tailings under Mystic Hero, possible Legitimacy loss, possible Religious Authority loss)
Following the advice of our hero. No offense guys, but I trust the woman who solved our plague issues to be a better admin than you.
We don't need to war with the Trelli if they start to threaten our Dye dominance.
We'd take a stability hit if they overtake us, but then we could just do more snail cultivation. There are also a fair number of dyes that are probably undiscovered at this point- we are specifically near the native region of the Armenian Cochineal, and it's fairly likely if we do Study Forest we'll find it or another dye agent the Trelli can't really compete with so easily.
That said, I'm totally down for conquering or diplo-conquering the Trelli when the time comes that it's practical, we just don't have to do it the first time they trigger us.
We'd take a stability hit if they overtake us, but then we could just do more snail cultivation. There are also a fair number of dyes that are probably undiscovered at this point- we are specifically near the native region of the Armenian Cochineal, and it's fairly likely if we do Study Forest we'll find it or another dye agent the Trelli can't really compete with so easily.
That said, I'm totally down for conquering or diplo-conquering the Trelli when the time comes that it's practical, we just don't have to do it the first time they trigger us.
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- Location
- his hidden lair
The Trell are perfectly justified in enforcing a sound toll. These things have been around for nigh millennia in some way shape or form. Unfortunately for them, we're just as justified in going to war to avoid said toll. There's no real morality to it. It's just too factions mutually willing to but heads over filthy lucre.
When have I ever steered you wrong Citino?
- Location
- Austria
America? Decent? No. Nobody ever thinks that. America is basically the biggest and most obnoxious bully around...honestly, Trump was how US was viewed outside of it for quite a lot of the time.
Also,
Trying to fight not!Constantinopole when at least two wars loom on horizon is not the best idea; and even if we can defeat sailing-focused nation on the sea, it is still way too far to be governed with anything resembling efficiency. It would have to be a colony.
And distant colony on a vital chokepoint which would make said colony disproportionately rich is, um, very interesting and typically headache-inducing for everyone involved.
[X] [Curr] Yes, in vallyhome
[X] [Horse] Openly allow but regulate it (-1 Religious Authority, potential stability loss)
[X] [Hero] Provide sponsorship (Main Study Tailings under Mystic Hero, possible Legitimacy loss, possible Religious Authority loss)
[X] [Infra] Build aqueduct in Sacred Forest (-4 Econ, +4 Econ Expansion, increased True City threshold)
Spectrum
Tell me a secret~
- Location
- Behind you~
So what? We don't have the range to do any trading with anyone they'd be blocking off anyway. They're also a non-hostile polity when we're surrounded by mostly unfriendly ones. Why on -earth- are you people agitating the moment they show to go kill them?
We have to fend off the Nomads.
We have to fend off the Hath and/or push them to collapse.
We have to prop up the Metal Workers so the nomads stop stealing from them and using their goodies to beat us up and/or should probably just vassalize them at this point because they're teetering also.
We have to keep the HK both non-hostile and a viable rival state to the Thunder Horse.
We have to keep an eye on the Thunder Horse/Xoh/Thunder Speakers so they don't realize we're their only valid rival left and start coming after us.
AFTER ALL THIS
Then we can maybe think about doing something about the Trelli.
I want to say people's priorities being completely out of wack surprise me but it really doesn't.
- Location
- Mists of Albion
That's why we said we'd do it next turn, after we slap down the Hath and see wether the Nomads will even be back
pblur
Reminiscing over the halcyon days of Ymaryn
- Location
- Lawrence's Wagon
So, to be clear, the new civ is a lot like us. Passive aggresive assholes leveraging their advantages for all they're worth. Slanting the peace playing field as hard and as long as they can. Like I've pointed out before, the lowlands can't afford to not be assholes anymore. And we actively discuss how to make sure the millenia-long bloodbath continues indefinitely.
We aren't ready for war across the sea any time soon, but if we go that route it will simply be more direct and less opportunistic than our previous assholery.
We aren't ready for war across the sea any time soon, but if we go that route it will simply be more direct and less opportunistic than our previous assholery.
- Location
- Reno
- Pronouns
- They/Them
[X] [Curr] Yes, in Valleyhome
[X] [Horse] Openly allow but regulate it (-1 Religious Authority, potential stability loss)
[X] [Infra] Build aqueduct in Sacred Forest (-4 Econ, +4 Econ Expansion, increased True City threshold)
[X] [Hero] Provide sponsorship (Main Study Tailings under Mystic Hero, possible Legitimacy loss, possible Religious Authority loss)
[X] [Horse] Openly allow but regulate it (-1 Religious Authority, potential stability loss)
[X] [Infra] Build aqueduct in Sacred Forest (-4 Econ, +4 Econ Expansion, increased True City threshold)
[X] [Hero] Provide sponsorship (Main Study Tailings under Mystic Hero, possible Legitimacy loss, possible Religious Authority loss)
[X] [Curr] Yes, in Valleyhome
[X] [Horse] Openly allow but regulate it (-1 Religious Authority, potential stability loss)
[X] [Infra] Build aqueduct in Sacred Forest (-4 Econ, +4 Econ Expansion, increased True City threshold)
[X] [Hero] Provide sponsorship (Main Study Tailings under Mystic Hero, possible Legitimacy loss, possible Religious Authority loss)
Already explained the officalize the Valleyhome system and let it spread naturally where needed system.
Building a Sacred Forest aqueduct will mean they are to busy growing to annoy things... which will raise the religious authority on its own. Sacred Forest being the temple/library settlement.
With them priests appeased and busy, regulating the Horse option means that there won't be abuses here and making it officially noted formalizes its growth without sending it underground. I suspect that just knowing people are doing this will bring up questions of 'Why?' and 'Is it hurting the horses?' and that is where the potential stab loss kicks in. Religious Authority is probably taking a hit because it means adapting the rules and views again. If nothing else non-chariot horse riding regulation shaman is something new to deal with in the social structure. Possibly its a matter of having shamans to handle such things.
The possible losses are likely because this can produce weird effects that could change the teachings around... or just be another think for some existing shaman department. Legitimacy is then obviously as this is a Kind sponsored study and it can go wrong.
I'm taking Religious Authority to mean available personal to handle new thing/jobs/concepts. You need available personnel to handle new fields.
[X] [Horse] Openly allow but regulate it (-1 Religious Authority, potential stability loss)
[X] [Infra] Build aqueduct in Sacred Forest (-4 Econ, +4 Econ Expansion, increased True City threshold)
[X] [Hero] Provide sponsorship (Main Study Tailings under Mystic Hero, possible Legitimacy loss, possible Religious Authority loss)
Already explained the officalize the Valleyhome system and let it spread naturally where needed system.
Building a Sacred Forest aqueduct will mean they are to busy growing to annoy things... which will raise the religious authority on its own. Sacred Forest being the temple/library settlement.
With them priests appeased and busy, regulating the Horse option means that there won't be abuses here and making it officially noted formalizes its growth without sending it underground. I suspect that just knowing people are doing this will bring up questions of 'Why?' and 'Is it hurting the horses?' and that is where the potential stab loss kicks in. Religious Authority is probably taking a hit because it means adapting the rules and views again. If nothing else non-chariot horse riding regulation shaman is something new to deal with in the social structure. Possibly its a matter of having shamans to handle such things.
The possible losses are likely because this can produce weird effects that could change the teachings around... or just be another think for some existing shaman department. Legitimacy is then obviously as this is a Kind sponsored study and it can go wrong.
I'm taking Religious Authority to mean available personal to handle new thing/jobs/concepts. You need available personnel to handle new fields.
...okay? I own this channel, you pay me for going through or I'm not going to let you is literally how every channel ever has worked. That's trade! We do that today!
It will threaten us, yes. But I'm alright with that. I really want to evolve our trade trait ASAP so that we're not constantly forced into trade wars further down the road and can afford to let some other people into the market.
No. Fuck no. We're not attacking someone because of a channel and trade route that we can't even exploit. Besides, this is Byzantium. You do NOT want to attack Byzantium, and certainly not without siege equipment and a true blockade ability.
I'm kind of hoping we can find a civ in Not!Russia to trade with. We can probably keep a trade route semi-open with our awesome boats, but it's extremely unlikely we could protect a colony over there.
- Location
- Philippines
I am against this right now the lowlands are about to boil over and the chance for us to finally take it is almost at hand we should not be distracted by a mega project at this time
- Location
- Austria
Yep, this too. Before even thinking about poking at Trelli we have to make sure we are not losing Hathatyn lands to their hero, that nomadic Son 2 won't fuck up our northern parts, that we have enough Stability to diploannex parts of HK/TS/some more Hathatyn whenever we can.
Given that Hath have heroic leader, it's a bit dubious, honestly. I suspect trying to fight Trelli on water, given description of ships, is not unlike trying to fight Ymaryn in forested hills.
Given that Hath have heroic leader, it's a bit dubious, honestly. I suspect trying to fight Trelli on water, given description of ships, is not unlike trying to fight Ymaryn in forested hills.
pblur
Reminiscing over the halcyon days of Ymaryn
- Location
- Lawrence's Wagon
Byzantium was like 3 millenia more advanced than them. Not a sound comparison.
Also, there's no mention of tolls. Pretty sure you got it wrong.
- Location
- Mists of Albion
Okay so your list:
Nomads might not even come back and if they do we are developing cavalry, also there will always be Nomads so your argument of 'wait till there are no Nomads' means wait forever.
The Hath are bitches at the moment without their Heroic Martial Leader, not even able to push out the Highlanders, who can now focus more on them and their foothold in their territory, also Hatriver solves that issue for us
The Metal Workers can stabilise with the help of our Trading Post, they already seem to be doing so somewhat. They don't need us to Baby them forever
We have been keeping the Lowlanders non hostile for centuries without really trying to, why are you putting so much emphasis on them now? We'll just let them keep killing each other and they'll keep ignoring us.
So overall, some weak arguments, not going to lie most of them seem like excuses not to do it, some of them aren't even issues we've been overly concerned with or can solve
- Location
- Philippines
Guys wouldn't implementing the currency in Valleyhome and in Valleyhome only, cause a class imbalance as the people inside Valleyhome are able to stock up on the currency before it gets fully implemented elsewhere making it so that those outside Valleyhome will have less currency to start with than those inside?
- Location
- Mists of Albion
Not 'pay me for going through it'. Stop here you can't go though you have to do all your business where I tell you and make sure we get to reap most of the benefits, you can't try and go round us or we kill you.
And this isn't real life mate, are you even playing this game? This isn't Byzantium, it's in a similar place but it has no empire around it, it's in the mid Bronze Age and it's only a city state. Stop overinflating thier power and comparing them to a strong real life example when they are far from being the same aside from rough geographical location