No we didn't. This was our next vote after taking in the Nomads:
[Main] Restoration of Harmony
[Secondary] War Secondary - Dead Priests
[Secondary] Sacred Warriors
Paths of Civilization
- Thread starter Academia Nut
- Start date
- Original
[Main] Restoration of Harmony
[Secondary] War Secondary - Dead Priests
[Secondary] Sacred Warriors
- Location
- United States of America, Michigan
[X] Contact with the Metal Workers and safe passage for caravans going that way
- Location
- Australia
In order to get useful amounts of copper, we need several things. First, we need to survey our hills and find sizeable deposits of copper. As you said, this shouldn't be too difficult. Not guaranteed, but still. It will take an action, however, which we could be short on like we are now.
Then comes the difficult bit, which is setting up the mines. The Metal Workers are fine with trading people metal, but things like teaching people how to mine? They'd be breaking their own monopoly for people who are far away, not connected by trails, and have had relations with for just a few generations at most. Still even assuming they'd be willing to share their secrets, that's still actions we'd have to take in order to get a proper foundation of professional miners set up to actually do the mining.
We'll have to take even more actions to get a proper base of trained blacksmiths in order to work the metal, actions which we might have to use on dealing with natural disasters, or quickly beefing up our military to deal with increased DP pressure against us, or dealing with stability issues, or any number of other possibilities.
So no, while quickly getting mining/metalworking is possible in theory, it's very unlikely that that'll be the outcome with all the variables in play and assumptions we'd have to make.
- Location
- Sydney
[X] Contact with the Metal Workers and safe passage for caravans going that way
[X] No (Keeps Honourable Death)
Wow, I missed an entire update and vote/discussion.
[X] No (Keeps Honourable Death)
Wow, I missed an entire update and vote/discussion.
[X] There is much glory to fighting in the south
-[X] We will offer you safe passage through our lands
[X] No (Keeps Honourable Death)
The Dead Priests are getting stronger and stronger, so they need to dealt with as early as possible particularly now that they've stumbled onto a pretty workable expansion formula. Letting the Nomads through our land harms them incredibly due to the terrain bonuses they'd possess, and because the nomads have a hero that's notably had his weapon been blessed by our spirits. What do our shamans have to say about the Dead Priests?
It also keys of the nomad traits that we know of which include valuing and honoring your word so the threat of the nomads to our polity in this generation should be pretty negligible which is when we need their help the most, and when we can most take advantage of them having a hero. While within a generation or two the descendants are not likely to honor the trade agreement or another family/clan would rise up, so it's of limited utility particularly as we already have actions dedicated next turn to improving our stability. There's also a good chance that with the information the Nomad Chief gave us, that our ships should be more than sufficient to reach that place without travelling over land.
-[X] We will offer you safe passage through our lands
[X] No (Keeps Honourable Death)
The Dead Priests are getting stronger and stronger, so they need to dealt with as early as possible particularly now that they've stumbled onto a pretty workable expansion formula. Letting the Nomads through our land harms them incredibly due to the terrain bonuses they'd possess, and because the nomads have a hero that's notably had his weapon been blessed by our spirits. What do our shamans have to say about the Dead Priests?
It also keys of the nomad traits that we know of which include valuing and honoring your word so the threat of the nomads to our polity in this generation should be pretty negligible which is when we need their help the most, and when we can most take advantage of them having a hero. While within a generation or two the descendants are not likely to honor the trade agreement or another family/clan would rise up, so it's of limited utility particularly as we already have actions dedicated next turn to improving our stability. There's also a good chance that with the information the Nomad Chief gave us, that our ships should be more than sufficient to reach that place without travelling over land.
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For those worrying about the DP, copper weapons are exactly the sort of thing that could let us cut them down. In the short term, we could buy from them, while in the long term we could learn our own metal working from them. There's a reason it's called the Bronze Age: metal is just that important on every level. I would legitimately risk our civilization fracturing to acquire a good source of metal.
Motoko
Herald of Iron to The People
- Location
- Canada, ontario
[X] Contact with the Metal Workers and safe passage for caravans going that way
[X] No (Keeps Honourable Death)
Metalworking hardliners unite! We could rush (in theory) the surveying with a main (8 econ) and do the rest with periodic secondaries just to ensure we don't need to dump a full turn on it. Hopefully we can find some 'Starmetal' (probably nickel-iron mix, or something exotic if we're lucky) and become the local war tech leaders.
[X] No (Keeps Honourable Death)
Metalworking hardliners unite! We could rush (in theory) the surveying with a main (8 econ) and do the rest with periodic secondaries just to ensure we don't need to dump a full turn on it. Hopefully we can find some 'Starmetal' (probably nickel-iron mix, or something exotic if we're lucky) and become the local war tech leaders.
- Location
- Sydney
No (Keeps Honourable Death) :: There are no Values on offer better than Honourable Death,which at least we are working at improving. All starting Values have significant cons, with their benefits. Can anyone who is voting to switch values tell me why? It takes time to advance a value so why restart the process.
Contact with the Metal Workers and safe passage for caravans going that way :: We know nothing about the Metal Workers, lets fix that while we can. We gain the possibility of improved technology and a positive trade/diplomatic relationship with another group. Our traders will be passing through the Nomads lands under safe passage and trading with them at the same time. If we have the chance at building a positive relationship with them we should. Every other choice could lead to war with two enemies at once, something I do not see the appeal it has for other people.
^ There is much glory to fighting in the south
^ -We will offer you safe passage through our lands... leads to angry Death Priests, leting Nomads see our wealth/defences
^ -The easiest pass through to the south is the Spirit Talkers, and they did insult you... leads to angry Spirit Talkers and Death Priests
^ Have you a piece of the star for us?... leads to angry Nomad leader, this is his spirit blessing and he will not appreciate us attempting to gain part of it
Next turn plan:
Main:Trade Mission/Metal Workers --take advantage while we can
Second:Festival -- we have lots of econ and low stability, lets fix that
Second:New Settlement/Coastal --Overcrowded settlements and low total population, we MUST fix that ASAP
Alternatively
Main:Restore Harmony --we have low stability, lets fix that (only worthwhile if mained)
Second:Trade Mission/Metal Workers --We NEED new allies as we sacrificed our last to the DP, new tech possiblity
Second:New Settlement/Coastal --Overcrowded settlements and low total population, we MUST fix that ASAP
Contact with the Metal Workers and safe passage for caravans going that way :: We know nothing about the Metal Workers, lets fix that while we can. We gain the possibility of improved technology and a positive trade/diplomatic relationship with another group. Our traders will be passing through the Nomads lands under safe passage and trading with them at the same time. If we have the chance at building a positive relationship with them we should. Every other choice could lead to war with two enemies at once, something I do not see the appeal it has for other people.
^ There is much glory to fighting in the south
^ -We will offer you safe passage through our lands... leads to angry Death Priests, leting Nomads see our wealth/defences
^ -The easiest pass through to the south is the Spirit Talkers, and they did insult you... leads to angry Spirit Talkers and Death Priests
^ Have you a piece of the star for us?... leads to angry Nomad leader, this is his spirit blessing and he will not appreciate us attempting to gain part of it
Next turn plan:
Main:Trade Mission/Metal Workers --take advantage while we can
Second:Festival -- we have lots of econ and low stability, lets fix that
Second:New Settlement/Coastal --Overcrowded settlements and low total population, we MUST fix that ASAP
Alternatively
Main:Restore Harmony --we have low stability, lets fix that (only worthwhile if mained)
Second:Trade Mission/Metal Workers --We NEED new allies as we sacrificed our last to the DP, new tech possiblity
Second:New Settlement/Coastal --Overcrowded settlements and low total population, we MUST fix that ASAP
- Location
- Sydney
We just abandoned the war against the Dead Priests, the worst decision we could make would be returning to war.
The Dead Priests are engaging in a massive expansion, if we want to remain relevant we need to make a new settlement every second turn(if not every turn).
- Location
- Austria
Well, yeah, but that's why the idea with sending nomads to them is so appealing: we aren't locked into the war yet again, but Dead Priests are busy fighting nonetheless.
Ideally, nomads would migrate in their entirety to the south, but that's too good to be true.
- Location
- Sydney
The Dead Priests are currently focused on their version of economic expansion and are ignoring us. If the Nomads go via our land the DP will focus in our direction, if via the Spirit Talkers then the DP biggest opponent will be weakened at the worst possible time.
[X] Contact with the Metal Workers and safe passage for caravans going that way
I highly doubt the major players on this thread will be unable to get a trade vote through in the time frame we have.
And knowing that something can be done, and seeing it done, is a big boon to figuring out how to do it. We might even see proper sailboats there. I doubt we're the only ones who find metalwork intriguing. Also knowing where they are will be a plus when we get sailboats to send there.
I think we should wait with the survey until after we've visited the metalworkers so that we have a better idea of what to look for. And a new settlement is probably a good idea instead, yes.
I highly doubt the major players on this thread will be unable to get a trade vote through in the time frame we have.
And knowing that something can be done, and seeing it done, is a big boon to figuring out how to do it. We might even see proper sailboats there. I doubt we're the only ones who find metalwork intriguing. Also knowing where they are will be a plus when we get sailboats to send there.
I think we should wait with the survey until after we've visited the metalworkers so that we have a better idea of what to look for. And a new settlement is probably a good idea instead, yes.
- Location
- Sydney
The distance between the Nomads and the Death Priest is huge. Even with giving them the ability to travel on our trail network, why do you believe the Nomads have the logistical ability to move an effective army that distance? I am sure they could send some raiding parties, but what would be the point?
Ideally, some of them will settle in the lowland rather than leaving.
- Location
- Sydney
While possible, it is also possible that the DPs will decide to counter-attack the Nomad raids, and as they are originating in our lands (from the perspective of the DPs) the counter-attack will fall on the People.
What reasons(/advantages for the Nomads) would the have for settling in the lowlands? They will raid to repay the debt to us, but will only settle there if it benefits them.
Note they have to get through the WC, and then through bad terrains to get to us.
The nomads settle there because well, it's probably good pasture grounds for their animals.
- Pronouns
- He/Him
Their wood seems to be drawn from thinner plants for the most part, with only the major parts like the wheels and axle coming from large trees.
It will keep both his people off your backs and have him attack any other groups that threaten trade in along that route.
It's a special opportunity given by things being all mixed up, with the people coming from the WC giving a specific trait related to why they are coming over, and the nomads more generally through increased contact.
They're nomads. They'll just pack up and move down to the lowlands with their stuff and raid out of there. They have a logistical tail of essentially zero, and can pack up and move when need be. You would essentially be unleashing the full might of the nomads under Wendtikwos on the lowlands.