- Location
- The Surface Of A Hostile Planet
He's not the Stig, he's the Stig's professor, he's solved conundrums nobody else could conceive of, he's the Trig!
Warhammer Fantasy: Divided Loyalties - an Advisor's Quest
- Thread starter Boney
- Start date
- Fantasy Users' Choice!
Voted best in category in the Users' Choice awards.
He's not the Stig, he's the Stig's professor, he's solved conundrums nobody else could conceive of, he's the Trig!
Turn 32 Social - 2485.5 - Part 1
[*] [ROMANCE] Continue a monogamous relationship with Panoramia.
[*] Cython, to discuss the Gods of Kislev and the Kurgan.
[*] Qrech, to discuss his newly-acquired diploma from the University of Altdorf.
[*] Eike Hochschild, to get to know your future business partner.
[*] Elder Hluodwica, High Priestess of Esmerelda and civilian leader of the Eight Peaks Halflings.
[*] Cython, to discuss the Gods of Kislev and the Kurgan.
[*] Qrech, to discuss his newly-acquired diploma from the University of Altdorf.
[*] Eike Hochschild, to get to know your future business partner.
[*] Elder Hluodwica, High Priestess of Esmerelda and civilian leader of the Eight Peaks Halflings.
"It seems I have erred in overlooking what you call the Old World - an admirably egocentric label - in my research of the Gods," Cython says as it peruses the books on Kislev you've brought down into the guest room dedicated to it. "I visited it a few times in the aftermath of the Elf-Dwarf War, but their Gods seemed mostly aped from the Elves whose ruins they built upon. Hoeth and Morai-Heg as parents, Isha as the daughter, Myrmidia being the only novel element. But then they decided on a new addition to their pantheon, and I admit that at first I was as fooled as they. A horned God of savage competition and self-interest? Kurnous, clear as noon. When I next visited, the few survivors were scattered far and wide."
"We call them the 'Classical' or 'Southern' Gods," you note, "as opposed to the 'Elder' or 'Northern' Gods that the ancestors of the Empire brought with them - Taal, Rhya, Manann, and Ulric."
"The wilds, fertility, the ocean," it says dismissively. "Ulric is another puzzle. Ellinilli, perhaps?"
"I once heard a Laurelorn Elf theorize the same. Who or what are the Ellinilli?"
"Elven Gods of natural destruction fathered by Ellinill, who then grew mistrustful and devoured most of them. Some of them have grown beyond their origins - Mathlann became God of the Sea, Drakira the Goddess of Vengeance, Addaioth has been trying to become a God of Weapons. Ulric may have been a God of blizzards or similar that grew beyond His origins."
"Ulric is said to be brother to Taal," you note.
"It is my suspicion that mortal labels do not apply well to relationships among the Gods." It snorts. "Or perhaps they do, and they are as tumultuous and variable as those of mortals. Ask a Priest of Asuryan who sired Nethu."
"Why do you theorize that there must be so much crossover between the different pantheons?"
It tilts its head. "Why would there not be? Do two dragons share a hunting ground? Two kings a kingdom?"
You consider the point, and have to admit there could be merit to it. You've yourself witnessed Ranald in conflict, first against Stromfels and then against Mork. You've also recently read of Kislevite Gods, and Ursun's Cult is said to have a fraught relationship with Ulric's. Did that reflect the relationship between the Gods, where Ulric and Ursun's conceptual territories are too similar, bringing the two into conflict because it causes them to... what? Detract from each other? Be able to prey upon each other?
"I can see the question roiling inside you like a gathering storm," Cython notes. "To Hysh, it is the moment of realization that is most satisfying, and the rest is simply the thrill of the hunt. To Ulgu, the seeking itself must energize."
You turn your attention to your Windsight, and note that indeed the Ulgu in the room has gathered around you like an aura. It's not enough for you to notice unless you're looking for it, though maybe that changes as one grows more and more attuned to a Wind. "As a Wizard, maybe," you say. "As a scholar, I'd like some hard answers."
"And as a dragon, it is a matter of great regret that I cannot hunt and eat light. We can never satisfy every facet of our nature."
---
"The Kurgan worship the Chaos Gods," you say to Cython later, after it had moved on from Kislevites to Chaos Marauders. "Which I expected. But they have a pantheon of one-two-four-eight - one sun, two moons, four Chaos Gods, and Eight Winds. It was surprising to me to read about, and then encounter, a people that consider Priests and Wizards to be so similar."
"I doubt they worship Asuryan or Lileath, so it might be erroneous worship - I doubt the celestial bodies care for or respond to worship. Their worship of..." It flips through the book. "'Ghyranek' might be an aspect of Chaos worship, perhaps a representation of Chaos Undivided. I have heard of Beastmen that worship Chaos itself and spurn the Chaos Gods. But as for the Winds, to worship them as Gods is incorrect, but why is it incorrect?"
"I assume you're going for something deeper than 'because Winds aren't Gods'."
"Correct. What is the vital difference between these two varieties of foreign energy with distinct preferences?"
A hefty question, but one you are not approaching unassisted. "Winds are reliable and ambient. 'I do not wish to trust the continued benevolence of a deity whose need for my faith and dedication might far outweigh my own need for His or Her aid.' That was said by Volans, the first leader of the Empire's Colleges of Magic."
"It is a vital difference, and one that makes all the difference in the wisdom of adopting one or the other. The Winds are available freely, acting according to their nature in the same way that air and water and soil are. But I observe that though Hysh asked nothing of me, it has dictated as much of my life and preferences and activities as the most demanding God. Could you say differently?"
You consider the question, and have to admit that as much of a constant presence Ranald is in your life, Ulgu is more so. "No, I couldn't. Are you suggesting that the Winds are, what, Gods playing the long game?"
"I do not believe that to be the case," Cython says, ruffling its wings in a draconic shrug. "But I have yet to find a way to prove that it isn't. There are many theories as to why the energies of the Aethyr change so drastically and fundamentally when they enter this world, and that there are Eight guarding the entrance to this world and countering the corruption of the Four is far from the least likely of those theories. There is also an argument to be made that the Winds are Gods that exist primarily in this world, where the other Gods exist primarily in the other. To prove or disprove either requires more insight into the nature of the Gods than I possess." It grins, a sudden flash of glinting vertices. "Yet."
---
To all to whom these Letters shall come, Greeting; The Warden of the University of Altdorf, on the recommendation of the Council of Masters and by virtue of the authority in them vested, have conferred on Quirin Waramunt who has satisfactorily pursued the Studies and passed the Examinations required therefor, the Degree of Baccalaureate Philosophiae in the Social Science of Near Eastern Studies with all the Rights, Privileges, and Honours thereunto appertaining. Given this Eighth Day of Vorgeheim, Two Thousand Four Hundred and Eighty-Five.
The framed certificate is on display on the wall of Qrech's cell, nestled amongst the many shelves filled with books and carved wooden figures. Qrech chitters with pride every time his eyes fall upon it, but judging by the papers resting upon his desk Qrech is far from finished with his terrorizing of the University of Altdorf. Ever since he learned that an advanced degree would confer upon him the title of 'Doctor' his eyes have been set on it, apparently as a balm to a sense of inadequacy that every Skaven of House Moulder who do not participate in the art of their Clan feels.
"And then I shall teach," Qrech says, in between carefully gnawing a fresh point onto his quill. "And in doing so, reveal the vulnerabilities of the Chaos Dwarves to the surface races. Every blow that weakens them will strengthen Moulder." He seems to mean it, but there was more conviction and pride in his voice at the start than at the end. He seems to be trying to convince himself that the comfort he's found in his academic niche is still serving his distant Clan. And then he perks up and waves a claw at his bookshelf. "And when all respect my words as master of the doom of the eastern foes? A book. All Qrech's knowledge carved onto wood and stamped onto a hundred, a thousand copies. And when those books grow old, copied into new books. I have read of the Ambush at Mount Cragg, words from ten lifetimes ago. The Battle of Kurgel's Gulch from fifty lifetimes ago. The song of Sir Baldrin of Brionne from seventy lifetimes ago." He chitters, patting the spines of his books. "Qrech will die, but Qrech's words will outlive all. Even the favoured who get the long-life concoctions. Even Throt. Even Lord Verminkin."
"That's a worthy ambition," you note.
"Qrech has many advantages," he says with clear pride. "One Professor has personally fought Chaos Dwarves. Did so during an attack on his caravan. A paltry skirmish with their lowest soldiers. Very respected, treated as an authority." He sniffs. "Qrech has lead small armies against the Eastern Dwarves. Qrech has slain them. Qrech has feasted on their flesh. Qrech has seen Bull Centaurs and Daemonsmiths and K'Daai. Qrech's victory is assured."
---
"Gods above," Wilhelmina says, settling back gingerly into the well-cushioned seat on the balcony of the EIC's headquarters. "The years sneak up on you. I've spent too many years sitting on hard wooden carriage seats and the bill's come due."
"From the paperwork, you don't seem to have lost a step," you observe as you sit yourself on a significantly less cushioned one.
"Here's hoping you're right, and it's just my back that's playing up. It's easy to hunker down, we'll really see how well I'm doing when that canal is finally done and we have to fight off everyone with a boat and a dream." She sighs, and runs her hand through her hair. "Anyway, what brings you here today?"
"I wanted to spend some time with Eike, get to know my future partner."
"Good idea, better to inculcate the proper terror of the Grey Order early on. My sons might have turned out worth a damn if I had you around to scare them into submission. Tillie!" A few moments later a frazzled-looking assistant pokes her head out. "Go get Eike and bring her up."
"Do you want to be there while I talk to her?"
She shrugs. "Probably for the best not to, she and I haven't been getting along of late. Inherited my temper, probably." You let that pass uncommented as Wilhelmina hauls herself back up with a groan.
A few minutes after Wilhelmina disappears back inside, Eike appears at the doorway. "You wanted to see me, Dame Weber?"
"Take a seat," you say. She moves to do so, but hesitates halfway. "Something wrong?"
"Your shadow is looking at me," she says - her voice wary rather than outright scared, to her credit.
"It does that. It's harmless, it moves around a bit but in other respects it's like any other shadow."
Eike takes a seat, still watching the shadow. "Is that a Wizard thing?"
"A Grey Wizard thing, yes. Give it a poke if it will make you feel better." She does so hesitantly, then with a frown of concentration as her pokes try to chase the retreating shadow along the wall. You take the opportunity to give her a once-over - she's neatly if plainly dressed, sports a few inkstains, and seems to be in good health. Under your Windsight she's largely untouched, but close scrutiny reveals a few traces of Chamon and Aqshy. She'd probably been in tutoring before being called to meet you which could explain the Wind of Metal. The Wind of Fire is tricky, it could be the result of enthusiasm or annoyance, so it's hard to draw any conclusions from that. You refocus on the physical world as the shadow finally retreats entirely from Eike's reach and she turns back to you. "You're going to be my partner in the EIC one day," you comment.
She nods firmly. "When oma retires. Going to Keep The Wagons Rolling and help everyone by getting the things where they need to be." You can practically hear the capital letters in her voice as she parrots a phrase she probably heard from Wilhelmina.
You smile. "That's one way to describe what we do."
"Oma says that you're here to Keep Us Honest and it's a good thing that I'd be in charge because if my father was you'd have to shoot him." She eyes the revolvers on your hip curiously. "Would you?"
"If I had to," you admit. "Getting everything where it needs to be is important. Some people think they can make money by interfering with that."
"They try to Skin The Sheep," she says, nodding. "Oma says not to, and that when my Dooming said to 'beware the cloven hoof' it wasn't talking about sheep, and it's a metaphor anyway."
"She's probably right." You consider all the other possible cloven-hoofed dangers, and decide to move the conversation along. "So if you've had your Dooming, have you had your Quickening too?"
She makes a face. "The Priestess explained a whole bunch of things she said I'll be interested in one day."
You nod. The Dooming and the Quickening are supposed to happen at about the same time, but in small villages they happen whenever the right Priests come by, so you'd ended up never having yours. "And what did you do after?" you ask casually.
"Fed the doves. I had to go to the park to do it because oma said if I fed them here they'd hang around and poop on her chair."
You nod. She's a Shallyan, then. You can work with that.
---
"Done?" Wilhelmina says distractedly as you enter her office.
"Seems like a decent kid," you say, and note Wilhelmina's frown. "You don't agree?"
"She's ten, she's supposed to be an adult now, but she's nowhere near where she should be. Her tutors say she's getting there, but I half-suspect they're just saying that so I don't fire them. She seemed so bright when I adopted her."
"If she's getting there, she'll get there. Are you in a hurry to retire?"
"Far from it. I just don't want what I build collapsing the second I settle down or keel over." She sighs, and shuffles some papers. "While you're here, I might as well get you updated, save some money on scribing."
"Sure."
"Short version: Sylvania's still quiet and those last two holdouts are still besieged, and there's rumours that Roswita will finally finish it this coming spring - but then, there's been rumours of that for every spring since she showed up. Piracy is still huge, still taking big chunks out of the competition, still taking very few chunks out of us - those galleys have been a big help in filling gaps in River Warden schedules."
She slides over papers and you run your eyes over the distilled reports to see if anything jumps out at you. "Outbreak of disease among the canal workers?"
"Bad meat or bad water," Wilhelmina says with a shrug. "It happens, especially with that many people in one place. The Dwarves say it shouldn't set back the schedule too much."
"You think it's natural?"
"You don't?"
"It'd be normal most of the time, but this is a Dwarven project in a remote area. They'd be supplying food and water, and they'd be making sure they were clean."
"Surely the Marienburgers wouldn't..." She frowns. "They wouldn't, would they? I mean, sure, piracy and sabotage, but fomenting disease? That would be..." Her frown deepens. "I'll have a word with some Witch Hunters."
"Good. I do hope that it's nothing, but if they're willing to even flirt with the Ruinous Powers like that..."
She shudders. "Gods, I hope it's nothing. In other news..."
You raise your eyebrows as Wilhelmina drops two bulging purses on the table. "Business has been that good?"
She shakes her head exasperatedly. "It's not your cut, it's already yours. You haven't touched the profits from that factory since you first left for Eight Peaks."
"Oh, right." You frown and eye the purses, trying to calculate if the Bursar is going to get snippy about this.
"Bloody Wizards. That shadow of yours and the smoke and the candles playing up, that's par for the course. But 'oh, right'? That's just not natural. It's enough money to buy a house and you just had it sitting there."
"I am supposed to be under a Vow of Poverty," you protest. "That's why I asked you to plough it all into expanding instead of buying me out."
"Which I did, but I'm not taking your actual money to do so. There's a line and that's it." She shakes her head again and rummages in her papers. "Right, gong farming. I kept the model you were using - subscription to pay for the collectors, fertilizer sales to pay for the factories. Where it already existed it was mostly ad hoc for fertilizer, only a few big towns were doing it for cleanliness and health, so Rudiger was able to use the threat of undercutting and a promise of better wages to absorb what there was without much trouble. We've broken ground on factories in Blutdorf and Franzen, should be ready when the first round of the material is ready for processing. The only question is the output." She eyes you across the desk.
"How do you mean?"
"It's a lot of management and set-up for a modest return on investment. You wouldn't be bothering if it wasn't about the niter. Zhufbar has the current output locked into a contract, but a lot more is about to be made. What's the plan for it?"
[ ] Sell the niter to Zhufbar
[ ] Sell the niter to Karak Eight Peaks
[ ] Sell the niter to Nuln
[ ] Plan to set up EIC gunpowder production in Stirland
[ ] Plan to set up EIC gunpowder production in Karak Eight Peaks
[ ] Other (write in)
- Qrech's portion was meant to be a fair bit longer as he and Mathilde hashed out a suitable future for him, but while double-checking Skaven lifespans I came across the death scene of Sleek Sharpwit and Qrech's ambition fell right into place.
- Keep in mind that Cython's theories are not WoG about the setting's metaphysics. This is recreational for Cython, rather than being approached as a hard science.
- The text of Qrech's diploma was originally posted here.
You think... you think any beyond your own scrap of hill knows or cares who you are? You think in fifty years any will remember? You are impossible, mad-thing. You do not know the meaning of forever. Look at me! I am still alive and already forgotten! [...] We scurry through time, like the rats in Fizqwik's wheel. Over and over the same mistakes. I am glad to be done. I am sick of it. We steal so much from the dwarf-things, more than any care to admit, but never that. Respect for what is past. [...] It would be nice... to be remembered.
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- Location
- being near locations is my passion.
AH CRAP! MONEY!
Quick, get rid of it - before the Bursar comes after us!
Since there does not seem to be a moratorium;
[X] Plan to set up EIC gunpowder production in Karak Eight Peaks
This way Mathilde and K8P get the most immediate use out of the Niter.
[X] Plan to set up EIC gunpowder production in Karak Eight Peaks
This way Mathilde and K8P get the most immediate use out of the Niter.
Qrech is just so... wholesome.
- Location
- Spain
Doomed Wombat
Let's go Darling!
- Location
- Dancing on wires!
Once again a reminder of the sorry state of the skaven... 
Omegahugger
Inattentive Idiot
Okay, so I think I know how we could prove that the Winds of Magic are actually divine. First, we develop a way to kill Gods, test it on some unwanted God like The Horned Rat or Sigmar, and then we see if we can use it to slay one of the Eight.
Probably the Celestial Wind, just to see the look on their faces.
A worthy ambition.
Although Qrech, if you wanted to, you could, you know, just keep teaching after you die. We could do that for you, if you ask us.
Asheram
Not quite altogether
- Location
- Δ Hidden Forbidden Holy Ground
Immortality through creation rather than destruction. Imagine if all Skaven were like that, then their empire would rise, and rise, and rise. Alas, their culture suggests that they'd rather sabotage each other to get ahead instead of working fully towards it.
- Location
- Leeds
Yup, just load all that shit on a barge and float it off to K8P.
I don't think this is really practical even if producing their own gunpowder would be strategically very important.
This seems likely to run into trouble with the Dwarven gunpowder makers.
tapkomet
Senātus Populusque Rōmānus
- Location
- Ukraine
Proposal: sell it all to Marienburg, then we can be said to be giving them lots of shit
- Location
- Mid-Atlantic
Good on Qrech for finding a workable ambition.
It was, in an indirect kind of way, inspired by him.
It took me a while to get myself to read Shepherd's Crown - it was the last Pratchett book, and I didn't want there to be none left. And while I enjoyed it, it was less than I hoped. A lot of people have criticized Shepherd's Crown and I can't really dismiss those criticisms, because the cracks are fairly clear to see for anyone familiar with how good things used to be. But one of the criticisms that I never liked was that the redemption arc for the Queen of the Elves 'came out of nowhere', though it took a while to figure out why. After ruminating on why for a while, I remembered that in one of his later letters, Tolkien expressed regret that he had painted the Orcs as irredeemable. Drawing that line made me recontextualize Shepherd's Crown and realize what it was, instead of what I wanted it to be. I wanted one last Terry In His Prime book, but it was never going to be that. What it was is Terry, through herculean effort, managing to communicate in depth his intentions for the setting, tell the last story he had in him as best he could, and put right all that needed putting right so he could rest peacefully and without regrets. The world will go on after Granny Weatherwax dies. The story goes on, even if its telling has ended. Men can be Witches, and Elves can be redeemed.
So, I like to think, can Skaven.
So, I like to think, can Skaven.
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- Location
- New York
- Pronouns
- He/Him
[ ] Plan to set up EIC gunpowder production in Stirland
This would be good for Stirlands development. If it's good enough for dwarves, it's good enough for human competition. They're already making high end rifles, this is good.
This would be good for Stirlands development. If it's good enough for dwarves, it's good enough for human competition. They're already making high end rifles, this is good.
- Location
- Europa, Jupiter Orbit
Since we are mostly just creating a style that uses Branulhune's features and mastering the basics of what can be done with it, doesn't that mean that there are even greater heights that can be reached with that blade?
Also, what exactly is Near East Studies in this world? IRL it would be everything from the Middle East and Caucasus till India IIRC. Here Arabya isn't east, the Badlands are inherently to the point that culture of any kind since Strygos can't really retain ground, knowledge on Ind is fairly limited and the Karaz Ankor sound like their own specific field of study.
The thing that would be shipped around is niter crystals, rather than the raw materials.
Theoretically.
Chaos Dwarves, Ogres, the Kurgan, Hobgoblin Khanates, and the various trade roads and posts between east and west.
- Location
- Brazil
FlyingScanian
Tea Addict
- Location
- Land of Eternal Night
- Pronouns
- He/Him
Bad time to be drinking tea and then remember Ranald. Will certainly be interresting
It's pencilled in for once the visiting traditionalists are outside of screaming range.
- Location
- alphen aan den rijn
i say sell it to nuln i might help gain some friends and a bit more profit?
Holy shit, that is an incredible revelation. The people of Kavzar used to worship The Horned Rat? That certainly recontextualises a lot about the Doom of Kavzar myth. The stranger adding his contribution to the Great Temple might well be a metaphor for the people including an evil god as part of their pantheon.
And then I could easily see the Horned Rat deciding to... tweak his worshippers, to make them more like him, so that they would only worship him...
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- Location
- France
I wonder how often some genius academic makes the incredible discovery that there's a species of technologically advanced beastmen living beneath the Empire, only to end up an extremely disappointed victim of censorship and "yes, everyone who mattered knew all along".
And I wonder how many of these discoveries will come from Qrech's students investigating him and his wild tales!
And I wonder how many of these discoveries will come from Qrech's students investigating him and his wild tales!
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Mathilde actually made the same mistake as Cython not long ago.