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Warhammer Fantasy: Divided Loyalties - an Advisor's Quest

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Lurker of Urk said:
Can we re-attune dragon bones though? because if not, then we're likely to get a bunch of bones of the wrong wind. (This isn't rhetorical, I don't know if this has been confirmed)
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By my understanding, yes, we just need to expose it to enough Ulgu; think of it like building up momentum.
Lurker of Urk said:
Also I doubt that anything would be comparable to a staff made from our own bones. (Would the seed of regrowth allow us to heal from a missing bone, and would Mathilde actually go for that?)
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Valmond said:
Why a third arm?
Just chop one of the current ones and then use the regen seed to regrow it. :V
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It got nerfed, probably, in hindsight, specifically to prevent this.
 
fictionfan said:
It's not like dwarfs forget. Also it is likely going to have to last us awhile we don't have an easy way to get more now.
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I remind you that they are Dwarfs. Earning favours is as easy as asking who they have grudges against and applying sword to neck until resolved.

We can also go into negative favours and invite them to cash in their Mathilde favours. Although that is probably murder on our action economy.
 
Angelform said:
I remind you that they are Dwarfs. Earning favours is as easy as asking who they have grudges against and applying sword to neck until resolved.

We can also go into negative favours and invite them to cash in their Mathilde favours. Although that is probably murder on our action economy.
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Which is to say applying an indeterminate amount of actions going who knows where, probably in horrible danger wholly unrelated to the current narrative. I don't think there will be a lot of votes for that.
 
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chocolote12 said:
Like what? The only other thing that's even been mentioned to be Ulgu-conducive is the wood of a particular kind of tree that we used as Timber in our wizard towers, and dragon bone is better than it is, once it's been properly attuned.

Like, Dragons are the dominant single-wind-spellcasting organism. Their entire body is made to channel whatever wind they're attuned to. The only thing that'd be comparable is if we had a third arm that we could chop off, or something.
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Where are you getting the bolded? I can't recall anything like that in the quest or GW canon.
 
Omegahugger said:
The only other strict single-wind-spellcasting organism I can think of is humans, and when that's the competition I don't think it's much of a stretch to say dragons are dominant.
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Pretty much. There's one example of mono-wind attunement in nature, and it is Dragons. Dragons embody their wind; they're basically living avatars of it. The Ice Dragon is just called that because 'Hardlight Dragon' sounds too sci-fi.
 
Lupercal said:
Oookkkkaaaayyyyy, but thats pure supposition and you treated it like hard fact in your post.
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I'm not sure how to respond to this. It is... self evident? It is a thing we know? Do you think there is a secret, better organism for attuning to the winds hiding out somewhere, when nothing that could meet that definition has ever been expounded upon in the written canon of Warhammer, according to my understanding?

Like, calling it supposition is confusing me because it is, as far as I understand it, a statement of fact.
 
Humbaba said:
Honestly I'd like it if we could get a couple of years where Belegar gives us free reign to pursue our own projects after the skaven job. We have a number of things that might be very, very good if we actually have some time to pursue them, and with the Karak reclaimed now is a good time while the Waystone issue is considered.
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As I think Pickle already suggested, the way to do this is to convince Belegar to assign us these research projects as our Task.

As for earning occasional Dwarf Favour, or perhaps even converting College Favour into Dwarf- there may be another avenue available. We once tried to make an enchanted Spider Horn for the Rangers to commemorate the Spider Incident, which would IIRC have earned 2DF, had we not failed the roll badly.
(I suppose this now needs to be clarified as being the First Spider Incident.) :V

Maybe making or commissioning commemorative devices for the shared deeds in reclaiming K8P, doing something to repay the Dalaz Kron of Belegar. The human magic doesn't have to be used by Dwarves, then.
It might also be difficult to distinguish from our duties as a Loremaster, but maybe this is a source of Dwarf Favour if we start running low.

Or, perhaps there are even Ranger-level 'unusual' dwarves in K8P for which commissioning a device would be doable.
An Ulgu Lens Solar Forge for prospector-smelters?
 
Lupercal said:
Oookkkkaaaayyyyy, but thats pure supposition and you treated it like hard fact in your post.
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When all evidence seems to point towards a certain widespread belief being true, and there seems to be nothing contradicting it, then the belief may as well be a fact. Even if nobody has examined all of forms of life in Warhammer and assigned each of them Magic Affinity stats.

That stays the case until an individual claiming otherwise can find compelling evidence supporting their position.
 
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chocolote12 said:
a statement of fact.
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I don't see your reasoning around it being possible to re-attune dragonbone.

If dragons become avatars of their wind, and their bones gain intrinsic properties from that, then I'd think that changing wind alignment would damage that. So we don't just need dragonbone, we need the bones of an ulgu dragon, which may or may not exist.

If dragon bones don't gain intrinsic properties from the winds they are saturated with, and are just reservoirs and conductors instead, then human bones are competitive again, and ulgu aligned wood might even be better if the ulgu alignment is a property of the wood, and not just a consequence of it being filled with ulgu already.

Some of your statments are facts, some are plausible but not confirmed, and some seem wrong to me.

We don't actually know for sure though.
 
Alectai said:
Incidentally @BoneyM , there does seem to be some ambiguity, but could you confirm that Dragonbone is--in general--just a really good conduit for magical force and can be adapted for pretty much whatever Wind you want as long as you put some effort in to attune it properly?
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BoneyM said:
The amount of effort it takes would depend on the dragon itself, but yes, it's very adaptable.
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Alectai said:
Hrm, so basically a Carmine Dragon bone would be harder to aspect to something like Ghyran (As Carmine Dragons are the ones that respire Shyish) while a theoretical Light Dragon would reject attunement to Ulgu but on the whole, barring some bad luck, you can pivot it over to what you need, with greater or lesser difficulty depending on how far away it is from your desired Wind on the wheel, right?
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BoneyM said:
Correct. You're basically reversing the process that occurred when the dragon was alive.
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Lurker of Urk said:
I don't see your reasoning around it being possible to re-attune dragonbone.
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It is Quest canon.
 
It also sounds time-consuming, whether in actions to force the wind change, or elapsed time (leaving them to soak in the Ulgu tower?)

I'm also still not convinced we know for sure the results will be better than with Ulgu-aligned wood. Certainly not convinced the cost-benefit is going to be better, if we do have to spend actions in recalibrating their wind alignment.
 
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Just drop it in a puddle of mist. We're sitting on a big bucket of the stuff. If it takes more than an action (a constant source of activity for six months) to plug the bone into our gigantic battery designed to push Ulgu into things we're doing something wrong.
 
Alternatively, we keep it in a tube of Aethryc Vitae. That way it gets attuned to all the winds and/or Dhar.

... Now I want to experiment with the effects of various dragon materials on AV. Are you guys sure we can't kill the Ice Dragon for its shiny loot? Even if you want us to date them, we could just cast Raise Dead after that!
 
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chocolote12 said:
Just drop it in a puddle of mist. We're sitting on a big bucket of the stuff. If it takes more than an action (a constant source of activity for six months) to plug the bone into our gigantic battery designed to push Ulgu into things we're doing something wrong.
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Simply dropping a different-wind-aligned bone in Ulgu probably leads to Dhar, though.
The Shyish-kebabs only stayed pure because they weren't exposed to other winds. Either the dragon bones are supersaturated and don't let Ulgu in naturally, or they do, then the winds mix and then Dhar.

Crikey, just had the unwelcome thought we might have to spend an action investigating how to purge dragon bone of the Ghur or whatever, before we can do it.
 
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Eh, 300 gold isn't really a big deal anymore, and if we want to get into enchanting, having some dragon bone laying around will be usefull no matter what.
 
Omegahugger said:
Alternatively, we keep it in a tube of Aethryc Vitae. That way it gets attuned to all the winds and/or Dhar.

... Now I want to experiment with the effects of various dragon materials on AV. Are you guys sure we can't kill the Ice Dragon?
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I'm pretty sure we physically can't kill the ice dragon. I doubt the entire Karak could do it. And that's before you get into the ethical issue of murdering a sentient being that's minding its own business (and who a good number of us ship Mathilde with) just to run experiments.

That said, the idea of dropping dragon bone in AV to see what happens is an interesting one. Just so long as we're a long way away from any potential ground zero.
 
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NSMS said:
I'm pretty sure we physically can't kill the ice dragon. I doubt the entire Karak could do it. And that's before you get into the issue of murdering a sentient being that's minding its own business (and who a good number of us ship Mathilde with) just to run experiments.
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When has attempted murder ever stopped a good ship from sailingDoes it really count as murder if their soul is still located inside their body and said body is still moving?

Yes, I know it is still unethical to conduct scientiffic experiments without obtaining informed consent of the participants, but Mathilde already killed enemy noncombatants in cold blood. So really, the question is if this act is significantly more unethical than the other things we've done. Common consensus says yes
 
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