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Warhammer Fantasy: Divided Loyalties - an Advisor's Quest

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On that sabotage scene that Ulgu poke wasn't a casual use of the second secret was it.

Because i can just imagine the puritanical hurt feelings if such a casual use of 'temptation' was done without a vote, i can't imagine it was.

It was 'just' introducing Ulgu to produce more unwanted Dhar into the Dhar casting of the baby necro?
 
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SCO said:
On that sabotage scene that Ulgu poke wasn't a casual use of the second secret was it.
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No. The Second Secret is a Dhar spell, not a dispel.
BoneyM said:
Previous experience had convinced me that mystery boxes were catnip for questers. The learning process truly never ends.
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Mystery Boxes are a gamble, but QM Choices are certainties. The only thing that beats maybe getting a cool thing is definitely getting a cool thing.
 
BoneyM said:
You could theoretically bootstrap past that using obscene amounts of charcoal, and the Empire is very heavily forested. The problem is there's a lot of competition for said forests.
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And I'm guessing the Dwarves have access to most of the Coal and oil producing sites because that's how they make coke for their steam engines?
 
Rafin said:
Has anyone here actually heard of a quest where two different groups of voters control two different entities?
The closest I can think of was this one Worm quest across SB/SV where on one forum people controlled an alternate Taylor while on the other they controlled her Shard that was trying to drive her to conflict and other data gathering opportunities.
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Literally every arms race quest ever.
 
ninjafish said:
I mean the only reason not to be a vampire is if you like dying after less than a century.
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Putting aside for the moment my previously mentioned distrust of Dhar and any achievements resulting from it. Nagash used to be human and used the power of dhar to transform himself into something more. Nagash did not do so by becoming a vampire. A vampire is a lesser existence than Nagash. In xianxia terms, the problem with vampires is that they have flimsy foundations. They transform into a state that no longer transforms. Throwaway the advantage of humanity for a small boost in power. In the longer term, there is little prospect of them being anything more than a vampire who is a little more skilled. They have hit a bottleneck in power they cannot progress through.

So the fear of old age may be a good enough reason to pursue becoming a vampire as a last resort. That does not make it a first resort, it would be better to end up a vampire by actually inventing the longevity ritual yourself. It would be better still to find a way past the Dhar induced limitations of vampirism to produce a longevity ritual that does not rely on Dhar at all.
 
In hindsight, I am actually wondering if the vooks on Shyish might let us jumpstart into a second wind of magic?
What's the rules/social policies for learning two winds at a time? Is it normally not viable because people can see the einds like we can (windsage) or is it the fear of mixing those winds by accident and doing a Dhar?
 
BungieONI said:
No.

Because the QM explicitly said No to such plans.

I swear this update is a great showcase for how people don't read everything in an update.
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Given that he outright used the word 'cunning' I'm pretty sure he read everything in the update and he was just joking.

ninjafish said:
So basically humanities fucked?

Unless they switch to warp stone or someone can figure out a substitute for aforementioned warp stone?
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Against the skaven? Yes, absolutely. Against everyone else? No. The Empire is a lot stronger than it was since its foundation thanks to better technology and more magic, while its non-skaven enemies haven't really grown any more powerful than when they started. Now's the time when the Karaz Ankor really starts reaping the benefits from allying with the Empire over two thousand years ago.
 
Ranking the books:
  1. Shysh and death gods. We have two current acquaintances who'd gain by reading these books and they fall squarely into the interests of the Amethyst College without having headline levels of forbidden lore so it would be simple to trade some in for favour and we won't get in trouble for having them. Theology and divine magic are relevant to our own interests. Extra shysh lore adds to our library.
  2. Vampires and dhar: Vampires are the most dangerous of the undead and comprise the leadership in Sylvania. The vampire lore has obvious potential to be useful. However, the dhar lore is very unlikely to help us because we will not be wielding dhar. Having the dhar lore present contaminates this part of the collection as far as openly adding to our library too.
  3. Necromancy and undead: Lesser undead are less interesting. Necromancy is forbidden, uses the wrong wind for us and we already have the Liber Mortis - we don't need these and we certainly don't need the hassle of hiding them.
 
BoneyM said:
Previous experience had convinced me that mystery boxes were catnip for questers. The learning process truly never ends.
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Yeah, you posted two "shiny trinkets", three "mystery boxes", and two "systemic change" options, explained the value of the last two, and it's a vote where two options can be taken.

It looks like you were 'subtly hinting' for the questers to take the options that are currently winning in a landslide.

Questers are a strange and superstitious lot.

Oh, speaking of votes:
[X] Proof of the 'College of Necromancy'.
[X] Detailed trade ledgers.
 
Thespurgin said:
In hindsight, I am actually wondering if the vooks on Shyish might let us jumpstart into a second wind of magic?
What's the rules/social policies for learning two winds at a time? Is it normally not viable because people can see the einds like we can (windsage) or is it the fear of mixing those winds by accident and doing a Dhar?
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You can do it, but you'll be worse at either of them, and also you'll totally go crazy, because you have to go crazy to get good at a wind to begin with, and now you're trying to become two kinds of crazy at the same time.
 
Thespurgin said:
In hindsight, I am actually wondering if the vooks on Shyish might let us jumpstart into a second wind of magic?
What's the rules/social policies for learning two winds at a time? Is it normally not viable because people can see the einds like we can (windsage) or is it the fear of mixing those winds by accident and doing a Dhar?
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Technically you don't because you then go insane because there is dhar forming in your brain. And further body horror because WH is grimdark.

One of the 'advantages' of vampirism is that using dhar to fuel all types magic is possible apparently since there are examples of them learning multiple kinds and their 'soul' (whatever that is in WH) is a vortex of dhar sucking and compressing into dhar small amounts of magic from what would be the warp in wh40k.

Though most prefer necromancy to wind magic for obvious reasons. They even have a (small) amount of protection from insanity, since apparently most necro vampires learn to be functional threats to life instead of usually turning into deranged exiled-mages most often a threat to their own life like multiple wind mages.

Though it might be more of a case of 'eventually' mad. It seems to me, that specimens like Neferata are already kind of torpor-ish to borrow a world of darkness term. In stagnation in spite of being brilhant humans thousands of years ago (she 'invented' the original vampire elixir from Nagash's notes of his version).

Of course, this is all Watsonian. Doylistically vampires are supposed to be secret seductive and reactive, set in their ways monsters, so all the tropes get beaten up in a dark alley by the Games Workshop writers and pieces of them lifted up to form a 'vampire' with a bit of 'magic bad m'kay' alongside.
 
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thepsyborg said:
So:

​

Winds of Magic
uncurdled, individual winds
gaseous phase​
intermediate step in Powerstone production
e.g. Adela Burgstaller's wand
uncurdled, individual winds
fluid phase (gaseous or liquid? possibly depending on physical properties: temperature, pressure, boiling point of the specific wind in question)​
Powerstones
uncurdled, individual winds
solid phase​
High Magic
uncurdled, all eight winds
gaseous phase​
Snekjuice
uncurdled, all eight winds
fluid phase​
Hypothetical Artifact Bullshit Supermaterial?
uncurdled, all eight winds
solid phase​
Dhar
curdled, corrupted multiple winds
gaseous phase​
True Dhar
curdled, corrupted multiple winds
fluid phase​
Warpstone
curdled, corrupted multiple winds
solid phase​
...maybe?
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To go back to this for a moment I'd suggest it's something rather different based on the evidence.

Aethyric vitae is essentially the bare matter of the immaterium before being influence by anything it's essentially unreality in a pure untouched and uninfluenced state.

High magic isn't per se a state of magic so much as a structure imposed on the winds of magic to work in concert with each other. I don't think there is such a thing as a power stone of high magic. Teclis sword for instance is supposed to have a powerstone from each of the winds of magic rather than a Qhaysh stone containing all of them.

So the proposed set High magic -> Snake juice -> Qhaysh power stone, probably doesn't exist.
 
DragonParadox said:
There is no coal and oil. Dwarfish steam engines run on alcohol and charcoal.
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Given there's references to tar pits and coal in other sections of the lore and that coke is oil or coal burnt without oxygen when Gotri talks about coke fuel for his copters unless Boney messed up his definitions a bit that should have come from oil or coal or something similar.
 
BungieONI said:
And I'm guessing the Dwarves have access to most of the Coal and oil producing sites because that's how they make coke for their steam engines?
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Peat coal > coke is the way to create the best fuel. Unfortunately, there's a lot of gribblies that consider bogs and mires to be prime real estate. There's a lot of Dwarves trying to figure out how to accelerate or reproduce the process, but for now most have to make do with charcoal or alcohol.
 
BoneyM said:
Peat coal > coke is the way to create the best fuel. Unfortunately, there's a lot of gribblies that consider bogs and mires to be prime real estate. There's a lot of Dwarves trying to figure out how to accelerate or reproduce the process, but for now most have to make do with charcoal or alcohol.
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Cool!
 
Well, the bright college can turn water into fuel, and just cut out the middleman and create endless sources of heat, so that sounds like a partnership waiting to happen.
 
chocolote12 said:
Well, the bright college can turn water into fuel, and just cut out the middleman and create endless sources of heat, so that sounds like a partnership waiting to happen.
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And its serendipitous that we have a Brighty duckling fall into our lap!

Having our Chapterhouse with a strong Bright presence is good civ.
 
Ah, damn it. Just found out that The Skaven Are Real, and They Are Among Us! can't be canon in Divided Loyalties, because it was finished in 2522 after 10 years of research and it's only 2480 in this game. It has an extraordinary amount of information on the skaven as well as on how to fight them.
 
As an OOC note, I've tried researching abiotic hydrocarbon formation but as far as I can tell it's a spillover battlefield from creationist debates and Soviet science and I can't find reliable answers. Any local chemistry buffs able to weigh in?
 
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