Warhammer Fantasy: Divided Loyalties - an Advisor's Quest
- Thread starter Boney
- Start date
- Fantasy Users' Choice!
Voted best in category in the Users' Choice awards.
When Johann's golden find are discovered, it can force the pageants to decide whether to get into a fistfight with McMetalmuscle for good metal muscles, or another peasant for the gold coins. This moment of contemplation is often enough do then to decide that they probably don't want to get into a first fight at all, but especially not into a magical fist fight.
Scene: The inner sanctum of a Vampires lair in the heart of Sylvania. The Vampire is hard at work, concocting a weapon to destroy the Empire once and for all.
Mathilde emerges from the Shadows wielding a sock full of quarters.
Nah, it should be half a gold bar in a sock. For extra reference.
- Location
- somewhere over there.
- Pronouns
- They/It
But where is Mathilde supposed to find a lemon to wrap around it?
BursarQuest
To be the Bursar of a college is to hold an unglamorous, yet indisputably important, position within the academic hierarchy. It is your role to ensure that the financial apparatus of the institution runs as smoothly as it can, from corralling graduates over their student loans to ensuring that tenured staff receive the grants they need to pursue their research. Should any of these systems falter, then the ruin of the college will swiftly follow—yet many see you as the greedy coinkeeper, constantly raising an unnecessary fuss over other people's finances.
This is even more true when you are the Bursar of the Grey College, who's students and staff consist of the most duplicitous, dishonest, and devious wizards in all the Empire. Manipulation and trickery are bywords for members of the Grey Order, and it's not just your job to collect the dues they lawfully owe to the College, but also that they don't stray outside the lines defined by the various oaths and vows that enable Shadowmancers to even exist, lest the common people's distrust boils over.
Unglamorous, and unenviable—especially when many of those wizards worship Ranald, God of theft and deception.
And now word has just reached you that one of those wizards—a rather promising young Magister—has just attempted to tithe a wagonload of silver to the college.
Actual silver, or so your assistant says, smelted into ingots and stamped with the personal seal of a Dwarf King.
You sigh, and call for more tea.
This is even more true when you are the Bursar of the Grey College, who's students and staff consist of the most duplicitous, dishonest, and devious wizards in all the Empire. Manipulation and trickery are bywords for members of the Grey Order, and it's not just your job to collect the dues they lawfully owe to the College, but also that they don't stray outside the lines defined by the various oaths and vows that enable Shadowmancers to even exist, lest the common people's distrust boils over.
Unglamorous, and unenviable—especially when many of those wizards worship Ranald, God of theft and deception.
And now word has just reached you that one of those wizards—a rather promising young Magister—has just attempted to tithe a wagonload of silver to the college.
Actual silver, or so your assistant says, smelted into ingots and stamped with the personal seal of a Dwarf King.
You sigh, and call for more tea.
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- Location
- North Wales
- Pronouns
- He/Him/His
@Boney If we sent Eike to the College classes on [ ] The Creation of Artificial Familiars, would that fall under the purview of her Natural Alchemist trait?
I'm not really sure on the level of overlap there given how weird artificial familiars are.
If they do involve the same kinds of process, that seems like a fairly natural path to her earning a familiar while simultaneously engaging with interests she's already displayed.
____
Also, is anything available on Kurgan magic through the College Book Purchase option, for researching our artifacts?
I'm not really sure on the level of overlap there given how weird artificial familiars are.
If they do involve the same kinds of process, that seems like a fairly natural path to her earning a familiar while simultaneously engaging with interests she's already displayed.
____
Also, is anything available on Kurgan magic through the College Book Purchase option, for researching our artifacts?
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- Location
- North Wales
- Pronouns
- He/Him/His
Because they're neat, and I'd like to see more scenes with familiar interaction. Because creating familiars seems also very neat, and it's an aspect of magic that Mathilde herself hasn't explored that might be particularly suited to Eike's approach to magic (or not, which is why I raised the question).
The major objection people raised to this purchase turn vote was that "buying a familiar feels uncomfortable, and her finding or making one would be better". So, I'm asking about making one. As a reminder, once she sets out on her Journey, she can't return to Altdorf for classes until she makes Magister, which could potentially be in her late 20s-early 30s. Getting her into the classes for familiar-making while she's an apprentice means she'll be in a better position to do so if and when she wants, even if that's not while shes under Mathilde's care.
The major objection people raised to this purchase turn vote was that "buying a familiar feels uncomfortable, and her finding or making one would be better". So, I'm asking about making one. As a reminder, once she sets out on her Journey, she can't return to Altdorf for classes until she makes Magister, which could potentially be in her late 20s-early 30s. Getting her into the classes for familiar-making while she's an apprentice means she'll be in a better position to do so if and when she wants, even if that's not while shes under Mathilde's care.
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- Location
- New Zealand
No need for a lemon, this is a Terry Pratchett reference, not a Douglas Adams reference. Any proper college-trained wizard should be able to defeat a vastly more powerful magical opponent with half a brick in a sock.
My general problem is that it's us deciding she now needs a familiar. Having someone share your soul should be your decision and not your master pushing you because it's cute.
Eike should decide if she wants a familiar not the thread. I have seen these same problem in parents who think they can decide their kids lives. You can not decide what a person wants and needs to let them decide for themselves. You can be there for them but ultimately they have to decide who they want to be.
- Location
- Finland
Except vampires.
Which sometimes need a lemon stuffed into their mouth.
- Location
- North Wales
- Pronouns
- He/Him/His
And if Eike doesn't want this to happen, it doesn't happen. All I'm asking is whether the classes would fall under the branch of topics that Eike has already demonstrated interest in to the point that she gained a trait for studying them.
Parabola
Divided Loyalties Librarian
- Location
- The Destination of Fate
- Pronouns
- She/Her
By this logic, it'd be simpler to tell Eike "ok my child, I'm giving you 1 CF for the coming turn, you can use it on anything you wish, but you have to use it."
- Location
- North Wales
- Pronouns
- He/Him/His
I don't follow? Sending her to classes is now over-reaching on Mathilde's part as a mentor?
As her teacher, mentor and idolized childhood hero us going "take the "make your own familiar class."" is not quite an order... But man it certainly is pressure.
Parabola
Divided Loyalties Librarian
- Location
- The Destination of Fate
- Pronouns
- She/Her
What I'm saying is, yes, she has developed a trait for studying how mundane materials interact with magic, and it is a unique skill that will be very useful to her, but that does not mean she might want to take the class on artificial familiars specifically. For all we know she could be more interested in staff-turning, or further Enchantment skills.
And if Eike would in fact want lessons on How To Make a Magical Pet, she could take that rather than us pushing her into it.
- Location
- North Wales
- Pronouns
- He/Him/His
Ah well, fuck it. I'll chalk this one up to another case of me being very out of sync when it comes to the thread's ideas on pedagogy.
Talking to Eike about Ranald was proselytising and awful for a good long while. Encouraging her to work through her hangups on learning Sounds remains cruel. Encouraging her to find a companion is overbearing. The only independent action she's had was the charcoal trade route, and the planning for that was that Mathilde would be the one doing it and Eike would be playing the part of the observer, until the update itself flipped the roles.
I find the idea that a student is incapable of showing agency or engaging with or pushing back on their mentor when they disagree to be very weird and infantilising. But then there's a decent portion of the thread that wants to assign Eike a babysitter when we step away for a few weeks after she's 17+.
Talking to Eike about Ranald was proselytising and awful for a good long while. Encouraging her to work through her hangups on learning Sounds remains cruel. Encouraging her to find a companion is overbearing. The only independent action she's had was the charcoal trade route, and the planning for that was that Mathilde would be the one doing it and Eike would be playing the part of the observer, until the update itself flipped the roles.
I find the idea that a student is incapable of showing agency or engaging with or pushing back on their mentor when they disagree to be very weird and infantilising. But then there's a decent portion of the thread that wants to assign Eike a babysitter when we step away for a few weeks after she's 17+.
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I think you are missing the context on some of those. We didn't talk to Eike about Ranald, but about faith in general and how it can be useful to a wizard. Helping her find a way to cast Sounds is fine, but some of the suggestions weren't appropriate. Obtaining a familiar is a very personal process, and our role as a master is to help facilitate that process if she expresses a desire for one, not forcing it on her because we think it'll be good for her.
As her master, our job is to help guide Eike into becoming the wizard she wants to be, not the wizard we think she should be.
I'm not against sending her to the build your own familiar class like I was just gifting her a familiar. But I'm not for it either, it's an advanced subject when she hasn't even finished the first advanced subject we've had her start on (enchanting is still 1/2) and she still has core skills to work on like intrigue and the spellbook. Maybe in a year or so I might consider it as something it might make sense to do.
This isn't really true either though, it's Mathilde's job to let her be the wizard she wants to be sure, but only within the limits Mathilde believes is appropriate.
This isn't really true either though, it's Mathilde's job to let her be the wizard she wants to be sure, but only within the limits Mathilde believes is appropriate.
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- Location
- North Wales
- Pronouns
- He/Him/His
I'm not talking about the most recent social. I'm talking about earlier turns, where suggestions to talk about religion were said to be intruding on a matter that's entirely private. But even there, with the softest option possible, we had arguments like
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- Location
- Greece
I am still convinced that the majority of Grey executions (not all of them, there are bound to be some greedy idiots who just deserved it, but the majority) is just a sneaky way to "disappear" an agent and "appear" a different one elsewhere without raising suspicions.
The execution rate and draconic laws purported by the books makes no sense otherwise, especially considering the assets held not only by us but also by other Grey Magisters we know.
The execution rate and draconic laws purported by the books makes no sense otherwise, especially considering the assets held not only by us but also by other Grey Magisters we know.