Mopman43
Mountain-Hermit of Nitpeak
- Location
- Vermont
How does releasing the codes stop us from making a separate network? If anything, it'd make it easier to make one.
Warhammer Fantasy: Divided Loyalties - an Advisor's Quest
- Thread starter Boney
- Start date
- Fantasy Users' Choice!
Voted best in category in the Users' Choice awards.
- Location
- Aotearoa
That does not match my recollection. I thought we got offered double-tap, because I suggested something like it and Boney thought it was plausible.
I didn't see them as directly connected.
Wasn't there going to be an option to go back and refine the guard bypass technique?
Edit: especially now we've got the trainer sword that doesn't destroy every practise target.
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That's not a Leyline, that's a waystone. And a waystones doesn't span an empire... The Leyline is the thing connecting two waystones. Making a waystone incorruptible is impossible yes, but a Asur Leyline is several feet underground and generally very hard to tap.
- Location
- Argentina
The codes are for the central intelligence to link with new waystones.
Waystones need somewhere to dump their magic to. By allowing us to connect to the vortex, they are solving that problem for us.
- Location
- being near locations is my passion.
Honestly, with Swords plan this turn getting all the people on every task - if it wins, I might be up for dropping a Waystone action and letting a few folk site idle for a turn.I agree that what I foresee happening next turn if Parabola's plan wins is a fight between a WEB-MAT plan without Iron Orcs/the Father and a non-WEB-MAT plan with those things. But, like, that's also true if Windfall wins, because the Apparitions partisans are going to want to do it again. We'll see how it goes.
(We could always cut another Waystone action next turn to make room for our real priorities)
A large part might be 'how useful might Johann be for the Iron Orc action? Personally I'm finding it hard to find arguments to bring him.
- Location
- New Brunswick, NJ
- Pronouns
- He/Him/His
I can see it happening if we go to Nagarythe with the Protector up and impress the right people. Not for anything less than that.
...oh shit, I think you're right. I had assumed that double-tap was there because we rolled so badly on guard bypass, as a replacement for it (in much the same way that after we fucked up our first plan for the deployment of Rite of Way, we could try something else).
But it appears that no, that's not the case, double tap and fixing the guard bypass are separate stretch goals.
Fuck. Now I'm not sure what to do for Branarhune, this throws all my planning out of whack. Shit shit shit; @Parabola, was this what you believed, or is this new information to you too?
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Mopman43
Mountain-Hermit of Nitpeak
- Location
- Vermont
I believe Boney has said outright that the problem that the Iron Orcs have presented- not being able to find them- means Mathilde by herself is the best option.
- Location
- Finland
They have clockwork horses and steam tanks.
fancy magically de lactosed milk is probably fairly easy in comparison.
dinomannitro6
all your gender is belong to us
- Location
- The Land Where The Sunflowers Bloom
when we were making preliminary plans, we were working based of of this WoB:
- Location
- Outside the Box
- Pronouns
- She/Her
Was about to citation this same passage, but I believe you're misreading things. The stretch-goal was given as a way to gain a technique that the guard bypass should have given us. Maybe the name/idea came from Alliterate, maybe not, but to me it looks like it was given in response to us rolling a 9 on the action.
[Branarhune training: Martial, 9+23+7(Library: Greatswords)=39.]
I'll try to find a Boney post about this in the discussion, but for now, I don't believe that this is reason to panic.
NavySeel
"I don't know what I'm doing."
- Location
- Places
Clearly it isn't, Teclis still isn't back.
- Location
- Finland
He has very brittle bones, he needs lots of milk, and can consume only so much at a given time.Clearly it isn't, Teclis still isn't back.
Parabola
Divided Loyalties Librarian
- Location
- The Destination of Fate
- Pronouns
- She/Her
Bold of you to assume he is not lactose intolerant.
Asking the real questions here.Oh definitely. I'm just saying, it'd be a real 'suffering from success' deal if it turned out that we overshot our preparations. But probably not, we already assumed the Rune was the easiest part of the process.
As picklepikkl says, I do think the biggest point of future concern is that the next turn will likely be a fight between making it a Father turn (Forest of Shadows nexus, Damsel recruitment/dealing with Iron Orcs) and a WEB-MAT turn. It seems unlikely that we could do both without having a bunch of project members sit the turn out, which is unappealing.
Even if this is correct, I firmly believe it wouldn't change our priorities. The point of training with the sword is to get good with the sword, and anything that helps toward improving the style is good. And as @dinomannitro6 pointed out, Boney hasn't been talking about needing a sixth action or whatever - the discussion has been centered around whether we go the extra mile after the fourth action to do the fifth.
- Location
- New Brunswick, NJ
- Pronouns
- He/Him/His
That was absolutely the reading of that passage which I've had for the past solid year, but now that Alliterate has pointed it out, I think they're different, for this reason:
Boney talks about them separately and, importantly, talks about them differently with regard to the benefit the training sword provides, which strongly implies that they are distinct options. So there are really two stretch goals for Branarhune, not just one, and we need to decide if we want to do both of them or just one of them.
If given the choice, I think I would prefer to just refine the guard bypass for Branarhune, rather than do the double-tap, and then call the style done, since if the guard bypass works it does the thing the double-tap does but faster, and Boney has said that the training sword would be a "big help" for the guard bypass, meaning we're in better shape to do it than we were before.
The thing I'm worried about is us not being done with the style at the time we thought we would be done with the style, or finishing the style in a suboptimal way because we misunderstood what our options were. As I outline above in this post, I think there's good reason to believe that there are six potential actions for Branarhune, not five: four base and two extra.
Boney, if you see this, can you shed some light on what the potential "stretch goals" for Branarhune are? Is it just the double-tap as a workaround to failing the guard bypass like we'd been thinking, or are both the double-tap and the guard bypass available?
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Yeah, but on the other hand:
Look we can make this work listen:(We could always cut another Waystone action next turn to make room for our real priorities
Plan Father In Shadows (With WEB-MAT and Apparitions I Guess)
- Damsels
- Forest of Shadows
- Waystone follow-up thing (on either Capstone or Leyline)
- Windfall
- Lustrian Rubbings
- Apparition (we probably have to do rider in red. does no one like the whispering darkness?)
Now as far keeping the project members busy goes, yeah we're gonna have and give some of them a six month break, but assuming that the follow up includes roughly the same people as the initial action did (not at all a sure thing) then:
- If we follow up on river leylines only 2 project members are idle (though to be fair those two are Hatalath and Thorek)
- If we follow up on the Capstone 5 project members are idle (Niedzwenka, Zlata, Sarvoi, Cadaeth, and Tochter) but Niedzwenka is doing two actions this turn maybe she'll appreciate the break I dunno, and maybe we can take Zlata with us on the Forest of Shadows because she hit it off with Aksel??? Is this a terrible idea idk
- Location
- Outside the Box
- Pronouns
- She/Her
@Boney Are there three possible AP remaining for the sword style, instead of two? One for finishing the style, one for refining the Guard Bypass, and one for doing the Double Tap as an extra/bonus? For over a year, I (and many others) have been under the impression that there was only 2 AP at maximum instead.
Parabola
Divided Loyalties Librarian
- Location
- The Destination of Fate
- Pronouns
- She/Her
Maaaybe that could work. It'd depend on whether picklepikkl is right or not and us not needing a sixth Branulhune action (which I hope we don't). And of course, it assumes Codifying and Swords wins in the first place. Honestly, we've seen bigger upsets where votes are concerned so I'm not inclined to declare victory just yet and start worrying about next turn's plan. The Windfall or Red Rider plans could still make a comeback. I don't want to tempt fate by saying Swords is a done deal.
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- Location
- North Wales
- Pronouns
- He/Him/His
For all we know this six-months finally tips Egrimm past his limit into writing the paper himself. I don't expect it to, but you never know.
That'd be nice and would free up options for the WEBMAT-dedicated actions.
That'd be nice and would free up options for the WEBMAT-dedicated actions.
- Location
- Oklahoma
Maybe we should just shout at him to write his damn paper while passing him in the halls one day.
Wow I really dont like the leading plan, I was really looking forward to both the windfall paper and the Lustria exploration journals with Lizardmen rubbings, on top of that it's yet another plan that does not make use of our hard earned extra AP in the form of WEB-MAT options.
How our branch college works in general might need to be revisited at some point somehow, there are so many limitations on what we can do with it that making plans that are AP efficient constantly runs into the problem of them needing two WEB-MAT actions, locking us out of doing any self improvement, Ulgu only research, secret research or solo infiltration with the extra AP.
Can we figure out ways to somehow include some more options into it ? Our other organisations have actions to improve them so they can be used in new ways, a WEB-MAT action that allows for multiple Wizards to try something like arcane mark manipulation or training magical skills despite differing in winds
would be incredibly usefull.
How our branch college works in general might need to be revisited at some point somehow, there are so many limitations on what we can do with it that making plans that are AP efficient constantly runs into the problem of them needing two WEB-MAT actions, locking us out of doing any self improvement, Ulgu only research, secret research or solo infiltration with the extra AP.
Can we figure out ways to somehow include some more options into it ? Our other organisations have actions to improve them so they can be used in new ways, a WEB-MAT action that allows for multiple Wizards to try something like arcane mark manipulation or training magical skills despite differing in winds
would be incredibly usefull.
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- Location
- Aotearoa
I don't think they overlap quite to that extent, or at least they didn't in my original conception. Double tap would in my minds eye additionally be able to leverage the Superior Skill Rune quickly.
Debuff a 'hardened target' on the first hit, then cleave through the hopefully weakened opponent on the second tap.
So we could get a debuff hit and a kill shot in the course of one opening in a fight. It'd perhaps be less for dealing with supreme speed and more for dealing with tough, buffed opponents. Like maybe Iron-skinned orcs, perhaps. Shatter the shield or armor, plus remove any buffs, then hit again straight away.
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- Location
- North Wales
- Pronouns
- He/Him/His
The cleanest solution would be for the thread to decide that two Waystones actions a turn is sufficient progress, leaving the standard turn as "2 WEBMAT, 2 Waystones, 1 flex".
I don't think there's many takers for that, though. I'm not sure I'd be a taker for that long-term (two actions here and there is fine, certainly more often than we do, but I'm not sanguine about it as the default)
It turns out that when you're constantly flying across the continent, running two separate research institutes, an international library and a trading consortium, while also teaching an apprentice and keeping up your obligations as a Lady Magister and knight, you don't end up with a lot of free time unless you compromise somewhere.
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Something that compounds the issue is that with the Waystone Project we can assign our wizards to that research, encouraging us to skip on the bonus AP if we want to do another cool action that is Mathilde only.
Magical research we can do with WEB-MAT is getting shafted so often I am starting to hope plans will start skipping the EIC and KAU half AP to get another cool Mathilde only AP instead of the magical research I really care about.
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- Location
- Chicago
- Pronouns
- She/They
The other consideration is whether any organization in Nordland would take the opportunity to take a shot at the elf allies who are diving into isolated and dangerous parts of the province.
They've got more than Kislev: Tochter and Elisse, plus all the other college wizards. And Battle wizards are still roaming the land. So if we can assume that Kislev is going to get tributaries without us doing anything, it seems safe to assume Stirland will as well.
Sell us on it. I'm not super into either the aesthetics or the proposed uses of the red riders, I'd probably vote for San alternative.
- Location
- New Brunswick, NJ
- Pronouns
- He/Him/His
Here's what Boney said about it a year ago:
Out of six turns in Laurelorn, we've gotten the WEB-MAT bonus AP on four of them. That's four free AP, essentially. That's fine. It does not need to be more generous than that.
Personally, the thing I'd like to do in the next ~4 turns or so is get the Library into a good place where we don't need to oversee the day-to-day of its expansion and hand off our organizations, reclaiming the 1 personal AP from those two half-actions. The Nuln deal should help us a lot in establishing ourselves as a Real Library, and we've hired staff and begun their training already, so there isn't a lot more micromanagement for Mathilde to do besides just "picking what library to try to make deals with next."
This is not allowed. We're not permitted to drop the organizations on a turn-by-turn basis. We either keep them, and pay the AP cost, or drop them entirely and not get to pick them up again casually.
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