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To Boldly Go... (a Starfleet quest)

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To Boldly Go... (a Starfleet quest) Starfleet Ship Design Bureau, Refit ("To Boldly Go...")
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So the Breen Romulan war ended in somewhat of a stalemate with the Romulans getting their major colony back while having to concede some evacuated colonies. Which probably stings a bit but not as much as the Breen taking the major world.

But the Breen are well on their way to being the DS9 Breen Confederacy. They will likely develop their damned energy dampening weapon in the next few decades.

Cardassian situation is getting hot again.
 
Well crap.

@anon_user

You are missing opinions from a few member species, including some fairly important ones. The Caitians have a sizeable fleet plus colonies in the GBZ. I'd be very interested in the thoughts of the Ked Paddah and the Honiani, as new members with significant fleets and in the case of the KP recent war experience. The Gaeni, Andorians, and the Orions would also be nice, though secondary. Risa and Caldonia are small and removed enough from the conflict that I can understand leaving them out, but the rest would be nice.

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I know it's not the norm in this thread, but it might be worth slapping a moratorium on the vote to give people time to plan and discuss things. This is a pretty pivotal vote after all.
 
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[X] We should intervene in the Chrystovian invasion.

Because I will be damned if we just sit there and let the fascists do this. General war or no general war, their aggressive ways end now. Bajor shall be our rallying cry. Never Again.
 
I am all for sticking it to the Cardassians as much as possible but this time I think we really need to think about our next moves now.
 
Nervos Belli said:
Well crap.

@anon_user

You are missing opinions from a few member species, including some fairly important ones. The Caitians have a sizeable fleet plus colonies in the GBZ. I'd be very interested in the thoughts of the Ked Paddah and the Honiani, as new members with significant fleets and in the case of the KP recent war experience. The Gaeni, Andorians, and the Orions would also be nice, though secondary. Risa and Caldonia are small and removed enough from the conflict that I can understand leaving them out, but the rest would be nice.
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anon_user said:
This report will only cover those with strong opinions.
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So.
 
My personal opinion:

It has been far too long doing nothing to intervene now. Any squadron we send to Chrystovian space will be entirely sacrificial and won't be large enough to deter the full Cardassian force. Even one with added ISC or HoH ships. Among the intervention options, the best is to hover a warfleet on the border and to try to force the Council to declare general war if the Cardassians still go ahead. I feel that bluff will be called, and deterrence is the name of the game we should have been playing because we actually don't want a general war.

Does anyone see the strategic calculus differently? I'm interested in the dissenting opinion, but not really in devil's advocacy.
 
anon_user said:
Harmony of Horizon
The Harmony are prepared to assemble and equip a large expeditionary force to assist our efforts, finding the Cardassian aggression appalling. However, due to the distance, they would need us to take the lead in any intervention, and would rely on our logistical support.
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This would be very helpful. Having the Harmony on our side for once? Those fleet tenders are something to take seriously, and the Cardassians would certainly think twice if it looked like the Harmony was going to jump into the fray to punch some fascists-the Harmony and Federation working together could basically take on the quadrant.

On the other hand, this could give the Harmony their own opportunity to pull some dirty tricks. From a realpolitik point of view, they'd benefit a great deal from igniting tensions with Cardassia and thus war, drawing our attention away from securing the HBZ. An under-the-table deal with the Cardassians is a possibility...

Ultimately, it does not change my view.

[X] We should not intervene in the Chrystovian invasion.

We have failed on every level to prevent or delay this result in the years after contacting the Chrystovians. The time to act was several years ago. We cannot, and should not, compound our mistake by engaging in such an unfavorable fight.
 
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Okay.

How old are are Cardassian fleet numbers we have? I think they're a few years old.

Whatever.

Tactical battle-engine-wise, we are not in great shape unfortunately. The Cardassians have multiples of their new scout and skirmish frigates in service. We do not. Comet hasn't launched yet and we have only one Kepler. Similarly we are currently disadvantaged in Vanguard compared to Cardassian cruisers.

Strategically, our best option is the one we probably can't take, which is to let the Cardassians commit a third or so of their fleet into the Chrystovian Confederacy and only then declare war and roll over the border with a doomstack of Megatortises and Rialas. Hopefully, if we can push deep enough and hard enough, we can allow the Apiata and STO to undertake some local offensives as well. But we're not going to be able to do that.
 
aceraptor said:
So the Breen Romulan war ended in somewhat of a stalemate with the Romulans getting their major colony back while having to concede some evacuated colonies. Which probably stings a bit but not as much as the Breen taking the major world.

But the Breen are well on their way to being the DS9 Breen Confederacy. They will likely develop their damned energy dampening weapon in the next few decades.
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I still don't understand why the Breen are on the other side of Federation space here than they are in canon. Canon Breen were close to Cardassian space, TBG Breen close to ROMULAN space...

Anyway. The Romulans aren't likely to do anything while our back is turned, since they're still recovering from their last two wars. The Klingons are on good terms with us, and would be only too happy to bitchslap the Romulans if they try anything. Horizon's offer of support is most likely genuine, and standing against the Ashalla Pact will make it easier to claim Bajor in the future...

While what the Chrystovians are doing to prewarp cultures is utterly reprehensible, standing by while the Pact invades is pretty much asking for World War II Recycled IN SPACE, with the Cardassians in the role of Nazi Germany. As such,

[X] We should intervene in the Chrystovian invasion.
 
Night said:
Okay.

How old are are Cardassian fleet numbers we have? I think they're a few years old.

Whatever.

Tactical battle-engine-wise, we are not in great shape unfortunately. The Cardassians have multiples of their new scout and skirmish frigates in service. We do not. Comet hasn't launched yet and we have only one Kepler. Similarly we are currently disadvantaged in Vanguard compared to Cardassian cruisers.

Strategically, our best option is the one we probably can't take, which is to let the Cardassians commit a third or so of their fleet into the Chrystovian Confederacy and only then declare war and roll over the border with a doomstack of Megatortises and Rialas. Hopefully, if we can push deep enough and hard enough, we can allow the Apiata and STO to undertake some local offensives as well. But we're not going to be able to do that.
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I mean, we could do that. We'd marshal our forces at the border, then declare that if the Cardassians invade we will attack. They'd know it was coming, but we'd never be able to hide moving that many ships to the front to begin with.
 
[X] We should intervene in the Chrystovian invasion.

Victoria:
"Fascists? I thought we got rid of those three centuries ago."

Tera:
"What are fascists?"

Victoria:
"Acceptable targets, mostly."
 
[X] We should not intervene in the Chrystovian invasion.

No... no... no.

Do this and we lose the coreward polities to the Harmony of Horizon. Do this and we end any possibility of halting the Gorn/Ittick-ka war. Do this and metatons of ships and years of construction vanish in warp core breaches and beloved characters die. Please, please, please, don't vote to intervene.
 
Welp, saw this coming. In fact I'm surprised it took them this long since we know the Cardassians have been eyeing up the Chrystovians ever since we discovered them.

I'm just questioning what these 'atrocities' the Cardassians claim happen have proof.
 
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While I favor intervention, can we really politically support it? There's a lot of uncertainty and divide in the Federation about whether to intervene or not. And you can bet that the Cardassians will be in PR warfare over drive to chip away at Federation willingness to continue war for the sake of the Chrystovians via showing evidence (real or otherwise) of abuses that they claim the Chrystovians have perpetrated against pre-warp societies.

If said allegations of abuses are true and the claim that the central government of the Chrystovians have turned a blind eye to said abuses is also true, then the average Federation citizens are probably going to have a lot of questions about why we are trying to defend such a people.
 
[X] We should not intervene in the Chrystovian invasion.

It's too late. If we wanted to save these guys, the time was years ago. We had other priorities then, unfortunately (for them) we still do. Intervention will cost us, and dearly.

Our new model fleet isn't out yet- no wave of Keplers to scout, not even a single Comet skirmisher. No Vanguard-refit Renaissance-A.

The Cardassians know this, too. We are not in as good position to fight a general war right now as we would be in three years.
 
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[X] We should intervene in the Chrystovian invasion.

I am against it. Its too far to send a relief force so I am voting against it.
 
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[X] We should not intervene in the Chrystovian invasion.

One day there will be a reckoning. But not today.
 
[X] We should not intervene in the Chrystovian invasion.
trooperist said:
Welp, saw this coming. In fact I'm surprised it took them this long since we know the Cardassians have been eyeing up the Chrystovians ever since we discovered them.

I'm just questing what these 'atrocities' the Cardassians claim happen have proof.
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Sad thing is, I'm entire able to believe the Chrystovians did exactly what the Cardassians are accusing them of, based off how we've seen them acting when we had a ship down there.
 
Do we know how much industry and resources the Chrystovians have? How much will taking it be strengthening the Cardassians?

Anyways, not intervening will likely dent our relation with the ISC, whom are very much about proactively ending threats instead of letting it fester.
 
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