Are the special abilities IC or OOC? I can easily see them being IC, something like "They're great at organizing schedules and securing contracts and deals and building plans for dealing with setbacks" that would absolutely apply for the length of the construction even if all they did was organize it. If they're IC like that, then there's absolutely an in-character reason to delay the move as indicated. Additionally, the part where the ability was specifically chosen as "only needs to be started" indicates that this exact situation was considered and an answer provided.
 
I'm against moving Chen because we made our dual ambassador plan - and planned the rest of our build schedule around that - with the assumption that we'd have her bonus.
The schedule that we haven't voted in yet?

We can still build a second prototype even if delaying swap is rejected, but I see no reason that it would be. There are plenty of reasons that Sulu knows that a change doesn't need to happen instantly.

The biggest one starts with E and ends with e.
 
Also Shey started as Head of Intel then became Chief of Staff. That is not someone I want to have retire and should continue being a department head.
 
I think it lasts the whole build. Here are some QM quotes on the matter.

Original description of ability:
[ ][SYO] Rear Admiral Patricia Chen
Human Female, 54 (Time in Rank, 10 years)
Current Posting: Director, Utopia Planitia Fleet Yards
A flag career that has seen her handle a variety of roles, most recently in charge of the mighty Utopia Planitia Fleet Yards. If selected, bonus to parallel builds (ships of the same class built at the same yard with the same start date take -1Qtr per year to complete).

Later clarification:
New builds only, started during Chen's tenure.

My take is that means that as long as the builds start during Chen's tenure, the boost lasts even if she leaves. Since her bonus didn't apply on ships started before she took over, that seems equitable.

I recall that, but I thought that clarification was all about distinguishing between existing builds before vs during Chen's tenure, not during vs after Chen's tenure.

@OneirosTheWriter, can you clarify whether Chen's parallel build bonus lasts for a whole build started during her tenure, or for just the years during her tenure?
 
I recall that, but I thought that clarification was all about distinguishing between existing builds before vs during Chen's tenure, not during vs after Chen's tenure.

@OneirosTheWriter, can you clarify whether Chen's parallel build bonus lasts for a whole build started during her tenure, or for just the years during her tenure?
Are you saying we intend to keep Chen in Shipyard Operations for the additional almost six years that the Amby will take to prototype? Because the suggestion is ridiculous. We would have to plan the entire schedule around her planned promotion/retirement years in advance and it would be terrible. There's no way it works except if it keeps counting after she leaves, and the double accelerated Amby plan just won't work if she needs to stay on for their entire construction.

Sulu could easily be out of office before the Ambys finish, are we going to be making this same argument about promoting Chen to Commander of Starfleet?
 
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[X][TAC] Rear Admiral Pathe Lathriss
[X][SDB] Rear Admiral Sirvk
[X][OPS] Vice Admiral Shey ch'Tharvasse
[X][COS] Vice Admiral Nyota Uhura
[X][SYO] Vice Admiral Patricia Chen
 
That really sounds like the sort of metagaming/button-mashing behavior Oneiros will disapprove of, @Briefvoice
I've said this before:

I don't mind losing the build time reduction. Heavy industry will end up doing something similar anyways.

To me, Chen is worth more than one year of build time.
Why are people so eager for Shey to retire? Or is there some V Admiral slot you expect to slide Shey into?
We're not arguing for him to retire; we're arguing for him to take a sabbatical.

I'd rather have Chen as Ops anyways.

Q:
Oh, Q, why?
 
Inserted tally

EDIT: Oops.

Eh. I'll leave it here.
Adhoc vote count started by AlphaDelta on Jun 10, 2017 at 12:13 AM, finished with 51296 posts and 44 votes.
 
Are you saying we intend to keep Chen in Shipyard Operations for the additional almost six years that the Amby will take to prototype? Because the suggestion is ridiculous. We would have to plan the entire schedule around her planned promotion/retirement years in advance and it would be terrible. There's no way it works except if it keeps counting after she leaves, and the double accelerated Amby plan just won't work if she needs to stay on for their entire construction.

Sulu could easily be out of office before the Ambys finish, are we going to be making this same argument about promoting Chen to Commander of Starfleet?

I'm not saying that at all.

But the idea that we can get the "best of both worlds" by having Chen give a huge enduring boost to Ambassador production is surely a major factor behind voting to have her stay on until after the Ambassador builds start before moving on to another position.

Like, if her bonus only procs as a build quarter saving for every completed three build quarters, then there isn't as much point to Q3-delayed transfer, except for "I started off Ambassador builds" bragging rights.

So it's important to know the details and scope of Chen's parallel build bonus wrt transfer/promotion boundaries.
 
I'm not saying that at all.

But the idea that we can get the "best of both worlds" by having Chen give a huge enduring boost to Ambassador production is surely a major factor behind voting to have her stay on until after the Ambassador builds start before moving on to another position.

Like, if her bonus only procs as a build quarter saving for every completed three build quarters, then there isn't as much point to Q3-delayed transfer, except for "I started off Ambassador builds" bragging rights.

So it's important to know the details and scope of Chen's parallel build bonus wrt transfer/promotion boundaries.
Thing is, nowhere in that is a reason to keep Chen on for five years. If we get 1 quarter for 1 year or 2 quarters for 2 years, those are fairly irrelevant and we should just promote her now. So in either case, where we get the full bonus or where we don't, we should still be choosing to promote her.
 
Ugh....

I don't really have a good in-game reason why he couldn't delay in order to let Chen start a big project before handing over, so I'll allow it.

Question: Would the Ambassador prototypes retain Chen's parallel build bonus for the whole build?

Assuming a build time of 29 quarters, that amounts to a saving of 7 quarters. Or 14 quarters of berth time, due to the two builds.

If it only lasts until Chen is transferred/promoted, then it only results in a saving of either 0 or 1 quarters, depending on whether the saved quarter is applied before the 1st quarter or before the 4th quarter of each build year.
 
Says you.

Personally I think Chen is overhyped as hell and I'd be fine with her never making commander. At the minimum I'd like ch'Tharvasse to get the seat before her. Between SDB, COS, and OPS he'd have a huge amount of breadth, and it means I don't have to gripe about another fricking human in charge.

But Chen was the first named character in the entire quest :V

I feel species is possibly the worst reason to elevate someone to Commander of Starfleet. But that aside, I don't really see what ch'Tharvasse brings that's genuinely unique.


Anyway, on another topic, I have an omake, but can someone tell me why Zrai ch'Shennaryth is apparently an Andorian chan but is referred to with female pronouns? I know nothing about Andorian genders but maybe there's an explanation I missed.
 
Pick people for their competence and their personality. Doesn't matter what species they are.
 
"The day I let some augment sumbitch run Starfleet is the day I run down to Alukk and have them shoot ADAM into my daggone eyeballs!"

Naming conventions are just conventions not laws, and finding a non-chan whose name begins with ch' is about as weird as a boy named Sue.
ch' is a pretty specific genedered prefix though. My first thought was 'trans?' but you'd think they'd be allowed to change to what they identify as. Unless Andorians don't care as much about that? idk
 
Omake - Fresh Ideas - SWB
Eh, if I have to change it, I'll make an edit.



Fresh Ideas

It was forty minutes into the meeting with Rear Admiral ch'Shennaryth when Hikaru Sulu realized something was amiss.

"Ah, Patricia," Zrai ch'Shennaryth says. "She still sends me recommendation sheets. Not just her direct subordinates either, almost anyone she finds interesting in her whole command. Quite on-point, that one."

"Truly?" Hikaru replies. "I think that more officers should be involved in the careers of their subordinates. Ensuring they meet their potential is part of our duty."

"That it is. Patricia goes the extra mile, though. She even recommends transfers for those she think would work well in specific teams. In an alternate universe, she could easily be director of the academy. Or even have my job."

"Well, that's excellent. I suppose she's one of the prime candidates for the new Admiral position in Ops?"

"Ah, b-" Zrai cuts herself off. "I suppose she is."

"But what?" Hikaru asks sharply, alarm klaxons going off in his head.

"Ah, it's just, there's signs there's something big happening in Shipyard Ops right now. You know about Vice Admiral Chen's accelerated program, yes? I mean, no one could miss how we put out the last wave of Constitution-class in two years rather than three. And in my position, it's hard to miss that her recommendations are usually timed along with the build schedule."

"Yes, I've seen much on this," he says, "but what does it have to do with the Admirality?"

"Well, that's the thing," she says. "These last few months a trickle of requested reassignments has turned into a flood. Usually it's just a few individuals, but the Vice Admiral has been sending me whole lists. Independent requests for reassignment are also coming in thick and fast. Even ch'Volet had a few transfer recommendations at the end. Usually I'd chalk that up to last appointments before retirement, but taken together? There's something going on up there, and Vice Admiral Chen is in the thick of it. Promoting her now could be very disruptive."

"Perhaps preparations for the Ambassador prototype?" he suggests.

"No, it couldn't be that. The teams were lined up for that years ago. This is something new. More than half again as many teams requested and hundreds of personnel reassigned."

"I see," he says slowly. "I will have to confirm this before making a decision, then. For now, let's designate the plan to send Chen to Operations as Contingency Blue," he tells her.

She gives a snort of laughter before entering the file title on her PADD.

"And if you want to keep her in Shipyard Ops?" she asks.

"Contingency Yellow, ch'Tharvasse to Operations instead. I suppose I should get this resolved before my well-wishers beat down your office door. Either way, you'll be hearing from me again soon, Rear Admiral," he says to her. Then he speaks into his communicator. "Starbase One, Transporter Room Three."

"Sir," a voice replies not five seconds later.

"Sulu here. One to beam up."

"Acknowledged, sir."



The offices of Shipyard Operations on the periphery of Starbase One were vast and labyrinthine. Vice Admiral Patricia Chen had a windowed office well away from the main concourse, overlooking the three berths of San Francisco Fleet Yards. If he had held her position, it was a privilege he would have chosen for himself too.

"Admiral!" Patricia Chen chirps from her position on her roller chair. She jumps to her feet, PADD almost clattering to the ground as she catches it and sweeps it onto her desk. "Congratulations! I'm surprised to see you here so soon. Usually it's a few weeks before the new Commander pays a visit to Shipyard Ops."

For her to be this young and spry and the well-seasoned age of sixty almost beggared belief. Certainly, he had been described as energetic in his, how to put it, advanced years, but he had nothing compared to Patricia. And no, he only knew her age because he had just looked at her file in Personnel.

"Yes, well, I hear there are some exciting developments here, so I thought I would drop by. Although I admit, I had not expected news of my promotion to travel so quickly."

"Oh, I wrote a program to monitor public Starfleet chatter about the potential new Admiral. It, uh," she glances down for a second. "It's a position that will affect all of us. I figured I should be ahead of the curve."

Left unsaid was the "it could have been me".

Chen grins sheepishly.

"Please, have a seat," she tells him, even as she remains standing. She leans down and taps closed the file she had open on the PADD, bringing it back to the main screen. Hikaru catches a glimpse of the build schedule for the new explorer, the Ambassador, although there are many additions since he last viewed it. Not his department, but it certainly catches his interest.

He steps forward and eases himself into one of the chairs. Chen on the other hand, takes the top edge of her seat with one hand and spins it, seating herself exactly as it aligns with her desk and catches under her legs.

"I'll get straight to the point," Hikaru says. "I've just spoken to Rear Admiral ch'Shennaryth, who told me that on with Sousa's permission, you've been sending her assignment recommendations."

"Oh," Patricia says, an undisguised look of concern flitting across her face before being replaced with a slight frown. "That's not a problem, is it?"

"Not at all. I wish more officers took such a keen interest in the careers of their subordinates. I-"

"Not just their careers, Admiral!" Patricia interrupts. "It's important our engineering and construction teams work efficiently together, and boosts job satisfaction too. Too many brilliant spacers end languishing without seeing their full potential. But get the right combination, and the team becomes more than the sum of its parts."

"That certainly may be so," Hikaru says. He can see why Vitalia spoke so highly of Patricia now. "Zrai said, though, that you're making even more reassignments than normal. Why is that?"

"Oh, it's for this," Patricia says, opening her PADD to the same file she just closed and spinning it to face Hikaru. She smiles widely as she does. "Circumstances conspired to allow us a unique opportunity. It still needs final approval, likely from you now, but you can see the summary here."

He takes a moment to read carefully.

"Two Ambassadors," he says with a sharp intake of breath. "I had seen that proposal in Tactical, but I didn't realize it had gotten this far."

"Absolutely. I was just reviewing the schedule for the deflector assemblies. We'll be ready to go at around the time of the Council meeting."

"This won't affect the reliability, will it?" he asks. "It is still a prototype."

"Well, kind of," Patricia says. "But doubling the parts means we'll be far better prepared for mass production. The teams will have good reasons to produce consistent quality, and will have a second sample to check their work against. On the balance it cancels out any issues with unproven technology."

"Remarkable," he says. "But tell me, does this plan need your supervision?"

Chen narrows her eyes slightly. There's a long pause.

"The build schedules are flexible until about a month before the hull is laid down," she tells him slowly. "But after that they can't be changed at all. I mean really can't be changed, or everything goes to hell. Even if I come up with something after, at that point it's out of my hands."

"Even if there are issues or unforeseen delays?" he asks.

"How often have we launched a ship late?" she asks right back. "But yes, I do some management. I don't think it's anything only I can do, most of the time it's just approving the shipyard Rear Admiral's requests."

"I see," Hikaru says. So she could be crucial, or she could be unnecessary. "I can certainly work with that."

Chen seems to relax at that, giving him another slight smile.

"By the way," he continues, "these two ships won't both be the Ambassador. Have you spoken to the naming committee about the second yet?"

Chen's smile turns into a grin like the cat that caught the canary.

"It's exactly as you're thinking," she tells him. She taps the wireframe on the PADD and the panels on the hull fill in, revealing the hull number.

NCC-1701-C



"So what you're telling me is that we're back where we started," Rear Admiral Zrai ch'Shennaryth says, hands folded on the table.

"I wouldn't say that," Hikaru Sulu tells her. "But we still have a decision to make. Keep Chen in for the duration, or for part of it. Or move her once the project is started."

"Or you could move her immediately."

"Mmm, I suppose," he says, not really meaning it. He isn't going to let the new Enterprise go that easily. "Let me see her file again..."
 
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We have zero other opportunities to promote Chen to Admiral before a potential Commander, Starfleet vote.

We can delay the change, but we have to act now (or in Q3) if we are to promote Chen.
 
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