We back-burnered it since the Council launched an independent investigation and we had the GBZ on our plate.
To Boldly Go... (a Starfleet quest)
- Thread starter OneirosTheWriter
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- Sci-Fi
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We back-burnered it since the Council launched an independent investigation and we had the GBZ on our plate.
[X][PRESIDENT] Addressing Council Division
[X][PRESIDENT] Need to hold off and investigate further
[X][PRESIDENT] Seek Individual Diplomatic Contact with Major Licori Houses
I don't care about the Ked Paddah to the President, we can do that easily with our own teams. What we need is time to work with, and the confused message asking for diplomacy and focus in multiple directions doesn't address that. Talking about the Ked Paddah dilutes our message.
Again, they won't be forgotten, because we have our own External Diplo teams. Please consider adding the Need to hold off part.
I will also point out that anonymous sources in the FDS just told the FBS that mentats are too closely entwined in Acadian society! That implies there's more information we don't have. This thing about sponsorship and lack of a central government is just the tip of the iceberg. If we don't have time to slow-roast the FDS here we will come away with the war that the FDS wants. Isn't that a horrifying statement? Please use the "Need to hold off" option. It's there for a reason.
[X][PRESIDENT] Need to hold off and investigate further
[X][PRESIDENT] Seek Individual Diplomatic Contact with Major Licori Houses
I don't care about the Ked Paddah to the President, we can do that easily with our own teams. What we need is time to work with, and the confused message asking for diplomacy and focus in multiple directions doesn't address that. Talking about the Ked Paddah dilutes our message.
Again, they won't be forgotten, because we have our own External Diplo teams. Please consider adding the Need to hold off part.
I will also point out that anonymous sources in the FDS just told the FBS that mentats are too closely entwined in Acadian society! That implies there's more information we don't have. This thing about sponsorship and lack of a central government is just the tip of the iceberg. If we don't have time to slow-roast the FDS here we will come away with the war that the FDS wants. Isn't that a horrifying statement? Please use the "Need to hold off" option. It's there for a reason.
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For me it's a choice of Need to Hold Off versus Exit Strategy. You think Need to Hold Off will yield better long term results?
- Location
- Mid-Atlantic
@SynchronizedWritersBlock, that is a... very interesting point you have there. I'm not sure what I think of it yet, but it's got my attention.
I'm going to be looking over further discussion of that with a lot of interest, hopefully there will be some.
You think we can do an adequate job of liaising with the Ked Paddah using our own resources, without needing to refer to our political oversight, do I have that part right?
If anyone else wants to comment on this I'd be interested to hear what I have to say. As with SWB's point, I'm not sure I've got the mental wherewithal right now to make firm judgments. Not this minute.
I'm going to be looking over further discussion of that with a lot of interest, hopefully there will be some.
You think we can do an adequate job of liaising with the Ked Paddah using our own resources, without needing to refer to our political oversight, do I have that part right?
Hmmmm. Okay, that is actually a good point, especially since last month I myself was arguing that we can afford to put off bringing in ships (and by extension runabouts) in favor of teams that do long-duration projects like industrial and engineering assets (and by extension researchers).
If anyone else wants to comment on this I'd be interested to hear what I have to say. As with SWB's point, I'm not sure I've got the mental wherewithal right now to make firm judgments. Not this minute.
Yes. It may get us another round or two of SOE direction before we have to operate under a wardec. And contacting all the houses will take time.
What we need is the opportunity to get the Sarek and Enterprise into action doing what they do best - defusing crises. We need Kahurangi grilling the diplomatic service. We need external diplo teams and time to get them in action, actually, I'm surprised no one is taking more of those. It's a rather desperate need.
If we start the war in two turns it all comes falling apart.
This is a very good point, I'm going swap the diplomatic outreach with that.
pbluekan
Somethin's Fucky ...
- Location
- Trumpistan
- Pronouns
- He/Him
[X][PRESIDENT] Seek Individual Diplomatic Contact with Major Licori Houses
[X][PRESIDENT] Addressing Council Division
[X][PRESIDENT] Need to hold off and investigate further
I feel that we desperately need both Kahurangi and Eriksson here. The doctrinal analysis is key, especially after our Betazed test, and the diplomatic powerhouse that is Kahurangi should help shore up internal issues.
[X] Plan Grey Lady
[X][PRESIDENT] Addressing Council Division
[X][PRESIDENT] Need to hold off and investigate further
I feel that we desperately need both Kahurangi and Eriksson here. The doctrinal analysis is key, especially after our Betazed test, and the diplomatic powerhouse that is Kahurangi should help shore up internal issues.
[X] Plan Grey Lady
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[X][PRESIDENT] Addressing Council Division
[X][PRESIDENT] Need to hold off and investigate further
[X][PRESIDENT] Seek Individual Diplomatic Contact with Major Licori Houses
[x] Plan 11th hour diplomacy
-[x] Generate Generic External Diplomacy Team from United Earth (10 Cost to Starfleet, 5 Cost to Member World, gain External Diplomacy Team)
-[x] Retired Admiral Vitalia Yukiko Kahurangi - Personal Diplomatic Consultant (5pt cost for Starfleet, gain Special Asset)
-[x] Dhara Heavy Industry Park - Heavy Industry (5 Cost to Andoria, gain Heavy Industry asset)
-[x] Retired Vice Admiral Heidi Eriksson - Doctrine Specialist (5pt Cost to Starfleet, gain Doctrine Specialist)
Get our specialists, get our external diplomats, and get ready to do our engineering push next round. I'm picking human diplomats both because Earth has high support and because Earth has historical memory of a fragmented government. My next choice would be Betazoid diplomats or Vulcan diplomats, but we can't really afford to dip either to 45.
e: I could also be persuaded to replace Heavy Industry with runabouts and ship callups.
[X][PRESIDENT] Need to hold off and investigate further
[X][PRESIDENT] Seek Individual Diplomatic Contact with Major Licori Houses
[x] Plan 11th hour diplomacy
-[x] Generate Generic External Diplomacy Team from United Earth (10 Cost to Starfleet, 5 Cost to Member World, gain External Diplomacy Team)
-[x] Retired Admiral Vitalia Yukiko Kahurangi - Personal Diplomatic Consultant (5pt cost for Starfleet, gain Special Asset)
-[x] Dhara Heavy Industry Park - Heavy Industry (5 Cost to Andoria, gain Heavy Industry asset)
-[x] Retired Vice Admiral Heidi Eriksson - Doctrine Specialist (5pt Cost to Starfleet, gain Doctrine Specialist)
Get our specialists, get our external diplomats, and get ready to do our engineering push next round. I'm picking human diplomats both because Earth has high support and because Earth has historical memory of a fragmented government. My next choice would be Betazoid diplomats or Vulcan diplomats, but we can't really afford to dip either to 45.
e: I could also be persuaded to replace Heavy Industry with runabouts and ship callups.
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Yes, absolutely. Our default options include doing exactly that. What can Madam President do here that we can't already do, except direct the FDS when the FDS needs to be laser-focused on the Acadian Houses?
Agreed, but do we not need to buy time for both of them to do their work? Isn't that the most desperate resource right now?
- Location
- Central Standard Time
This looks good.
[X] SynchronizedWritersBlock
Also, planning an Omake series for Red Runabout Squadron
No way, we need to get that Betazed starbase up and running.
As for your other points, I just don't feel the need for a second external diplomacy team. Our existing one will be available for reassignment very soon. What exactly would you have this second team doing that's so urgent?
pbluekan
Somethin's Fucky ...
- Location
- Trumpistan
- Pronouns
- He/Him
We do. That's why I voted for the "need to hold off option."
The thing is, as much as eleventh hour diplomacy could work, I think we should also use that extra time to get more recon assets in place. Keeping the war from officially going hot is important, yes, but keeping a stray mentats from detonating a star is crucial.
We have two urgent diplomatic tasks, talking to the Ked Paddah, and making contact with individual Licori houses. We have one diplomatic asset. Even if we can get an option to detatch the Sarek and Enterprise (@OneirosTheWriter?), we will still be limited in the pace of diplomatic operations. Even if the FDS is on board, which we have seen they are not, we still need to make this push now rather than delay it. It is absolutely crucial and immediate.
I do not believe that making contact with individual Licori houses is something we can assign an external diplomatic team to do at this point. I don't know where this idea that the FDS is not on board is coming from. Seems weird. In any case, I'm not sure talking to the Licori houses will be productive until after there's been some violence.
Basically, my point of view is that after getting the Gaeni on board the only crucial external diplomatic task is talking to the Ked Peddah, and that can be begun four turns from now.
Or more succinctly... I don't believe avoiding war is possible, so I'd rather prepare to make it a success rather than spend actions in a doomed attempt to stave it off.
Godwinson
"Well, I've got nothing."
[X] SynchronizedWritersBlock
The idea that the FDS is potentially compromised is... very unsettling.
Edit: Not the least because we have evidence that diplomats have, in fact, been replaced, and that attacking the Federation through its diplomatic service is absolutely the sort of espionage ploy the Cardassians would love to pull to get us embroiled in a war on the other side of our borders from them.
The idea that the FDS is potentially compromised is... very unsettling.
Edit: Not the least because we have evidence that diplomats have, in fact, been replaced, and that attacking the Federation through its diplomatic service is absolutely the sort of espionage ploy the Cardassians would love to pull to get us embroiled in a war on the other side of our borders from them.
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- Location
- Austria
[X] SynchronizedWritersBlock
Avoiding such a clusterfucks as 'head of Starfleet is not briefed on specifics of political situation of Arcadian Empire which make ultimatum almost pointless' should be FDS job; so, either they are major fuck-ups, or they've all been replaced by Lecarre - and, honestly, the latter is not impossible.
Avoiding such a clusterfucks as 'head of Starfleet is not briefed on specifics of political situation of Arcadian Empire which make ultimatum almost pointless' should be FDS job; so, either they are major fuck-ups, or they've all been replaced by Lecarre - and, honestly, the latter is not impossible.
If we give the advice to the President, then options should open up to execute it. And everyone is voting to give that advice to the President.
e: And removing even one of the houses from supporting the Emperor would make our war-job an order of magnitude easier. We wouldn't have to aim for upending their society, just installing a government they understand who is friendly to our aims.
The head of the FDS is supporting regime change. The Councillors who went in to talk to Sousa said as much:
In other words, the reason we're jumping straight to war is that Director th'Chanik says that we can't talk to them until we change the structure of their government. Which is why we have people in this thread calling for his head.
And if you're going to be directing us to war, then I'm going to be a PAAP obstructionist and oppose you at every turn, because we've seen in the very last update that we're headed to war for all the wrong reasons and with the wrong information and with the wrong preparation.
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Chaos Blade
Procrastinating Writer
- Location
- Buenos Aires, Argentina
Sorry, thought that trying one last ditch conference type deal with all the parties to this mess could be a workable option and within that framework, we could get opportunities for individual diplomacy.
That said, I will vote:
EDIT: decided to make a mod on the President Advice, I think @SynchronizedWritersBlock has a point there; something stinks here and to move forward could be one hell of a problem
[X][PRESIDENT] Seek Individual Diplomatic Contact with Major Licori Houses
[X][PRESIDENT] Need to hold off and investigate further
[X][PRESIDENT] Addressing Council Division
[X] Plan Iron Lady
-[X] Retired Admiral Vitalia Yukiko Kahurangi - Personal Diplomatic Consultant (5pt cost for Starfleet, gain Special Asset)
-[X] Federalise Auxiliary Units from Tellar: One Cargo Ship (2 Cost from Tellar)
-[X] Federalise Fleet Units from Vulcan: 1 Oberth (1 cost from Vulcan)
-[X] Federalise Fleet Units from Rigel: 1 Oda-Gach (1 cost from Rigel)
-[X] Dhara Heavy Industry Park - Heavy Industry (5 Cost to Andoria, gain Heavy Industry asset)
-[X] UESPA Deep Space Engineering - Engineering Team (10 Cost from United Earth, gain Engineering Team with 2 Engineering Ships, 3 Cargo Ships, 1 Freighter)
-[X] Vulcan Survey Corps - Recon team (3 cost for Vulcan, gain +1 to outpost and starbase atttempts to detect incoming ships, gain 1 Civilian Research Cruiser)
-[X] Andorian Orbital Guard Runabouts (3 cost for Andorian Guard, gain +1 to outpost and starbase atttempts to detect incoming ships)
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pheonix89
Wants to be Seven Of Nine
- Location
- North American Plaguelands
- Pronouns
- She/Her
[X][PRESIDENT] Addressing Council Division
[X][PRESIDENT] Need to hold off and investigate further
[X][PRESIDENT] Seek Individual Diplomatic Contact with Major Licori Houses
[x] Plan 11th hour diplomacy
[jk] Have Linderly look into the FDS and the councilers who approached us.
Edit: We just found out that we're not dealing with a single Licori state. We're dealing with a bunch of Licori states that are semiallied. We may be able to EC diplostunt our way into only needing to fight one or two houses.
[X][PRESIDENT] Need to hold off and investigate further
[X][PRESIDENT] Seek Individual Diplomatic Contact with Major Licori Houses
[x] Plan 11th hour diplomacy
[jk] Have Linderly look into the FDS and the councilers who approached us.
Edit: We just found out that we're not dealing with a single Licori state. We're dealing with a bunch of Licori states that are semiallied. We may be able to EC diplostunt our way into only needing to fight one or two houses.
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Or you're insulting the QM by calling actions he thinks were reasonable and in-character signs of a conspiracy of stupidity.
Sousa herself was surprised by the information. It's reasonable to say that the FDS did not inform Starfleet of information crucial to our sweeping mandate during a State of Emergency. I don't attribute it to conspiracy, but somewhere on a sliding scale between miscommunication and incompetence.
Godwinson
"Well, I've got nothing."
It's insulting to think that we might be dealing with an infiltration and intrigue ploy when our major enemy prefers intrigue and has a species of infiltration specialists working with them?
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Chaos Blade
Procrastinating Writer
- Location
- Buenos Aires, Argentina
NOTE: EDITED my last vote slightly
- Location
- Austria
I am not sure how 'FDS either fucked up or were compromised because those are the details Sousa should have been briefed on before the ultimatum and Diplomacy, going by the name of FDS, is literally their job' can be interpreted as an insult to QM, so let's just say I never intended it as one.