Ainsworth's low diplomacy is becoming an increasing issue. Can we appoint a translator or something?

Not really, this isn't that much a diplo issue of one admiral but of the interaction between two. OTOH, perhaps we might suggest the Amarki to cashier, or at least, reprimand their local fleet admiral?
Honestly, we could even use this in our favor, to show that we need a more streamlined control interaction between Starfleet and member Fleets.
Actually, let's try that.
 
Apiata Vs. Cardassians:
Apiata Forces:
2x Little Queenships (C8 L14 H4)
4x Stinger (C16 L16 H4)
Total: C24 L30 H8
Cardassian Forces:
1x Kaldur (C5 L4 H4)
3x Jaldun (C12 L12 H12)
1x Takaaki-Combat (C4 L3 H3)
1x Isamu (C4 L2 H2)
Total: C25 L21 H21
So roughly equal Combat power between the two forces but while the Apiata had more Shields they also had dramatically less Hull.

Apiata Crew:
Offices: 2/2
Enlisted: 17/18
Technicians: 11/12
Total Casualties: O0/E1/T1
Cardassian Crew:
Officers: 14/15
Enlisted: 20/22
Technicians: 14/14
Total Casualties: O1/E2/T0

We don't really know much about the Cardassian Forces to say how much that may or may not have hurt their crew situation. We know they can conscript people but I doubt conscripts make for good Officers. On the Apiata side; they got out of there with all their queens so I'm sure they are happy.

Apiata Reapirs:
Undamaged:
Telzziadriz - Hull 20.00/20
Pollizazza - Hull 20.00/20​
Lightly Damaged (<10%):
Grizzi - Hull 9.82/10 - 98.2% Hull Integrity​
Crippling Damage (>50% & <75%):
Fozarri - Hull 4.81/10 - 48.1% Hull Integrity
Gerzzi - Hull 4.69/10 - 46.9% Hull Integrity
Triada - Hull 4.20/10 - 42.0% Hull Integrity​
Cardassian Repairs:
Undamaged:
CDF Onacker - Hull 40.00/40​
Lightly Damaged (<10%):
CDF Tylack - Hull 37.84/40 - 94.6% Hull Integrity
CDF Naldar - Hull 37.41/40 - 93.5% Hull Integrity​
Medium Damage (>10% & <25%):
CDF Anakar - Hull 25.20/30 - 84% Hull Integrity​
Heavily Damaged (>25% & <50%):
CDF Benakot - Hull 29.20/40 - 73% Hull Integrity​
Write-offs (>75%):
CDF Icaran - Hull 0.00/20 - 0% Hull Integrity​
So the Apiata's Little Queenships got out without damage but three fourths of their Stingers got mauled. In exchange however they destroyed one old and outdated Frigate and did noteworthy damage to one of Cardassian's new and awesome Kaldurs and another frigate.


Federation Vs. Cardassians:
Federation Forces:
1x Constitution-B (C5 L4 H3)
3x Miranda-As (C9 L9 H6)
Total: C14 L13 H9
Cardassian Forces:
1x Kaldur (C5 L4 H4)
2x Jaldun (C8 L8 H8)
1x Takaaki-Combat (C4 L3 H3)
1x Isamu (C4 L2 H2)
Total: C21 L17 H17
Damn! No wonder Revak thought this was illogical. Even with the +4L due to being outnumbered the cardies still had basically double the Hull and fifty percent more Combat.

Federation Crew:
Offices: 6/6
Enlisted: 10/10
Technicians: 6/7
Total Casualties: O0/E0/T1
Cardassian Crew:
Officers: 12/12
Enlisted: 18/18
Technicians: 11/11
Total Casualties: O0/E0/T0
So the Cardassians managed to avoid any fatalities on their side while we lost a point of Technicians. I suppose if we had to lose crew it's good that it was from the one pool we can afford to lose.

Federation Reapirs:
Undamaged:
USS Clarion - Hull 20.00/20​
Lightly Damaged (<10%):
Grizzi - Hull 9.82/10 - 98.2% Hull Integrity​
Medium Damage (>10% & <25%):
USS Shield - Hull 15.19/20 - 76% Hull Integrity​
Heavily Damaged (>25% & <50%):
USS Valiant - Hull 21.24/30 - 70.8% Hull Integrity
USS Bon Vivant - Hull 12.36/20 - 61.8% Hull Integrity​

Cardassian Repairs:
Undamaged:
CDF Ernagot - Hull 40.00/40
CDF Konyok - Hull 40.00/40​
Lightly Damaged <10%):
CDF Nocorod - Hull 19.47/20 - 97.35% Hull Integrity​
Medium Damage (>10% & <25%):
CDF Yrmak - Hull 34.22/40 - 85.55% Hull Integrity
CDF Cabarrad - Hull 25.66/30 - 85.53% Hull Integrity
Ouch. We were already hurting for repair bays and now we have four more ships to add to the long list of repairs. To make things worse we barely scratched the Cardassian forces, in fact their Kaldur got away without a scratch. I suppose that's what happens when you throw a tiny escort fleet at a real battle fleet.
 
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Soooo... We need more berths? And Starbases in the GBZ or close to it.

EDIT: Grrbizzi is close to the GBZ and has no Starbase. Even if it's not optimal, maybe we should stick one there so we at least have an extra spot to repair light escort damage?
 
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Apiata Vs. Cardassians:
Apiata Forces:
2x Little Queenships (C8 L14 H4)
4x Stinger (C16 L16 H4)
Total: C24 L30 H8
Cardassian Forces:
1x Kaldur (C5 L4 H4)
3x Jaldun (C12 L12 H12)
1x Takaaki-Combat (C4 L3 H3)
1x Isamu (C4 L2 H2)
Total: C25 L21 H21
So roughly equal Combat power between the two forces but while the Apiata had more Shields they also had dramatically less Hull.

Apiata Crew:
Offices: 2/2
Enlisted: 17/18
Technicians: 11/12
Total Casualties: O0/E1/T1
Cardassian Crew:
Officers: 14/15
Enlisted: 20/22
Technicians: 14/14
Total Casualties: O1/E2/T0

We don't really know much about the Cardassian Forces to say how much that may or may not have hurt their crew situation. We know they can conscript people but I doubt conscripts make for good Officers. On the Apiata side; they got out of there with all their queens so I'm sure they are happy.

Apiata Reapirs:
Undamaged:
Telzziadriz - Hull 20.00/20
Pollizazza - Hull 20.00/20​
Lightly Damaged (<10%):
Grizzi - Hull 9.82/10 - 98.2% Hull Integrity​
Crippling Damage (>50% & <75%):
Fozarri - Hull 4.81/10 - 48.1% Hull Integrity
Gerzzi - Hull 4.69/10 - 46.9% Hull Integrity
Triada - Hull 4.20/10 - 42.0% Hull Integrity​
Cardassian Repairs:
Undamaged:
CDF Onacker - Hull 40.00/40​
Lightly Damaged (<10%):
CDF Tylack - Hull 37.84/40 - 94.6% Hull Integrity
CDF Naldar - Hull 37.41/40 - 93.5% Hull Integrity​
Medium Damage (>10% & <25%):
CDF Anakar - Hull 25.20/30 - 84% Hull Integrity​
Heavily Damaged (>25% & <50%):
CDF Benakot - Hull 29.20/40 - 73% Hull Integrity​
Write-offs (>75%):
CDF Icaran - Hull 0.00/20 - 0% Hull Integrity​
So the Apiata's Little Queenships got out without damage but three fourths of their Stingers got mauled. In exchange however they destroyed one old and outdated Frigate and did noteworthy damage to one of Cardassian's new and awesome Kaldurs and another frigate.


Federation Vs. Cardassians:
Federation Forces:
1x Constitution-B (C5 L4 H3)
3x Miranda-As (C9 L9 H6)
Total: C14 L13 H9
Cardassian Forces:
1x Kaldur (C5 L4 H4)
2x Jaldun (C8 L8 H8)
1x Takaaki-Combat (C4 L3 H3)
1x Isamu (C4 L2 H2)
Total: C21 L17 H17
Damn! No wonder Revak thought this was illogical. Even with the +4L due to being outnumbered the cardies still had basically double the Hull and fifty percent more Combat.

Federation Crew:
Offices: 6/6
Enlisted: 10/10
Technicians: 6/7
Total Casualties: O0/E0/T1
Cardassian Crew:
Officers: 12/12
Enlisted: 18/18
Technicians: 11/11
Total Casualties: O0/E0/T0
So the Cardassians managed to avoid any fatalities on their side while we lost a point of Technicians. I suppose if we had to lose crew it's good that it was from the one pool we can afford to lose.

Federation Reapirs:
Undamaged:
USS Clarion - Hull 20.00/20​
Lightly Damaged (<10%):
Grizzi - Hull 9.82/10 - 98.2% Hull Integrity​
Medium Damage (>10% & <25%):
USS Shield - Hull 15.19/20 - 76% Hull Integrity​
Heavily Damaged (>25% & <50%):
USS Valiant - Hull 21.24/30 - 70.8% Hull Integrity
USS Bon Vivant - Hull 12.36/20 - 61.8% Hull Integrity​

Cardassian Repairs:
Undamaged:
CDF Ernagot - Hull 40.00/40
CDF Konyok - Hull 40.00/40​
Lightly Damaged <10%):
CDF Nocorod - Hull 19.47/20 - 97.35% Hull Integrity​
Medium Damage (>10% & <25%):
CDF Yrmak - Hull 34.22/40 - 85.55% Hull Integrity
CDF Cabarrad - Hull 25.66/30 - 85.53% Hull Integrity
Ouch. We were already hurting for repair bays and now we have four more ships to add to the long list of repairs. To make things worse we barely scratched the Cardassian forces, in fact their Kaldur got away without a scratch. I suppose that's what happens when you throw a tiny escort fleet at a real battle fleet.

It helps that the apiata have enough stingers that they can probably have those three replaced within the month, and that stingers are small enough that they can probably repair the damaged ones within a couple more.

But yeah, overall this post was a draw.
 
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Okay, so we got confirmation of the stats of a Kaldar. It's a 5-4-4, so basically just a Jaldun with some extra guns bolted on. Our Rennies should have a slight edge, which is nice to hear.
 
Okay, so we got confirmation of the stats of a Kaldar. It's a 5-4-4, so basically just a Jaldun with some extra guns bolted on. Our Rennies should have a slight edge, which is nice to hear.

We already knew the Kaldar's stats. The Kadak-Tor was just a kaldar with an added cloaking device.

They also have 5D to the Jaldun's 4, which means a higher dodge chance as well as more guns. Overall, its probably on par with the Kalindrax, but with a focus on firepower instead of shields.
 
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@OneirosTheWriter it makes some sense that the Apiata didn't benefit from our tactical analyisis bonuses (using a very different doctrine means that they can't fight the Cardassians quite the same way Starfleet would), but why did they get neither comms bonus nor the bonus to shield regen?
 
That'll go over like a lead balloon.

Possibly true, but we can work this onto my other idea, trying to create a more formal interaction between Starfleet and member fleets, including their place in the chain of command. we make a few noises about our displeasure with the Armakian Admiral, maybe even let filter something to the press, and then use this to build the idea of integrating the fleets better...
 
Ainsworth's low diplomacy is becoming an increasing issue. Can we appoint a translator or something?

I think it might even be time to replace her. Her aggressive course/attitude was very useful in the early stages of the conflict and allowed us to push out the sydraxians but I personally think it is becoming increasingly less useful, especially with the possible war against the Licori limiting the amount of ships we can send into the GBZ. I think a slow and steady expansion in close cooperation with our member nations will be more effective and she isn't the candidate for that.
 
I think it might even be time to replace her. Her aggressive course/attitude was very useful in the early stages of the conflict and allowed us to push out the sydraxians but I personally think it is becoming increasingly less useful, especially with the possible war against the Licori limiting the amount of ships we can send into the GBZ. I think a slow and steady expansion in close cooperation with our member nations will be more effective and she isn't the candidate for that.
Best way to handle that would be to give her a Vice-Admiral slot in the coming reorg-she did earn one IMO for pushing out the Sydraxians without losing a single ship permanently
 
At which point the autonomous member governments tell their representatives in the Council to flatten us politically.

That would depend on how our proposal is worded, we avoid using words like subservient, but use coordination and joint control and establish policies for determining a chain of command.
And use words like, within operational theaters, which means member fleets deployed in joint-operational areas would be under certain, unique, conditions and regulations.

We'd have to be careful of the language and add tons of conditionals, possibly even poll member fleet brass in an extra official manner and seek their input and support.
It would be ideal if this is not a suggestion of Starfleet Command, but a joint proposal by Starfleet AND as many member fleets as we can.
 
That would depend on how our proposal is worded, we avoid using words like subservient, but use coordination and joint control and establish policies for determining a chain of command.
And use words like, within operational theaters, which means member fleets deployed in joint-operational areas would be under certain, unique, conditions and regulations.

We'd have to be careful of the language and add tons of conditionals, possibly even poll member fleet brass in an extra official manner and seek their input and support.
It would be ideal if this is not a suggestion of Starfleet Command, but a joint proposal by Starfleet AND as many member fleets as we can.
It's just not going to work dude. This is a good way to get Sousa fired.
 
I think you guys need to consider the Amarki POV here. Admiral Galen Toor is now an Amarki national hero. Not only did he hunt down Syndicate slavers who dared raid one of their colonies, but he just led the Amarki to a stunning victory in the biggest space battle in a decade. As far as the Amarki are concerned, he's bulletproof. He's a living legend, the most famous man in their entire fleet.

Carping because he was a little tardy in regrouping his forces will be ignored at best and cause resentment at worst. Forget about "doing anything" regarding Toor. You don't diss Toor.

As for Ainsworth and her low diplomacy, eh, I don't see any particularly bad results from it so far. So she didn't scramble the fleet faster. So what? If the Cardassians hadn't turned around it might have been trouble... but they did turn around. She just led us to a great victory, followed by an acceptable draw. I'm pretty happy with her.
 
Possibly true, but we can work this onto my other idea, trying to create a more formal interaction between Starfleet and member fleets, including their place in the chain of command. we make a few noises about our displeasure with the Armakian Admiral, maybe even let filter something to the press, and then use this to build the idea of integrating the fleets better...

The problem is, that the low diplomacy issue came from multiple sources.

The Amarki are free to act as they see fit in the GBZ. We told them that, and Ainsworth was unable to change that. The fact that they have done something stupid with that reflects on both parties. We can't use it as political capital.

Even worse, Ainsworth likely said something that was fairly politically insensitive, and then proceeded to send Revak out on what could have been seen as a suicide mission. He performed admirably, but that doesn't excuse the shitty orders.

Galen Toor will likely be reprimanded by his own government for shitty strategy. They are Amarki. They don't like shitty strategy. However, I will repeat that we can not use this as leverage. Edit: As @Briefvoice pointed out, he's also a national hero. At best, they might actually just tell him he had a bad idea.

We especially can not to use this to attempt to incorporate the member fleets more fully into Starfleet. There honestly isn't a single situation we would ever use to try that. The very idea is laughable, and to even suggest it would be political suicide on the level of Kahurangi's predecessor. There's a reason the council hates States of Emergency.

So here's what's gonna happen. There's gonna be some inquiry, possibly formal, as a result of the orders Revak was given. Maybe Ainsworth gets a political aide or somesuch but I doubt it. Probably just a slap on the wrist.
 
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That would depend on how our proposal is worded, we avoid using words like subservient, but use coordination and joint control and establish policies for determining a chain of command.
And use words like, within operational theaters, which means member fleets deployed in joint-operational areas would be under certain, unique, conditions and regulations.

We'd have to be careful of the language and add tons of conditionals, possibly even poll member fleet brass in an extra official manner and seek their input and support.
It would be ideal if this is not a suggestion of Starfleet Command, but a joint proposal by Starfleet AND as many member fleets as we can.

We chose to Greenlight the Amarki, which means they're basically independent operators. If we wanted them subservient that's what yellow lighting is for.
 
I think you guys need to consider the Amarki POV here. Admiral Galen Toor is now an Amarki national hero. Not only did he hunt down Syndicate slavers who dared raid one of their colonies, but he just led the Amarki to a stunning victory in the biggest space battle in a decade. As far as the Amarki are concerned, he's bulletproof. He's a living legend, the most famous man in their entire fleet.

Carping because he was a little tardy in regrouping his forces will be ignored at best and cause resentment at worst. Forget about "doing anything" regarding Toor. You don't diss Toor.

As for Ainsworth and her low diplomacy, eh, I don't see any particularly bad results from it so far. So she didn't scramble the fleet faster. So what? If the Cardassians hadn't turned around it might have been trouble... but they did turn around. She just led us to a great victory, followed by an acceptable draw. I'm pretty happy with her.
I mean, yeah I wouldn't mind if she stayed, but the others do have a point that with the changing situation a Medium aggression admiral with better diplo might be better at this point.
 
The Amarki are free to act as they see fit in the GBZ. We told them that, and Ainsworth was unable to change that. The fact that they have done something stupid with that reflects on both parties. We can't use it as political capital.

What did they do that was stupid? They weren't intentionally dragging their heels. Toor just couldn't pull it together fast enough.

Even worse, Ainsworth likely said something that was fairly politically insensitive, and then proceeded to send Revak out on what could have been seen as a suicide mission. He performed admirably, but that doesn't excuse the shitty orders.

Point of order. All Ainsworth did was second Revak to Queen Nerzizza, which was perfectly reasonable. It was Queen Nerzizza who decided to split their forces and send Revak off alone. She could have kept them together. Him being outnumbered is on her, not Ainsworth.

Galen Toor will likely be reprimanded by his own government for shitty strategy. They are Amarki. They don't like shitty strategy.

What strategic mistake did he make?
 
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