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Starfleet Design Bureau

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KlavoHunter said:
Do I really have to spell it out to you? *sigh*

So, our battleships will divert from their usual course to meet with the Orion Syndicate, and we'll sell them the hottest-pink Saturnine Glitterdust that bored Starfleet Science officers can cook up. This shit will reset your pacemaker. In return, the Orions pay in cold hard dilithium crystals. The Orions don't try and pull any funny deals unless they want to face the Federation's wrath, and in return we keep real quiet about it.
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Ngl, you really had me in that first line. Thanks for the laugh.
 
I actually would advocate for adding diplomatic suites to the Federation. Why?

Because for quite a while here, it's going to be the biggest, most impressive, best protected, and generally shiniest ship in Starfleet. Enough guns to conduct gunboat diplomacy on Klingons (they like it better that way anyhow). Enough interior space to build a VIP suite for a whale. Enough Max Cruise to make executive couriers look like slugs. Enough shielding that you can conduct peace talks in the middle of a warzone. This ship is going to be the poster-girl battleship of Starfleet for decades.

Additionally, we're not going to get too many of these. Just a simple fact of its size and cost, we'll end up with a dozen or so most likely. Not enough to handle other tasks all over the Federation. But diplomatic duties and VIP transport don't need too many ships dedicated to them, particularly when they're speedy.

Doesn't mean we can't stuff other things in it, but I do really think this is the best spot we're going to get for a diplomatic cruiser for a good while, particularly as we aren't getting Explorer designs until the Excaliburs get retired from the sounds of their epiloge.
 
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luckless21 said:
That's what planet bound hospitals are for.
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It's a plot point in a few episodes. TOS The Galileo Seven, for example, starts off with this captain's log:
TOS Whom The Gods Destroy
  • "Captain's log, stardate 5718.3. The Enterprise is orbiting Elba II, a planet with a poisonous atmosphere, where the Federation maintains an asylum for the few remaining incorrigible, criminally insane of the galaxy. We are bringing a revolutionary new medicine to them. A medicine with which the Federation hopes to eliminate mental illness… for all time. I am transporting down with Mr. Spock, and we're delivering the medicine to Doctor Donald Cory, the governor of the colony."
TOS The Cloud Minders
  • "Captain's Log, Stardate 5818.4. A botanical plague is devastating a planet in the quadrant of the galaxy where the Enterprise is operating at present. It threatens to destroy the vegetation on the entire planet, leaving it uninhabitable. At Federation orders, we're proceeding at top warp speed to the planet Ardana, where the only source of zenite exists. It is the one substance that can halt the plague."
TAS Albatross
  • "Captain's Log, Stardate 5275.6. Preparing to beam aboard the Enterprise following the successful completion of delivery of medical supplies to the planet Dramia in the remote Dramen star system."
I'm sure that there are more examples, but I don't really want to do more digging. I skipped a few about how the Enterprise herself needed to create some kind of cure for her crew as well. (See TOS The Tholian Web).
 
stakenbake said:
Sure, but developing the drug on board and then the colonies making more using their replicators would work gangbusters.
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Okay, but now we're talking about a full scale pharmaceutical research lab, which even assuming we can fit on this ship, will almost certainly be the only major module we can fit. For what, a lab that's usually not going to be doing anything?
 
luckless21 said:
But that's them shipping cargo and not making the stuff on board.
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We're trying to one-up that level of response by making it happen even faster than the Enterprise could. Much less some puny Miranda...

No need to go back to Starbase 123 for the drugs when you can make them en-route to the place that needs 'em.
 
Lohjak said:
Okay, but now we're talking about a full scale pharmaceutical research lab, which even assuming we can fit on this ship, will almost certainly be the only major module we can fit. For what, a lab that's usually not going to be doing anything?
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Idk how if that would be a major module, or that we'd only fir one major module on this bird, which is why my main opinion is "Wait and see".

And diplomatic suites might even fall into that same category, you don't really need them for rapid response cargo hauling or combat, making them "usually not doing anything".
 
Golgotha said:
If this was being treated as a limited number dreadnought, I would go diplomatic modules. But diplomatic modules aren't really a good fit in anything built in larger numbers.

I, too, want a primarily generalist ship with a slight emphasis on science. I think I lean towards larger, generalist labs than specific niches.

I don't want them to go "We only need 10 mineral surveys, so order only ten"
I want them to want all the ships for every occasion that is within two weeks of a potential problem.
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Not a good fit for larger numbers? I beg to differ. How often is an Enterprise - any Enterprise - sent to negotiate for resources, or resolve a local dispute, or oversee a new planet entering the Federation, set up a trade deal, or host a diplomatic conference? Not to mention escorting ambassadors around. That's a significant fraction of the series plots, it would be good to have more than one set somewhere better to host them then the senior staff conference room.

Having nice meeting rooms is also just the thing for Second Contact missions.

Razzocnor said:
I actually would advocate for adding diplomatic suites to the Federation. Why?

Because for quite a while here, it's going to be the biggest, most impressive, best protected, and generally shiniest ship in Starfleet. Enough guns to conduct gunboat diplomacy on Klingons (they like it better that way anyhow). Enough interior space to build a VIP suite for a whale. Enough Max Cruise to make executive couriers look like slugs. Enough shielding that you can conduct peace talks in the middle of a warzone. This ship is going to be the poster-girl battleship of Starfleet for decades.

Additionally, we're not going to get too many of these. Just a simple fact of its size and cost, we'll end up with a dozen or so most likely. Not enough to handle other tasks all over the Federation. But diplomatic duties and VIP transport don't need too many ships dedicated to them, particularly when they're speedy.

Doesn't mean we can't stuff other things in it, but I do really think this is the best spot we're going to get for a diplomatic cruiser for a good while, particularly as we aren't getting Explorer designs until the Excaliburs get retired from the sounds of their epiloge.
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I also agree with this. There's a lot to be said for negotiating while being impressively able to win a fight, and for being able to do it in a war zone.

Plus, as mentioned before, a lot of the capabilities that make a good diplomatic ship - good communications, good executive suites - also make it good for fleet command and electronics warfare.
 
darkstarling said:
Not a good fit for larger numbers? I beg to differ. How often is an Enterprise - any Enterprise - sent to negotiate for resources, or resolve a local dispute, or oversee a new planet entering the Federation, set up a trade deal, or host a diplomatic conference? Not to mention escorting ambassadors around. That's a significant fraction of the series plots, it would be good to have more than one set somewhere better to host them then the senior staff conference room.

Having nice meeting rooms is also just the thing for Second Contact missions.



I also agree with this. There's a lot to be said for negotiating while being impressively able to win a fight, and for being able to do it in a war zone.

Plus, as mentioned before, a lot of the capabilities that make a good diplomatic ship - good communications, good executive suites - also make it good for fleet command and electronics warfare.
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I mean... that's exactly my point? That's the Enterprise doing that. The Excalibur's, in their improv role as proto-explorers, of which we have like...9?
We don't want or need 20-25 extra diplomatic ships. If we were official Explorers, or absolutely resigned to a single production run I would get it, but I'm against limiting us that much. This is pretty much my argument against pharmacology as well.

I mean, if getting pharmacology is a pure bonus onto of science, a reward for having enough rooms them I withdraw my comments. But I'm pretty sure it's a specialization that removes breadth of ability for depth in the medical field.
 
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Golgotha said:
I mean... that's exactly my point? That's the Enterprise doing that. The Excalibur's, in their improv role as proto-explorers, of which we have like...9?
We don't want or need 20-25 extra diplomatic ships. If we were official Explorers, or absolutely resigned to a single production run I would get it, but I'm against limiting us that much. This is pretty much my argument against pharmacology as well.
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Good thing the Enterprise and her sisters did all the diplomacy that will ever need doing in the history of the Federation! We can safely scratch diplomacy off the list of things this (or any other) design needs to do...

Sarcasm aside, diplomacy is a never-ending task, like a renewable resource.
 
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KlavoHunter said:
Good thing the Enterprise and her sisters did all the diplomacy that will ever need doing in the history of the Federation! We can safely scratch diplomacy off the list of things this (or any other) design needs to do...
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There is no need for that. At all. And you know as well as me that I didn't argue for that.
The Excaliburs are still new, and in active use.
We are doing nacelles next, with a good chance of an official Explorer right after. That's when the Excaliburs get replaced as proto-explorers. And that's when I think it makes sense to focus on diplomacy..
 
For real though. Chances are high that at every stop at every colony, there's some dispute that needs resolving by an impartial third party... Not just when meeting new life forms while out exploring.
 
stakenbake said:
Idk how if that would be a major module, or that we'd only fir one major module on this bird, which is why my main opinion is "Wait and see".

And diplomatic suites might even fall into that same category, you don't really need them for rapid response cargo hauling or combat, making them "usually not doing anything".
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I'm sure the federation is probably much more advanced than modern day Earth, but for reference a modern pharmaceuticals company like Bristol Myers Squibb operates multiple R&D sites many of which have more square footage than the entirety of our ship. It's pretty unlikely that we're gonna be able to get a high-end drug research lab for anything less than a major module, and it really doesn't seem worth sticking on a heavy cruiser.
 
Writ advanced medical bay/facility for starships:

One thing people haven't been saying is the benefit of having a fully isolated facility that can have full control over its environment and is manned by personnel that does not have any possibility of having been affected by a sudden plague that's popped up in far-colony #15.

Planetside hospitals have the disadvantage of having its personnel and staff be a part of the community and potentially be compromised by a undetected plague/disease before they figure out its there or manage to create a cure.

Its really hard to treat a disease if most of your doctors are also patients.
 
Given TOS is kinda the age of sail/ancient west in space there's probably a basic level of diplomacy capability baked in at a level below our abstractions. The Captain and their ready room at the very least on larger ships.
 
Personally I like the idea of an admiral suit. A set of quarters for an admiral and admiral staff, with offices and facilities to allow them to do their work. Big conference room with holo projector and view screen for wicked battle meetings. It would allow an admiral to command a theater from on site without needing to take over the ship bridge.

And a Starfleet admiral is also likely the second diplomat Starfleet sends to an important contact species.

The ability to send high level officials places with staff, in comfort and safety, faster than any other ship in the fleet, sounds like a useful capability.
 
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Fouredged Sword said:
Personally I like the idea of an admiral suit. A set of quarters for an admiral and admiral staff, with offices and facilities to allow them to do their work. Big conference room with holo projector and view screen for wicked battle meetings. It would allow an admiral to command a theater from on site without needing to take over the ship bridge.

And a Starfleet admiral is also likely the second diplomat Starfleet sends to an important contact species.

The ability to send high level officials places with staff, in comfort and safety, faster than any other ship in the fleet, sounds like a useful capability.
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Note this would also allow us to transport non-starfleet dignitaries, as it would be room for them and their staff that they could basically claim for themselves for the duration of a diplomatic mission back to Earth.
 
Golgotha said:
I mean... that's exactly my point? That's the Enterprise doing that. The Excalibur's, in their improv role as proto-explorers, of which we have like...9?
We don't want or need 20-25 extra diplomatic ships. If we were official Explorers, or absolutely resigned to a single production run I would get it, but I'm against limiting us that much. This is pretty much my argument against pharmacology as well.

I mean, if getting pharmacology is a pure bonus onto of science, a reward for having enough rooms them I withdraw my comments. But I'm pretty sure it's a specialization that removes breadth of ability for depth in the medical field.
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The fact that there's a constant need for it, everywhere, means there's a demand not being met. And that having ships properly set up for it would be valuable. There's always SOMETHING you know?

For an oddball not-quite-serious module choice... forensics lab. Crime syndicates and pirates are going to be a whole thing, a high quality crime lab isn't really a priority on most colonies, and when we run into the inevitable.mystery episodes that's what is called for. One job for a cruiser is Space Police... so lets pack space police gear.

Fouredged Sword said:
Note this would also allow us to transport non-starfleet dignitaries, as it would be room for them and their staff that they could basically claim for themselves for the duration of a diplomatic mission back to Earth.
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Definitely, since playing diplomat ride is abig part of starship duties.
 
I still like my idea of naming this class after admirals

There's definitely lots of good admirals if we have a long production run
 
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Counterpoint, if we name it after admirals that greatly decreases the chance of a McCoy class medical ship/station from ever coming about.
 
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