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Starfleet Design Bureau

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Eh, we were asked to make a bio-survey ship. Starfleet has all the information we do and they haven't told us to abort. I'd imagine they'll be pleased our ship has greater firepower, as it can stake a claim and defend it, but San Francisco will be making an alternate design, perhaps a warp 8 patrol destroyer or combat ship to do the things our design won't.

Ultimately if our design isn't ideal, Starfleet won't make many and will make another design instead. It's not like they're stuck making 3 tranches of Project Darwin to the exclusion of all else.

Besides, we don't know for certain what state Starfleet and the Federation will be in post-war, we can design our next ship in direct response to that. We'll also hopefully have better weapons and shields, so any design we make will be fundamentally stronger than our current ones anyway.
 
This isn't a ship where success is measured in how many they make. Or even, really, how long they are around for. Science ships don't age well.
This is a ship where success is having enough to solve the biological problems that crop up, plus a percentage for unforeseen circumstances, for as long as it's labs remain modern enough to do so effectively.
To an extent, a great reflection would simply be "there were no plagues during the lifespan of this ship" with the best outcome having novel medicines or life forms found as an addition.
 
Frankly, this is one of those points where the nature of the quest stretches a little thin, because cargo bay or arboretum is something that should be easily yard-convertible and even if not a simple enough redesign to create a variant class.
 
Godwinson said:
Frankly, this is one of those points where the nature of the quest stretches a little thin, because cargo bay or arboretum is something that should be easily yard-convertible and even if not a simple enough redesign to create a variant class.
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Maybe Sayle can add options to do modular modules, add cost but make it really easy to switch between a couple torpedo launchers, a cargo bay or a science lab? Valuable but a tactical move, because it may or may not pay off.
 
Terrible Ideas: design brief for a standard for hot-swappable starship modules. Choices include shape and dimensions, mass limits, power supply, what each face of the module is used for, how hard to go on proof-of-concept modules to launch the program with, etc.
 
Vebyast said:
Terrible Ideas: design brief for a standard for hot-swappable starship modules. Choices include shape and dimensions, mass limits, power supply, what each face of the module is used for, how hard to go on proof-of-concept modules to launch the program with, etc.
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Is it bad I would see this as a good idea.. like seriously this could be fun being able to get into the nitty gritty on everything would be so much fun.. tbh it's not much different then the Nacelles and warpcore votes we did..
 
Vebyast said:
Terrible Ideas: design brief for a standard for hot-swappable starship modules. Choices include shape and dimensions, mass limits, power supply, what each face of the module is used for, how hard to go on proof-of-concept modules to launch the program with, etc.
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There'd obviously have to be downsides to a modular system like this, especially in its infancy, the simplest being reduced performance and increased base-cost
 
TheShadowDeamon said:
The US navy actually tried this. Decided it wasn't worth it as the swappable modules weren't as good as their dedicated counterparts, it was hugely expensive and you needed somewhere to store all the modules not in use.
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It's rather important to note that they failed on it when another NATO navy had done it successfully for decades, and others seem to be adopting it to some extent (what with the popularity especially of modular mission bays).
 
Modular ships are not very interesting from a quest standpoint. Instead of putting in parts you just have.. modules. The ship can do anything. What decisions are there to be made?
 
Having a single aux slot or large module be swappable seem reasonable if it's positioned well. As long as there aren't a huge number of module configurations they need to deal with or massive differences in power usage then why not. With gravity manipulation and space environments swapping modules feels like it should be easier to achieve. There could be restrictions on antimatter use or tying in major EPS grid branches which would stop us from creating a tactical pack for the first few generations.
 
I wouldn't be opposed to tactical focused ships getting options for megaphasers, for example.

Bonus there would probably be that when next generation regular phasers come in the overbuild EPS conduits would likely work out well for a refit.
 
Shard said:
Modular ships are not very interesting from a quest standpoint. Instead of putting in parts you just have.. modules. The ship can do anything. What decisions are there to be made?
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Both the Miranda and the Nebular class of ship's with modular designs. The base ship remains, but the mission pods can be swept as needed.

Both designs are among the fan favored. So, I wouldn't say it would be boring.

Especially if we didn't have to design the ship itself but the mission pod.

For example, we might be asked to design a mission pod for a scout variant. What kind of sensors will we use? Is there a limit to the weight and/or energy requirements?
 
Tank man said:
It's rather important to note that they failed on it when another NATO navy had done it successfully for decades, and others seem to be adopting it to some extent (what with the popularity especially of modular mission bays).
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IIRC there's a crucial difference between LCS multi mission modules and the Danish Stanflex system.

Stanflex let's the Danish navy hot swap a gun for another gun.

The multi mission modules were supposed to allow the LCS to change missions on the fly.

The first one works great. The second one failed. The thing about missions? You need to train for each mission. You can't just swap a anti-surface module for a mine sweeping module and expect the crew to just instantly be good at minesweeping. Even if they receive training in both missions, they still need time to refamiliarize themselves with the new capabilities of the ship. What they gained. What they lost. The peculiarities of the mission etc.

With Stanflex, you're swapping say a 45mm bofors for another 45mm bofors. Same shit, different day.
 
Jax said:
Both the Miranda and the Nebular class of ship's with modular designs. The base ship remains, but the mission pods can be swept as needed.

Both designs are among the fan favored. So, I wouldn't say it would be boring.

Especially if we didn't have to design the ship itself but the mission pod.

For example, we might be asked to design a mission pod for a scout variant. What kind of sensors will we use? Is there a limit to the weight and/or energy requirements?
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Are they, though? With the Miranda, every single one has the rollbar except for the Lantree, which doesn't have anthing, and the Saratoga, which has a pair of little sensors sticking out the side that don't even attach at the same point as the rollbar. There's nothing to suggest its something easily swapped as the rollbar is directly integrated into the pylons of the warp nacelle. It seems more likely that the Saratoga is just a variant or refit. The same goes for that distant background 'Antares' variant from one episode DS9. You can see a list of the variants at Ex Astris Scientia.

The same applies to the Nebula. Every single one has the triangle pod except the original Phoenix, and maybe the weird Wolf 359 proto-Nebula 'Melbourne' if you say it's the same class. Fans say that it's a swappable module but if so Starfleet sure doesn't seem to be swapping them on 95% of Nebulas.
 
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That actually raises another point: modularity only matters if you actually plan to swap out the modules. If the ship is going to do bioscience 95% of the time, there's no point making it modular because for the few times it hauls cargo you can just lash the crates to the trees and call it a jury-rig. Modularity costs time and money to install and takes up precious volume, so only use it if you actually need it.
If it's about extending lifespan, just refit the ship class when its science is obsolescent. Tearing stuff out to make cargo space is an easy refit.

[X] Arboretum (+2 Science)
 
Man, here we are stuck between building the design Starfleet asked us for, or building the design we think Starfleet will need.

We've received no changes to the order, and I'd rather design a dedicated new Warp 8 engineering/patrol ship.

[X] Arboretum (+2 Science)
 
"Super easy refit" and "straight up hotswapable anywhere the moduels can be stored" are very different kinds of modular. "We make standard role specific parts and combine them as needed" is another type entirely, and very well suited to, say, small to mid size stations. Not so much ships. And then there's modular construction of the type used IRL for ships, with sections built seperately and then brought together late in the construction process, rather than building it all as a single unit.

The "super easy refit" version which also allows for inividual ships to be more customized during production (this is the "some with trees, some with crates" idea), is Highly practical. The hotswap version is... Not, generally.
 
I can see "Mission Bay"s working if they have teams dedicated to them. Kinda like how each Squadron of aircraft have their own teams. So the specialists in a specific mission type learn their thing and focus on that thing. The permanent crew only learn what they need to learn.
 
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2242: Project Darwin (Auxiliary: Part Two)
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    • [X] Arboretum (+2 Science)

    With the Arboretum installed in the secondary hull you turn your attention to the saucer section. There is a great deal of space available on Deck Six which can be adapted to house science labs and sample vaults, and given the small form-factor of the Darwin you are reluctant to waste it with the installation of general-use equipment. Instead you are of two minds over the pair of options the team has settled on, with both having useful applications.

    The first option is to continue investing and emphasising the colony-world investigation capabilities which the ship is primarily designed for. By adding a biosciences lab you can carry out general investigations on the flora and fauna of a target planet, with the arboretum allowing transplantation and live examination on plant-based exobiology in general. Further expanding on this with a full chemistry suite would allow more in-depth molecular analysis in addition to the usual advantages of having a wide availability of basic chemical synthesis for other operations. These capabilities combined would make the Darwin's facilities the match of any university laboratory when it comes to plant sciences.

    Alternatively you could hold back by adding the biosciences laboratories for the same advantages, but stopping short of the chemistry facilities. By instead adding medical-specific equipment and expanding the sickbay you could use the biosciences modules to provide the adaptability in analytics and available equipment a competent physician needs to tackle novel diseases or conduct treatments away from more sophisticated facilities - facilities which are almost universally unavailable on the frontier. While producing less raw data than the first option and falling short of the sheer patient throughput of a dedicated medical ship, this provides a utility that is likely to save lives down the line. The decision is yours.

    [ ] Plant Sciences (+8 Science) [Specialisations: Exobiology, Biochemistry, Plant Sciences]
    [ ] Advanced Medical (+6 Science) [Specialisations: Exobiology, Advanced Medicine]

    Two Hour Moratorium, Please

     
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    • .... Well, I personally am fine with us economizing on science a bit when "will likely save lives down the line" is outright stated. If nothing else, having a ship like this as a medical emergency first responder is probably a damn good idea, considering any medical ships we've got are at best going to be Warp 7 vintage.
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    Varano said:
    [X] Advanced Medical (+6 Science) [Specialisations: Exobiology, Advanced Medicine]
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    Two Hour Moratorium, fellow designer - vote opens at 5:53 PM EST, by my math.
     
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