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If we end up designing another support ship, it's probably an idea to snap up light covariant though (situation dependent of course), it should keep things fairly cheap, give it better durability and push the technology on a wee bit.
- Pronouns
- He
[X] Type-1 Heavy [36 Shields] --- (Cost 79.25 -> 97.25) --- [Second Tranche: 73.25 -> 91.25]
[X] Heavy Covariant [44 Shields] --- (Cost 79.25 -> 116.75) --- [Second Tranche: 73.25 -> 103.25]
[X] Heavy Covariant [44 Shields] --- (Cost 79.25 -> 116.75) --- [Second Tranche: 73.25 -> 103.25]
- Location
- west
Heavy type 1s are better than the standard covariants from that perspective because it actually let's the ship keep up with the tech instad of being stuck with obsolete shields for it's size.
By this logic most Klingon ships will also be alone. Thus leading to the question of 1 on 1 engagements being one of the more relevant metrics. This seems to some what match canon as well, where Enterprize encountered lone D7.
When we get to actual practicalities, I've still yet to hear what exactly you are so afraid of from the D7. Or which particular 'likely' engagement type threatens the current ship so much that one absolutely must have a small bit of extra shield power to overcome it.
I would not come to that conclusion, considering that Covariants are the new tech.
[X] Type-1 Standard [27 Shields] --- (Cost 79.25 -> 84.75) --- [Second Tranche: 73.25 -> 78.75]
[X] Type-1 Heavy [36 Shields] --- (Cost 79.25 -> 97.25) --- [Second Tranche: 73.25 -> 91.25]
With how Covariant Shields are only currently 4 years off from hitting Standard Technology anyway I'm inclined to get more ships out now and save the better shields for a refit once they are Standard. Especially, since it also lets us dodge a having another prototype roll on the first order.
[X] Type-1 Heavy [36 Shields] --- (Cost 79.25 -> 97.25) --- [Second Tranche: 73.25 -> 91.25]
With how Covariant Shields are only currently 4 years off from hitting Standard Technology anyway I'm inclined to get more ships out now and save the better shields for a refit once they are Standard. Especially, since it also lets us dodge a having another prototype roll on the first order.
Eh.
Sayle has said that Klingon weapon and shield tech is better than ours.
So we're looking at a ship half the size of ours that can likely dance like a ballerina due to the weight
And which has great weapons and shield tech.
We should be able to achieve parity or near-parity, but deleting D7s looks like it might be optimistic.
It's a simplified example, yes. I'd actually presume that one A would die due to perfectly focused damage here. Under that assumption a C with 2 dps and 20 hp would beat two A's. Having said that, ships in Star Trek are not discrete like this. As they take damage, their effectiveness degrades. This puts the outcome closer to square, but that requries a calculus derivation that I'm not going to try and stuff in a forum post. Lanchester's laws - Wikipedia has the derivation.
Yes, but net-net it represents roughly how a fleet action will work. If we have 20% fewer ships, we can expect on average 20% fewer of them will show up.
The strategic issue is about breakpoints, where what we want is as many hulls as possible that can defeat a single D7 reliably(or two, but we're not likely to get that). This is harder to judge. I think Type-1 Heavy is sufficient to beat a D7 reliably, you can differ. I have arguments why I think so but it's all speculative.
[X] Type-1 Heavy [36 Shields] --- (Cost 79.25 -> 97.25) --- [Second Tranche: 73.25 -> 91.25]
Enthusiast#117
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- Location
- United States
[X] Heavy Covariant [44 Shields] (Cost 79.25 -> 116.75) [Second Tranche: 73.25 ->103.25]
[X] Standard Covariant [36 Shields] --- (Cost 79.25 -> 104.75) --- [Second Tranche: 73.25 -> 93.75]
[X] Heavy Covariant [44 Shields] --- (Cost 79.25 -> 116.75) --- [Second Tranche: 73.25 -> 103.25]
[X] Heavy Covariant [44 Shields] --- (Cost 79.25 -> 116.75) --- [Second Tranche: 73.25 -> 103.25]
- Location
- Australia
It's on the basis that we can only refit to the size we install. So it's heavy shields forever at whatever we refit to, or standard forever. Both have the same current power, the heavy has better future prospects.
Mechanis
Confirmed Extremely Screwed
- Location
- Absconding with Alacrity
I find this highly reductive of the arguments made. We have stated how it makes the ship better: By increasing durability, we will reduce the rate at which ships suffer nontrivial damage, critical damage, and destruction, leading to potentially having more ships as fewer will be destroyed or irreparably damaged; we will reduce the casualty rates for their crews (extremely valuable), we will be advancing a technical field that has remained stagnant for decades, AND we will be producing a vessel of intimidating strength that may itself deter a war from even occurring simply because it is so fast, powerful and durable. All of which are very good reasons, not "chasing the shiny thing."
NSMS
Probably evil, unfortunately.
- Location
- A rapidly widening tear in the fabric of reality
I think what they mean is that we're stuck with the shield size we pick here- we can't go from Covariant Standard to Type-2 Heavy later on, for example.
It's because the thinking is that you probably can't swap a Standard Covariant for a Large Covariant in a refit. If that is the case, then the Type 1 Heavy would be the logical choice to go to. Both for longevity via refit as well as keeping costs down, thus allowing more ships.
[X] Type-1 Heavy [36 Shields] --- (Cost 79.25 -> 97.25) --- [Second Tranche: 73.25 -> 91.25]
For 3 reasons:
1- it's the best bang for buck and compromise we had available since the engine dilemma and we need to rein in costs to pump out more ships.
2- has pointed out if we win a post war refit is pretty much inevitable specifically after the new nacelle. Everything point to a higher tension post war so i doubt they will just mothball them.
3- we need them to come out swinging and we already have to much prototype tech low rolls can reduce it's treath and lose us the chance to push back the war for a decade if it gives enough pause to the Klingons.
For 3 reasons:
1- it's the best bang for buck and compromise we had available since the engine dilemma and we need to rein in costs to pump out more ships.
2- has pointed out if we win a post war refit is pretty much inevitable specifically after the new nacelle. Everything point to a higher tension post war so i doubt they will just mothball them.
3- we need them to come out swinging and we already have to much prototype tech low rolls can reduce it's treath and lose us the chance to push back the war for a decade if it gives enough pause to the Klingons.
No they are not.
We are already starting from behind the tech curve; the Klingons have better shields than we do.
Just to achieve technological parity requires additional effort on our part.
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[X] Type-1 Standard [27 Shields] --- (Cost 79.25 -> 84.75) --- [Second Tranche: 73.25 -> 78.75]
These votes have been happening so fast.
EDIT: Once again, tactical voting time.
[X] Type-1 Heavy [36 Shields] --- (Cost 79.25 -> 97.25) --- [Second Tranche: 73.25 -> 91.25]
These votes have been happening so fast.
EDIT: Once again, tactical voting time.
[X] Type-1 Heavy [36 Shields] --- (Cost 79.25 -> 97.25) --- [Second Tranche: 73.25 -> 91.25]
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- Location
- New York
- Pronouns
- He/Him
[X] Standard Covariant [36 Shields] --- (Cost 79.25 -> 104.75) --- [Second Tranche: 73.25 -> 93.75]
I assume we'll never do the refit. We sometimes don't. Large is fine for a ship this size, tbh. I'd prefer Heavy Covariant, if I'm brutally honest, but the cost prevents me from voting for it.
We will reduce our effectiveness in a fleet action, we will reduce our coverage and therefore increase the losses to other ships, civilians, and attrition on these ships, we will have advanced a technical field by no more than 5 years at the cost of our current war. And we do not know how the Klingons will react, but my bet is that they know military theory and will recognize that fewer, stronger ships do not necessarily advantage us in a war.
Sayle said basically you can swap out a large-type shield for another large-type, or a medium for medium. They're size-dependent. This thing would be terrifying it after a refit it had next-gen nacelles, Type 2 large shields, an aft rapid-fire torpedo launcher, a couple of flanking phasers and another aft phaser. Absolute beast. Makes my lobes tingle.