Remove ads

Puella Magi Adfligo Systema

Reader mode
[X] She already stands with you. She's a good friend, a brave fighter, and has enormous potential as a meguca. Switching under pressure is important, but it'll just take practice.
-[X] Reiterate how absurd her power is. You wouldn't be surprised if she ended up as the most powerful member of the group in combat, given time.
--[X] Beyond that, you want to help magical girls everywhere, and her assistance (teleportation, healing, info gathering, meta/antimagic, etc.) can provide logistics support that would take an entire team, normally.
-[X] In the short term, she's doing quite well. Give perspective on what newbies are usually like. When Homura was as fresh as her, she almost keeled over in exhaustion from trying to beat up a barrel with a golf club. Don't, uh, tell her you said that.

[X] But that's enough of heavy topics. Go enjoy karaoke. Hug teh Mumi. Duet?

150 words.
 
[] The things you intend to fight are stranger and stronger than you think Sayaka might have imagined. Prima Luce is useful, but against Walpurgisnacht and its peers it's a parlor trick. Sayaka's power set is practically designed for the kinds of spectacular bullshit that we'll need against greater threats.
 
"It's alright to feel that way. Sometimes I feel it too, worrying about how despite everything I can't do everything I want to do. But, Sayaka, you're amazing. Not just because of your magic--and don't get me wrong, your magic is fucking god-tier--but even as Sayaka Miki, you're amazing. Your wish...it gave you the power to put that awesome personality, those wonderful ideals, to use. Honestly my mind boggles when I consider what you could do with the powers you have right now as it is. You can fill any role, in combat or support. You're the ultimate team player, both by your magic and by your personality.

So you have some areas you can improve on. If you didn't, well...you'd be Mami Tomoe. :p"
 
Vebyast said:
[] The things you intend to fight are stranger and stronger than you think Sayaka might have imagined. Prima Luce is useful, but against Walpurgisnacht and its peers it's a parlor trick. Sayaka's power set is practically designed for the kinds of spectacular bullshit that we'll need against greater threats.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...

Is there a sense you had in mind for that spectacular bullshit besides us helping Sayaka go singularity with a power enhancer by enabling them to keep it going as long as they can get returns safely?

Do you mean the Incubators and Feathers when you speak of greater threats?
 
Last edited:
Conjured Blade said:
Is there a sense you had in mind for that spectacular bullshit besides us helping Sayaka go singularity with a power enhancer by enabling them to keep it going as long as they can get returns safely?
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
Yes. Just simple power interactions are fucking broken.

Like, say that Sayaka finds a power that grows stronger the longer she stays in one place; that could have a trivial interaction with Nadia's Juggernaut ability, defining herself as being conceptually attached to that specific place. The lightning ability should be able to power quite a few things. The x-ray vision power breaks in half an entire class of powers that're balanced by insufficient ability to inspect the changes you're making. Stacking up healing and other defensive buffs until she's unkillable. There's probably something broken about her using Kazumi's power. Clone powers combined with anything that stacks with itself or can be applied to itself, for example, power boosting or lightning. Super learning skills plus skills that're balanced by being difficult to learn to use, for example, Sayaka's own power. Super learning skills combined with x-ray vision and Kazumi's power.

There, that's five minutes of brainstorming just on the powers that Sayaka has and that should be common enough for us to find for her to copy. Give me a huge list of meguca and I'll find more. Sayaka is broken.
 
Vebyast said:
Yes. Just simple power interactions are fucking broken.

Like, say that Sayaka finds a power that grows stronger the longer she stays in one place; that could have a trivial interaction with Nadia's Juggernaut ability, defining herself as being conceptually attached to that specific place. The lightning ability should be able to power quite a few things. The x-ray vision power breaks in half an entire class of powers that're balanced by insufficient ability to inspect the changes you're making. Stacking up healing and other defensive buffs until she's unkillable. There's probably something broken about her using Kazumi's power. Clone powers combined with anything that stacks with itself or can be applied to itself, for example, power boosting or lightning. Super learning skills plus skills that're balanced by being difficult to learn to use, for example, Sayaka's own power. Super learning skills combined with x-ray vision and Kazumi's power.

There, that's five minutes of brainstorming just on the powers that Sayaka has and that should be common enough for us to find for her to copy. Give me a huge list of meguca and I'll find more. Sayaka is broken.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...

Fair enough. What I was going for here is the research determining the most effective interaction for a situation would take and that brown belt syndrome/decision paralysis/meta-strategy angle I've been pushing.

If she's going to be investigating power interactions anyway and that's what makes her so broken, then bringing her in on cleansing research makes sense. It's even goes for power of friendship/social activity thematic. 50/50 Ribbon grief electromagnet between Sayaka and Mami to reduce the intrusive feelings maybe. Then Sayaka uses power enhancement to make the ribbons more durable/our grief attractor more forceful and we cleanse everyone in the city at once or something. That's just for starters about the possibilities. What if Sayaka finds a way to whitesnake our power and connect it to the magnet using some other power to provide a frame?

Couple other things I've forgotten about if your willing to answer. How many powers can Sayaka access at the same time? Does Sayaka know about feathers? If the only other threat is the incubators and Sayaka knows about feathers then we should just say feathers to avoid that minefield and needing to witchbomb Sayaka and such.
 
Last edited:
I think we told Sayaka and Hitomi about Feathers (but not about stairs. Hitomi knows about stairs) during the talk with Oriko.
 
Redshirt Army said:
[X] She already stands with you. She's a good friend, a brave fighter, and has enormous potential as a meguca. Switching under pressure is important, but it'll just take practice.
-[X] Reiterate how absurd her power is. You wouldn't be surprised if she ended up as the most powerful member of the group in combat, given time.
--[X] Beyond that, you want to help magical girls everywhere, and her assistance (teleportation, healing, info gathering, meta/antimagic, etc.) can provide logistics support that would take an entire team, normally.
-[X] In the short term, she's doing quite well. Give perspective on what newbies are usually like. When Homura was as fresh as her, she almost keeled over in exhaustion from trying to beat up a barrel with a golf club. Don't, uh, tell her you said that.

[X] But that's enough of heavy topics. Karaoke, group hunt, Mami, duet?

150 words.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...

I'm not a fan. I like perspective on where she is, I like it a lot. I don't like the rest, not really... Not when this exists:

Firnagzen said:
Oh, and I forgot to mention - keep the song suggestions coming!

Also, if you bring up Sayaka's versatility, she's gonna ask: versatility for what?
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...

Firnagzen said:
She has a versatile array of powers, but what is that versatile array of powers going to be applied to if not fighting?
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...

That's a wog. It's a wog that is not very nice. Sayaka is blueberry, not a weapon. Let's not ignore that.

Here.

[X] Reassure Sayaka about her growth rate and combat prowess. Maybe it doesn't seem impressive to her, but Kyouko, Mami, and Homura are all one-percenters among meguca as veterans.
-[X] It may be hard to believe she's doing incredibly when she's walking away bruised and beaten. But the facts are there: she's impressed Mami, you, and you're pretty sure she's impressed Kyouko, too, not that the Tsundere will show it.
[X] As a support? Healing, mobility, infowar... Every imaginable utility power under the sun in one blueberry.
[X] And out of combat... Ask (rhetorically) if she could stop a tsunami or a hurricane. You think maybe she's missing a power or two currently, but Akiko in Sendai has powerful hydrokinesis.
[X] She could be a hero without fighting. Seems she enjoys it, though, so, hey!
[X] But that's enough of heavy topics. Go enjoy karaoke. Hug teh Mumi. Duet?

Total: 135 words.
V3: 146 words. Added last sentence of line 4 as embellishment; unneeded.
V4: added line 5 between old lines 4, 5, removed V3 change.



Catgirl's note: Sayaka could definitely stop a tsunami with flight and hydrokinesis plus a clear seed. Maybe not the entire thing, but enough to protect a whole nation? Probably more. A hurricane, I'm not a physicist. Hell I could be wrong about this entirely -- but I don't think so, not with the ability to dump as much magic into the hydrokinesis as she can. Do tell me if you think line 3 is too triggering -- there's some balance of "making a point that will really, really stick" and "not fucking triggering Sayaka" that I probably have missed by miles, but I'm pretty beat up after moving today so yeah. I still contend that "you could stop a natural disaster" is basically the ultimate "this is a non-combat application" statement here and is also easy to provide support for. I'm omitting Homura from us kyouko and mami in line 2 because I don't think she's seen Sayaka recently.

...

Did we ever get details from Yuma on redblue meeting? I think we did.

E: threw out line 3 in favor of not triggering seikyu and instead talking about utility. Version 2
 
Last edited:
I still think that bringing up the sayapolice is a good idea.

[] Mami and Homura joked earlier that you'd make a terrible empress. Which you would be! But that doesn't mean that you won't have to do something when you have hundreds or thousand of meguca seeking shelter and cleansing. You need as much good help as you can get, and Sayaka is perfectly equipped to help.

Edit: something still feels off. Ugh.

You know what? None of this skipping off into the sunset, I want to get to the bottom of this, and if we can't do it up front we'll just have to settle in for a bit.

[X] Reassure Sayaka about her growth rate and combat prowess. Maybe it doesn't seem impressive to her, but Kyouko, Mami, and Homura are all one-percenters among meguca as veterans.
-[X] It may be hard to believe she's doing incredibly when she's walking away bruised and beaten. But the facts are there: she's impressed Mami, you, and you're pretty sure she's impressed Kyouko, too, not that the Tsundere will show it.
[X] As a support? Healing, mobility, infowar... Every imaginable utility power under the sun in one blueberry.
[X] And out of combat... Ask (rhetorically) if she could stop a tsunami or a hurricane. You think maybe she's missing a power or two currently, but Akiko in Sendai has powerful hydrokinesis. The Order of the Rising Sun has been awarded for less.
[x] If you don't get anything obvious from Sayaka's response, go ahead and ask her what exactly is bothering her. Despite your occasional pretension to divinity you're actually kinda terrible about some stuff.
[] But that's enough of heavy topics. Go enjoy karaoke. Hug teh Mumi. Duet?
 
Last edited:
I would rather like to ask directly about what Sayaka was referring to with Kyouko, also... I dunno. My original interpretation of that was that she was asking about something Kyouko had said, the bit about fighting dirty?
 
I thought what Sayaka was referring to was super obvious: She's asking if Kyouko is right that if her power is "switching powers", then if she can't do that effectively, "then what good is she."

That's why I directly responded to it in my vote: Switching powers more fluidly under pressure is important, but it's just a matter of practice, that's all.

Is that not the correct interpretation?
 
[]As a power copying magical girl you're basically the ultimate partner for cleansing research.
-[]But you suspect she doesn't want to hole up in a warehouse with you investigating grief electromagnets and such all the time
-[]As Sayaka Miki though, there's two things you can do to help. Look up Hobbes and Social Contract theory. Also the tragedy of the commons. Mami and Homura joked earlier that you'd make a terrible empress and you agree with them. But hundreds or thousands of magical girls seeking shelter and cleansing means something needs to be done. If it was a democracy and you were a communal resource people would fight over you. If you ruled as a tyrant you could punish people for fighting over you but it would cut into research time. Is there an alternative? Must you become leviathan?
-[]Sayaka would make an excellent peacekeeper in that new government.

Also if people are curious here's the basis for that angle about metastrategies/brown belt syndrome I was pushing. It may be useful advice for Sayaka.

Decide is the second time waster. There's a thing called Hick's Law which states that the more options you have, the longer it takes to choose one. Makes sense. I call this the Brown Belt syndrome. It's what happens when you have too many cool ways to win and you get your ass kicked while you are weighing options. The way to grow past this is something I call "meta-strategy". Again, this is something I've back engineered from the people that consistently make it work, not something I'm reasoning out.

The people I know who consistently do well in ambushes or have often beaten the maxim that action is faster than reaction have one thing in common. They have a group of techniques that form the core of their strategy that they DO NOT SEE AS SEPARATE TECHNIQUES. Mac has hundreds of disarms and counter-attacks, but when he is surprised he "de-fangs the snake". He can and will do it in a hundred different ways, but in his mind it's just one thing. James "does damage". Again, hundreds of techniques that are all one thing in his brain. I "take the center".
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...

Chiron: OODA Introduction
 
Last edited:
Redshirt Army said:
--[X] In the short term, she's doing quite well. Give perspective on what newbies are usually like. When Homura was as fresh as her, she almost keeled over in exhaustion from trying to beat up a barrel with a golf club. Don't, uh, tell her you said that.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
I don't think that we should mention events from a previous loop where Kyubey can hear us.

Kaizuki said:
[X] And out of combat... Ask (rhetorically) if she could stop a tsunami or a hurricane. You think maybe she's missing a power or two currently, but Akiko in Sendai has powerful hydrokinesis. The Order of the Rising Sun has been awarded for less.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
I really wish you'd quit harping on this hurricane thing. I don't think it's helpful for the issues Sayaka is having. I also don't think it's true. You're really underestimating the scale of the events in question. The NOAA has said that detonating a nuclear weapon in the eye of a hurricane would barely even slow it down.

Redshirt Army said:
Is that not the correct interpretation?
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
Unfortunately, Sayaka elected to be vague as fuck when we asked her what she meant:
Firnagzen said:
"Hey, Sabrina?" Sayaka murmurs quietly.

"Yep?" you ask, tilting your head back to glance at Sayaka.

"Was Kyouko right?" she asks.

"About?" you ask.

"She... I dunno," Sayaka says. "I know you said that fighting isn't everything, but... ugh. I made my Wish so I could stand with you, you know?"
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
 
Vebyast said:
I still think that bringing up the sayapolice is a good idea.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
Agreed. For all we joke about it, her sense of justice makes it's worth explicitly mentioning the idea to Sayaka, at least in passing.

Redshirt Army said:
I thought what Sayaka was referring to was super obvious: She's asking if Kyouko is right that if her power is "switching powers", then if she can't do that effectively, "then what good is she."

That's why I directly responded to it in my vote: Switching powers more fluidly under pressure is important, but it's just a matter of practice, that's all.

Is that not the correct interpretation?
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
I figured it Sayaka was bringing up the comment on her monofocus.

EDIT:
The Narrator said:
I really wish you'd quit harping on this hurricane thing. I don't think it's helpful for the issues Sayaka is having. I also don't think it's true. You're really underestimating the scale of the events in question. The NOAA has said that detonating a nuclear weapon in the eye of a hurricane would barely even slow it down.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
I think, more relevant than whether or not its actually possible, is that it sounds like hype. We's have a better chance to get away with saying such things if Sayaka knew about our metaknowledge and thus had reason to believe we're alluding to an event we actually saw, but as it stands it's sounds a lot like hyperbole.
 
Last edited:
Redshirt Army said:
I thought what Sayaka was referring to was super obvious: She's asking if Kyouko is right that if her power is "switching powers", then if she can't do that effectively, "then what good is she."

That's why I directly responded to it in my vote: Switching powers more fluidly under pressure is important, but it's just a matter of practice, that's all.

Is that not the correct interpretation?
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...

Kyouko said nothing of the sort in the update. She may have implied it, but it was never said. I thought she might've been responding to the bit about dirty fighting because that seemed... Well, like the kind of thing she wouldn't like. And... She really hasn't seen any of us fight except against witches where we hold back. Mami fights "fair" against witches from that perspective, plausibly. I dunno.

The Narrator said:
really wish you'd quit harping on this hurricane thing. I don't think it's helpful for the issues Sayaka is having. I also don't think it's true. You're really underestimating the scale of the events in question. The NOAA has said that detonating a nuclear weapon in the eye of a hurricane would barely even slow it down.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...

Adding energy to a storm. Terrible plan. A nuke would have to use pure force to fuck with a storm; it's an inherently wasteful concept, and distributed in a rough sphere it's virtually pointless. Hydrokinesis is a different matter, especially because "moves water at will" has a variable power output depending on the previous momentum of the liquid.

The real question becomes the mechanics of the hydrokinesis in question. I theorize that, given a clear seed's worth of magic, those mechanics are almost surely busted AF.

Optimally speaking, in terms of energy a strong hydrokinetic would grab as much moisture as possible and just start spinning it the wrong way, is my hairbrained theory. You'll do a helluva lot better than a bomb, at least. Keep in mind also that a nuke is a one-off. An effort made over several hours with a meaningful tool is much more intriguing. Alternatively, any power which generates relatively cool material would be a very strong shutdown mechanism. Injecting cold water en masse into the parts of the system that are supposed to be warm would be catastrophic at sufficient amounts.

Ignoring that, tsunamis are still valid.

Please remember that magic has potentially arbitrary physical effects depending on how it is used. Timestop exists as a prime example. Also, before making accusations and talking about how I'm "harping", I would've liked it if you would have read the nice note i left and been so kind as to respond with courtesy.

Now, issues.

Sayaka's issues:

> Feels useless (always)
> By wog, doesn't see a use for her powers besides combat
> ???

Would you like to dispute wog again?
 
Last edited:
Maybe we need to give Sayaka some advice on how to be creative? Or is the failure to see non-combat applications for literally having all the powers ever necessarily a symptom of messed up cognition as a result of psychological distress?
Kaizuki said:
I would rather like to ask directly about what Sayaka was referring to with Kyouko, also... I dunno. My original interpretation of that was that she was asking about something Kyouko had said, the bit about fighting dirty?
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
SGTM. This vote is pointless until we know more about what's going on inside her head.


[x] Reassure Sayaka. She is standing with you.
[x] Put things in perspective for her. She's comparing herself to several of the best magical girls on the planet. Possibly among the best in history. And whatever she thinks, it's only a matter of practice for her to measure up.
-[x] Elaborate as appropriate - Sayapolice, weather control and clones+teleport+healing for disaster response, plant control for chemistry and fabrication, etc.
-[x] You'd absolutely trust her to solve something that needed solving. She's impressed Mami. And you have it on good authority that Kyouko is 110% tsundere.
[x] If she's worried about the over-focus that Kyouko was talking about, reassure her - that's also something that can be practiced. Why else did Kyouko have her practicing it? And focus can be a good thing, if properly managed, same way that lack of focus can be useful if managed.
[x] If appropriate, do the supportive-listener thing; ask her if there's anything else bothering her, if we missed the point entirely, etc.
 
Last edited:
Sayapolice seems like a good plan.

Hurricane stopper does sound like Hyperbole, even if it's possibly true. I'd much rather we focus on her character than on her raw ability, because she does have a role in the group it just hasn't been called on much yet. She'll be far too popular in the months ahead - we should mention that to her.

[X] Vebyast
 
Vebyast said:
Maybe we need to give Sayaka some advice on how to be creative? Or is the failure to see non-combat applications for literally having all the powers ever necessarily a symptom of messed up cognition as a result of psychological distress?

SGTM. This vote is pointless until we know more about what's going on inside her head.


[x] Reassure Sayaka. She is standing with you.
[x] Put things in perspective for her. She's comparing herself to several of the best magical girls on the planet. Possibly among the best in history. And whatever she thinks, it's only a matter of practice for her to measure up.
-[x] Elaborate as appropriate - Sayapolice, weather control and clones+teleport+healing for disaster response, plant control for chemistry and fabrication, etc. You'd absolutely trust her to solve something that needed solving.
[x] If she's worried about the over-focus that Kyouko was talking about, reassure her - that's also something that can be practiced. Why else did Kyouko have her practicing it? And focus can be a good thing, if properly managed, same way that lack of focus can be useful if managed.
[x] If appropriate, do the supportive-listener thing; ask her if there's anything else bothering her, if we missed the point entirely, etc.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...

This needs to be bandwagoned. I think you should add a derivative of the

Vebyast said:
she's impressed Mami, you, and you're pretty sure she's impressed Kyouko, too, not that the Tsundere will show it.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...

Line from my vote, on the grounds that it's an easy thing to do with lots of meaning + reassurance, but otherwise?

[X] Vebyast
 
Reader mode
You must login or register to reply here.
Remove ads
Back
Top