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Puella Magi Adfligo Systema

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Nolrai said:
The Shelby reference is not good I think. Its not the actual situation, nor does it help elucidate anything.
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I 'unno. Initially good kid, who's the very much in the image of her creator and shares her flaws and virtues both, driven bad by circumstance and terrible parenting and then ends up taking revenge?

I mean, all you really need to complete it is for Hijiri to ask them to make someone else like her so she won't have to suffer so much loneliness (and possibly marry), have that wish rejected by her creator, and swear eternal revenge as a result.

And a bit ago there was kinda talk about how Hijiri might end up crushing on Sabrina if she found out about her.
 
[X] Onmur

Although I'd prefer to preemptively break up a fight and interject now (a large part of my brain is even screaming at me to whip up my own vote), I can understand that our intentions might be misunderstood.

Not to mention, I don't trust my own votesmithing capabilities.
 
[x] To Saki: Niko's attempting to run Hijiri's life for her. Having good intentions doesn't change that she's denying Hijiri's agency. And since that's exactly what Hijiri is having problems with...
[x] Interrupt.
-[x] Shoot down the "fake person" idea.
--[x] Don't give away any sensitive information, but convey that you're in a similar situation.
--[x] Also, no observable differences between "real" and "artificial", so why care in the first place?
-[x] Tell Niko that she's being overbearing. She has good intentions, but Hijiri's a person too.
[x] Step back and let them go another round.

The phrasing on "Hijiri is a person too" is important.
 
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[X] No, slapping and yelling doesn't end well. And we're not leaving them alone, that's a recipe for evil-clone shenanigans.
[X] Interject, tell Hijiri that created doesn't mean "fake" and argue the point briefly.
-[X] Niko and Hijiri are scientists. Empiricism, then: What is the observable difference? Hijiri can't tell that you woke up in an alley with no memories and a giant hole in your chest not three weeks ago, you can't tell that Hijiri is anything but normal.
[X] Break to voting after seeing the reactions to that line.

Honestly I'm thinking revealing that we are, as far as we know, a wish creation, can only help at this point, and this is the best way to go about bringing it up
 
AuraTwilight said:
I mean granted Hijiri's dad could just be a cop or something.

EDIT: Also, Onmur recovered on a reread of PMKM that Niko's incident happened in California.
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A Cop would have studied gun safety enough to know that kids should never be anywhere near a loaded firearm. Seriously, my best friend's house had enough rifles to stock a small revolution, as well as a few handguns. but they all were under lock and key.

And cops are told to never hand off their guns to anyone let alone a small child. You don't just leave that shit loaded on a table or in a drawer or some shit. This ain't a videogame where the gun has to be easily accessible for the protagonist.
 
[x] Vebyast

Is most in line with my thinking, so far. I get the feeling it might piss Niko off, so there might be a certain amount of of tuning to be done with the phrasing. On the other hand, Hijiri is more likely to be useful soon if we get Niko to back off, and she doesn't get the impression that she's alone, friendless, an aberration.
 
... I don't want to interrupt yet, because the Kannas are actually talking their minds.

But we should get a word in, and try to help them stay calm.

...

[ ] Hijiri's still a threat, and Niko's angry and not treating her fairly.
[ ] Give the Kannas space if they mind you being there, but stay within sight and listen in.
-[ ] Grief Fog ready, if case it's needed.

[ ] If the conversation progresses well, let it play out.
-[ ] Else, interfere. Mediate. Try to keep the Kannas calm.
-[ ] Appeal to their rationality, help them make their cases, and understand each other's point of view.

[ ] If the conversation seems hopeless, bring up the current crisis. Yuuri.
-[ ] Get rid of the Memory Device and ask to be put in contact with Yuuri.

The veB approach sounds great... if it works.

Call bullshit, make some points, let them at it. If they listen, great.

But why would the Kannas even listen to us, here?

We can hint at our possible origins while we're at it, but that can come out as cryptic BS and just anger the Kannas further.
 
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Vebyast said:
[x] To Saki: Niko's attempting to run Hijiri's life for her. Having good intentions doesn't change that she's denying Hijiri's agency. And since that's exactly what Hijiri is having problems with...
[x] Interrupt.
-[x] Shoot down the "fake person" idea.
--[x] Don't give away any sensitive information, but convey that you're in a similar situation.
--[x] Also, no observable differences between "real" and "artificial", so why care in the first place?
-[x] Tell Niko that she's being overbearing. She has good intentions, but Hijiri's a person too.
[x] Step back and let them go another round.

The phrasing on "Hijiri is a person too" is important.
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Now that is exactly what I want us to do.

Changing vote to

[X] Vebyast
 
The Phoenixian said:
I think one of the things I'm going to take away here is that Sabrina's multitasking is, demonstrably, not as versatile we had assumed and should not be taken as such until proven capable.
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OK, no, that was my mistake and I apologise. Sabrina is capable of that degree of multitasking, but I didn't write it that way because I didn't realise that was the intent.

I tend to be busy quite a bit these days, and check the thread in between work, so I miss and/or forget details of plans. A bit of intent explicitly in votes would be good "get this done quickly so that we have time before the Saints arrive", for example, would be good in future, but I'll try and do better, as well.

Again, I apologise.
Vebyast said:
I'm still confused by how Niko is able to get in slapping range. The memory device is still active, right?
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Yes, it is.
 
Slightly updating my vote.

[X] Hijiri's still a threat, and Niko's angry and not treating her fairly.
[X] Give the Kannas space if they mind you being there, but stay within sight and listen in.
-[X] Grief Fog ready, if case it's needed.

[X] If the conversation progresses well, let it play out.
-[X] Else, interfere. Mediate. Try to keep the Kannas calm.
-[X] Appeal to their rationality, help them make their cases, and understand each other's point of view.

[X] If the conversation seems hopeless, bring up the current crisis. Yuuri.
-[X] Get rid of the Memory Device and ask to be put in contact with Yuuri.

Make no mistake, we're gonna draw some heat and incense the Kannas, unless we just sit this one out.

Because dangers, that's likely not an option.

Well... If things go well without us, I want the option there to sit this out.

If not, I don't think bringing up 'we're also a wishgirl' will help until Hijiri gets a chance to calm down. She's focused on something else right now, and it's not the time to either drop some cryptic hints, nor to go explain our backstory. Focus is on Kannas.

And if we do need to interfere, well, draw some heat, try to get the girls calmer at each other, at least. If they get angry at us for interfering? At least their anger is dissipating a bit, and they won't be as mad at each other. But still, it's not very likely they'll listen to us if we try to drop some lines and step out (as if we had the 'right', or 'knew better'...).

But we can try to keep things calm, and offer our understanding of the situation, as long as we're only supporting the Kannas in their discussion.

And if things don't work out, distraction! Yuuri is still out there, let's go!

(What I'm not really addressing is the rest of the Pleiades...)

EDIT: Maybe ask Mami to help?
 
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khfan21 said:
Do you mean actually hear us or acknowledge a point we have? Because I might have something for the first one.
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Well, the second one.

Keep in mind we're meddling into very personal affairs, and these two girls are very angry, lashing out, not quite listening to each other, if at least airing out their grievances.

This foreigner steps in, drops some lines, steps out.

I wouldn't be shocked if the Kannas tell us to fuck off and keep yelling each other's heads off.
 
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