With regards to books and the conspiracy it is worth keeping in mind that books in general are rare, the ability and inclination to read a lot of them even rarer. Like just because something is in a book does not make it common knowledge unless it is the holy book of a major cult, in which case it might be known by most of their adepts.
Warhammer Fantasy: Divided Loyalties - an Advisor's Quest
- Thread starter Boney
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- Fantasy Users' Choice!
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- warhammer warhammer fantasy fantasy be gay do crimes (gay) female protagonist pansexual protagonist ck2 quest divided loyalties mountain vietnam ranald is real this is a dwarf quest (dwarfs) this is maybe an elf quest this is not a vampire quest this is not an empire quest try it and find out open voting
Voted best in category in the Users' Choice awards.
- Location
- Actually pretty lost
I don't think that the marginal gains of getting basic elf god books a turn early are worth it. I also prefer maximising the incoming amount of books, and therefore bonuses, over targeting textiles for silk specifically - we can always do that later.
That said, I don't think we need to worry about picking the wrong books with regard to "the public good". The intention is to get all the books eventually; if Mathilde picks books useful to her in the short term, that doesn't really change what books we'll have in a few decades, and we intend for this library to last for much longer than that.
Also, upgrading our pistols for free seems like a no-brainer? We can always replace them later if we invent The Perfect Gun Enchantment later, but I don't recall any plans in that front.
[x] [LIBRARY] Back-fill.
[x] [DWARF] Runed pistols
[x] [COLLEGE] No purchase.
[x] [PURCHASE] No purchase.
That said, I don't think we need to worry about picking the wrong books with regard to "the public good". The intention is to get all the books eventually; if Mathilde picks books useful to her in the short term, that doesn't really change what books we'll have in a few decades, and we intend for this library to last for much longer than that.
Also, upgrading our pistols for free seems like a no-brainer? We can always replace them later if we invent The Perfect Gun Enchantment later, but I don't recall any plans in that front.
[x] [LIBRARY] Back-fill.
[x] [DWARF] Runed pistols
[x] [COLLEGE] No purchase.
[x] [PURCHASE] No purchase.
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Codex
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I think the rareness of books is a bit overstated. Yes, in comparison to the modern day the number of books in the WHF universe is small, but there are enough books to literally drown yourself in in most major libraries, and there are enough libraries that I'd consider major that I couldn't count them with all the fingers on my hand and all my toes.
You can still argue that that's a small number in the grand scheme of things, but the impression that "rare" gives me is that you can go your whole life without seeing a book. Maybe that's the case for rural villagers, but we haven't had to interact with rural communities for a very long time, and urban centres is where a significant population (if not the majority) lives anyway. Every urban center with a library of Verena has a library, even if it's small and hyper specialised.
There may be a lot of books gathered in any one place, but if you look at the total number of books vs the number of people, you are still not going to come up with that many, and most of those books will be copies of the major holy texts of popular gods. Most people on Malus will live and die never having seen a book and if they do see one nine times out of ten it is the life if Sigmar or similar. Under those circumstances the simple existence of books about Skaven is not a danger to the conspiracy as the Skaven will know that most people can't read, never mind have the chance to read those specific books.
- Location
- Canada
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- He/Him
I hope we get to find out what's going on with this soon.
With the Dwarves resisting change and stubbornly sticking to the ways of their Ancestors?
Codex
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The most populous nation in Warhammer is Cathay, so your line about the books being about Sigmar is incredibly Old World centric.
Even ignoring that, you don't even address the fact that your numbers look pretty ridiculous if you consider that there is a significant urban population in Warhammer, and most of those people would have seen a piece of writing, even if they couldn't read it. Agitators and Demagogues are constantly cycling pamphlets and the setting books mention that there have been newspapers going around for a while by the time of canon. Most of these newspapers are about gossip.
Your numbers are pretty crazy without evidence backing it up. 9 out of 10 never see a book? Would you care to present the reason you believe that figure?
- Location
- Canada
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With Francesco's attempts to build a booming silk industry in K8P.
Well for one I was talking about the Skaven worrying about the Conspiracy of Silence so books in Cathay are not really relevant, also most people in the empire are subsistence farmers who have never seen a city either so what 'a significant portion of the urban population' knows is not really relevant.
Codex
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Genuine question. Do you believe that at the current tech level of the Empire and the fact that this world is a death world, that the majority of the population is actually subsistence farmers? Weren't you arguing with me a while ago about the Cityborn outnumbering the Forestborn because they live in an urban population which statistically means a greater population? And now you flip the script and say that there are more rural farmers than urban settlers when it comes to the Empire?
The elves also have a ancient and well established magic tradition that would allow them to maintain that sort of ratio, humanity in the old world does not. The Empire has only recently gotten any life mages and there certainly does not seem to be any sort of massive population shift with the afferent socio-political consequences because of it. As warhammer functions on 'as history unless otherwise specified' I see no reason why most of the population would not be subsistence farmers living and dying in sight of the same (fortified) village, just like their ancestors going back to the time of Sigmar.
Travler66
Let her name echo in song!
- Location
- Beyond
[X] [LIBRARY] Library of Mournings: name two non-magical topics to hire Cityborn scribes to copy all available Laurelorn books on.
-[X] Eonir of Laurelorn
-[X] Weaving Spider silk
[X] [COLLEGE] No purchase.
[X] [DWARF] Runed pistols
[X] [PURCHASE] No purchase.
-[X] Eonir of Laurelorn
-[X] Weaving Spider silk
[X] [COLLEGE] No purchase.
[X] [DWARF] Runed pistols
[X] [PURCHASE] No purchase.
Codex
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Last time I argued that there would be more forestborn than cityborn these figures were used:
Nuln: 120,000/1.2 million
Altdorf: 105,000/1.05 million
Middenheim: 95,000/ 950k
Talabheim: 72,000/ 720k
I should mention that in canon, the average village has around 50 or less people. A large town has around a 1000. A city has 10,000.
If we take the modified values of only the four most major cities of the Empire, and then compare them to the rough 15mil figure, you find that those four cities account for 3.92million.
Roughly 38% of the Empire's population lives in only four cities. I don't know about you, but that figure makes sense to me. Now if you include every urban population center in the Empire, accounting for cities and towns (which are urban), your figure would almost certainly come about to see that the majority of the Empire's population is in fact urban.
And this is referring to a single city for an area equalling 2/3rds the size of Nordland.
You know how Warhammer has abysmal population figures? Last time I posted about it, Boney gave me a rough multiplication figure of x100 to get the actual population. That was an offhand mention, but he did say that at the current time period hundreds of thousands of people can in fact live in a city if it's big enough. So, I'm going to give you the canon population figures of the four most major Empire cities, then to make them more realistic, because we know Warhammer sucks at population figures, I'll multiply them by 10. Not 100, because the figures would be absurd otherwise:
Nuln: 120,000/1.2 million
Altdorf: 105,000/1.05 million
Middenheim: 95,000/ 950k
Talabheim: 72,000/ 720k
I should mention that in canon, the average village has around 50 or less people. A large town has around a 1000. A city has 10,000.
If we take the modified values of only the four most major cities of the Empire, and then compare them to the rough 15mil figure, you find that those four cities account for 3.92million.
Roughly 38% of the Empire's population lives in only four cities. I don't know about you, but that figure makes sense to me. Now if you include every urban population center in the Empire, accounting for cities and towns (which are urban), your figure would almost certainly come about to see that the majority of the Empire's population is in fact urban.
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fictionfan
Please sir, may I have some Meows?
- Location
- Tempe, AZ
I was just rereading and thought of the perfect use for this. It protects against divine magic. If we gave it to Qrech it would protect him from the horned rat. Very useful for converting him. Don't know why I didn't think of it at the time.
The problem with this is that... everyone should be dead if the population looks like that specifically dead of the plague du jour. Until the discovery of the germ theory of disease and epidemiology cities did not grow from internal growth, more people died them then were born. The only way they could grow was from migration from rural areas so if most of the population is urban than then the Empire should be dying at a rate that makes the dwarfs look downright healthy. Now you could say that the Shaylans handle public health better than was done IRL at a comparable time, but if they save more people than Nurgle's plagues kill well that technically means the Dove of Peace is stronger than Grandfather Plague which the lore does not bear out.
As far as he is aware, he's still a devout follower of the Horned Rat and fucking up mutual foes.
Mathilde isn't going to disabuse him of that unless forced by events
Sort of like the metal industry IRL wouldn't really be bothered by someone through a medieval portal getting their hands on a wikipedia printout of the reaction principles of smelting.
I don't think they'd even register how big a boon it is unless you rubbed their faces in it.
"The urban proportion of the population [of the Holy Roman Empire] remained broadly constant, rising only from 20 to 25 per cent across 1300-1800, with the highest density in Holland and Brabant, where the proportion was already 40 to 50 per cent in 1514."
So I'd say that the average across the entire Empire would be about 1 in 4, dropping to about 1 in 6 for places like Ostland and Stirland and as high as 1 in 3 for Reikland and Wissenland. That would be prone to fluctuation as disease outbreaks have a far greater effect on urban population than rural, but times of unrest see large amounts of people seeking the protection of city walls.
So I'd say that the average across the entire Empire would be about 1 in 4, dropping to about 1 in 6 for places like Ostland and Stirland and as high as 1 in 3 for Reikland and Wissenland. That would be prone to fluctuation as disease outbreaks have a far greater effect on urban population than rural, but times of unrest see large amounts of people seeking the protection of city walls.
It would also protect him from our magic.
Look, Qrech is cool and adorable and I love him, but the relationship between him and Mathilde is partially based on the power imbalance between the two. Giving him the jet would reduce that power imbalance and change our relationship.
- Location
- Greece
Didn't it also protect him from our magic? And if it works on HR, it would work on the coin, no?
I am pro Qurechdemption and all, but I do not want to give our prisoner the gun he needs to escape.
Codex
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The most major cities of the Empire have Dwarf dug sewer systems. Would that change things significantly in the face of plague?
On the one hand, sewers and Shallyans and magic. On the other, Nurgle and Skaven. I'd call it about even, demographically.
- Location
- Utrecht
Qrech is also getting on in the years, and the Cathayan jet won't help against Branalhune.
Not advocating for it, but claiming that it will significantly change the relationship is not the case.
Mathilde doesn't regularly use magic on Qrech, and the jet would not let him out of the cell either.
Yep, Tiliea is Italy and Estallia is Spain (Espana).