Sure, suggest courses of action, a thing you do by talking to people. Silence on something you know they would want to know is not a suggestion, it is deception.
Warhammer Fantasy: Divided Loyalties - an Advisor's Quest
- Thread starter Boney
- Start date
- Fantasy Users' Choice!
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- Tags
- warhammer warhammer fantasy fantasy be gay do crimes (gay) female protagonist pansexual protagonist ck2 quest divided loyalties mountain vietnam ranald is real this is a dwarf quest (dwarfs) this is maybe an elf quest this is not a vampire quest this is not an empire quest try it and find out open voting
Voted best in category in the Users' Choice awards.
Sure, suggest courses of action, a thing you do by talking to people. Silence on something you know they would want to know is not a suggestion, it is deception.
- Location
- Omniverse #1345
I am voting yes, with a hope that Belegar is at least willing to take us along to confront Thorgrim about it. He may not be willing to spill in front of most, but he knows we know at least part of it, so is likely to be willing to at least give a "the energy is vital for the continued survival of the entire karaz ankor" statement.
- Pronouns
- she/her/hers
Yes! I think we're really focused in these comments on Belegar's potentially explosive confrontation with Thorgrim, but not so much on what a staunch ally Belegar could be in the conservation of these waystone connections. If he knew what that power did for the dwarves, there is nothing he wouldn't do to protect it.
- Location
- Omniverse #1345
Pretty much. I just hope he can be convinced to take us along on said confrontation and let us take the lead at least initially. It would be unusual, but everything about this is. And Thorgrim knows we know at least part of it. Ranald was being cheeky there, probably to rub it in Thorgrim's face that we know.
...actually we may owe ranald one there. If he intentionally made sure that the tale relayed would make it obvious to Thorgrim that Mathilde knows about the waystones.
Hmmm... that can be counted as part of Protector now that I think about it. Other dwarves would need it explained to them, so it doesn't count. But Thorgrim is intimately aware of just how vital those waystone connections are to the karaz ankor. So Ranald arranged for him to find out we know part of the truth.
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- Location
- Africa
[X] Yes
- Location
- Finland
And if we knew, or had idea how to find out in timely fashion, then telling it to Belegar, Kragg, and every king and runelord in existence, would be an ectremely good idead.
Also making sure nobody not loyal dawi ever learns of this because we do not need enemies of Karaz Ankor going hunting for waystones.
- Pronouns
- she/her/hers
I don't disagree. But when Belegar seeks more information about this, he will likely learn that generation after generation the High Kng's have kept this information secret
I think our spin is a gamble, and deserves its own vote. On some level I think this is really a conversation about:
- What should Belegar know
- What does he deserve to know
- What we are obligated to tell him
pucflek
Verified simpleton
- Location
- Czech Republic
I am fairly sure Algard would want to know where Liber Mortis is. Stop trying to guilt people over "uwu lying to our friend". Its something we do as way of life.
But the thing is we do not know, and I would rather we act IC as much as we are able and more to the point I would rather not have Mathilde lie to Belegar 'for his own good'. He is older than Mathy by decades, let us not treat him like a child.
And I'm fairly sure Van Hall, the person who gave it to us on his death bed, would rather Algard not know.
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- Location
- Chicago
- Pronouns
- She/They
[X] No
This is where we take it on ourselves to spare Belegar another chip in his honor.
Because he is going to have to be ok with what he considers theft, even if eventually convinced it was for a good cause, it's still basically the high king taking taxes from Belegar's realm and refusing to tell him until chased down and cornered. I don't see good coming from this at all.
So best case is he swallow's another chunk off his crumbling honor and wonders harder if success was worth it, or if a good death on a failed attempt would have been better.
Worst case is a dwarf civil war.
And we are very much a character that keeps secrets, even or especially from those closest to us, so "just be honest" feels very out of character when we could just say nothing.
This is where we take it on ourselves to spare Belegar another chip in his honor.
Because he is going to have to be ok with what he considers theft, even if eventually convinced it was for a good cause, it's still basically the high king taking taxes from Belegar's realm and refusing to tell him until chased down and cornered. I don't see good coming from this at all.
So best case is he swallow's another chunk off his crumbling honor and wonders harder if success was worth it, or if a good death on a failed attempt would have been better.
Worst case is a dwarf civil war.
And we are very much a character that keeps secrets, even or especially from those closest to us, so "just be honest" feels very out of character when we could just say nothing.
By far the most tragic thing here is that the two 'job explanations' are getting essentially no attention or discussion. Fourteen pages of discussion and less than a dozen are about anything other than the report. Waystones will likely be a front-runner regardless but this was the only chance Border Princess had to catch peoples' imaginations.
They have no runesmiths and thus can never recreate the Waystones.
- Location
- Finland
It's not treating Belegar like a child, it is treating Belegar like a very stressed out angry dawi who is already looking for things to criticize the High King for.
I'd rather we research the situation more before telling anyone about this.
pucflek
Verified simpleton
- Location
- Czech Republic
???
Original Waystones are of Elven Make. Dwarfs and Humans only learned how to make them later, Dwarfs independently. Dwarfs then joined Elves to cover the entire planet with them in massive joint job, which is how dwarfs got to commission their own private nexus.
And yet we stole money from him without telling him. Wow, mucho concern. We keep secrets. From our friends, from our lovers, from everyone. And we most likely will for our entire life. Such is the life of shadowmancer. Pragmatism wins the day. Tell people what you think they need to know, lie or don't talk at all if you think it improves the odds.
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- Pronouns
- she/her/hers
We - without any ooc knowledge - don't have any reason to believe those conclusions are false. My interpretation here has been that Mathilde shares or at least understands Belegar's frustration and anger towards Thorgrim, and it would be out of character to obscure information that points to an important truth.
The first generation of Waystones were purely elven work. It was only the second generation of them that involved dwarven runecraft. There's no reason they can't make the original version.
I think from what we know the elves invented Waystones and then later worked with the dwarves to upgrade them, I don't believe the dwarves invented them independently, and I don't think humans have ever made them (the druids of Albion may or may not be an exception).
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So you would rather lie to him. I mean you are assuming there is more to find out that would exonerate Thorgrim. We know OOC that it is not as bad as he suspects, but what if further study were to reveal that yes it really it a matter of Thorgrom being the bad guy? In that case we will have taken from Belegar's time to prepare his case against the High King because we made a judgement call we had never been caleld on to make and decided ge could not be trusted with the information.
Please name one secret of this scope we have kept from an employer?
- Location
- Earth
Spitballing:
1) Mathilde did not cause the lack of energy for Valaya's Runes
2) Mathilde reestablished the flow of energy that powers Valaya's Runes
3) Are we sure the Karak Vlag Dawi were the only ones pinged by the Protector?
- Location
- Chicago
- Pronouns
- She/They
I am very pro-elf and so will definitely be voting for the waystones, and it is a good thing for me that it will be more dealing with characters and their needs, desires and interests rather than research. The first is a story to me, the second is more of a dialogue between the author and the thread with characters as a framing device, I feel. Cool for world building, but worlds aren't interesting as settings unless something is say there. 
The Sylvania and Border Princess options are both very interesting to me, but they feel end-game as had been said. I hope they stay open- after elves and an acquiring an apprentice I would be delighted by either.
Sylvania would seem to play more towards Mathilde's strengths as a shadow mage, the borders not so much: general and steward, because the enemies would be more armies and less scary individuals. The main pull for borders for me is actually Wulfhart Jr- I like him and I'd like playing old mentor to his dashing cavlreyman. But I like Roswita more.
The Sylvania and Border Princess options are both very interesting to me, but they feel end-game as had been said. I hope they stay open- after elves and an acquiring an apprentice I would be delighted by either.
Sylvania would seem to play more towards Mathilde's strengths as a shadow mage, the borders not so much: general and steward, because the enemies would be more armies and less scary individuals. The main pull for borders for me is actually Wulfhart Jr- I like him and I'd like playing old mentor to his dashing cavlreyman. But I like Roswita more.
pucflek
Verified simpleton
- Location
- Czech Republic
Having Liber Mortis.
Not actually being Loyal to The Empire, not revealing the fact that current Empress is a deep cover Ranald Cultist that was vegetating among Vampires like it was a vacation, not revealing Regimand murdered empress and the fact that entire upper echelon of Empire was lahmian controlled uhhhh. I don't honestly know, there is a lot probably but this quest is long. Can't recall them all.
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