Voted best in category in the Users' Choice awards.
So I note that we have a vote to attempt to create a liminal realm in our plan for this turn.
But I don't remember us taking any classes in the college on how to do that without daemons showing up to mess with us.
Am I missing something that explains why we're doing that now?
Mathilde's already taken anti-Chaos training, if that's what you mean, and that's pretty much the extent of what we can get from them on that topic. And the Colleges have bupkis on liminal realm creation, or else our discovering of how to do it wouldn't be such a big deal.

The Daemon showing up when it did wasn't significantly worse than any number of other miscast possibilities that can happen as part of the risks of normal spellcasting.

Edit: Weber'd.
 
The hope is that the Daemon popping up was just bad luck and a second attempt can see us create one without any unexpected gribblies.

It's one of the last actions we have before writing the book on Aethyric Vitae, along with creating the Morbs, which I believe is generally penciled in for next turn.

Not sure the Grey College would have any classes on that when they don't seem to know how to create liminal realms. Algard seems to have done the most research into it and his best results so far are his paperwork holders and the Screaming Towers, which were an accident.
Huh, they were? I guess we learned this in an informational answer somewhere?

Mathilde's already taken anti-Chaos training, if that's what you mean, and that's pretty much the extent of what we can get from them on that topic. And the Colleges have bupkis on liminal realm creation, or else our discovering of how to do it wouldn't be such a big deal.

The Daemon showing up when it did wasn't significantly worse than any number of other miscast possibilities that can happen as part of the risks of normal spellcasting.

Edit: Weber'd.
I had assumed that if the head of the college was making them to store paperwork he must have a way to keep Daemons out of them.

Even if it's as simple as tossing blessed silver in when they open a new one.
 
I had assumed that if the head of the college was making them to store paperwork he must have a way to keep Daemons out of them.

Even if it's as simple as tossing blessed silver in when they open a new one.
Algard doesn't make new liminal realms, he's manipulating the existing liminal realm of the Grey College.
That's just institutional knowledge of where the door is. Algard's tried to figure it out but all he's managed is very minor manipulations of the existing liminal realm of the Grey College, and his other attempts were failures, with his famous towers being him finding a creative use for a technique that was a complete failure at what it was originally intended to do.
 
Algard doesn't make new liminal realms, he's manipulating the existing liminal realm of the Grey College.
And whatever methods might be employed to keep daemons out of your new liminal realm, we can be reasonably confident that Teclis employed them when he made the Grey College.

So Algard probably doesn't have any insight into the issue. He might not even know it's a potential issue.

That and, well, even if he does know, getting secrets out of Grey Wizards typically isn't easy. And Mathilde would need to share her findings with AV with him, which the thread is generally reluctant to do up until we do the big reveal with the book and the Morbs.
 
Bright side, we might get the chance to ask Teclis in person how to daemonproof liminal realms soon!
I can see the flight school memes already.

So you want to make a liminal realm!
Well that's fine indeed, a new kind of space for a new face!
But most of you have a life expectancy of, like, a century, so I'll get to the point.
Your best bet is to be better than everyone else, that works for me, so that's my advice.
Oh, and try to make sure you don't miscast.
But what do you do if you summon a daemon and miscast?
Miscast? That's a bad strategy, Weber, plus it's gruesome.
Casting is what I do, stick to that.
I hope this was helpful.
:V
 
I can see the flight school memes already.

So you want to make a liminal realm!
Well that's fine indeed, a new kind of space for a new face!
But most of you have a life expectancy of, like, a century, so I'll get to the point.
Your best bet is to be better than everyone else, that works for me, so that's my advice.
Oh, and try to make sure you don't miscast.
But what do you do if you summon a daemon and miscast?
Miscast? That's a bad strategy, Weber, plus it's gruesome.
Casting is what I do, stick to that.
I hope this was helpful.
:V
Strangely I think Teclis might be better at teaching than that.
Given that he taught the colleges nearly everything they know.



So, now that my questions(and the informative answers I got for them) have gotten the thread onto the subject: from what I remember, it was said that a bag of holding probably wasn't possible, on account of how ordinary liminal realms don't more around.
With the sole exception of souls being a similar sort of phenomenon that may have hints in the right direction for a movable liminal realm. But animal souls would be too simple(and i assume apparition or familiar souls would be the same), success may require experimentation on sentients.
I dunno whether experimenting on orc and goblins would be enough.
Or whether they're all already connected to a Greenskin afterlife through their souls.

But the concept makes me think of Xianxia-style 'inner worlds' which in turn makes me wonder how Cor-Dum got that sand to the chaos wastes.

It also makes me wonder whether a steam tank has anything like a machine spirit. Less of one than an animal or apparition? It would be amazingly cool to be able to wheel a wizard tower around folded into a space within one of the too-messed-up-for-combat steam tanks.
Probably completely impossible. But one can dream about it.
 
Strangely I think Teclis might be better at teaching than that.
Given that he taught the colleges nearly everything they know.
The classic I've taught you everything you know... but not everything I know. :V

So, now that my questions(and the informative answers I got for them) have gotten the thread onto the subject: from what I remember, it was said that a bag of holding probably wasn't possible, on account of how ordinary liminal realms don't more around.
With the sole exception of souls being a similar sort of phenomenon that may have hints in the right direction for a movable liminal realm. But animal souls would be too simple(and i assume apparition or familiar souls would be the same), success may require experimentation on sentients.
I dunno whether experimenting on orc and goblins would be enough.
Or whether they're all already connected to a Greenskin afterlife through their souls.

But the concept makes me think of Xianxia-style 'inner worlds' which in turn makes me wonder how Cor-Dum got that sand to the chaos wastes.

It also makes me wonder whether a steam tank has anything like a machine spirit. Less of one than an animal or apparition? It would be amazingly cool to be able to wheel a wizard tower around folded into a space within one of the too-messed-up-for-combat steam tanks.
Probably completely impossible. But one can dream about it.

If steam tanks had souls, then they would be visible to magesight. Binding souls to steam tanks would get you halfway to what the Chaos Dwarves are doing, but that runs into, uh, many problems.

Gods are big souls, so they would fit the bill of being able to sustain movable liminal realms, but that's a bit out of our reach for the forseeable future. There's actually a Ranaldian spell that does something similar to a Bag of Holding, but if He likes the contents too much He might just keep them for Himself.
 
That's so amazingly Ranald. (I think we've seen Heidi pull things out of nowhere!)
It might not be the same spell, given Heidi's devotion to the Gambler over the other aspects, since the Bag of Holding thing seems more in line with the Night Prowler. Pulling things out of nowhere is, I think, an application of her probability kicking that saved her from becoming an actual vampire at one point.

"I was running the 'lost heir' caper in Hornau and must have really sold it because instead of hooking the usual burgher twits with more greed than sense, I got a late-night recruitment offer that involves fangs and blood. But she bit off more than she could chew too, and it just so happened that the landlady was the hoarder type and left several wooden stakes and a vial of holy water in the nightstand - or at least, it just so happened after I gave probability a few good kicks in the ribs. Put the body in a crate, put the head in a different crate, dressed myself in her clothes and her face and went from town to town until the gate guards said 'welcome back, Countess'. The rest you can probably guess."
 
'The summoning itself is successful, but then it turns against you' isn't really a Khorne-induced kind of failure mode.
I believe you, but personally I could see it.

With most spells, Khorne just reacts with "FUCK YOU, I PUNCH YOU IN THE FACE" and the spell fails because the spell is not specifically suitable for facepunching.

But I could plausibly imagine that if you try to summon a ferocious monster, Khorne could somehow react with "FUCK YOU, I PUNCH YOU IN THE FACE, THIS THING YOU JUST SUMMONED WANTS TO PUNCH YOU IN THE FACE, I BLESS IT WITH MORE ARMS FOR MORE FACEPUNCHING!"
 
It might not be the same spell, given Heidi's devotion to the Gambler over the other aspects, since the Bag of Holding thing seems more in line with the Night Prowler. Pulling things out of nowhere is, I think, an application of her probability kicking that saved her from becoming an actual vampire at one point.
But why reinvent a more complicated version of the wheel? She's a devotee of Ranald, she can invoke Ranaldian miracles. I don't think favoring one face limits someone to miracles associated with that face.

Getting stakes and holy water was a situational convenience, so probability kicking was the right tool for that. Carrying a specific toy without having to actually visibly carry it is the kind of thing you'd use a hammerspace for if you're capable of that at all.
 
Ranald might have four faces, but He's just one guy—each face is just a different aspect of the same person, and there's overlap between them because they all stem from the same core personality.
 
Mathilde's already taken anti-Chaos training, if that's what you mean, and that's pretty much the extent of what we can get from them on that topic. And the Colleges have bupkis on liminal realm creation, or else our discovering of how to do it wouldn't be such a big deal.

The Daemon showing up when it did wasn't significantly worse than any number of other miscast possibilities that can happen as part of the risks of normal spellcasting.

Edit: Weber'd.
The demon showing up wasnt the only consequence, if you look in the character sheet you'll find a ominous 'Fated' trait that probably has a sting in the ??? section not to mention the name. I find it pretty sane to ignore it, but it's not nothing.
 
Once we have the CF for it, I think we should get +5 Eonir Anatomy and Medicine, spend 10 CF to get them translated, and donate the translated copies to the Cult of Shallya. I reckon that within a single year, that'll save as many lives as the MATHILDE towers would in a century.
 
Once we have the CF for it, I think we should get +5 Eonir Anatomy and Medicine, spend 10 CF to get them translated, and donate the translated copies to the Cult of Shallya. I reckon that within a single year, that'll save as many lives as the MATHILDE towers would in a century.

i second this, it's brilliant. in coming campaigns against chaos and other threats, having good medicine/nursing will save thousands of soldiers' lives, minimum. and mat would know, because she has books like the one she found at drakenhoff, but that cant distribute because they have a bad reputation (from human experimentation by necromancers). knowledge from the eonir does not have that particular problem.
 
Once we have the CF for it, I think we should get +5 Eonir Anatomy and Medicine, spend 10 CF to get them translated, and donate the translated copies to the Cult of Shallya. I reckon that within a single year, that'll save as many lives as the MATHILDE towers would in a century.
It's a good idea. Right now we've been stockpiling CF for the Orbflex, but honestly, we otherwise accumulate it pretty quickly, and don't really use it for stuff beyond buying college books out-of-pocket and sometimes a few classes. It's not something we ever really lack.

...Not sure if Eonir anatomy books would of much practical help to Shallyans, but the Medicine ones, 100%.
 
@Boney Is it fair to say that there are no Imperial books on Ancestor Gods even though Imperial Dwarves exist and sometimes write about them, because the ones who do have meaningful amounts of information on them are still too culturally Karaz Ankor, while those who can be said to be Imperial in mindset have forgotten or moved away from them (and therefore have no meaningful information)?

On a similar tangent, do the Chaos Dwarves count as having books on the topic since they followed the Ancestor Gods once and probably retained some knowledge, or did they intentionally burn and forget as much as they could (even at the expense of having less to use against Karaz Ankor dwarves) during their conversion to Hashut?
 
@Boney Is it fair to say that there are no Imperial books on Ancestor Gods even though Imperial Dwarves exist and sometimes write about them, because the ones who do have meaningful amounts of information on them are still too culturally Karaz Ankor, while those who can be said to be Imperial in mindset have forgotten or moved away from them (and therefore have no meaningful information)?
I've asked before.

Well, that answers that question. Might as well ask the other one outright: Does the Empire have any books on the Ancestor Gods?
No. There are some Imperial books on the subject, but they're so surface-level that they don't really give any insight on the Ancestor God, just Dwarven society, so they go in the Karaz Ankor section.

For that matter, does anyone else that we know of? I certainly don't think we'll find Eonir or Bretonnian books on them.
The Asur would.

Though I don't imagine it's very public information - that's old knowledge from a group that they used to be friends with before they went on a super devastating war with them - I would hope it's not so absolutely hidden away that it'll require monumental effort to get ahold of them.

----
Completely forgot about Gaelen. Yeah, I suppose there must be a number of anatomical things which are readily applicable from elves to humans.
 
That and, well, even if he does know, getting secrets out of Grey Wizards typically isn't easy. And Mathilde would need to share her findings with AV with him, which the thread is generally reluctant to do up until we do the big reveal with the book and the Morbs.

It isn't like there's any hurry in collaborating until Mathilde gets out the Morbs and books - and then Algard is going to want to work with us.

Once we have the CF for it, I think we should get +5 Eonir Anatomy and Medicine, spend 10 CF to get them translated, and donate the translated copies to the Cult of Shallya. I reckon that within a single year, that'll save as many lives as the MATHILDE towers would in a century.

It'd also have the pleasant side effect of putting Mathilde into Shallya's good books (well more than being Ranald's favourite agent already does).
 
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