- Pronouns
- He/His/etc
I kinda want to go Trio just because it gives your regular Grey Magister a good 'fuck that shit over there' option without limiting it to professional Battle Mages.
Warhammer Fantasy: Divided Loyalties - an Advisor's Quest
- Thread starter Boney
- Start date
- Fantasy Users' Choice!
-
- Tags
- warhammer warhammer fantasy fantasy be gay do crimes (gay) female protagonist pansexual protagonist ck2 quest divided loyalties mountain vietnam ranald is real this is a dwarf quest (dwarfs) this is maybe an elf quest this is not a vampire quest this is not an empire quest try it and find out open voting
Voted best in category in the Users' Choice awards.
I kinda want to go Trio just because it gives your regular Grey Magister a good 'fuck that shit over there' option without limiting it to professional Battle Mages.
I am also reminded of when she was sneaking around sabotaging K8P during the retaking and got stuck in a room full of orks she was barely able to get away from.
Or when she fought that giant Khorne dude with the axe during the Karak Dum expedition and would've died if not for Ranald rolling only a single 1 higher than Khorne.
For as killy and skilled at combat as Mathilde is, she's still a wizard, and a Grey Wizard at that. Any time she's forced into a close combat situation where she's outmatched and can't disengage quickly, she's in very visible danger. An apparition bodyguard helping out would be a big boon for her and for Grey Wizards in general.
[ ] [BEHAVIOUR] Bodyguard
[ ] [NUMBER] One
Last edited:
fictionfan
Please sir, may I have some Meows?
- Location
- Tempe, AZ
I expect that is the case for the gold's wrapping hounds in steel, but shadow and mists is a bit more flexible. Also we seem to primarily be binding it by tricking it rather then any sort of brute force (not that we lack brute force if it breaks free).
3 is still battle magic so the same limits would apply.
Last edited:
- Location
- Brazil
Having caught up I hope the thread can get over its fear so we can get a lance of raiders to start, battle magic is kind usefull in battle situations, and people should remenber aparition spells specificaly are the ones where even if we get the dreaded double one crit fail it still isn't instant death, the riders just get free, so we could actualy try to push for a full band at some poiny, and boney confirmed we could add mist after the fact, so a band of riders as fiendish spell is actualy theoreticaly possible.
II would prefer one knight for a number of reasons. If we could get this down to somewhere that's a sub-battle magic, it could be usable by a lot more wizards while still being a a very useful tool. The bodyguard function in particular would be great.
deathofrats0808
Don’t think of it as dying; just as leaving early
- Location
- Earth
Not entirely true. Boney said that it's about equal risk with regular BM because the lesser likelihood of regular style miscasting is made up for by the risk of the apparition breaking free and trying to murder you. But you can still regular miscast with all the potential consequences.
I feel that a lot of Mathilde's equipment and spells seems to make sure that one early quest Incident back in Stirland Castle never happens again, where she was in a critical situation but left wandering unarmed (Branulhune), alone (Rider), nothing but her bloomers on (Aetheric armor), and no way to call for help (Wolf).
- Location
- Aotearoa
One apparition trying to murder you or your squishier wizard friends is a much better fail state than three splitting off to do the same thing.
I'm also persuaded by the argument that Grey Battlemagic also already has several spell options ideal for Wreck That Unit Over There, Specifically.
One, Bodyguard, (hoping for Fiendishly complex) is a big win and new capability for the Greys, and matches our original goal, of backup when we get in over our head.
Last edited:
Parabola
Divided Loyalties Librarian
- Location
- The Destination of Fate
- Pronouns
- She/Her
Huh...
Looks over at how during the Sylvania campaign, Drakenhof town was half-burnt and Jovi Sunscryer exploded into white flames, Mathilde's judgment was possibly impaired by Dhar and she got hospitalized
Looks over at Mathilde's Belt
Last edited:
- Location
- Brazil
That is wrong, this is how it was explained to us :
So if you miscast the spell they can break free, wich happens instead of the normal potential miscasts not in adition, much of the point of apparition biding is the it frontloads the risk, so don't have to worry about portals sumoning daemons.
- Location
- Brazil
I think Pendulum is mid-grade, and Pit is most definitely high level BM, no? Pendulum also seems fairy unwieldy.
And even then, the advantage of this kind of spell is that the risk is more manageable, in that if you fuck up, you don't explode, or summon daemons or anything like that which would be probable consequences of fucking up a Pit of Shades. Angry, unchained summons is, of course, a staple of bad ends for wizards across all fiction, but this is a significantly more manageable risk, especially for teleporting shadow wizards.
So even if the Lance option ends up High grade, while that's not a super appetizing option, I can actually see it being more tempting than the big Pit. It's nowhere near as good, sure, but it seems to me that the consequences are also nowhere near as bad.
Honestly, I feel like this vote should have been held alongside the other one, because if we stick to a singular summon, the murderkitty would have been far preferable. Horses have one advantage: charging.
I really like the sub-BM bodyguard idea, but given we have already invested on the Horse form, I also feel compelled to actually make good use of it.
Last edited:
- Location
- Earth
The same can be said for the multiple rider version. If we release the single rider version now, then eventually, I can imagine some battle wizard looking at it with some professional hubris and thinking to themselves, 'Even Mathilde Weber could only bind one at a time. But what if I tried this...!'
The Phoenixian
The Glacier Witch
- Location
- My own little world
In other news, unrelated to mechanics, something stuck out to me since first reading the update...
Somehow, this description reminds me of nothing so much as what I've read of Solkan. "Restoring order, as might be understood by a cold-blooded, reptilian intelligence," feels like it maps to the description here. Of smiting acts of death and destruction not out of rage or hate, but with all the simple joy one might take in tidying a room.
- Location
- Aotearoa
Yes, they are. Which is also where Band (or Lance imo to approximate those spells effect) could wind up especially if we're inefficient. Despite appearances this section, we can't rely on rolling well.
Last edited:
deathofrats0808
Don’t think of it as dying; just as leaving early
- Location
- Earth
That's true, but my point was that miscasting is still a risk you need to be aware of; it being an apparition doesn't mean miscasting it is safe, even if you think Mathilde can defeat the Rider blindfolded and with one hand tied behind her back.
Gehenna did say that, however Boney also said this:
In direct response to someone asking if Gehenna's was (becasue of the quote you posted) therefore safer than regular Battle Magic. Given that, the fact that GGH can miscast in canon and the fact that Gehenna is just introducing the concept in the discussion you quoted and not going over an in-depth risk assessment, it reads to me like apparition spells can still miscast like regular, they are just less likely to do so (and in turn, apparitions break free more often than wizards generally miscast, hence the more or less equal danger of the two).
Last edited:
Parabola
Divided Loyalties Librarian
- Location
- The Destination of Fate
- Pronouns
- She/Her
If we'd had the vote on what the Rider's behavior was and then failed the binding roll, that'd have been real awkward for Boney.
And while charging is what horses are best at, regardless of shape a horse rider is still useful for being a bodyguard or for seeking out single targets.
Last edited:
- Location
- Canada
Inclined to go one rider + duel for our first binding. Most grey wizards able to cast this sort of thing will probably have plenty of ways of getting out of trouble if need be, which means most won't stick around where a bodyguard would be useful. However non-battlemagic is noted as having a lack of damaging spells, with shadow knives and burning shadows being the notable exceptions. It we could get a sub-battle-magic version of this spell working it would plug that hole in the grey wizard arsenal very nicely. It would still leave a gap for reliable anti-formation work, but that's not typically a grey wizard's bailiwick anyways so I'm less worried. And if it ends up as battlemagic anyways, then I offer the observation that grey magic has no real single-target battlemagic unless you go up to shades (which is quite difficult even by BM standards). Having a less dangerous single-target spell seems like it would be a rather useful niche to fill.
Typography:
I was a little worried that we'd have to collect more badges—for Mathilde, that would probably be hats—when the Rider in Grey didn't immediately listen to the command. Looks like it's all good, though.
Shamans. Or maybe Shamanism? Either works.
Repetitive phrasing.
I was a little worried that we'd have to collect more badges—for Mathilde, that would probably be hats—when the Rider in Grey didn't immediately listen to the command. Looks like it's all good, though.
Enthusiast#117
This is not the Profile you are looking for
- Location
- United States
[ ] [BEHAVIOUR] Duel
The Rider will appear at your location and move towards a chosen individual, and will engage them until it or the Rider is slain.
[ ] [NUMBER] One
1 Knights, 0 additional actions, possibly sub-Battle Magic.
I like the idea of being able to keep a tough enemy indefinitely occupied with a summon that we can recast in a pinch whenever it dies.
The less complex the spell, the easier it is to spam it, and the more useful it will be for the grey college as a whole if we can teach it ( I don't remember the rules the gold college gave us for their information. Can we teach this spell?)
If we stick to one knight per casting, can we still bind more Riders so that we can get multiple castings going at once?
If we end up doing a 1 Knight Bodyguard spell, I'm imagining doing some pre-fight prep by casting it several times in a row.
What do the statistics say is riskier for miscasting, casting a barely-sub-BM spell several times, or a BM spell once?
The Rider will appear at your location and move towards a chosen individual, and will engage them until it or the Rider is slain.
[ ] [NUMBER] One
1 Knights, 0 additional actions, possibly sub-Battle Magic.
I like the idea of being able to keep a tough enemy indefinitely occupied with a summon that we can recast in a pinch whenever it dies.
The less complex the spell, the easier it is to spam it, and the more useful it will be for the grey college as a whole if we can teach it ( I don't remember the rules the gold college gave us for their information. Can we teach this spell?)
If we stick to one knight per casting, can we still bind more Riders so that we can get multiple castings going at once?
If we end up doing a 1 Knight Bodyguard spell, I'm imagining doing some pre-fight prep by casting it several times in a row.
What do the statistics say is riskier for miscasting, casting a barely-sub-BM spell several times, or a BM spell once?
dinomannitro6
all your gender is belong to us
- Location
- The Land Where The Sunflowers Bloom
I recently asked about a different instance of this, Boney uses Shaman as the plural form as well
deathofrats0808
Don’t think of it as dying; just as leaving early
- Location
- Earth
Boney has said chaincasting is up there in terms of danger. Unclear to what level that applies though and which is more dangerous overall. This I think implies that one time BM is safer than chaincasting though:
- Location
- Oklahoma
Probably worth nothing that Mathilde didn't specify anything about her belt. She just requested something protective. The dhar burning in particular was a complete surprise, as I recall.
During favourable conditions in general, of which Storms of Magic are the most widely applicable.
About the same as a fireball - if you point it at something you don't actually want dead, too bad.
Yes.
To a limited extent. They can't dismount and don't really have fine motor skill.
No.
You could, but it would only actually do anything if that person happens to have an Apparition bound to their soul, and you couldn't stuff an Apparition into the Matrix.
You could, but trying to Duel a group would have them laser-focus on one person in the group, and trying to Charge an individual would make that person much more able to get away by fleeing or seeking shelter in a group.
Probably in the ballpark of tens of minutes.
It doesn't have to travel from you to the target, it just appears next to them. That way it can't be intercepted or prepared for.
Spells that cause direct physical harm.
It's a spell you cast that triggers that behaviour, lasting for probably less than a hour. It wouldn't be an always-on effect.
Yes, all the versions of the spell will have a means to end it early and yank the Rider back onto Mathilde's soul.
No, see above re: Matrix limitations.
Two separate votes. Neither way of doing it is perfect and I went back and forth on how to do it, but two separate votes seems less imperfect to me and has less potential weird edge cases where the final result doesn't really reflect what most people actually wanted.
You could Smoke and Mirrors while casting the Bodyguard, but casting it ahead of time won't give you a 'free' Smoke and Mirrors when the Bodyguard effect triggers.
No. You could pull it back before it reaches the target to sort of use it that way, but doing that too many times in a row is likely to aggravate it. One of the less immediately and directly destructive Apparitions might be better suited to being a sort of magic-detecting bloodhound.
Yes.
Not originally, but currently yes, because of Stirlandians that went on the initial Karak Eight Peaks Expedition and came back with a lot of silver and stories.
Yes.
Main difficulty yes, but not the only difficulty. Trying to make magic alone create a group of horseman out of nowhere and go on a prolonged chase across a battlefield would be horrendously more difficult.
No, see above for reasoning.
It would be highly resistant to it, but its behaviour isn't to seek out the magic itself, it's to seek out the one casting it.
Yes.
Not impossible, but potentially less effective. See above for further details.
She can yank it back.
Yes.
Shaman as both singular and plural is less common than Shamans, but it sounds right-er to me so I use it anyway.
Yes.
Yes.
The latter until you get into the double digits.