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Warhammer Fantasy: Divided Loyalties - an Advisor's Quest

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So, I think I'm going to lay down my thoughts on every behavior option and their battlefield roles in one place.

[ ] [BEHAVIOUR] Directed
You will be able to give the Rider moment-to-moment instructions to do just about anything, but you will need to focus most of your attention on it while it is summoned.
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This sounds like nothing so much as a telepresence spell. Range limit is unknown, but given other versions go out to kilometers and Mathilde's soul seemingly has no limit to its link with Wolf, it could be anywhere from "a tent behind the battlefield" to "the next province over."

[ ] [BEHAVIOUR] Instinctive
The Rider will lay dormant until someone or something within several kilometers uses destructive magic, at which point it will manifest and hone in on that being and attempt to destroy them.
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Magical counterbattery fire. Turns the rider into a Mage-seeking missile.

[ ] [BEHAVIOUR] Duel
The Rider will appear at your location and move towards a chosen individual, and will engage them until it or the Rider is slain.
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Destroy or suppress one important target. Seems like a primary role of assassination and suppression of monster and commanders.

[ ] [BEHAVIOUR] Charge
The Rider will appear at your location and charge towards a specific group of people, and will engage them until it is slain or the group is destroyed or shattered.
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Anti-mook/suppressive fire spell. Where the last one kills or takes down one strong or important target, this is geared towards destroying or suppressing a group.

[ ] [BEHAVIOUR] Bodyguard
The Rider will lay dormant until you attack or are attacked by someone, at which point it will manifest and fight alongside you until combat is over or it is slain.
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Both bodyguard and force multiplier. Keeps classic wizards from getting squished and adds another comrade in arms besides the more punchy sort.

[ ] [BEHAVIOUR] Ambush
The Rider will appear near the chosen target and strike them once before disappearing. Further strikes will require the spell to be cast again.
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Assassination and sowing terror. A single strike, but a single strike against a wholly unprepared target can fill a very different niche than committing to a kill. Notably, appearing near the target is also a capability offered by no other version of this spell. All but "Directed" rule it out either implicitly or explicitly.

It's basically a sniper spell. With a bullet shaped like a swordswoman on a horse.
 
Dynamesmouse said:
This is both stupid and overkill, but what if we went 10 Riders + Ambush? There's like 10 people who could cast it, but I feel like there's only 10 people in the world who could survive *that* ambush.
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Valmond said:
Riders are great, but they are mook killers and hero distractors, even in numbers.
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Ah, but they are also really good at killing squishy wizards. Sure Mannfred or other Big Names are likely to survive, but they probably will get hurt. For most Necromancers or Chaos Sorcerers? Probably game over. They don't have much time to react to the magic resistant appertation after all.
 
If we had chosen another mount I would be happy with one and bodyguard, but I want to lean into the strengths of the chosen form , so it will be be Trio/Lance and charge for me. The Grey College has other ways to deal with clusters of infantry, but the decision for something that is awesome at charging into groups of enemies has been made, so now we should take advantage of that instead of pivoting and inventing a spell that is lacking a clear identity and is confused about what it tries to achieve. I'm apprehensive about battle magic, but this I feel like this is a pretty good spell to start with for Mathilde in particular, since she is pretty good at defending herself in melee.

[X] [BEHAVIOUR] Charge
[X] [NUMBER] Trio
[X] [NUMBER] Lance
 
Y'know, what most impresses me about Apparitions is how moldable they are. I mean, we grabbed one horse-man blender and we can already make it do wildly different things in a great number of forms.

It can single-target steel-chair a target by giving a cat-form ambush behavior (bonus points for being supremely fitting for how cats operate).

It can bodyguard against mobbing by horsing around as the Dammerlichreiter.

It can devastate an enemy formation by giving it some friends and an objective marker over the poor souls to be charged.

And it can even be used in wolf-form to Harry and hold down big monsters so the cannoneers can line up their shots (without risk of friendly fire even, since a non-magical cannonball can't hurt an apparition)!

I love these things!
 
[X] [BEHAVIOUR] Duel
[X] [BEHAVIOUR] Charge
[X] [BEHAVIOUR] Instinctive

[X] [NUMBER] One
[X] [NUMBER] Trio
 
I think we stick to the Rider's strengths. She's a beefy girl who wants to chase hunt down destructive magic-users, and in a battlefield that will mean going right through infantry lines and other obstacles to get at their target in a single-minded way. Given that Mathilde is also likely to be in the thick of things, and Grey Wizards in general are kinda squishy, it would also make a superb bodyguard.

I really really think we leave Trio and Charge for later.

[X] [BEHAVIOUR] Duel
[X] [BEHAVIOUR] Bodyguard
[X] [NUMBER] One
 
veekie said:
One x Duel - Summon one strong combatant with a magic weapon that will rapidly cross the battlefield to duel an opponent. Good for stalling one guy, killing spellcasters or messengers. Not certain to kill a professional warrior with a magic weapon, but it'd keep one busy for a bit.
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I don't really understand why some (it hasn't just been you Veekie) just take it as a given that we'll only want more than one Rider on Charge
And only one Rider on Duel or Bodyguard

It's not like the individual Riders get any weaker with more of them
I outlined how multiple Riders scale well with either of those options and made sure to check with Boney that I had the right idea

Like if we picked Cat I could understand the 1 Rider x Duel combo, since there's only so many Cats that pounce on and maul one dude at a time due to surface area

But Horse actually scales pretty well with multiple Riders vs one guy
Why take it as a given that the Rider is not going to be good at taking on tough warriors, when we could up the numbers of Riders to give it more punch so that maybe it could be good against tough warriors?

Why settle for a single bodyguard that can only defend us from so many things at once due to being in only one place at a time
When we could have a trio or lance of Riders defending us that'll be able to circle around and ward away entire groups?

The only benefit to one Rider is maybe making it sub battle magic and that's a diceroll

And even if it is sub battle magic that doesn't actually increase it's availability that much
Since Magic 7 is the requirement for reliably casting fiendishly complex spells, and magic 7 is still primarily the domain of Battle Wizards and Wizard Lords
 
While I am not opposed to Bodyguard, Charge seems more flexible because we can tell it to attack something while we do something else.

[X] [BEHAVIOUR] Charge
[X] [BEHAVIOUR] Duel
[X] [BEHAVIOUR] Bodyguard
[X] [NUMBER] Trio
[X] [NUMBER] Lance
 
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[X] [NUMBER] One
*grasping at the sky, hands half-clutched in mad passion* Themes!

[X] [BEHAVIOUR] Bodyguard
My primary option. Simple, solid, thematic. A force multiplier and bet hedge.

[X] [BEHAVIOUR] Instinctive
A counterbattery option: The Mage Seeking Missile. Possibly Necromancy Seeking Missile, with further work. Worse case scenario it seems like something that could be cast while instructing allies to work on buffs and counterspells instead of explosions.

>.>
<.<
[X] [BEHAVIOUR] Ambush
For the glory of Mork!

...And more seriously because I do honestly expect this is both the single most likely spell to be sub-battle magic, and because the sniper role means it likely has uses in sowing terror and confusion behind enemy lines. Hitting a target out of nowhere at range has its uses.
 
[X] [BEHAVIOUR] Charge
[X] [NUMBER] Trio
[X] [NUMBER] Lance

Ambush I think having a clot of choking mist would probably be WAY better for. Not much answer to Surprise Suffocation.

And Directed...Handmaidens would make a neat telepresence avatar wouldn't it?
 
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For the love of all that is holy, why the fuck are people wanting a combat spell with such a nasty risky miscast chance and no significant advantages over other battlemagic? Bloody hell, if you want a bunch of these guys then go with One and just capture and cast it repeatedly, don't fucking risk Mathilde's life every time we try to use these guys by picking Lance.
 
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Bodyguard wins out on sheer action economy. Also, less chance for magic to go wrong.

Consider the difference between casting it on <Duel> to assault someone and dropping a Melkoth's while the already-cast <Bodyguard> rider assaults its unfortunate victims.

And that's just offense! Defensively, on critical situations, you don't want the character distracted any further than necessary. You might not even want to cast at all, if against someone great at counterspelling. This just triggers while Mathilde focuses wholly on evasion. It could also be the difference of an assassin not confirming the kill as the <Bodyguard> appears, hence it buying time enough for a seed revive.

[X] [BEHAVIOUR] Bodyguard
[X] [NUMBER] One
 
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cheesyme said:
I would like to point out that Mathilde herself is also the Dämmerlichtreiter, and can and does charge people on a Shadow Steed with a fuck off sword if you want showiness. We did that back in one of the first battles for Karak Eight Peaks. If we run Bodyguard, they'd be charging with her. Offensive uses of the Bodyguard version are just a thing that'll become common place if we run that, because Boney uses whatever Mathilde could reasonably have on hand and use for fights, and Bodyguard can be cast an hour before the fight is expected to start and trigger just fine.
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If this is true, then Bodyguard can pretty much do the role of Charge and Duel as long as Mathilde is personally engaging the enemy. I also think it's worth it to create both One and Trio versions of this even if it costs us 1-2 additional actions.
[X] [BEHAVIOUR] Bodyguard
[X] [NUMBER] One
[X] [NUMBER] Trio
 
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[X] [BEHAVIOUR] Bodyguard
[X] [BEHAVIOUR] Ambush
[X] [NUMBER] One

Start simple, and has a low AP cost. We don't exactly have a large surplus at the moment, and this would be a good proof of concept we should be able to use in a fight with little worry.
 
Luftwaffles27 said:
If this is true, then Bodyguard can pretty much do the role of Charge and Duel as long as Mathilde is personally engaging the enemy. I also think it's worth it to create both One and Trio versions of this even if it costs us 1-2 additional actions.
[ ] [BEHAVIOUR] Bodyguard
[ ] [NUMBER] One
[ ] [NUMBER] Trio
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It has been confirmed to be true by Boney yes, but also you forgot your Xs.
 
cheesyme said:
Duel and Charge are both good, but they overlap with the Grey Wizard's already existing Fuck You battle magics,
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You're conveniently ignoring the indiscriminate destruction aspect of grey battle magics.

You wouldn't use pit of shades while you have an incoming friendly charge. But you could use multiple riders to disrupt the formation before the cavalry charge hits.

Likewise, with 3 and duel is a low battle magic, which has no competition in that tier.

1 and duel, if it's fiendishly complex, competes against shadow knives... Which has been rather underwhelming against tougher targets.

The rider is am offensive apparition, using it defensively seems like discarding it's primary strength: which is charging.

An Apparition more suited to defence is the Black essence. It just hangs around and gets in people's face.
Bonus: multiple targets.

[X] [BEHAVIOUR] Duel
[X] [BEHAVIOUR] Charge
[X] [NUMBER] One
 
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