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Finreir beat Mannfred in a magic duel, I don't know that he just dispelled the whole army like the Grand Theogonist did.

Even if the Druchii or Asur know the 1st and 2nd Secret, that doesn't mean the Eonir know them.

Boney noted that Mathilde could give Sarvoi lessons about Dhar use, though of course he's probably not the Eonir pinnacle of Dhar Magic.
The 1st and 2nd secrets are big, sure, But I don't think those are the reason Mathilde could give Sarvoi lessons.

Mathilde flat out has Dhar insight as trait, and it's not just from the Liber Mortis, she's seen a lot of variants of Dhar. Vampires and Necromancers, Chaos worshippers, even Eshin magic which people didn't even know existed. Then there's her trip up to the Chaos wastes.

She has a hell of a lot of direct experience with Dhar, of almost every sort.
 
God I was just struck by something, With Mathildes tendency to give things terrible puns as names, and the fact Eike is somewhat planned to run the EIC (If she still wants to)

...What are the chances people in the future end up assuming Mathilde named the EIC as a dumb pun on Eike's name?
 
Because if it is a human book people aren't going to buy that it was in Eonir hands.

There's a lot of ways we could justify human books. From arrangements with other countries libraries, to having found them ourselves to just saying we have copied it from one of the Colleges archives.

Honestly I am baffled about having to argue why Mathilde a Grey Wizard with 27 Intrigue (and in my argument literal years of letting the trail get cold) is able to justify laundering books.

So I think I will just stop arguing about it.
 
God I was just struck by something, With Mathildes tendency to give things terrible puns as names, and the fact Eike is somewhat planned to run the EIC (If she still wants to)

...What are the chances people in the future end up assuming Mathilde named the EIC as a dumb pun on Eike's name?

That's sort of already happened.

You nod. "I work with her grandmother in a trade concern in Stirland, and Eike's to inherit her grandmother's stake in it."

"The EIC, yes. I've encountered them a time or two in my other job, they're a nightmare to suborn. Was Eike named after the company?"

You blink. "I never noticed that, actually. I don't believe so, she was named by her mother, who wasn't involved with the EIC back then."
 
Edit: This is in reference to the fantastically stupid idea of trying to teach Saovir how to better use Dhar.

Or you know, we could not reveal our insight in a way that could get us comprehensively executed (or worse, pacified), tarnish our legacy forever including among the dwarves, potentially disband the Waystone project entirely and subject Eike to the most through possible scrutiny to maybe, possibly, perhaps teach an old and incredibly powerful elf how maybe augment his skill a tiny amount more by using an element Mathilde has no personal love for.
 
God I was just struck by something, With Mathildes tendency to give things terrible puns as names, and the fact Eike is somewhat planned to run the EIC (If she still wants to)

...What are the chances people in the future end up assuming Mathilde named the EIC as a dumb pun on Eike's name?
I think the math wouldn't check out. Eike is 14 in turn 40, so she was born ~ turn 12. Four years after the EIC was named.
 
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Perhaps we'll also be able to introduce the Bretonnians to RoW. Enabling cavalry charges over more difficult terrain seems like it would be right up their alley. Perhaps they'd try to get Damsels or the Fey Enchantress interested in creating their own version. That would be worth some kudos, surely.
As much as Bretonnia is a frequent ally to the Empire against the more evil factions, they're also a major rival, with on-and-off border friction around the Wasteland. I really don't think giving away Battle Magic (or demonstrating it sufficiently that they can make their own copy) is going to fly.

Battle Magic is a strategic national asset; disseminating it (or, more likely, not disseminating it) is more an "Algard or higher" decision than a Lord Magister one, especially if we're only doing it for kudos.
 
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The 1st and 2nd secrets are big, sure

I am curious about what more secrets there are about Dhar. Because I doubt the second secret is enough to counter an army made by Nagash or Druchii sorceress spells.

As much as Bretonnia is a frequent ally to the Empire against the more evil factions, they're also a major rival, with on-and-off border friction around the Wasteland. I really don't think giving away Battle Magic (or demonstrating it sufficiently that they can make their own copy) is going to fly.

Battle Magic is a strategic national asset; disseminating it (or, more likely, not disseminating it) is more a "College Patriarch or higher" decision than a Lord Magister one.

I'd rather give RoW to the Druchii* than to Bretonnia. I think people forget just how many wars the Empire has had with Bretonnia and how many people they have killed. I really don't think giving them something to make their cavalry even stronger is a good idea at all.

*: Uh, I thought giving it to them would be a terrible idea which is why I used them as example, but thinking about it is not that bad of an idea as I thought considering the main problem with the Druchii are their raids not their cavalry so most likely it wouldn't see much use for them.
 
Is bloodying your apprentice normal? I'm pretty sure it didn't happen to Mathilde, Panoramia, or any of the Ducklings. Maybe that's all the more reason to do it for Eike, I'm just curious how unusual it would be.

Mathilde managed to screw up badly enough she started out being hunted by an Apparition. You could make the argument that doing so was effectively a less controlled form of the "take her along when we go to capture an Apparition" method of blooding Eike.

You could also look at Mathilde's Journeying and point out that she went into it badly unprepared; it was primarily due to the Wisdom's Asp having obscenely bad luck (thanks Ranald!) that she didn't have a serious chance of death fairly early on, and she was both less magically and mundanely skilled than Eike.

Panoramia was notably sheltered in some ways. This resulted in her taking a sufficiently cavalier approach to her use of Ghyran that Mathilde felt the need to have a talk with her about it, and particularly about her use in dangerous situations and of stronger spells, which is something we very much don't want to be the case for Eike.

More broadly, the duties of a Jade Wizard are very different to those of a Grey Wizard, and what's a perfectly reasonable means of educating one might be a very poor fit for the other. Panoramia is able settle down in a very safe location (a thriving Karak) to focus entirely on soil reclamation and crop management. Most options available to Eike don't look very much like that.

As for the Ducklings, I'm curious why you say that; from what I remember of the expedition to reclaim Karak Eight-Peaks they seemed to have reasonable abilities in combat and largely kept their heads. Which doesn't prove anything, but does seem to lean the other way insofar as we have any evidence.

There is the potential that such bounties would lead to thieves stealing from legit institutions which safeguard illegal books (like the Verenans), but we can apparently be quite specific in how to setup the bounties, so we could simply add a caveat to not raid them.

I like Ranald, but I think that shows a shocking degree of optimism about how likely the people who choose to devote themselves to the god of lying, gambling, and thievery are to not take the chance that they can pass it off as acquired from another source, particularly if (as is being proposed to keep Mathilde's name out of it) they have no idea that they're working for a Grey Wizard.

I think the math wouldn't check out. Eike 14 in turn 40, so born ~ turn 12. Four years after the EIC was named.

Getting people to check information like that before they start spreading theories around is hard enough when it's freely available online.

As much as Bretonnia is a frequent ally to the Empire against the more evil factions, they're also a major rival, with on-and-off border friction around the Wasteland. I really don't think giving away Battle Magic (or demonstrating it sufficiently that they can make their own copy) is going to fly.

Battle Magic is a strategic national asset; disseminating it (or, more likely, not disseminating it) is more an "Algard or higher" decision than a Lord Magister one, especially if we're only doing it for kudos.

I'm also given to understand that Brettonia is lacking in the Ulgu-capable mages department (though not entirely).

Which, on the one hand, does make it easier to defend our actions if they do work out how to adapt it to the point that it can be used universally, but also makes it much less useful to them if they can't.
 
Aside from the Fey Enchantress does Brettonia even have anyone who could use RoW? Damsels can only use Ghur and Ghyran, with Prophetesses getting Azyr as well, so no Ulgu casting at all, let alone on a BM level.
 
If we really want to engage in Ranaldite Book Acquisition™ I'm entirely on board for doing it ourselves. Much less so for outsourcing where we don't even put a crew together personally.
 
*: Uh, I thought giving it to them would be a terrible idea which is why I used them as example, but thinking about it is not that bad of an idea as I thought considering the main problem with the Druchii are their raids not their cavalry so most likely it wouldn't see much use for them.

Also the Druchii ride Cold Ones, which are not as hindered by poor terrain as horses are.
 
If we really want to engage in Ranaldite Book Acquisition™ I'm entirely on board for doing it ourselves. Much less so for outsourcing where we don't even put a crew together personally.

If we were to steal books personally I'd pretty much would prefer to steal a Skaven library (do they have those?). Much harder to obtain books and all the ones we get would give us bonuses. Otoh I am not sure how we would be able to steal many books at the same time...
 
If we were to steal books personally I'd pretty much would prefer to steal a Skaven library (do they have those?). Much harder to obtain books and all the ones we get would give us bonuses. Otoh I am not sure how we would be able to steal many books at the same time...
Skaven, Marienburg, Chaos Dwarves, I'm flexible as to target as long as Night Prowler should be applicable.



As to moving the haul, Liminal Realm in a box. Hopefully anyway.
 
Getting people to check information like that before they start spreading theories around is hard enough when it's freely available online.
Well, they would have to know about Mathilde's involvement in the EIC, her tendency for weird names and that she has an apprentice named Eike in the first place. If you fulfill all these criteria, you probably also know the timeline or have the means and inclination to check before you spread these theories, since you are most likely either a Grey Wizard and/or know Mathilde on a personal level. Or work for her. And even then it would be hard for the theory to gather momentum before someone fact-checks you, because most people that would be interested in it are nerds or spies.
 
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Since the chance to be identified grows with every tome added and that if we build a massive library scholars from all around the continent will come to K8P that means we're basically guaranteed to get caught if we use Ranaldian networks to buff our library significantly.

Remember - we're not talking about common books since Belegar can just buy those - no it'd be consistently bringing in rare tomes that are if not unique then available only in a handful of places: eventually people will grow suspicious of how works that got pillaged are appearing in the K8P library.
Guarenteed is such an interesting word to use there. It is also completely ridicilus one. Who the hell has time to watch our complete corpus for specific tomes and link that to thefts that happened on the other side of continent. Especially since we are likely to make copies and display those rather than the originials.

I wonder why they are not clearing out chaos cults from the entirety of the Old World. It should take them couple of weeks tops with that kind of presience they seem to have. Oh well I suppose catching small time thieves is so much more improtant that these hypotetical Super Sherlocks on Celestial Crack that does not exist will be focusing on it and blow the whole thing right away. That totally makes sense.

Or you know that might not happen.
 
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As much as Bretonnia is a frequent ally to the Empire against the more evil factions, they're also a major rival, with on-and-off border friction around the Wasteland. I really don't think giving away Battle Magic (or demonstrating it sufficiently that they can make their own copy) is going to fly.

Battle Magic is a strategic national asset; disseminating it (or, more likely, not disseminating it) is more an "Algard or higher" decision than a Lord Magister one, especially if we're only doing it for kudos.
Mathilde already used it to get Kislev soldiers to battle in time. If it ended up being useful to get Bretonnian knights to a fight with orcs or to allow them to charge home against orcs when otherwise they couldn't I can't see any way she would decide not to use it in a similar way. I doubt that she'd give it away, but using it in the same way as before would surely earn credit with Bretonnia.
 
Mathilde already used it to get Kislev soldiers to battle in time. If it ended up being useful to get Bretonnian knights to a fight with orcs or to allow them to charge home against orcs when otherwise they couldn't I can't see any way she would decide not to use it in a similar way. I doubt that she'd give it away, but using it in the same way as before would surely earn credit with Bretonnia.

Using it on a battle is different from repeatedly showing it to a Damsel to the point she can copy it or giving a copy of the codified spell away.
 
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