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Warhammer Fantasy: Divided Loyalties - an Advisor's Quest

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[X] Remain silent.
[X] Join the hunting with Maximilian
[X] 'Make sure the ale hasn't gone bad' with Johann

[X] Drinking
[X] Telling war stories
[X] Being maudlin

[X] Yes to Shenanigans
 
Guys, can we Please not hide the truth from Belegar and Kragg? Given the way he's looking at us I'm betting Kragg already knows more than we said, and hiding this from him might make him rather exceptionally unhappy with us for the rest of forever. And no that's not hyperbole, Kragg holds All the grudges.

Belegar at least Deserves to know what actually happened. The Black Orks tried to use Karak Eight Peaks as the staging ground for there divine hijacking attempt, and even though we killed the Shaman responsible there is still a very real chance this could happen again.

Hiding these things from what is likely to become our closest Dwarf Friend, and Kragg the Grimm himself, just feels like a completely terrible idea.


Why are you all so afraid of trusting the two most level headed dwarves we know with the secret of what really happened?
 
Nix's Warden said:
No, but it would help to know to prioritize the Black Orcs even more then they normally do, and I would like to learn that story IC as I said. I think it would be interesting, and I trust we have enough Dwarf Rep, that Belegar isn't going to be pissed that we're asking him about it when we learned about the Chaos Dwarves existence because of a Greenskin Vision.

Plus there's that nice Dwarf Favor boost from knowing we helped our God take Mork to the cleaners.
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  1. They are already prioritizing black orcs as much a dwarfily posibile because they are black orcs
  2. I would really rather not burn dwarf favor on learning a secret, that we would be then sworn to keep from everyone else on pain of losing all our dwarf rep.
 
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notanautomaton said:
We trained stats as of the last normal turn, where we trained Learning and Piety. It's possible that BoneyM has changed things, but if so I'm not aware.
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See here:

BoneyM said:
I'll be retiring Internalize Lessons after this turn, and base characteristic increases are being surrendered to dicerolls when narratively appropriate. If you really want to spend actions on stat increases, all skills when Proficient will give +1 to the relevant stat on top of narrative bonuses to using it, and hopefully learning Dwarven War Yodelling for +1 diplomacy will be less of an autopick than Internalized Lessons for the same.
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I want to learn Skaven and Greenskin Lore anyway, so the bonus to Learning is just gravy for me.

Edit: Grey GM-ed
 
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Darik29 said:
Guys, can we Please not hide the truth from Belegar and Kragg? Given the way he's looking at us I'm betting Kragg already knows more than we said, and hiding this from him might make him rather exceptionally unhappy with us for the rest of forever. And no that's not hyperbole, Kragg holds All the grudges.

Belegar at least Deserves to know what actually happened. The Black Orks tried to use Karak Eight Peaks as the staging ground for there divine hijacking attempt, and even though we killed the Shaman responsible there is still a very real chance this could happen again.

Hiding these things from what is likely to become our closest Dwarf Friend, and Kragg the Grimm himself, just feels like a completely terrible idea.


Why are you all so afraid of trusting the two most level headed dwarves we know with the secret of what really happened?
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Let's not tell them about the Dawi Zharr and the greenskin god possession.
 
[X] Remain silent.

[X] Join the hunting with Maximilian
[X] 'Make sure the ale hasn't gone bad' with Johann

[X] Drinking
[X] Telling war stories
[x] Hold a Ranaldan religious service

[X] Yes to Shenanigans

Johann is a chad, and Max needs some moral support after everything that's happened to him. He may not be able to rely on anyone else, but he can rely on Matilde!
 
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DragonParadox said:
OK, so its definite Panoramia screwed up all on her own and should spend a good long while thinking very seriously about what she has done.
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I mean, ultimately every wizard has to be their own judge of how tired they are and how 'safe' it is to be casting spells.

You could say that Panoramia correctly judged she wasn't as tired from making the poisons as Mathilde thought she was and was indeed correct that another spell or two was reasonably safe.
 
ctulhuslp said:
Ehhhh.
Like, all else aside: she is already a wizard. Kragg won't start trusting her less because this is pretty much level of "oh gods why" she expects of all of our kind.
Belegar is different, but he already trusts us. And it's an interesting story anyway.


I mean, it was...possession in a sense that we played role of Mork Prophet in a tale, so to speak?
In one setting name of which I forgot, heroes could attain power of gods by repeating deeds gods did in their mortal life, and got the more power the closer were deeds to the tale, mindset and all.
We basically inadvertently hijacked the tale of Mork's chosen, it was not some willy-nilly possession like by demon. It is much, much more interesting than that.
And then we used it to steal power of both gods because that's just how we roll.

Idk I think it's a tale worth telling; and besides, you noticed how Kragg looked at us? He...he is feeling something going on. Best not to breed misunderstandings.
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How do I put it ?
The second you started thinking in terms of other settings you missed the entire point, this is WARHAMMER there is no positive conotation to being possessed whatsoever and 10001 long storied reasons why that should lead to burning at the stake as soon as possile for the good of all.

Being a wizard doesn't she is already as bad as it can be, it means she always on the line and on the verge of tiping over, and a possessed one doesn't tend to merit more trust, add the whole chaos dwarf thing that they just refuse to talk about and the presence of the most hidebound dwarf of them all and this is powder keg that will explode whitout doubt for no visible gain.
 
Darik29 said:
Guys, can we Please not hide the truth from Belegar and Kragg? Given the way he's looking at us I'm betting Kragg already knows more than we said, and hiding this from him might make him rather exceptionally unhappy with us for the rest of forever. And no that's not hyperbole, Kragg holds All the grudges.

Belegar at least Deserves to know what actually happened. The Black Orks tried to use Karak Eight Peaks as the staging ground for there divine hijacking attempt, and even though we killed the Shaman responsible there is still a very real chance this could happen again.

Hiding these things from what is likely to become our closest Dwarf Friend, and Kragg the Grimm himself, just feels like a completely terrible idea.


Why are you all so afraid of trusting the two most level headed dwarves we know with the secret of what really happened?
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...Kragg is NOT level-headed. Like, at all. He just takes his lack of level-headedness in an uncommon direction.

This is in no way relevant, is full of opportunities to cause problems if only by adding needless burdens to Belegar's mind. It could very well cause at least subconscious dislike of us via knowing their terrible shame. Or distrust because we were possessed by a damn Greenskins god.
 
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Briefvoice said:
I mean, ultimately every wizard has to be their own judge of how tired they are and how 'safe' it is to be casting spells.

You could say that Panoramia correctly judged she wasn't as tired from making the poisons as Mathilde thought she was and was indeed correct that another spell or two was reasonably safe.
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The GM described it as juggling radioactive chainsaws while exhausted. From that description one can deduce that Mathilde considers it an unacceptable risk, thus Panoramia screwed up.
 
DragonParadox said:
  1. They are already prioritizing black orcs as much a dwarfily posibile because they are black orcs
  2. I would really rather not burn dwarf favor on learning a secret, that we would be then sworn to keep from everyone else from everyone else on pain of losing all our dwarf rep.
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It's better we learn from them just how much of a secret that is, instead of, idk, sending info to Grey Order and then a decade later realizing there is now a grudge against us or whatever.
Like, IC Mathilde has no idea how dwarves view their lost cousins, I bet - after all, humans keep in mind fallen humans all the time without going all "SECRECY" over the very existence of necromancers or cults. It'll probably be something of culture shock for her to see how dwarves treat the issue. Better learn here and now, from a person who trusts us as much as dwarf trusts human outside of like Sigmar or Gotrek/Felix...and Kragg, but we need him to explain to Belegar that we are not secretly an ork now.
 
Alratan said:
See here:

​

I want to learn Skaven and Greenskin Lore anyway, so the bonus to Learning is just gravy for me.
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Kinda ninja'd by the QM himself.
Briefvoice said:
I mean, ultimately every wizard has to be their own judge of how tired they are and how 'safe' it is to be casting spells.

You could say that Panoramia correctly judged she wasn't as tired from making the poisons as Mathilde thought she was and was indeed correct that another spell or two was reasonably safe.
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Which makes the choice we made work out well, since it was 'share how I accidentally summoned a Daemon and my shadow sometimes kills people,' rather than 'berate Panoramia until she cries.'
 
Belegar and Kragg needs to know.

- They deserve to know.
- If can have strategic implication. I.e.: Mork encouraging greenskins to concentrate on K8P.
- Kragg already knows more than he says.
- Belgar is leader of the expedition that Mathilde is part of.
 
Briefvoice said:
I mean, ultimately every wizard has to be their own judge of how tired they are and how 'safe' it is to be casting spells.

You could say that Panoramia correctly judged she wasn't as tired from making the poisons as Mathilde thought she was and was indeed correct that another spell or two was reasonably safe.
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When you're a Magister you get to make that call. Panoramia isn't, Mahilde told her that she was too tired, and when the more experienced and competent wizard told her that, she should have done what she was told.

notanautomaton said:
Which makes the choice we made work out well, since it was 'share how I accidentally summoned a Daemon and my shadow sometimes kills people,' rather than 'berate Panoramia until she cries.'
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If we go on to treat it like it's no big deal after the lecture we'll just make it more likely that she forgets the lesson again.
 
ctulhuslp said:
It's better we learn from them just how much of a secret that is, instead of, idk, sending info to Grey Order and then a decade later realizing there is now a grudge against us or whatever.
Like, IC Mathilde has no idea how dwarves view their lost cousins, I bet - after all, humans keep in mind fallen humans all the time without going all "SECRECY" over the very existence of necromancers or cults. It'll probably be something of culture shock for her to see how dwarves treat the issue. Better learn here and now, from a person who trusts us as much as dwarf trusts human outside of like Sigmar or Gotrek/Felix...and Kragg, but we need him to explain to Belegar that we are not secretly an ork now.
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If we tell the grey college there is no way Belagar or Kragg could ever know Mathilde was the one who leaked the information. After all there is no reasonable way she could have known
 
Alectai said:
[X] Remain Silent

We don't need to elaborate further, and we didn't even tell Van Hal everything!

We've gotten all the pertinent information in, let's keep some information that won't actually impact the campaign to ourselves, you know?
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Mathilde has vey very little idea of how much of a pain point it is for dwarfs.
Better learn now, in...well, as much of a friendly dwarven audience as we are realistically going to get.

And that's, well, a purely self-interest point of view. There is also stuff about them trusting us or whatnot, and about Kragg suspecting something and being liable to arrive to some even more pessimistic conclusion if left alone.
 
Revised vote:

[X] Remain silent.
[X] Join the hunting with Maximilian
[X] Join the hunting with Ruprecht Wulfhart
[X] Sparring
[X] Target shooting
[X] Help move the Karag Nar hoard


Thor's Twin said:
Kragg the Grimm is not level headed. He is full of spite, anger, and disapproval and I'm convinced that those are the only emotions he feels.
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You forgot hate.
 
DragonParadox said:
If we tell the grey college there is no way Belagar or Kragg could ever know Mathilde was the one who leaked the information. After all there is no reasonable way she could have known
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Fair enough. But it'd still be our responsibility this happened, and that's...a kind of diplomatic incident that puts hypothetical fallout of Johan's actions to shame, quite likely? Or at least it has such potential.
And Mathilde has approximately zero clue how much of a diplomatic minefield she is in with such a secret.
 
ctulhuslp said:
Mathilde has vey very little idea of how much of a pain point it is for dwarfs.
Better learn now, in...well, as much of a friendly dwarven audience as we are realistically going to get.

And that's, well, a purely self-interest point of view. There is also stuff about them trusting us or whatnot, and about Kragg suspecting something and being liable to arrive to some even more pessimistic conclusion if left alone.
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No, it's better to never learn, share the vision with the College for some favor and walk away, secure in the knowledge that the dwarfs are not in any way going to learn Grey College secrets, like who might have told them about the Chaos Dwarfs.

ctulhuslp said:
Fair enough. But it'd still be our responsibility this happened, and that's...a kind of diplomatic incident that puts hypothetical fallout of Johan's actions to shame, quite likely? Or at least it has such potential.
And Mathilde has approximately zero clue how much of a diplomatic minefield she is in with such a secret.
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As I said above it's as close as makes no difference to imposibile for the dwarfs to ever find out.
 
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So the talk about our Jade journeywoman's age got me thinking. What is the average age for someone to be promoted to magister?
 
ctulhuslp said:
And that's, well, a purely self-interest point of view. There is also stuff about them trusting us or whatnot, and about Kragg suspecting something and being liable to arrive to some even more pessimistic conclusion if left alone.
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Whatever conclusion he comes to, I doubt it will be worse than possession by Mork and knowledge of Chaos Dwarfs.
 
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