I never implied that there would be or should be change, Mathilde's faith for Ranald would coincide with her lessons on the nature of the gods at the College, so any faith would have to include and internalize those facts.
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Warhammer Fantasy: Divided Loyalties - an Advisor's Quest
- Thread starter Boney
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- warhammer warhammer fantasy fantasy be gay do crimes (gay) female protagonist pansexual protagonist ck2 quest divided loyalties mountain vietnam ranald is real this is a dwarf quest (dwarfs) this is maybe an elf quest this is not a vampire quest this is not an empire quest try it and find out open voting
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I never implied that there would be or should be change, Mathilde's faith for Ranald would coincide with her lessons on the nature of the gods at the College, so any faith would have to include and internalize those facts.
chocolote12
A Penguin Flailing Against The Keyboard Of Life.
That's not the question I thought I was asking, sorry.
Because we have used our Gambler+ charges for now, do the other facets of the coin still work, or is it spent until it recharges somehow?
Also, is there a courtesy length between changing faces?
DocMatoi
Theoretical Lover of Girls
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[Von Carstein voice]: "Perhaps the same could be said of all religions..."
- Pronouns
- He/Him
Mmm, the ability to treat both a god and oneself as that and mean it is very difficult. It requires a mindset that isn't really compatible with humans, more machine-like really.
The elves know what their gods are and don't have any problem with that.
Mathilde would do very well if she read the records of Teclis' lectures on the divine to his human students that the Colleges have kept. While the Colleges have institutionally drawn one set of lessons from them, that's not the only path to take from them. The elven concept that you are your gods and they are you (like overlapping Venn diagrams) seems truer than the human conception, and gives a clue to how you might perform sorcery - and why the elves consider their magic to be both divine and arcane.
Well, gods aren't that like human souls. They're made of the same stuff, but that's not quite the same.
I think people exaggerate that a lot through overexposure to Teclis. Teclis is a massive dick, but he's not a representative Loremaster, even if he is in charge. Their characters vary as much as humans' character do. Humans of great age, experience, and power that is. On the other hand, this is how they're described:
Here the High Elves learn and study High Magic, the only spellcraft that uses the Winds of Magic in harmony. Teclis, the same mage that helped the Humans of the Empire found the Colleges of Magic, is now the High Loremaster of the White Tower and he presides over some of the mightiest wizards in the world. High Elves utilize color magic akin to that of the Colleges of Magic, but to them such spells are minor magics taught to apprentices. In other words, the greatest wizards of the Colleges of Magic would be considered but whelps in the Tower of Hoeth. It is for this reason that High Magic is not detailed in Realms of Sorcery. Not only is it beyond the scope of most WFRP games, it is also impractical for Player Characters in typical campaigns. Those wizards lucky enough to find their way to the White Tower would not be seen outside its walls for decades, so while aspiring to study at there is a great character goal, its achievement would effectively mean the retirement of the character. GMs who want to feature high magic in their games should use it as a story element. It should be portrayed as both powerful and mystical, something beyond the scope of what most Imperial Magisters can even imagine. Remember that the aid of only three High Elf mages in the Great War Against Chaos was a priceless gift to Magnus the Pious and absolutely crucial in the enemy's defeat.
However, we don't need a Loremaster. A mist mage in the employ of one the Lothern Merchant Houses would be an ideal teacher and collaborator. They're users of Ulgu from a very intrigue heavy society.
How comfy is your standard Halfling romance novel?
Either maximum comf or no comf at all, no middle ground.
The speed of this thread continues to amaze.
On the other hand… cazador. The word brings back unpleasant memories.
The Seed.
The Belt.
Shadow Tentacles.
The Coin.
We set out as a reasonable scout, a passable assassin and a lacklustre organiser.
We arrived at Eight Peaks as a combat cockroach that has better than even odds of beating any hero and most lords that aren't armed to the teeth with magic armour. Who is also a scout, assassin and organiser.
Before our exam Mathilda wasn't really capable of just wandering around the world doing meaningful deeds. She needed a support base or a long time to grow a network from scratch. Now we could go to basically anywhere outside the chaos wastes and be a mover and shaker on arrival.
Might be time for at least some research.
On the one hand, good to see some enthusiasm from a Dwarf King.
On the other hand… cazador. The word brings back unpleasant memories.
Notably when we made that decision we didn't have:
The Seed.
The Belt.
Shadow Tentacles.
The Coin.
We set out as a reasonable scout, a passable assassin and a lacklustre organiser.
We arrived at Eight Peaks as a combat cockroach that has better than even odds of beating any hero and most lords that aren't armed to the teeth with magic armour. Who is also a scout, assassin and organiser.
Before our exam Mathilda wasn't really capable of just wandering around the world doing meaningful deeds. She needed a support base or a long time to grow a network from scratch. Now we could go to basically anywhere outside the chaos wastes and be a mover and shaker on arrival.
We may be seeing campaign turns (like we had during the haunted hills) when the current battle(s) are done with. The expedition will needs time to consolidate.
Might be time for at least some research.
IIRC, the entry point to being an elven high mage is reaching peak wizard lord level (sans Arcane marks/Ascension rituals) in every single Wind.
There are also specialist elven wizards, such as the mist mages using Ulgu, sea mages using Ghyran, and dragon mages using Aqshy (Asarnil is 'probably' a sub-battle magic grade dragon mage, as some ability to use the Lore of Fire seems to be part of the process for dragon riders to awaken their dragons). Not all elven mages invest the decades required to master every Wind and then Qhyash.
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DarkLight140
Credit to Team
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Hm. In terms of game mechanics that makes turn votes a fair bit tougher. Being able to put a +20 bonus on our single most dangerous action was a huge safety net, and now it'll be competing against the other facets to exist at all.
We'll probably end up with a lot less spread of focus sometimes because of this; we'll want to cram all our available actions that can use the Night Prowler bonus into a single turn while freezing all dangerous magical research, for example. Using the Protector bonus instead of Gambler is basically sacrificing odds of success for the sake of everyone knowing that you succeeded, which is self-aggrandizing to the point of foolishness in any matter of true importance, so we'd only use it when we're capable of conducting multiple relatively low-risk operations or aren't doing anything with our other actions which we deem risky or important.
Will make for some more interesting arguments than simply where to put the +20, at any rate. Still, I'd expect us to stick with Gambler most of the time because "Mathilde is less likely to die and more likely to critically succeed" is a very difficult thing to compete effectively with.
No bonii outside the crazy bonkers one the Coin will be providing you from one of the non-Gambler faces.
It works only during normal turns. During those turns you'd choose what face you would be using as part of your plan for the turn.
Mathilde's entire career is centered around using her own warp blob to manipulate warp energies to the extent that her warp blob has absorbed some and been permanently changed. Sometimes it's harder to remember the meat side of the equation.
It seems to me that people have a really skewed perspective on what Stirland is/means to Mathilde.
Furthermore, I wouldn't be so quick to say that she outgrew it.
Rather, instead of almost being under-qualified at the start of the quest, she would now be extremely competent at her job. If she ever became a spymistress again, that is.
But I am not advocating for her trying to get her job back.
Personally, I would use her holdings in Stirland as a research retreat after we finish this particular business with dwarfs (whether immediately after expedition or after several turns serving as Belegar's court wizard), solving some of Stirland's problems in her spare time if she feels like it as a form of stress relief and then decide where to go from there.
I am not interested in power-gaming for its sake. I quite like Mathilde as a character and would like to have her develop and behave organically.
Furthermore, I wouldn't be so quick to say that she outgrew it.
Rather, instead of almost being under-qualified at the start of the quest, she would now be extremely competent at her job. If she ever became a spymistress again, that is.
But I am not advocating for her trying to get her job back.
Personally, I would use her holdings in Stirland as a research retreat after we finish this particular business with dwarfs (whether immediately after expedition or after several turns serving as Belegar's court wizard), solving some of Stirland's problems in her spare time if she feels like it as a form of stress relief and then decide where to go from there.
I am not interested in power-gaming for its sake. I quite like Mathilde as a character and would like to have her develop and behave organically.
DocMatoi
Theoretical Lover of Girls
- Location
- within 2 hours of the White House
- Pronouns
- They/Them
With all the sudden questions of "can we get MORE" it feels like we're suddenly trying to wring our good relationship with ranald like a sponge.
Which uh
Is kind of how you lose a good relationship. If you think of someone, even a deity, only in terms of "what can they give me" soon you will lose their favor.
Which uh
Is kind of how you lose a good relationship. If you think of someone, even a deity, only in terms of "what can they give me" soon you will lose their favor.
BungieONI
Seven gremlins in a trench coat
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I think the important factor there in the high elf apprentice comparison is the high elf bit, i.e a Wizard Lord compares favorably with a high elf apprentice. I remember the phrasing which was that he starts treating you like an actual person, so an upgrade from cute puppy to a cute and bumbling apprentice.
notanautomaton
I've got 99 quests, I've finished one
The thing is that Loremasters being as far above wizard lords as a wizard lord is above an apprentice isn't really borne out by game mechanics. In the wargame and Total Warhammer they're good but not that good, and they don't show up in the Tabletop RPG.
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DocMatoi
Theoretical Lover of Girls
- Location
- within 2 hours of the White House
- Pronouns
- They/Them
I firmly agree. Stirland is home for Mathilde, no matter how much everyone wants her to uh... [checks thread] heist Bretonnia?
I want what Mathilde wants, is what I mean. Everything we do should flow naturally from Mathilde's character and motivations. and right now, no matter what items of power she's accumulated, Mathilde is still just a Grey Magister from Wurtbad.
She didn't come here seeking riches, or power, she came seeking purpose. and perhaps, with both the expedition, and proof of her dedication to Ranald, she has found two.
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A worshipper of the God of Thieves and Conmen being in it for what they can get, you say? It seems perfectly in theme to have a transactional relationship with Ranald.
Also, pre-modern polytheistic societies were often very transactional in how they saw their gods. You prayed and sacrificed to them for success in basically commercial terms, and no one saw a problem with that.
Wll, not that favourably. A wizard lord is as competent as a fully trained elven apprentice at one Wind. A fully trained elven apprentice would be that good in all eight Winds.
That's just game balance, in the same way that dwarves can't kill the vast numbers of goblins or skaven each before falling that they should be able to. It's like how if you use the game rules elven mages would all have exploded from a miscast early in their careers, and the like of Morathi and Malkieth wouldn't have survived for many thousands of years of very regular magic use.
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chocolote12
A Penguin Flailing Against The Keyboard Of Life.
I'm not asking for more, I just don't know what we've already been given.
Mathilde's character is what we've made of her. We will continue acting as we have been because we haven't changed, but honestly now that we're not bound there I just don't find Stirland interesting anymore, except in that we keep some of our friends and fancy stuff there for safe keeping.
Wurtbad was home for Mathilde, just as before then the College was, and before that a small village in the back of beyond. She's grown past those parts of her life. It taught her lessons and gave her scars, but she's a grey wizard. She moves on. It's one of their defining characteristics.
Perhaps Karak Eight Peaks will now be her home for a few years, before she moves on to her next challenge, greater and wiser for what she learned here.
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notanautomaton
I've got 99 quests, I've finished one
The issue is that this quest seems to be drawing more from the various games than the fluff.
- Location
- Actually pretty lost
Yeah, in the wargame they're not that great, in the tabletop RPG they're incredible beyond what any PC could ever hope to achieve, to the point that any instance of high magic should, by the recommendation of the writers, be treated as a monumental, awe-inspiring event. As the latter is more lore-oriented, we're probably leaning in that direction here.
And yeah, I don't particularly care about Stirland anymore. It's somewhere to occasionally check in on and collect earnings from, not somewhere we need to invest heavily in or spend time improving.
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- Brazil
Yes, but not only is there an OOC commitment, but where could she leverage her abilities any harder than mapping the entirety of K8P, getting a nearly full headcount on every single faction, and snoop out innumerable surprises, on top of potentially assassinating irreplaceable (in the sense they will all be dead before a new one emerges) leaders?
That, on top of having convenient training partners for all things martial, accruing a shitload of dwarf favour and reputation?
I'd say on battle turns the Protector one is pretty good, until we get Battle Spells (and don't have an Earthing Rod).
DocMatoi
Theoretical Lover of Girls
- Location
- within 2 hours of the White House
- Pronouns
- They/Them
mmm. maybe. might just be my modern, monotheist-raised biases speaking but that feels kinda... dirty? like, not real faith.
IIRC Ranaldians in-quest treat ranald more like a brethren thief than that kind of Goodie Pinata. the way they call him "Our mutual friend," being my main source for that.
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BungieONI
Seven gremlins in a trench coat
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Eh, I don't think its a safe research retreat for two reasons: nothing there is properly built to ground magical energies and it'd be a pain to build stuff to be safe. And it is not safe in terms of secrecy for our more secret projects like Sorcery.
Using dwarf favors in K8P to build a vacation home is to me, a much more sound idea because it means we can use dwarf super eginneering much more easily to build a properly grounded lab, it can be hidden with the same engineering, and as an extra bonus it provides a safe haven in case something in the Empire goes wrong and we need to vacate the country. Like finding a cult of vampires and doing a lot of damage to it but having to evade their hunters and go to ground somewhere that isn't in Stirland because Stirland is right next to Vampire Land, as an example.
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