Warhammer Fantasy: Divided Loyalties - an Advisor's Quest

[Boney]

Let's say we were giving our robes another try. Like say when the We silk gets figured out.

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I don't want to start mapping out every hypothetical people can think of. If it will help, Mathilde will make use of it.

 

[GrimTheMad]

Johann is now a blind golden monk with a railgun staff and a robot dinosaur laser arm.

I don't really have a point, I just wanted to type that sentence.

 

[Aule]

Dwarves in Naggaroth?

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Well, they did put some dwarfs in Lustria. Hugrim Redaxe and a small hold survive there, probably because the lizards can't be bothered to climb those mountains and dwarfs don't give them a reason to.

 

[fictionfan]

I don't want to start mapping out every hypothetical people can think of. If it will help, Mathilde will make use of it.

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Fair. I do sort of wonder if Thorek would at the workshop with approval or not. He is the toughest judge we can bring in at the moment. The other one would likely prejudge it too much.

 

[Glau]

I *really* want to see Johann go all out now- I feel like he's in that special place where he can keep chaff off himself and fight a hero at the same time.

 

[Ericwinter]

Johann is now a blind golden monk with a railgun staff and a robot dinosaur laser arm.

I don't really have a point, I just wanted to type that sentence.

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I don't blame you, really. It's an awesome sentence. Almost as cool as the magic ninja saint with a cannon sword, a misty staff made out of dragon bone, anti-radiation belt, and a four-sided chunk of divinity around her neck. Plus her pet wolf.

 

[Glau]

And the... Dwarf apprentice level blacksmith magic archer with a publishing credit list twice as long as your arm?

 

[A_Somebody]

And the... Dwarf apprentice level blacksmith magic archer with a publishing credit list twice as long as your arm?

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Don't pick on Max! Him helping Mathy get the Waaagh paper out was legit crucial!

He's just following after his Dwarfen mentors, no point in rushing like he's got a limited lifespan! (prrerrtty sure he's done the whole "souls replaced with chunks of Chamon" thing)

 

[DragonParadox]

I for one am happy with what we got for the arm. To unravel the secrets of the Lizardmen would have been a research path at least as long as AV, if it could be done at all. We do not have time for that and we do not need another AP sink. Let Johann have his laser arm.

It is nice to see Mathy make friends (or at least friendly acquaintances) with elves near her own age. Queens and Mages older than the Empire are nice and all but there is a distance there which cannot be bridged. Laurelin on the other hand is just the sort of elf we can really get to know as an equal, maybe we can even do some fun stuff together on the side and learn about the Eonir in a less structured, less willful structure.

Who knows maybe she will become enamored with our success and strive to prove anything a human can do an elf can do better. The thought of a teenage elf with a greatsword strapped to her back going on adventures tickles my fancy.

 

[Ericwinter]

Laurelin on the other hand is just the sort of elf we can really get to know as an equal,

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…You must have a really weird definition of "equal". In age, sure, but in experience, ability, and authority? I really doubt it. At most, I would expect it to be a lot more like dealing with Panoramia back when we first met her… except even worse, because now Mathilde's got twice as many great deeds and an even higher rank.

 

[Execute/Dumbo]

This is the official quest description, from the Collection of Important Information Post, under battle magics available for purchase with College Favor section. (It would probably be nice to move the BM descriptions for other colleges to the Spellbooks post sometime.)



There is actually nothing in there about being especially effective versus dhar/daemon, but on the other hand there's nothing about it being less effective against stuff that isn't that. It seems to be the the most baseline "Zap-zap" spell of Hysh. When you don't want any fancy effects, you just absolutely positively need to tear a few creatures apart with pure energy. I'm actually not putting it down by saying that; it's a handy trick for Johann to have in his pocket and would make me more comfortable sending him on combat missions.

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It's also apparently plenty sharp and strong enough to carve through steel by accident. Thin steel, maybe, but I wouldn't be surprised if he'd be able to just cut a sword in half with a firm grip.

 

[Codex]

A lovely start to the day to have a DL update. This one in particular I loved, mostly because of this girl:

With a sudden jerk the figure that had been starting to relax from having seen to the morning's duties jerks upright and gives you a rather alarmed look. "Friend Loremaster," says the girl, whose lanky figure would suggest someone in their teens on a human, but on an Elf could signify anywhere from around the same to a decade your senior. "How may House Miriel benefit you?"

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I can't help but find her funny and interesting. My mental image of her after she called Mathilde "Friend Loremaster" and the description of her lankiness was that she was basically Starfire from the Teen Titans cartoon (not the comics one). I really like her.

"You wield the Wind of Shadow, I am told," he says as he works. "Much like I hear my distant kin in Ulthuan do, though my ancestors left them when the land was still whole. There is, I feel, more honour in doing what is necessary but not praised, than what is celebrated in story and song." He taps the stave while glancing up at you wryly. "The great hunter gets a canto, the bowyer but a stanza, and the fletcher not a line. And now you want to form your own legend that our labour will make possible."

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I'm curious if he meant kin in the sense of fellow elves or kin as in from the same clan/family. If he means it in the clan sense, then Miriel might likely be from Nagarythe, the most famous of the Ulgu users in Ulthuan. The inner workings of Eataine's Mist Mages and Yvresse's Mist Walkers are more obscure funnily enough.

He looks up at you thoughtfully. "You twist words like my children. Perhaps that is what the other Houses see in your kind. But though I will accede to the collective will of the High Council, I will not bleed my own House dry to fund your ambitions. You will pay for our services, as all must."

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Not sure if this is a backhanded complement or a genuine one. As Boney said, reading Elves is hard. Even Dwarfs when they were trying to be subtle were easier to read.

You also gain an understanding of why House Miriel is opposed to cooperation with Middenheim, where genuine doubt about the unreliability of humans is bolstered by concern for their carefully-guarded pride. House Miriel is renowned for their craftsmanship among the Eonir, but will that still be the case if the economy of Tor Lithanel is joined, however tenuously, with that of Ulthuan? What will it do to their reputation if goods from the forges of Caledor, the workshops of Tiranoc, the jewellers of Eataine, begin to trickle in via Marienburg, or possibly by direct trade via the Schaukel? Not the noblest of motivations, but not an uncommon one, either. A similar dynamic plays out fairly often when human craft guilds find themselves competing with imported Dwarven goods. Big fish in small ponds have a habit of getting quite concerned about a sudden connection to the ocean.

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Surprisingly mundane reason. Out of all the reasons for isolation, this might be one of the better ones. Thank god they're not supremacists. Would certainly be hard to deal with them if they were.

Your plan is to make something so complicated that nobody who isn't deeeply immersed in the art of metalworking can hope to understanding it, so that you will need to take Max directly to the artisans in question - the Smith-Priests of Vaul - and thus gain better insight into them. While this proves to be impossible, Laurelin's explanations for why that is are as enlightening as you could have hoped for. Laurelorn's Smith-Priests labour in the tunnels and caverns below the Rainbow Falls, where the magic in the waters from the Tarn of Tears flows through after being shattered upon the rocks of the falls. To even enter them takes a great deal of training to allow an utterly neutral mindset, or else part of the flowing Winds will be drawn to that person's soul and cause turbulence that can quickly grow into a vortex of Dhar. Part of that preparation is the ritual blinding common to Priests of Vaul, and the time spent in such close proximity to the constant tumult of the falls as they wield the Winds to bend mundane materials to their will renders these craftsmen as deaf as they are blind, only able to communicate with other members of the Cult of Vaul through methods protected as holy secrets. This creates a virtually unassailable monopoly on craftsmanship, as these artisans communicate only with their correligionists, which is under the unofficial but almost total control of House Miriel.

An unexpected upshot of these discoveries is that Max is thrilled to learn that the magical artisanry that he has been pursuing is possible, and far from being discouraged that those that have mastered it are unwilling to share it, he is glad that they are extremely unlikely to share it with anyone among the Colleges, leaving the field clear for him to invent and claim the credit for Chamon-based smithing. That's an unusual point of view, but you suppose he's done more than enough to earn the right to a little eccentricity.

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I find it fascinating that Boney took that snippet about the ritualistic blinding process of Vaul's Priest-Smiths from canon lore and converted it into Eonir society in such a natural way that fit the circumstances perfectly. It makes it so that these smiths feel distinct from the ones in Ulthuan. The whole blind and deaf thing is pretty extreme honestly, I'm not sure how glamorous a life of constant smithing under a waterfall with only the exact same people as company day in and day out is all that pleasant.

I'm glad we took this action.

It still takes Johann quite some time to adapt, as even though the new arm is responding much the same as if it was his old one, it still differs in length, strength, range of motion, and dozens of other small ways that combine to turn the usually-nimble Johann rather clumsy. The claws prove much stronger than his gilded fist, and Max has to produce several more gauntlets of even stronger designs after Johann accidentally mangles the first few, the golden claws slicing themselves free of their steel sheaths. Tests of exactly how much strength the arm is capable of are discontinued after he badly strains his shoulder muscles, proving that whatever the ceiling of his new strength is, it's higher than that of his flesh-and-blood body - though it might not be if he gilds his entire torso, he muses aloud one day.

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I wanted to provide the arm to Johann as an alternative to Gilding, but of course Johann doesn't view it that way and simply takes it as encouragement to Gild himself further.

I'm actually surprised he didn't Gild his torso? I thought he did for sure. After all, I'm pretty sure he's been hit in the torso before only to reveal golden skin underneath, and Mathilde was confident the bugs of the Schadensumpf wouldn't bother him. Did he only gild a portion of it? I find it weird he'd gild his lungs before he gilded his whole torso.

I'm also fond of the arm. Quite the powerful weapon. I'm glad Johann is satisfied with it.

Councillor Galrith: Patriarch of the Major House Miriel in Laurelorn. Miriel dominate the worship of Vaul and have a focus on craftsmanship. Galrith and his house are isolationist due to worry over competition but willing to cooperate with the Council's decision.Galrith in particular displays a dry wit and a certain passive aggressiveness typical of one in his position.

Laurelin: Galrith's eldest child who is three years older than Mathilde. Lanky and in her teens for an elf. Curious and friendly in comparison to her father.

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I also added this to the Characters of Divided Loyalties post. Two new characters.

 

[DragonParadox]

…You must have a really weird definition of "equal". In age, sure, but in experience, ability, and authority? I really doubt it. At most, I would expect it to be a lot more like dealing with Panoramia back when we first met her… except even worse, because now Mathilde's got twice as many great deeds and an even higher rank.

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Well yes, but she is an elf of noble line and heir to a major house. It would be inconceivable for her to be seen as anything less than an equal so if we want to be friends those are the terms under which it will have to be done

 

[Ericwinter]

Well yes, but she is an elf of noble like and heir to a major house. It would be inconceivable for her to be seen as anything less than an equal so if we want to be friends those are the terms under which it will have to be done

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Did you miss the bit where she had to run and get her dad because Mathilde was too important a guest for her to deal with? On her own words, even. That's, uh, pretty conceivable.

 

[fictionfan]

The whole blind and deaf thing is pretty extreme honestly, I'm not sure how glamorous a life of constant smithing under a waterfall with only the exact same people as company day in and day out is all that pleasant.

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I expect that by this point they have the most refined mage sight in the world and considering that mage sight can manifest as just about any sensation including emotional and they have been refinishing their work area for thousands of years they might be living/working in the greatest testimonial to hedonism ever conceived*.

*By mortal hands anyway stupid chaos gods.

 

[DragonParadox]

Did you miss the bit where she had to run and get her dad because Mathilde was too important a guest for her to deal with? On her own words, even. That's, uh, pretty conceivable.

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That was in the context of Mathilde's request for buying a lot of stuff, I really doubt Laurelin sees Mathilde as her personal superior, I mean her initial reaction was pity at how fast humans age, not exactly overawed by our grand position in the Colleges of Magic... whatever those are

 

[fictionfan]

I'm actually surprised he didn't Gild his torso? I thought he did for sure. After all, I'm pretty sure he's been hit in the torso before only to reveal golden skin underneath, and Mathilde was confident the bugs of the Schadensumpf wouldn't bother him. Did he only gild a portion of it? I find it weird he'd gild his lungs before he gilded his whole torso.

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Torso is a big place and considering the risks and cost of gilding they likely do as small a part at a time as they can. Johann definitely would have done one eye at a time if it was an option. Maybe just his torso skin and lungs is gilded right now.

 

[Boney]

A lovely start to the day to have a DL update. This one in particular I loved, mostly because of this girl:

I can't help but find her funny and interesting. My mental image of her after she called Mathilde "Friend Loremaster" and the description of her lankiness was that she was basically Starfire from the Teen Titans cartoon (not the comics one). I really like her.

I'm curious if he meant kin in the sense of fellow elves or kin as in from the same clan/family. If he means it in the clan sense, then Miriel might likely be from Nagarythe, the most famous of the Ulgu users in Ulthuan. The inner workings of Eataine's Mist Mages and Yvresse's Mist Walkers are more obscure funnily enough.

Not sure if this is a backhanded complement or a genuine one. As Boney said, reading Elves is hard. Even Dwarfs when they were trying to be subtle were easier to read.

Surprisingly mundane reason. Out of all the reasons for isolation, this might be one of the better ones. Thank god they're not supremacists. Would certainly be hard to deal with them if they were.

I find it fascinating that Boney took that snippet about the ritualistic blinding process of Vaul's Priest-Smiths from canon lore and converted it into Eonir society in such a natural way that fit the circumstances perfectly. It makes it so that these smiths feel distinct from the ones in Ulthuan. The whole blind and deaf thing is pretty extreme honestly, I'm not sure how glamorous a life of constant smithing under a waterfall with only the exact same people as company day in and day out is all that pleasant.

I'm glad we took this action.

I wanted to provide the arm to Johann as an alternative to Gilding, but of course Johann doesn't view it that way and simply takes it as encouragement to Gild himself further.

I'm actually surprised he didn't Gild his torso? I thought he did for sure. After all, I'm pretty sure he's been hit in the torso before only to reveal golden skin underneath, and Mathilde was confident the bugs of the Schadensumpf wouldn't bother him. Did he only gild a portion of it? I find it weird he'd gild his lungs before he gilded his whole torso.

I'm also fond of the arm. Quite the powerful weapon. I'm glad Johann is satisfied with it.

I also added this to the Characters of Divided Loyalties post. Two new characters.

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I think you might be right about the gilded torso. I'll double check and fix that part when I'm back at my computer tomorrow. Also I need to sit down and hammer out what distinct parts need separate gilding.

 

[Ericwinter]

That was in the context of Mathilde's request for buying a lot of stuff, I really doubt Laurelin sees Mathilde as her personal superior, I mean her initial reaction was pity at how fast humans age, not exactly overawed by our grand position in the Colleges of Magic... whatever those are

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An important person buying lots of stuff. Like, I'm not saying she's overawed, but everyone knows who Mathilde is, what she is in Laurelorn for, and the circles she moves in which—as you noted earlier—include the oldest and most powerful parts of their society. You can still feel pity for someone who's of a higher status than you.

I think you might be right about the gilded torso. I'll double check and fix that part when I'm back at my computer tomorrow. Also I need to sit down and hammer out what distinct parts need separate gilding.

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Didn't his lack of a need to breath play a part a few times in Eight Peaks? Could have sworn that was part of the torso, and mentioned a few times.

 

[The Phoenixian]

Your plan is to make something so complicated that nobody who isn't deeeply immersed in the art of metalworking can hope to understanding it, so that you will need to take Max directly to the artisans in question - the Smith-Priests of Vaul - and thus gain better insight into them. While this proves to be impossible, Laurelin's explanations for why that is are as enlightening as you could have hoped for. Laurelorn's Smith-Priests labour in the tunnels and caverns below the Rainbow Falls, where the magic in the waters from the Tarn of Tears flows through after being shattered upon the rocks of the falls. To even enter them takes a great deal of training to allow an utterly neutral mindset, or else part of the flowing Winds will be drawn to that person's soul and cause turbulence that can quickly grow into a vortex of Dhar. Part of that preparation is the ritual blinding common to Priests of Vaul, and the time spent in such close proximity to the constant tumult of the falls as they wield the Winds to bend mundane materials to their will renders these craftsmen as deaf as they are blind, only able to communicate with other members of the Cult of Vaul through methods protected as holy secrets. This creates a virtually unassailable monopoly on craftsmanship, as these artisans communicate only with their correligionists, which is under the unofficial but almost total control of House Miriel.

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Ah, the Rainbow Falls, a place where magic pours into the world, outside the polar gates.

Is it just me, or do the safety instructions here sound suspiciously like the care and handling instructions for Aetheric Vitae, as might be adapted for the notably elves' notably greater depth of feeling that I recall from some sources. Seeing as we never did have the opportunity to test how the care and handling of it would differ for them.

 

[Shane_357]

Ah, the Rainbow Falls, a place where magic pours into the world, outside the polar gates.

Is it just me, or do the safety instructions here sound suspiciously like the care and handling instructions for Aetheric Vitae, as might be adapted for the notably elves' notably greater depth of feeling that I recall from some sources. Seeing as we never did have the opportunity to test how the care and handling of it would differ for them.

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So what we need to do is show the Mireil guy our snake-juice.

 

[Ericwinter]

Ah, the Rainbow Falls, a place where magic pours into the world, outside the polar gates.

Is it just me, or do the safety instructions here sound suspiciously like the care and handling instructions for Aetheric Vitae, as might be adapted for the notably elves' notably greater depth of feeling that I recall from some sources. Seeing as we never did have the opportunity to test how the care and handling of it would differ for them.

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…Huh, wonder if Max could make use of some of the Dwarven tricks to progress his studies. Don't they have ways to repel specific Winds?

 

[Burned_Cookie]

I love it when things go according to plan.

Imagine all the cringe things you did as a teen, but stretch out that period by a extra forty years.

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So what? Imagine how competent the resulting adult would be, instead of doing some soulsearching and then getting tossed at life ready or not, such a long time practically ensures that you know who you are and what you want by the time you become and adult.

A bit more memories of embarrassing decisions seems like quite the small price to pay for that.

Johann is now a blind golden monk with a railgun staff and a robot dinosaur laser arm.

I don't really have a point, I just wanted to type that sentence.

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Wait Johann has a RAILGUN?!

 

[The Lone badger]

There are only THREE People in Warhammer Fantasy that I think could maybe beat Kroq'gar in a straight fight.

Gotrek (Because its fucking GOTREK)

Settra (The man of 100 titles, whos Chariot and glaive are two of the most broken pieces of equipment Fantasy has every seen)

Tyrion (This is a highly flawed choice imo, but the Blood of Aenarion is plot armor. It'd probably just let him survive rather than win, but still)

If you aren't one of those three I don't think you have a chance of fighting Kroq'gar in a fight. Kroq'gar's Gauntlet is more than safe from a couple marauder's... Then again... Looks at Gotrek...

Spoiler: Minor Note: Non-straight fight

A non-straight Fight, Melekeith, any Slann, Couple others could probably beat him.

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Grimgor Ironhide says WAAAAGH.

 

[DragonParadox]

An important person buying lots of stuff. Like, I'm not saying she's overawed, but everyone knows who Mathilde is, what she is in Laurelorn for, and the circles she moves in which—as you noted earlier—include the oldest and most powerful parts of their society. You can still feel pity for someone who's of a higher status than you.

Didn't his lack of a need to breath play a part a few times in Eight Peaks? Could have sworn that was part of the torso, and mentioned a few times.

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What she is in Laurelorn for is the reason why there is a human in the city at all, that does not make Mathilde automatically higher status that Laurelin. As the heir to a major House she is basically the elf equivalent of Anton. Would you say Anton is our equal? No not really, but as the son of a major noble and vassal to an Elector Count he is one rung below us at most. Now consider the elf part of 'elf Anton' for whom most of our accomplishments are vague rumors of half understood things 'what's a Skaven?' 'how do those colleges work?' etc... and that is where I get equals.