To Boldly Go... (a Starfleet quest)
- Thread starter OneirosTheWriter
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Well this is a lot of information!
So by pushing the Bajorans in an attempt to protect them from Cardassian occupation, we ended Cardassian political infighting and made sure they got occupied more quickly.
Nice job, us!
So two Jalduns a year, plus probably 1 or 2 escorts a year.
So they have:
Starfleet has:
Sucks breath in. Wow, that is a thing. If we can reach the 200 threshold, maybe we can reach the point where the Federation can stand down and the Orion Union can take on the long term job of grinding them down the rest of the way. Still, we're looking at a couple of years of Master of Orion turns to get there.
At a certain point quantity has a quality all its own. That's likely well over 200 Combat right there.
Ho-ho-ho. Quite the scam they've got going on there.
That damn Syndicate. They do love their conditioning.
So by pushing the Bajorans in an attempt to protect them from Cardassian occupation, we ended Cardassian political infighting and made sure they got occupied more quickly.
Nice job, us!
So two Jalduns a year, plus probably 1 or 2 escorts a year.
So they have:
- 5 - 3mt
- 5 - 1mt
- 9 - 500kt
Starfleet has:
- 6 - 3mt
- 2 - 2.5mt
- 9 - 1mt
Sucks breath in. Wow, that is a thing. If we can reach the 200 threshold, maybe we can reach the point where the Federation can stand down and the Orion Union can take on the long term job of grinding them down the rest of the way. Still, we're looking at a couple of years of Master of Orion turns to get there.
At a certain point quantity has a quality all its own. That's likely well over 200 Combat right there.
Ho-ho-ho. Quite the scam they've got going on there.
That damn Syndicate. They do love their conditioning.
KnightDisciple
Love God. Do Right. Fear No Man.
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It feels a bit "damned if you do, damned if you don't", as it seems highly likely the Cardassians would have forcibly occupied the Bajorans sometime soonish anyway.
Maybe it wasn't the best choice, but the way I was reading things (as someone who thread-binged, admittedly), the goal seemed to be carefully reaching out to them without being big and loud about it?
Definitely nothing to sneeze at.
Still. As someone pointed out, Starfleet probably needs to build some more yards that are in the "higher than 1million lower than 3" range, especially if we're going to end up having 1.5mt-ish designs running around. I don't think, at least going by the ship weights I've seen for our current crop, it's feasible to build sub-1mt berths, though the Starship Design number-crunchers are free to harrange me for being wrong here.
Going by canon, I'd bet the Klingons often do better at formation fighting, too. Those Birds of Prey are almost tailor-made for group strafing runs and the like. Yet they're strong enough to split off to do their own things, too. (They also look pretty cool, not gonna lie.)
I'm not sure there was a winning or losing option here. Cardassians were already drawing the Bajorans in when we found them. We could have done nothing and the Occupation probably would have happened anyways. We may have kicked it off early -- it's currently unclear if this is Full Occupation yet or just a prelude to full Cardassian control.
Like I'm not sure what the other option was here.
*Shrugs* We made the call we did. Time will tell if it was the better or worse option- though in my personal opinion the early indications are that it was a mistake. My earlier equivocation about 'if you're happy fine, if not do things differently next time' wasn't entirely tongue in cheek.
Making excuses with 'Well, but it's the CARDASSIANS fault it turned out badly' is absurd sophistry however. It's like a weatherman blaming the clouds when he fails to predict rain accurately.
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AKuz
Been Better
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I didn't want to push because I was afraid of waking the Cardassians up and cutting short the time we had to settle in and build ships without seriously worrying about a war. And now that the period of internal strife is over we're back to worrying about war again. Perhaps if Rwe were stronger militarily when they eventually moved in we could have somehow made the Cardassians back off.
Random Member
Gardener of Human Happiness
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Okay, so:
K'tinga: 90-120 Combat
Birds of Prey: 50-80 Combat
Advanced Birds: ???
Total: 140-200 combat + ??? (Has to be atleast 12, since the Advanced Birds of Prey will have atleast 1 Combat, so a minimum of 152).
With our current Combat being 144, the Klingon fleet at its lowest level is already stronger than Starfleet.
AKuz
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That seems canonically accurate. Though you also have to take into account the member fleets and that the Klingons are building up to fite the Romulans
And some of those member fleets are quite hefty, notably Amarkia, Ferasa, and Rigellians. (The original four have some ships, but have understandably shifted to letting Starfleet take most of the Defense burden.)
2311.Q4 - Fleet Distribution Plan Vote
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- Australia
From: Vice Admiral Heidi Eriksson, Director, Starfleet Operations Command
To: Admiral Kahurangi, Commander, Starfleet
Subject: Fleet Distribution
Hello Admiral,
We have worked up our new distribution between the active sectors now that Rigel Sector Command is coming on line. We should be able to arrange for ships to be in their new positions in preparation for the upcoming quarter. Please sign off on the attached scheme and we will get it implemented right away.
Sincerely,
Vice Admiral Eriksson
Attached:
[ ] Write in a Deployment Plan
(Remember that Rigel Sector is now online, with a Starbase and requiring D9 protection, remember that increased contributions to Ferasa and Amarki sectors will allow for extra events providing Impact against the Syndicate)
Edit: This came very very close to completely slipping my mind
To: Admiral Kahurangi, Commander, Starfleet
Subject: Fleet Distribution
Hello Admiral,
We have worked up our new distribution between the active sectors now that Rigel Sector Command is coming on line. We should be able to arrange for ships to be in their new positions in preparation for the upcoming quarter. Please sign off on the attached scheme and we will get it implemented right away.
Sincerely,
Vice Admiral Eriksson
Attached:
[ ] Write in a Deployment Plan
(Remember that Rigel Sector is now online, with a Starbase and requiring D9 protection, remember that increased contributions to Ferasa and Amarki sectors will allow for extra events providing Impact against the Syndicate)
Edit: This came very very close to completely slipping my mind
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pheonix89
Wants to be Seven Of Nine
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Minimum D from ships needed per Sector, Starbases and Extra Outposts already included:
Sol: 13
Vulcan: 7
Andoria: 4
Tellar: 0
Amarkia: 0
Ferasia: 7
Rigel: 4
RBZ: 7
KBZ: 6
CBZ: 5
SBZ: Unknown, 5 D from starbase.
@OnierosTheWriter
What's the requirement for the Sydraxian Border Zone? That's supposed to come online this quarter, taking the Vega Starbase with it. Also, the CBZ starbase is completing this turn and the ongoing/completed projects section of the front page doesn't include the mining colonies from this Snakepit.
Sol: 13
Vulcan: 7
Andoria: 4
Tellar: 0
Amarkia: 0
Ferasia: 7
Rigel: 4
RBZ: 7
KBZ: 6
CBZ: 5
SBZ: Unknown, 5 D from starbase.
@OnierosTheWriter
What's the requirement for the Sydraxian Border Zone? That's supposed to come online this quarter, taking the Vega Starbase with it. Also, the CBZ starbase is completing this turn and the ongoing/completed projects section of the front page doesn't include the mining colonies from this Snakepit.
The problem isn't that they occupied Bajor a bit earlyearly. 10 extra years of occupation doesn't make much of a difference besides giving the Cardassians some extra BR and SR to play with, but tying down extra military forces.
The problem was that we not only wasted a diplomatic push that could have been used on some other species or on another small shipyard berth, but also possibly provided the external threat that ended Cardassian Union infighting.
So diplo-pushing Bajor was not only a waste, but may have been actively counterproductive.
I don't think being stronger militarily would have particularly dissuaded the Cardassians, even if we were completely overwhelming. Unless we could credibly establish that we would absolutely come to blows over Bajor, they knew that for all our fleet power, there was pretty much zero chance we'd actually use it to intervene. Maybe they would have backed off had we integrated the Seyek and Apatia as full members, but I suspect they would have done this anyways.
The major problem is we don't really have an easy path for the Bajor situation. We can't really intervene because it is not an affiliate, but we can't make it an affiliate unless we try to wrestle it diplomatically from the Cardassian grasp. In that case the Cardassians hold all the cards because they can intervene in the government and due to the Prime Directive and public opinion, we can't.
Had the Cardassians toppled the democratically-elected government of say, the Seyek, I imagine the Council and the average Fed citizen would be chomping for Starfleet to do something. But as the last captain's log says, it's really a non-starter politically to stick our necks out to fight the Cardassians over their backing of one group of religious authoritarian assholes over the 'rightful' group of religious authoritarian assholes.
Bajor was like, the perfect planet for the Cardassians to bully. We could have held off on further diplomatic pushes, and they'd be free to waltz in anyways. The only viable way to protect Bajor was to make it an affiliate, and I'm not sure that was really a possibility. I suppose we could try to go hardline now, but I suspect fighting the Syndicate and manning a new sector or two will require too many resources to allow us to commit to a standoff.
As for the internal infighting -- Bajor's provided a nice salve for now, who knows how long that will last. It depends if the Cardassians settled all the bad blood, or if those divisions are going to reemerge as the pressures of fighting the Resistance start to ramp up. Or we fumbled having a few more years of Cardassian inaction but that's kinda minor in the grand scheme of things tbh. It's not like there was a democracy movement that got crushed.
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It's not like the Cardassians would have not noticed us cozying up to Bajor. Furthermore, even if we'd pushed Bajor to 300+ relations or whatever, the Cardassians are so close to Bajor that they could have moved into Bajoran space with an overwhelmingly powerful fleet any time they wanted. And we couldn't stop them. Then the Cardassians could either force us to attack them while their affiliates snipe at our flanks and our own pacifists question the wisdom of going to war to protect such a remote and oligarchical society... Or take over Bajor and brag about how they made us back down.
Basically, unless we were totally prepared to fight the Cardassians over Bajor, trying to push them was somewhat risky. And given how tightly our defense requirements are stretched, I don't think we're ready. Maybe if we'd let the situation develop for five more years we would be. Then again, maybe not.
You're pretty much right. The next design we're likely to do is the Ambassadors, which go in our three million ton explorer berths, and after that a new escort... but looking fifteen or twenty years down the road, when we're likely to start thinking about a new cruiser class to replace the Renaissance and Constitution-B, we'll want the option of making it heavier than a million tons.
Here, the Klingon Birds-of-Prey are the tiny ships like the one Kirk and friends hijacked at the end of Star Trek III. So small that about half a dozen people can operate one, and very lightly armed. Their stat line consists of "all ones." Whereas a balanced modern escort tends to have a stat line more like "all threes," and a good cruiser would have stats more like "all fours" or "mix of threes and fives."
I will note that we have vastly superior science and presence capability, and that our good ships (explorers and the new cruisers) have superior Defense. We have the potential for higher warp-speed maneuverability in wartime, and in peacetime our ships' noncombat stats are letting us rack up huge economic and diplomatic benefits that enable us to build ships at a remarkable rate and recruit new members who will replenish our ranks even if the Klingons were to defeat us in battle.
So it's not a one-sided thing, though we should definitely bear in mind that the Klingon fleet is NOT to be taken lightly. Even right now, when they've had to spend the past fifteen years dealing with a massive ecological crisis on their homeworld.
No wonder they were winning in the alternate timeline resulting from 'no Narendra III.'
That probably wouldn't have helped much here. The Syndicate had an agent onboard in a position to tell them the ship's shield frequency. If we kept changing it, the Syndicate would simply have adjusted accordingly. It reminds me of Generations, when the Duras sisters hacked Geordi's visor so they could see whatever he was doing, including his efforts to stop them from shooting right through the Enterprise's shields...
In canon, the Cardies waited about 5-7 more years before occupying Bajor... we think. It's a bit vague. It seems likely, especially with the intel confirmation, that the Cardassians decided to move in with force to forestall us from turning Bajor into a Federation affiliate through our diplomatic charms. Therefore, by pushing Bajor diplomatically, we wound up accelerating the timeline of the Occupation by 5-7 years.
This outcome was foreseen, and warned about, by quite a few people, myself included.
To be fair to us, if we'd done nothing, Bajor would end up occupied anyway. The Cardassians hurried up because they were worried about us stopping them- but our positive relations with Bajor at least give us some contact with their people, and we may be able to avoid the bizarre, total hands-off policy adopted by the Federation up through the 2360s of tolerating the Occupation even when actively at war with Cardassia.
Although I do think that this vindicates the many people (myself included) who expressed misgivings about pushing Bajor. We were hoping NOT to have this happen while we were still dealing with the Syndicate and the Sydraxians. If the Cardassians had waited another five years or so (as in canon), we'd be in a much better position to act quickly and decisively to stop them, if we had the will to do so.
Right now, that's true. But Nash is forty-one. She has, in all probability, another three decades' worth of active service left in her, maybe four.
The Nash ka'Sharren of 2275 could never have filled the shoes of the Nash ka'Sharren of 2305- because in 2275, Nash was a six year old child, whereas in 2305 she was a starship captain.
Who's to say that Nash won't grow in the next two or three decades, into someone we want as a senior admiral?
...Wowsers.
That is a LOT of warships. The good news is, there are 70 or so Birds-of-Prey with a statline of "all ones;" it would take about three of them to reliably beat one of our escorts- two would have to get lucky. The 35 or so K'tingas are more of a problem, since each of them is a match one-on-one for any of our older starships, though it would probably take two working in unison to handle one of our new cruisers reliably. Come to think of it, two of them could probably take one of our Excelsiors.
The advanced Bird-of-Prey is interesting; the real question is, does it have a statline more like a typical escort? Or just a slightly enhanced version of the existing Bird-of-Prey, with a statline more like a Soyuz?
I would casually estimate, with some rounding, that the total combat of the Klingon fleet as 70(1)+35(3)+12(2) = 190 or so. Impressive but not quite as terrifying as their raw fleet numbers would indicate. Although it must be remembered that K'tingas are so tough that their combat performance is a bit disproportionate to their combat score.
Also, we should probably expect the Klingons to use Swarm doctrine. They'd be idiots not to, with a fleet mix like that.
I would definitely like to know more about the Klingon shipyard infrastructure; they presumably have a whole lot of megaton or sub-megaton berths.
And, hm. They have a hundred ships, and about six of them are on our border. While clearly a lot of their fleet must be facing the Romulans. But it seems unlikely that they're so not-worried about us that they'd split their forces so that only 6% of the fleet faces us while 90% or more handles internal matters and the Romulans. Even we have a bit larger fraction of our overall strength facing them, although admittedly not by that great of a margin.
Speculatively, the Klingons may very well have armed borders facing off against another, unknown alien empire.
Well, that both is and is not a relief. It would hardly surprise me if the Syndicate were once in a while able to punch through a shield to cause light hull damage. The good news is they don't have a reliable shield-piercing weapon; the bad news is that they have some method of conditioning people that reliably, well enough that it continues to work on people well after they leave the Syndicate's direct control, so that you can get them to transmit data off an Explorer Corps ship that's presumably been isolated in space for days or weeks.
Finagle007
[Verified Great Old One]
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Should we try to modify our ships to have two layers of shields, which can be tuned to different frequencies when needed?
- Location
- Mid-Atlantic
This sounds like it would force our ships to spend more tonnage on shield generators to achieve the same amount of protection. Two little generators are probably not as efficient as one big one. So we'd end up with a less capable ship.
IF we were actually worried about an enemy who has a reliable ability to know our shield frequencies and shoot through our shields, that might be a reasonable precaution. But the Syndicate only pulled this off because they did something that wouldn't work just any time they wanted to try. And even then, they didn't do serious damage to S'harien. We shouldn't let this one incident scare us into reducing our ships' overall combat abilities, or sacrificing Science/Presence/Defense capacity in order to mount redundant shield generators.
If we were going to be voting on that here, he'd have asked us to vote on it, so no.
Plus, realistically a plan like that will require Council approval. This is just one of our subordinates asking us which ships we want to send to Rigel.
The problem is not the extra resources for Cardassia. Though they are resource-limited, and more resources for the Cardies almost certainly translates into more ships to shoot at us in the near future.
The problem is certainly not the 10pp we spent.
No, the problem is that some ten-digit number of Bajorans are now going to have Cardassian goon squads stomping on their faces about five to ten years ahead of schedule.
See, that's the thing- five years from now the Syndicate will hopefully be trimmed down pretty far. And we'd have proportionately more ships (and not so many brand-new sectors to garrison). We're turning out like 1.5 Excelsiors a year, plus about nine to sixteen cruisers plus some light escorts coming out in the next 5-6 years.
By that time, we MIGHT be able to deter the Cardassians entirely, or at least have a big enough fleet in the CBZ that if we really really wanted to, we could send them into Bajoran space to stop the Cardassians. We'd at least have the option of doing something about it.
As it stands, we don't really have a choice. We have to accept it, because we simply do not have the means to do anything about the situation.
ClawClawBite
Mad Engineering!
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Between conditioning and Lacarre, it might be a good idea to see if we can integrate our new generation tricorder technology when it is ready into Starfleet transporters, to automatically scan for signs of tampering and substitution.
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A very confused Pavel Chekov endorses this plan!
Nah, I'm much more broken up about the first two.
I'm not seeing much difference between Cardassian Goon squads and Bajoran Theocratic Goon Squads stomping on Bajoran faces. Especially when the difference only applies to 5-10 years.
The Federation has explicit policies to not interfere with other peoples' internal affairs, even when they are suffering under horrible, repressive governments. We aren't going to try and pull an Iraq 2003. The moral logic isn't much different here.
[X] Late 2311/ Early 2312 Deployment
Sol Sector – Requires D18
Vulcan Sector – Requires D12
Amarkia Sector – Requires D15
Ferasa Sector – Requires D15
Romulan Border Zone – Requires D12
Anti-Syndicate Task Force – No fixed Requirement
Sol Sector – Requires D18
- Current Q3 2311 - 1 Excelsior [Endurance] (6), 2 Miranda [Bon Vivant, Fidelity] (4), 1 Constellation [Selaya] (3), Starbase 1 (5) = 18D
- New Q4 2311 - 1 Centaur-A (3) [Bull], 3 Miranda [Dryad, Bon Vivant, Fidelity] (6), 1 Constellation [Selaya] (3), 1 Oberth [Suvek] (1), Starbase 1 (5) = 18D
- New Q2 2312 – 1 Constitution-B (5) [Hood - New], 2 Miranda [Dryad, Bon Vivant] (4), 1 Constellation [Selaya] (3), 1 Oberth [Suvek] (1), Starbase 1 (5) = 18D
- Notes: Sending the Endurance to man the new SBZ; reinforcing with Centaur from Amarkia and Oberth from Andor and Dryad from the Syndicate Taskforce. Then in 2312 reinforcing with Connie-B and sending Bull to Tellar Sector and the Fidelity to refit (if we choose to do that).
Vulcan Sector – Requires D12
- Current Q3 2311 - 1 Constellation [Sappho] (3), 2 Mirandas (4) [T'Kumbra, Thunderhead], Starbase I (5) = 12D
- New Q4 2311 – No change
- New Q2 2312 – No change.
- Notes: No reason to change.
- Current Q3 2311 - 1 Constellation (3) [Docana], 1 Centaur-A (3) [Lightning], 1 Miranda (2) [Eketha], 1 Oberth [Suvek] (1), Starbase I (5) = 14D
- New Q4 2311 - 1 Constellation (3) [Docana], 1 Centaur-A (3) [Lightning], Starbase I (5) = 11D
- New Q2 2312 – No change.
- Notes: Fleet dropped to two ships to reinforce SBZ and Sol.
- Current Q3 2311 - 1 Constellation (3) [Stalwart], 1 Centaur-A (3) [Gale], 2 Miranda (4) [Calypso, Shield], Starbase I (5), Extra Outposts (5) = 20D
- New Q4 2311 - 1 Constellation (3) [Stalwart], 1 Miranda (2) [Shield], Starbase I (5), Extra Outposts (5) = 15D
- New Q2 2312 – 1 Constellation (3) [Stalwart], 1 Centaur-A (3) [Bull], Starbase I (5), Extra Outposts (5) = 16D
- Notes: With Starbase and extra outposts only two ships required now that Klivvar Proxima covered by the SBZ. Send away Gale and Calypso. In 2312 bring Bull in from Sol and send Shield to refit (if we choose to do so)
Amarkia Sector – Requires D15
- Current Q3 2311 - 1 Excelsior (6) [Salnas], 2 Centaur-A (6) [Bull, Blizzard], Starbase I (5), Extra Outposts (5) = 22D
- New Q4 2311 - 1 Excelsior (6) [Salnas], 1 Centaur-A (3) [Blizzard], Starbase I (5), Extra Outposts (5) = 19D
- New Q2 2312 – No change.
- Notes: Extra outposts mean that two Centaur-As are not required for "flooding the sector" defense requirement. Send Bull to reinforce Sol sector.
Ferasa Sector – Requires D15
- Current Q3 2311 - 1 Excelsior (6) [Avandar], 1 Constitution-A (5) [Cheron], Starbase I (5)
- New Q4 2311 – No change.
- New Q2 2312 – No change.
- Notes: High requirement for anti-syndicate 'flooding the sector'.
- Current Q3 2311 – Starbase I (5)
- New Q4 2311 - 1 Centaur-A [Gale] (3), 1 Miranda [Svai] (2), Starbase I (5) = 10D
- New Q2 2312 – 1 Constitution-B (5) [Republic - New], 1 Centaur-A (3) [Gale], Starbase I (5) = 13D
- Notes: Initially reinforce with Miranda and Centaur-A from Tellar sector and RBZ, then in 2312 add Constitution-B and send Svai back to RBZ.
Romulan Border Zone – Requires D12
- Current Q3 2311 - 1 Excelsior (6) [Excelsior], 1 Miranda (2) [Svai], Oberth [Hawking] (1), Starbase I (5) = 14D
- New Q4 2311 - 1 Excelsior (6) [Excelsior], Oberth [Hawking] (1), Starbase I (5) = 12D
- New Q2 2312 - 1 Excelsior (6) [Excelsior], 1 Miranda (2) [Svai], Oberth [Hawking] (1), Starbase I (5) = 14D
- Notes: Send Svai off to Rigel until Connie-Bs are out and then bring it back.
- Current Q3 2311 - 1 Excelsior (6) [Thirishar], 1 Miranda (2) [Intrepid], 1 Oberth (1) [Inspire]
- New Q4 2311 – No change.
- New Q2 2312 – No change.
- Notes: Leave manned as is.
- Current Q3 2311 - 1 Excelsior (6) [Kumari), 2 Constellations (6) [Challorn, Vigour], 1 Centaur-A (3) [Winterwind] = 15D
- New Q4 2311 – No change except Starbase I now added at Lapycorias. = 20D
- New Q2 2312 – No change.
- Notes: No change.
- Current Q3 2311 – Starbase I (5) [Vega]
- New Q4 2311 - 1 Excelsior [Endurance] (6), 2 Miranda (4) [Eketha, Calypso], Starbase I (5) [Vega] = 15D
- New Q2 2312 – 1 Excelsior [Endurance] (6), 1 Centaur-A (3) [Zephyr], 2 Miranda (4) [Eketha, Calypso], Starbase I (5) [Vega] = 18D
- Notes: Pulling Excelsior from Sol Sector and Calypso from Tellar Sector and Eketha from Andor Sector. Add the Zephyr when it's freed up in 2312Q2 from the anti-Syndicate Task Force.
Anti-Syndicate Task Force – No fixed Requirement
- Current Q3 2311 - 2 Centaur-A [Yukikaze, Zephyr], 1 Constellation [Kearsage], 1 Miranda [Dryad]
- New Q4 2311 – 2 Centaur-A [Yukikaze, Zephyr], 1 Constellation [Kearsage]
- New Q2 2312 – 1 Constitution-B [Lexington - new], 1 Centaur-A [Yukikaze], 1 Constellation [Kearsage], 1 Oberth (1) [New Ship]
- Notes: With loss of the Lion, send Dryad to reinforce Sol sector when it loses its Excelsior. In 2312 add one of the new Connie-Bs and the Oberth to the task force; send the Zephyr to the SBZ.
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KnightDisciple
Love God. Do Right. Fear No Man.
- Location
- Midwest, USA
All fair points. I'm hoping we can end up doing something to avoid the canon scenario, which was "about one-quarter of a step below the Holocaust, and only just barely".
Okay, so just so I'm a bit clearer, generally speaking our goal has been, is, and will be a 3-tier ship design setup (Explorer, Cruiser, Escort)? Obviously specific classes get created, refitted, and eventually phased out in stages, but broadly speaking 3 types of ships?
The Renaissance is, from what I can see and tell, our Ambassador-era Cruiser (I'm using the Explorer class as a "benchmark" for Eras, so there was the Constitution Era, we're in the Excelsior Era, will go into Ambassador Era, and eventually the Galaxy Era)? It won't be launched the same year or anything, and probably phased out sooner, but still.
Is our Escort class going to be a completely custom design (aka no real canon equivalent)?
Will there be a replacement for the Oberth at some point, a dedicated SCIENCE! vessel? Or will the Nebula (somwhere between Explorer and Cruiser in size) fill that role when fitted with the Sensors/Labs/Computers module (while also ending up, essentially, our Cruiser)?
Can you refresh me (as someone who archive-binged the threadmarked updates and skipped a lot of the discussion in between) what all the various ship stats are? (The Design spreadsheets make my eyes spin.)
They're definitely an industrial powerhouse. And they're definitely not stupid in a fight.
And for all that some like to paint them as stupid, they really aren't.
Yeah, lots of smaller berths sounds quite plausible. They're probably really good at spitting out their Birds of Prey, too. Honestly they probably tinker with designs less than Starfleet/The Federation does, as my own speculation.
As to the "armed borders against another empire", who knows? Probably not the Breen. Hm. Maybe some fragment of the Dominion? I'm a bit fuzzy on which Quadrant bumps up against which....
It's also worth noting that we forced the Cardassians to move up their plans prematurely. They had to make their move early, and it's an ugly smash and grab. They could have instead focused on a more restrained move like exiling our friends on Bajor, or offing them quietly and giving them some cement shoe fittings. They instead chose a transparent and frankly embarrassing coup. It's not a victory for us by any means, but we've forced the central command's hand and made them expend PP on a world that frankly, they already had pretty well under their thumb. They're jumpy and anxious and things aren't going well for them-either some hardliners have come to power who will push for war NOW before the Federation's industrial power can be brought to bear against them, or they're gonna pull back and try to avoid poking the bear.
- Location
- Central Standard Time
I have a valid Lion design (C4 S2 H2 L4 P1 D2, 80br/65sr/759kt/2yr, O2 E2 T2)
Basically, a Miranda+.