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To Boldly Go... (a Starfleet quest)

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To Boldly Go... (a Starfleet quest) Starfleet Ship Design Bureau, Refit ("To Boldly Go...")
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So I'm been trying to see what we could do Task Force wise in 2323 without paying for 24 points of Member ships. Here's what I've got.

EOY pp stash = 275pp

Costs:

Retain 16 points of Member Ships - 40pp

Maintain following TF attachments:
Starfleet Tactical Brass: 0pp per year. Enables coordination events with other powers – 0pp [BEYOND]
Molchenek-Danashad Consulting: 3 pp per year. Effect: +1 to the first diplomatic roll involving a capitalist society each quarter – 3pp [BEYOND]
Lt. Sadd-Har's Cadet Field Training Team: 3 pp per year. Effect: Increased experience gain for missions involving S rolls. - 3pp [BOLDLY]
Ambassador Sarek: 5 pp per year. Effect: Reroll the first failed diplomatic roll each quarter; add +1 to the reroll. - 5pp [was SHIELD; move to wherever]
FDS Diplomatic Team. Cost: 5pp per year. Effect: Reroll first failed Diplomatic Roll each quarter – 5pp [FORWARD]
Starfleet Intelligence Analysis Team: 5pp per year. Effect: 25% chance of a free Intelligence Report related to the Task Force's Mission each year. - 5pp [FORWARD]
Langa Mbeki: 5 pp per year. Effect: +2 to the lowest diplomatic roll each quarter - 5pp [FORWARD]

To maintain current = 26pp

(I am not going to bother listing costs for RP/BR attachments, as that's basically irrelevant cost-wise.)

New Purchases:
-Ashtarr: 10 pp on purchase, 8 pp per year. Effect: +2 to the first diplomatic roll involving the Gorn each quarter. = 10pp
-Ventil Oyana: 5 pp on purchase, 5 pp per year. Effect: +5 points on one targeted tag each quarter = 5pp

New purchases = 15pp

Total pp cost of Task Force Deployment = 81pp

16 points of member ships drafted:

- Explorers: 1 Caitian Excelsior-A
- Cruisers: 2 Apiata Little Queenship, 1 Rigellian Turtleship, 2 Orion Nelhiar Savings & Loan Enforcer Cruisers, 1 Gaeni Tech-Cruiser-A
- Frigates: 4 Apiata Stingers, 1 United Earth Centaur-B, 5 Betazoid Centaur-B, 2 Tellarite Centaur-B, 1 Amarkian Anacail, 2 Amarkian Centaur-B, 1 Andorian Centaur-B


Task Force: Beyond
-Mission: Mission: Remove Horizon Influence from Licori, Felis, and from OSA.
-Commander: Samhaya Mrr'shan - +1P to Flagship, reroll first failed combat roll each year
-Attachments:
Free FDS Diplomatic Team attachment
Starfleet Tactical Brass: 0pp per year. Enables coordination events with other powers
Molchenek-Danashad: 3 pp per year. Effect: +1 to the first diplomatic roll involving a capitalist society each quarter
Sam Jones: 10 br on purchase, 10 br per year. Effect: Gain both sr & relations on trade summit missions for this task force.
NEW: Ventil Oyana: 5 pp on purchase, 5 pp per year. Effect: +5 points on one targeted tag each quarter

Ships 2323.Q1:
  • Explorers: 2 Starfleet Excelsior-A [Salnas (B)], Endurance (B)], 1 Caitian Excelsior-A [Hrvass], 1 Starfleet Constitution-A [Cheron (V)]
  • Cruisers: 2 Apiata Little Queenship, 2 Orion Nelhiar Savings & Loan Enforcer Cruisers [OUS Nelhiar's Pride, Nelhiar's Honor]
  • Frigates: 2 Starfleet Centaur-B [Chinook, Zephyr (B)], 2 Betazoid Centaur-Bs, 4 Apiata Stingers, 1 United Earth Centaur-B, 2 Tellarite Centaur-B
  • Notes: Remain at 19 ships, but several of the cruisers have been switched out for Centaur-Bs.
Task Force: Boldly
-Mission [Explore the Adazzi Gulf]
-Straak - +15 BR/SR on the first resource gain of each quarter
-Attachments:
All Pyllix Geological Institute Team. Cost: Free.
Lt. Sadd-Har's Cadet Field Training Team: 3 pp per year. Effect: Increased experience gain for missions involving S rolls.
Tellar Prime Academy of Mineral Science Team: 10 rp per year. Effect: +5BR or +5SR on the first resource gain each quarter
Henn-Makad Mineral Engineering Institute Team: 10 rp per year. Effect: +2 on the first mapping roll each quarter.
Igata Nikelda: 10 rp per year. Effect: Increased chance of finding resource colony sites.
NEW Vulcan Science Academy Science Team. Cost: 10 rp on Purchase, 5 rp per year. Effect: Reroll first failed Science test involving an anomaly per quarter.

Ships 2323.Q1:
  • Explorers: 1 Excelsior-A [Excalibur]
  • Cruisers: NEW 1 Gaeni Tech-Cruiser-A, NEW 1 Constellation-A [Stalwart (B)]
  • Frigates: 1 Kepler [Kepler], 1 Miranda-A [Dryad (B)], 1 Oberth [Hawking (B)], 1 Forager (free with mission
  • Notes: Added Gaeni ship and Stalwart as reinforcements. TF is now 7 ships strong.

[NEW] Task Force: Forward
-Mission: [Discourage attacks on the Trill]
-Pavel Chekhov - Nullifies the first 2pts of crew casualties per year, reroll the first failed Away Team Combat each year
-Attachments:
FDS Diplomatic Team. Cost: 5pp on Purchase, 5pp per year. Effect: Reroll first failed Diplomatic Roll each quarter;
Starfleet Intelligence Analysis Team: 5pp on purchase, 5pp per year. Effect: 25% chance of a free Intelligence Report related to the Task Force's Mission each year.
Langa Mbeki: 5 pp on purchase, 5 pp per year. Effect: +2 to the lowest diplomatic roll each quarter
NEW Yoyodyne Research Team: 10 rp per year. Enables reroll on first failed D-Test each quarter.

-2323.Q1 Ships:
  • Explorers: 1 Excelsior-A (6) [Thirishar (B)]
  • Cruisers: STO Audacious [Serene], 2 STO Constrictors, 1 Rigellian Turtleship
  • Frigates: 2 STO Arquilla, 1 Amarkian Centaur-B, NEW 1 Amarakian Anacail
  • Notes: TF is 9 ships strong.

[NEW] Task Force: Royal (the Gorn Task Force)
-Mission: Remove [Great Power Ambitions: 75/300] and [Distant Stars: 0/100] tags on Gorn. If a [Cardassian Influence: 0/100] tag emerges, remove that tag as well.
-Commander ?????
-Attachments:
  • Free FDS Diplomatic Team attachment. Effect: Reroll first failed Diplomatic Roll each quarter;
  • Ambassador Sarek: 5 pp per year. Effect: Reroll the first failed diplomatic roll each quarter; add +1 to the reroll.
  • Ashtarr: 10 pp on purchase, 8 pp per year. Effect: +2 to the first diplomatic roll involving the Gorn each quarter. = 10pp
-2323.Q1 Ships:
  • Explorers: Avandar (B), Rru'adorr (B), Pleezirra (B)
  • Cruisers: 1 Renaissance [Torch (pa)]
  • Frigates: 1 Amarkian Centaur-B, 1 Andorian Centaur-B, 3 Betazoid Centaur-Bs
  • Notes: TF is 9 ships strong.

Changes to Current Patrol Sectors:
Send Inspire (Oberth) to RBZ
Send Tarrak (Excelsior-A) to Licori BZ or HBZ
Send Yukikaze (Centaur-B) to HBZ
Send T'Mir (Oberth) to Ferasa (to make up for sending ship to refit)

Additional Ships in Later quarters:

2323.Q2 changes: 1 Centaur-A [Gale (B)] exits refit, 2 Renaissance [Ana Font Berth 1, Intazzi Berth 1] completes construction,
Net changes: +1 Centaur-B, +2 Renaissances

2323.Q4 changes: 1 Centaur-B [Oreasa Berth 2] completes
Net changes: +1 Centaur-B

Could theoretically pull those Q2 ships into a small (3 ship) TF or send them to reinforce an existing TF.
 
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I'm impressed that a Gorn task force was able to be put together without calling in more member ships. However, I'd say the extra cost is probably worth it if we could start task force whale this year lol.
 
Goat said:
Have you got some pp hiding under your couch? Cause we have a shortage of political weight to throw around at the moment ...
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Ah, no, though that is quite unfortunate. I would really prefer to deny the Harmony of any more possible access to the OSA. Oh well, at least we can cross our fingers and hope that we can find incriminating info on the Harmony.
 
If we can only have one new task force for next year, I feel that the OSA tag is more time critical. It's very likely to be something the HoH is using to set off a war in the area that will drag several major polities, including our affiliates/allies, or even the Federation itself, into it. Several powers are have already started mobilization. If we don't want to end up fighting a proxy war with the HoH "peacekeepers", I think the new task force should be directed at that tag first.

The Gorn/Ittick-Ka situation could come to a war, yes. But first of all, it doesn't seem to be as immediate as the coreward situation. It will take time for the Dawiar to mobilize, after all, and for the Gorn to establish their logistics with them over such a long distance. Secondly, it won't be involving any of our already affiliated or allied powers, so the Federation has less obligations tying our hands when it comes to handling it. We could even well sit it out like we did the Klingon/Romulan War, and then help broker the peace afterwards.
 
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Can we use the Breen Attack to push our ship production sectors to some level of mobilization for the year here?

Its a small compensation, but a quarter or two off the build times should see use push out 1-2 ships early.
 
Fallenblades643 said:
Can we use the Breen Attack to push our ship production sectors to some level of mobilization for the year here?

Its a small compensation, but a quarter or two off the build times should see use push out 1-2 ships early.
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As I understand it, our supply lines are only just keeping up with demand now - higher mobilization affects the entire supply chain, not just the ship yards, so we would need to call in additional lift capacity, pay the miners more overtime, lay on extra shifts at every intermediate processing stage .....
 
charysa said:
Secondly, it won't be involving any of our already affiliated or allied powers,
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This is a very optimistic view given we will have likely affiliated the Trill and even if we haven't that won't necessarily stop our becoming involved. Our southern affiliates have good relations down there and have shown they are willing to act to defend them against outside aggression.

Also, bluntly, the HoH's plan as described is currently nonfunctional. The crisis with the OSA does not just affect us; it means that rather than a general war the Harmony might want, the most likely outbreak of war is a massive joint invasion of the Outer Space Alliance, which would go a long way towards bringing the other regional powers closer together and which the OSA might not be able to withstand well enough for the Harmony to jump in and save them.

Remember when the enemy is hurting too.
 
Briefvoice said:
NEW] Task Force: Royal (the Gorn Task Force)
-Mission: Remove [Great Power Ambitions: 75/300] and [Distant Stars: 0/100] tags on Gorn. If a [Cardassian Influence: 0/100] tag emerges, remove that tag as well.
-Commander ?????
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You want to add -[The Ancient Enemy (Orions): 0/100] while you're at it?

charysa said:
If we can only have one new task force for next year, I feel that the OSA tag is more time critical. It's very likely to be something the HoH is using to set off a war in the area that will drag several major polities, including our affiliates/allies, or even the Federation itself, into it. Several powers are have already started mobilization. If we don't want to end up fighting a proxy war with the HoH "peacekeepers", I think the new task force should be directed at that tag first.
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I'm with Charysa, Task Forces should be used for Time-Critical problems first.
 
Night said:
Also, bluntly, the HoH's plan as described is currently nonfunctional. The crisis with the OSA does not just affect us; it means that rather than a general war the Harmony might want, the most likely outbreak of war is a massive joint invasion of the Outer Space Alliance, which would go a long way towards bringing the other regional powers closer together and which the OSA might not be able to withstand well enough for the Harmony to jump in and save them.

Remember when the enemy is hurting too.
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I don't understand your reasoning here-it seems pretty clear to me that in such a circumstance the Harmony would try to maneuver their way into a position of power over whatever came out of the war under the guise of neutrality. There's also that we dont know enough of the Horizon's plans here to infer that they're just going to up and fail-I see no evidence they're hurting.

chriswriter90 said:
You want to add -[The Ancient Enemy (Orions): 0/100] while you're at it?
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Actually affiliating the Gorn is a bad idea when the Ittick-ka are not yet affiliates, as it will push the Ittick-ka back towards open hostility. We need to deal with their Great Power Ambitions tag first.
 
Glassware said:
I don't understand your reasoning here-it seems pretty clear to me that in such a circumstance the Harmony would try to maneuver their way into a position of power over whatever came out of the war under the guise of neutrality.
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A brief war against a single power is far less useful for this than a general war where everyone is likely to be exhausted and their militaries badly damaged. At best, the Harmony could move in as the protector of the OSA in the post-war, but this would align them against everyone else, substantially undermining their overall goals. If their goal is generalized FUD, it has gone wrong. If their goal is to weaken everyone, the fact that there is single clear target to attack is a failure.
 
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The Ittick-ka have already warned us that if we get too cosy with the Gorn, they will consider us enemies. After all, everyone knows the Gorn are preparing to attack the Ittick-ka early next decade. We need to either get the bugs on board first, or affiliate both in pretty much the same quarter - or get rid of the Gorns expansion plans in such a way that the Ittick-ka know we scuppered those war plans.

Now, if you are fine with having a war with the Ittick-ka, taking who knows long and no doubt costing ships and crews, then we can push the Gorn to affiliate as quickly as possible.
 
Night said:
A brief war against a single power is far less useful for this than a general war where everyone is likely to be exhausted and their militaries badly damaged. At best, the Harmony could move in as the protector of the OSA in the post-war, but this would align them against everyone else, substantially undermining their overall goals. If their goal is generalized FUD, it has gone wrong.
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If that is their goal, yes. We don't know enough about what's going on here to make assumptions like that-only that we have a sudden buildup that looks to engulf at least five of our affiliates and several nonaligned species. It could well be that the Horizon sides against the OSA in order to bring peace and builds ties with the locals that way, for example, reasoning that they can gobble up the OSA in a postwar partition while simultaneously building military ties with everyone else.
 
I have a question.

I honestly don't remember; is there a PP cost associated with starting a task force? Or are all the costs per-ship only?

Because I might want to try rearranging things a bit so we can get a small task force to chew on the "Corps Are Lying To Us" tag this year.

I strongly agree with the notion that this is time critical and that if we don't start making an effort to bring it under control, even if only a cruiser and a few frigates or something, we could be in trouble next year.

Night said:
A brief war against a single power is far less useful for this than a general war where everyone is likely to be exhausted and their militaries badly damaged. At best, the Harmony could move in as the protector of the OSA in the post-war, but this would align them against everyone else, substantially undermining their overall goals. If their goal is generalized FUD, it has gone wrong. If their goal is to weaken everyone, the fact that there is single clear target to attack is a failure.
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The Harmony may have a second string to their bow- something ELSE they're planning to trigger to cause further tension at cross-purposes to the existing tension in hopes of sparking more general chaos. They may have plans to, say, nudge the Bolians into the picture on the OSA side somehow. Or the Felis. Let's not assume their plans have failed or that we know everything about their plans.

Furthermore, even if the result IS simply a general attack on the OSA, that would be highly effective at getting the OSA to scream to the Harmony for military assistance... which is good enough. One thing at a time, the Harmony may be reasoning, and if they can pry loose SOME of the polities on the border and get them into their sphere of influence, that gives them a much better position to hopefully secure/suborn the rest later.
 
The thing about the OSA tag is we get a continuing push roll on it Q1 and then an automatic roll on it in Snakepit, and that's before any diplomatic push we order next year. There's no point in declaring a task force for what might be as little as 20 points, and ordering a push on the OSA is sensible anyway.

e: this would be faster than a task force too
 
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Glassware said:
If that is their goal, yes.
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Considering that I was responding to someone who had already posited this as their goal, what do you believe you are accomplishing by disputing that point with me and not Charysa, exactly? You've ignored the context of the discussion.

Simon_Jester said:
that gives them a much better position to hopefully secure/suborn the rest later.
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How? If they step in to protect a regional bad actor that's not going to help them at all with any other power, and likely make it worse.
 
charysa said:
If we can only have one new task force for next year, I feel that the OSA tag is more time critical. It's very likely to be something the HoH is using to set off a war in the area that will drag several major polities, including our affiliates/allies, or even the Federation itself, into it. Several powers are have already started mobilization. If we don't want to end up fighting a proxy war with the HoH "peacekeepers", I think the new task force should be directed at that tag first.
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That's really not the interpretation I take of the OSA tag. You seem to think that solving or not solving that tag is the key to the entire crisis, whereas I think that "The Corps are Lying to Us" is something of a sideshow. Yes it's something the HoH may be using, but it's perfectly possible to resovle the crisis without eliminating the tag, and contrariwise eliminating the tag won't resolve the crisis.

Your gravitating to it because we're freaking out and wanting to do something, and this is something so we should do it, however little it might have to do with resolving the real problem.

But we'll see. I think a critical factor is whether the OSA tag is listed as one of our default choices and comes with a free FDS attachment, indicating that the President and FDS think it is a key and important Task Force. If it's not and merely falls under "Other Tags", that will say to me that it's actually not that big a deal.

The Gorn/Ittick-Ka situation could come to a war, yes. But first of all, it doesn't seem to be as immediate as the coreward situation. It will take time for the Dawiar to mobilize, after all, and for the Gorn to establish their logistics with them over such a long distance. Secondly, it won't be involving any of our already affiliated or allied powers, so the Federation has less obligations tying our hands when it comes to handling it. We could even well sit it out like we did the Klingon/Romulan War, and then help broker the peace afterwards.
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The urgency is actually that bit about them developing a Cardassian Influence tag. That is what we need to ward off with a Task Force. If that wasn't part of the mission, I'd treat it as less urgent.

chriswriter90 said:
You want to add -[The Ancient Enemy (Orions): 0/100] while you're at it?
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I didn't write the mission. That came from the 2322 Deployment vote and was one of the preselected missions for us.

I'm with Charysa, Task Forces should be used for Time-Critical problems first.
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Sure, but we disagree on which problem is time critical and which is not.

Goat said:
The Ittick-ka have already warned us that if we get too cosy with the Gorn, they will consider us enemies. After all, everyone knows the Gorn are preparing to attack the Ittick-ka early next decade. We need to either get the bugs on board first, or affiliate both in pretty much the same quarter - or get rid of the Gorns expansion plans in such a way that the Ittick-ka know we scuppered those war plans.
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It's not about Gorn affiliation. It's about preventing them from signing an alliance with the Cardassians that would cause the Cardassians to join their war with the Ittick-ka.

I'll say it again. The Gorn are not about the Gorn. They're about preventing the Ashalla Pact from encircling us with an allied power that can hit the Federation from the other side. It's the Sydraxians all over again, except tougher and with a bigger fleet.
 
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SynchronizedWritersBlock said:
The thing about the OSA tag is we get a continuing push roll on it Q1 and then an automatic roll on it in Snakepit, and that's before any diplomatic push we order next year. There's no point in declaring a task force for what might be as little as 20 points, and ordering a push on the OSA is sensible anyway.
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I am uneasy relying on the luck of the dice there. Even a small task force would be useful, if only to determine if we're dealing with an opposing task force and ensure the tag is completed rapidly. Also, as a 100-level tag aren't continuing pushes on the OSA now blocked? The last push we saw didn't move the needle on that tag at all even though they're now affiliates-it went straight into the general pool.
 
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Just to be clear:

1) Are there costs associated with starting a task force, other than the per-ship costs and the asset costs? I honestly do not remember and am trying to get up to speed so I can contribute usefully.

2) This is more a question for the GMs; is there a way we can order one task force to "roll into" another if it accomplishes its mission early? Can we order them to work on tags in a certain order? For example, IF we set up a task force to work on the "Corps are Lying" tag with the OSA, could we order it to finish rolling up that tag, then focus its mission on general improvement of relations, or on the "Disunited Homeworld" tag, for the duration of the year? That way its efforts wouldn't be wasted.

Briefvoice said:
That's really not the interpretation I take of the OSA tag. You seem to think that solving or not solving that tag is the key to the entire crisis, whereas I think that "The Corps are Lying to Us" is something of a sideshow. Yes it's something the HoH may be using, but it's perfectly possible to resovle the crisis without eliminating the tag, and contrariwise eliminating the tag won't resolve the crisis.

Your gravitating to it because we're freaking out and wanting to do something, and this is something so we should do it, however little it might have to do with resolving the real problem.
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Okay. So, do you have any other suggestion for resolving the real problem?

While it is possible that this issue will resolve itself in a satisfactory manner, I think it would be irrationally complacent to plan on it solving itself.
 
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