Also passenger ships I think will be needed in more limited numbers
Starfleet conducted evacuations during the Biophage crisis, and would have needed to evacuate nearby systems if a Mentat from the Arcadian Empire had cooked off a star. We almost had to evacuate a Sydraxian colony effort in the Gabriel Expanse, and were only spared that headache by convenient Cardassian maneuvers drawing our ships away.

More passenger lift capacity is a good thing, in my estimation.
 
Captain's Log, USS Voshov, Stardate 26153.1

Well, its just as well other ships weren't assigned to investigate these asteroid belts. I'd hate to imagine what a less prepared crew would have made of the hull parasites.

Oh yes, hull parasites, storming out of warrens and burrows in the asteroids, with a surprising ability to phase through shields. I'm putting my helm and tactical officers in for commendations on account of amazing evasive and phaser work, and my medical officer for determining how to disrupt the unusual proto-nervous systems of these parasites so we could put them to sleep and escape.
Ahhh shipivorous monsters! It's been too long since we ran into one of those!

No, it hasn't. It really hasn't. :p :D

Captain's Log, USS Thirishar, Stardate 26153.9

The Romulans and the Daljerra are standing down and returning to Romulan space. The K'tinga is being scuttled, the last of her crew having beamed aboard.

I invited both Captains aboard, and at one stage had both of them facing off on the bridge, ready to go for each other's throats with myself in the middle. I'll admit it took a lot of work, but I managed to convey that here, in Federation space, our peace holds, and their war does not apply here.

[Conflict with Romulans and Klingons avoided, use of Federation space for attacks deterred, gain +10pp, 200 Klingon crew interned by the Federation, to be held at Tipperary, +1 Crew Rating]
!

...I think the Thirishar has just achieved Crouching Moron, Hidden Badass status.

Captain's Log, USS Courageous, Stardate 26154.4

It appears that the former overlords of the Tauni have returned to leave their mark on their former subjects. We arrived in time to protect the second cargo ship, and the Tauni cruiser that arrived, from the raider. They refer to themselves as the Harmony of Horizon, a species that promises a utopia of music and culture, but of whom I am forced to conclude that there is a considerable dark side.

They are elegant rhetoricians, and spoke at length attempting to pain the Tauni as the villains for civil insurrection, and it was a difficult task to stay ahead of their tales. However, in the end, I was able to disprove their claims, and they resorted to attempted violence. When we collected the escape pods from the Horizonite ship, we were immediately called upon by the Tauni to hand over the captives in order that they may face Tauni justice. I had to refuse when I inquired as to what their punishments may be. The captain of the Tauni cruiser was furious, until I explained my position to him. Ultimately, vengeance is the comfort of fools.

[Gain +20pp, +25 with Tauni, meet Major Power: the Harmony of Horizon, starting relations frosty]

[Cartographers Nb: Closest Horizon planet is in 7B]
Oh pants. Why can't we meet nice music people? :(

Captain's Log, USS Bull, Stardate 26154.9

I think we are all now tired beyond reason, but we have drive off the more heavily armed Hishmeri Sept vessel by diving straight in. Apparently our approach was so blunt, necessitated as it was by the imminent collapse of lifesupport for the Qloathians, that it convinced the Hishmeri that there must be a task force following on our heels. We have beamed the surviving expedition members aboard and will now return to Starbase 7 for some urgently needed TLC for ship and crew.

[Gain +10pp]
Ah, yes, the famous "charge the nomads screaming and waving like a lunatic so they all run away because they figure you must have a whole army backing you up" trick. :D !

To my mind, this will forever be known as the EXETER SMASH!! trick after that one time when the valiant ConnieBee chased away two Sydraxian warships in screaming shieldbreached terror from the badly damaged wreck they'd made of the Challorn.

Captain's Log, USS Docana, Stardate 26182.4

The Romulans and Klingons are requesting an urgent meeting to discuss the incident in the Klingon Border Zone. Solitude has been chosen as the venue and we will be providing Starfleet's presence at the summit. Orders straight from the President are that we are not to take a backwards step from our position: we will not allow to carry on a war through our space, especially not against helpless targets.
Captain's Log, USS Docana, Stardate 26184.1

It has not been easy to keep matters on course, and to keep the other two sides from tearing strips off of each other. But it appears that we have managed. The Romulans and Klingons are both agreeing to stop attempting to utilise Federation space in this manner, and the Klingon Empire is accepting the continuing internment of the crew of the Gak'ptah in accordance with our laws and interstellar agreements.

[Gain +15pp, both Klingons and Romulans reassured about Federation intentions and neutrality]
Docana:

"Okay, everybody TIME OUT!!!"

Klingons and Romulans:

"...Okay."

Captain's Log, USS S'harien, Stardate 26183.5

We've arrived to help out an Indorian mining attempt find a compromise with some peculiar creatures that seem attracted to their mining equipment. The creatures, which the mining crews from Vidotti dub 'mynocks', have been chewing on an exposed power sources. This led to an absolutely disastrous incident where something gnawed on the EPS conduit supplying the main drill-head. So we're trying to find a safe solution to stop the creatures attraction to the mining equipment.
Oh joy, now we've got extragalactic space-monsters that like to eat our stuff!

DAMMIT SPACE MONSTERS, STOP EATING OUR STUFF!

[commences plan to slather Cardassian installations in barbecue sauce as a distraction]

Captain's Log, USS Atuin, Stardate 26185.9

I have met with the government of the Lamarck as Federation ambassador. They are a short species with long manes that run down their back into a tail, and a distinct green tone to their skin. We arrived not long after their own first warpship returned, and found a scene of mass planetary jubilation. Having met them and spoken to the pilot and engineer of that warpship, which you must understand is the most ramshackle creation. I think it was actually formed from a repurposed bulk liquids container. This was very much the work of a rogue genius whose ascent to space caught their world by surprise. Well, on the back of their success, they have my arrival, and now the planet is in a real frenzy.

I mean it, too, these people really know how to throw a party. There's like a three-mile long 27-hours a day festival going on at the great square in front of their government building.

[New species encountered - the Lamarck, starting relations 50/100]
All Humans On A'Tuin Crew:

"...We're still special, right?"

All Vulcans on A'Tuin Crew:

"Yes. Yes you are"

[administer Vulcan headpat]
 
Starfleet conducted evacuations during the Biophage crisis, and would have needed to evacuate nearby systems if a Mentat from the Arcadian Empire had cooked off a star. We almost had to evacuate a Sydraxian colony effort in the Gabriel Expanse, and were only spared that headache by convenient Cardassian maneuvers drawing our ships away.

More passenger lift capacity is a good thing, in my estimation.
So maybe 2 more giving us 4 with another 19 available from member worlds. Passenger ships are 3 year build so 6 years of berth time.
 
and hot damn, not a single failure.
... Yet. Fingers crossed.
Our 40C task force is only supposed to defend territory - that if they try trespass, we demonstrate our capacity to bite them. It's a deterrence force, not a force that could hope to take the attack onto the Hishmeri fleet.
... And this is why I wanted the fleetball.

Aggressive deterrence with a fleet the size of their civ.
. We were aided in this by a constant stream of reports to and from one Captain Straak
... Someone go get a transporter tag.

#VoteExpansionist
#XPCoalition
#LamarckTauni
 
... And this is why I wanted the fleetball.

Aggressive deterrence with a fleet the size of their civ.

Not needed. The Hishmeri fleet is powerful on paper, but if the Hishmeri want to avoid dying they can't stuff more than, say, 1/4th of their fleet's combat worth in any assault force. They need the rest to guard their civilians. And at 40C our fleet is big enough that any attack they do perform is likely to see major, and hard to recover from, losses on their part. Or they gamble their entire species on the attack and quite possibly get nearly wiped out in the battle, promptly followed getting actually wiped out in the follow up battle because the Klingon Empire will not mind pouncing on the Hishmeri and Starfleet will neither be in a position to object nor willing to object.
 
Not needed. The Hishmeri fleet is powerful on paper, but if the Hishmeri want to avoid dying they can't stuff more than, say, 1/4th of their fleet's combat worth in any assault force. They need the rest to guard their civilians. And at 40C our fleet is big enough that any attack they do perform is likely to see major, and hard to recover from, losses on their part. Or they gamble their entire species on the attack and quite possibly get nearly wiped out in the battle, promptly followed getting actually wiped out in the follow up battle because the Klingon Empire will not mind pouncing on the Hishmeri and Starfleet will neither be in a position to object nor willing to object.
However, they would be a lot more cautious, and more inclined to believe that we can retaliate with a large fleet.

Not that we would, but the shock and awe treatment is super effective when their entire civilization could be damaged almost to the point of extinction with a force of that size.

Thus, less stupid.
 
And then right in the next story post we have TWO Centaur-As doing fantastically well in really important events that involve (the threat of) combat and presence. I'd say that arguably the entire Centaur-A class would have been redeemed just by the Zephyr event even if it HAD been a failure until now. That was really critical and could easily make the difference between bringing the Sydraxians to our side and them slipping back into Cardassian client status.
The Centaur-As are very solid ships, and if we were still staring down the throat of a major crew shortage and didn't have the 'pacifist' Constellation-A refit as an option, I would be strongly in favor of building more of them. I don't regret a single ship of the production run, and I don't think any of us should. They're successful by all reasonable metrics.

TBG's Hypatia is shaping up!
Pray expound?

So it looks like the end of the Federation's expansion is coming closer. Assuming the ISC and Harmony of Horizon are about the same size as the other Major Powers we've encountered then almost the entire Corewards region is blocked to us. About the only route left to expand that way is Corewards-Spinwards diagonal through the GBZ and above the Cardassians.
The ISC is really compact, a dense, heavily fortified garrison state, based on everything we've heard about them from either Oneiros or their original creators. The 'Harmony' may or may not be, dunno.

Seeing as our Spinwards growth is already blocked by the Cardassians and our Tailwards growth blocked by the Romulans and Klingons that only leaves the Rimwad area free.
Yes, and it's likely to be a pretty 'squishy' frontier for some time to come. Notice that the Ittick-ka are able to get away with being aggressive isolationist bullies down there, and that the Hishmeri came right through and don't show any signs of being in bad shape from clashing with a major power down there. Both of these data points suggest a power vacuum down that way, for a fair distance beyond our present frontier.

I have to say that it are parts like that that really stretch my suspension of disbelief... I get that the Hishmeri are supposed to be the bad guys/space pirates but actions like that seem not only stupid but also so pointless. Why the hell would anybody halfway sane risk angering the "superpower" of this part of space, especially for something unimportant like a research vessel (I mean if it had been a merchant/transport vessel it would have still been stupid but at least somewhat understandable) and after seeing just how much force the assembled to protect a non-affiliated non-revelant primitive world? I think you stretch the mongol/hun analogy a bit to far here since unlike those the Hishmeri have no chance of escaping/disappearing into space after their attacks and do indeed have a very vulnerable "centre".

In my opinion by resorting to such a caricature villain behaviour you do yourself and your quest a disservice...
The Hishmeri SEPTS are not a centralized faction. It is entirely possible that some of the Hishmeri have gotten the memo "the United Federation of Planets has a big fleet and isn't afraid to use it," while others have not, or are listening to Lecarre/Cardassian/whoever bullshittery about the Federation being a juicy target.

Alternatively, the Hishmeri may figure they can do a 'hit and run' on a lone Federation ship and simply escape into the depths of space before anyone figures out what happened. Things like that have happened before, especially outside our space.

:eyebrow:
@Simon_Jester, I'll let you field this one.
Well, in this case @Iron Wolf appears to be attributing the word "PAAPist" to the disagreeable Cardassians, Lecarre, or others who might attribute weakness to us. That said, it is a slur-acronym I rather dislike, being as how it gets much of its derogatory power from sounding identical to a traditional English anti-Catholic slur.

... And this is why I wanted the fleetball.

Aggressive deterrence with a fleet the size of their civ.
The problem is, the fleetball would still only just have begun to even arrive in the region, and it would still take time for information to propagate. The main obstacle here isn't "instill an 'avoid Federation ships' meme into the Hishmeri" it's "wait until the 'avoid Federation ships' meme propagates throughout their scattered and decentralized fleet."

From the sound of the Bull's logs, we're halfway there: the Hishmeri raider (which must be a pretty heavy powerhouse of a frigate or a light cruiser) knew to avoid Federation task forces, and knew our task forces might be in the area... But they were still willing to opportunistically prey on weak, not-obviously-Federation ships in the area if they thought we weren't watching.

That's progress from where we would be without the 40C fleet, and I'm not sure the 100C fleetball would have made MORE progress in the time available.

However, they would be a lot more cautious, and more inclined to believe that we can retaliate with a large fleet.

Not that we would, but the shock and awe treatment is super effective when their entire civilization could be damaged almost to the point of extinction with a force of that size.

Thus, less stupid.
The Hishmeri are probably old hands at encounters with large interstellar powers, unless the density of such powers immediately around Federation space is VERY atypical. They HAVE to understand on some level that naval warships of major powers are like roaches; for every one of them you actually see when loitering around their borders, there are several more that you don't see because they haven't made kicking your ass their top priority.

The bare fact that we could assemble a 40C fleet that fast is going to give them reason to assume the 100C fleetball is a realistic possibility. If we sent a 100C fleetball they might posit a hypothetical 250C fleetball instead... but from their point of view, a clash with a hypothetical 250C fleetball is little or no worse for them than a 100C fleetball.

Unless they are really stupid, the 40C fleet will at least begin to have the desired effect. If we have to reinforce it, we can.
 
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Because that's how nomadic societies actually, historically, behave?

Typically, every clan does it's own thing and answers to the others only on an informal basis. If one groupthinks it can get away with committing a crime and then disappearing into the millieu of its fellows, it will often do it. And you only need one stupid or reckless chieftain who thinks he can get away with this for it to happen, often smearing the rest if his people by association in the process.

This has been a problem for the Roma, the Bedouins, the Berbers, and numerous others.

The difference is that unlike all the ancient nomadic cultures who could simply disappear into the steppe/desert and be confident that any pursuit would be impossible or at last prohibitively expensive the Hishmeri are not only up against the insane sensor ranges and abilities of STO tech but also the fact that they are highly depended on their easy to find, impossible to hide or run away with "lifeship(s)". Unlike a traditional nomadic culture which could simply split up and disappear the Hishmeri have the one thing they can't abandon and need to defend under any circumstance which in my eyes makes it impossible for them to behave like "mongols".

As long as they can't hide their big ship/fleet they are operating under massive strategic disadvantage since a single strike can devastate their whole infrastructure (and indeed cause a genocide) as well as it being ridiculously easy to locate the origin and return point of any attack (said fleet). If you want to ambush their ships, just hide in the neighbourhood of the fleet and intercept, if you want to destroy them, just assemble a big enough fleet (or manipulate the nearest blackhole etc...).
 
The difference is that unlike all the ancient nomadic cultures who could simply disappear into the steppe/desert and be confident that any pursuit would be impossible or at last prohibitively expensive the Hishmeri are not only up against the insane sensor ranges and abilities of STO tech but also the fact that they are highly depended on their easy to find, impossible to hide or run away with "lifeship(s)". Unlike a traditional nomadic culture which could simply split up and disappear the Hishmeri have the one thing they can't abandon and need to defend under any circumstance which in my eyes makes it impossible for them to behave like "mongols".

As long as they can't hide their big ship/fleet they are operating under massive strategic disadvantage since a single strike can devastate their whole infrastructure (and indeed cause a genocide) as well as it being ridiculously easy to locate the origin and return point of any attack (said fleet). If you want to ambush their ships, just hide in the neighbourhood of the fleet and intercept, if you want to destroy them, just assemble a big enough fleet (or manipulate the nearest blackhole etc...).

DO you remember the time that Enterprise snuck into a system and exploded a goddamn sun?

I bet the Hishmeri are at least that good at hiding even if they don't have cloaks
 
DO you remember the time that Enterprise snuck into a system and exploded a goddamn sun?
Shhh! we're not supposed to talk about that you wanna be spy! If you want to divulge top secret federation secrets do it so someone who believes that you are truly a seamstress. and not a Romulan spy. A failed romulan spy but a spy none the less. :D
 
Shhh! we're not supposed to talk about that you wanna be spy! If you want to divulge top secret federation secrets do it so someone who believes that you are truly a seamstress. and not a Romulan spy. A failed romulan spy but a spy none the less. :D

First of all: How Dare you.

Second of all: Who do you think you are

Third of all: Your pants will be ready on Monday.

Fourth of All: I am a perfectly normal Hunam Wonam.

Fifth of all: How Dare you

> : O

> : P
 
The Centaur-As are very solid ships, and if we were still staring down the throat of a major crew shortage and didn't have the 'pacifist' Constellation-A refit as an option, I would be strongly in favor of building more of them. I don't regret a single ship of the production run, and I don't think any of us should. They're successful by all reasonable metrics.
Actually less crew shortage and more SR shortage. Centaur-As are our most crew-efficient ships.

From the sound of the Bull's logs, we're halfway there: the Hishmeri raider (which must be a pretty heavy powerhouse of a frigate or a light cruiser) knew to avoid Federation task forces, and knew our task forces might be in the area... But they were still willing to opportunistically prey on weak, not-obviously-Federation ships in the area if they thought we weren't watching.

That's progress from where we would be without the 40C fleet, and I'm not sure the 100C fleetball would have made MORE progress in the time available.

I didn't get that particular impression - it just sounded like the Hishmeri raider panicked from completely ballsy approach and assumed the Bull had backup. I'm not sure the Ataami Defense Federation task force had arrived yet by that month. (Bull is notably not part of that task force.)

Also, merely the threat of losing a couple ships even in an engagement that favors them (like a 100C vs 40C fleet battle) will give them pause. They all live on their ships, and the loss of any one ship could be a significant blow.

where does PAAPist even come from

Honestly, the first time I saw this term, I think it was phoenix89 saying it, and I had no idea what it was.

Very confusingly, google led me to:



Yup check the front page.

BUT, unlike Simon Jester, you can fix this by posting on this very page now ;)
 
DO you remember the time that Enterprise snuck into a system and exploded a goddamn sun?

I bet the Hishmeri are at least that good at hiding even if they don't have cloaks

Pretty sure that it is damn near impossible to hide the massive subspace wake of their fleet/capital ship... If their fleet consisted only of small scale, independent ships I would buy them being able to scatter and hide but not if their central fleet consists of a super capital like the one our Homeworld expy is flying around (as well as other capital grade civilian ships...).
 
The difference is that unlike all the ancient nomadic cultures who could simply disappear into the steppe/desert and be confident that any pursuit would be impossible or at last prohibitively expensive the Hishmeri are not only up against the insane sensor ranges and abilities of STO tech but also the fact that they are highly depended on their easy to find, impossible to hide or run away with "lifeship(s)". Unlike a traditional nomadic culture which could simply split up and disappear the Hishmeri have the one thing they can't abandon and need to defend under any circumstance which in my eyes makes it impossible for them to behave like "mongols".

As long as they can't hide their big ship/fleet they are operating under massive strategic disadvantage since a single strike can devastate their whole infrastructure (and indeed cause a genocide) as well as it being ridiculously easy to locate the origin and return point of any attack (said fleet). If you want to ambush their ships, just hide in the neighbourhood of the fleet and intercept, if you want to destroy them, just assemble a big enough fleet (or manipulate the nearest blackhole etc...).

They can, however, disappear into the midst of the other Septs.

This is why many countries even in modern times have difficulty with Roma or Bedouins. There isn't enough accountability within those societies to identify the culprits, and if you push too hard they're likely to circle the wagons against the perceived invader rather than help find the criminals in their midst.
 
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