[x] Briefvoice

Well... as long as the Cardassians are Honorverse Sol.... and now I want to make an Honorverse quest. I like some of the universe, the line of battle, the lack of FTL communications between systems requiring courier boats for communication but can do without other parts of it (Mesa).
 
[x] Briefvoice

Well... as long as the Cardassians are Honorverse Sol.... and now I want to make an Honorverse quest. I like some of the universe, the line of battle, the lack of FTL communications between systems requiring courier boats for communication but can do without other parts of it (Mesa).
Well, Oneiros has managed to work out, over the past six months or so, one of the best 'engines' for simulating space-naval quests that I have ever seen, so... :D

Oh god no.

Sensibly?

Who do you guys think I am?

I'm getting consultants in from the Honorverse. Experts from Sol.
That would actually not work as badly as you'd think.

Honorverse Solarian tactics aren't bad. The "put your pants on your head and then light them on fire" stupidity is mostly the realm of bad strategy, plus of course having straight-up failed to invent the next generation of supermodern ultraweapons. If they ever showed up to a battle (rather than being ordered out of it by stupidity) with weapons of comparable performance to their opponents (rather than being hilariously outgunned), they'd do rather well.
 
[x] Briefvoice

Well... as long as the Cardassians are Honorverse Sol.... and now I want to make an Honorverse quest. I like some of the universe, the line of battle, the lack of FTL communications between systems requiring courier boats for communication but can do without other parts of it (Mesa).

I've actually considered using my copy of Saganami Island Tactical Simulator and the PRH fleet sourcebook to make an AU Honourverse quest where Honour's mother married a Havenite doctor instead. Name her Valour Villenueve to maintain the same style and alliteration. I'd probably call the quest "Valour Villeneuve: Attack on Basilisk Station" or "Something something Valour pun". Have a career arc that generally mirrors the canon one -to start anyway.

Way less level of bullshit ability though, maybe just have the questers vote on one or two of Honour's array of bullshit hax as character creation. And I'd also probably just use everything up to Weber got retcon happy after War of Honour for canon; so the Solarian League and whatnot still makes sense. (I find the whole tone and quality rapidly drops around and after War of Honour.)
 
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If Honor were a Havenite she'd be Joanne Hall.

Who got killed by a bullshit Manticoran superweapon in Book Eight. :(

Then again, just having your improbably talented heroine show up earlier would have helped; there were a few critical moments where someone a bit more talented or with a bit more gift for reading the enemy's intentions would have been very helpful.

That said, I like this idea and will, as you say, subscribe to your newsletter?

[like seriously I'd be happy to help brainstorm and set this up]
 
If Honor were a Havenite she'd be Joanne Hall.

Who got killed by a bullshit Manticoran superweapon in Book Eight. :(

Then again, just having your improbably talented heroine show up earlier would have helped; there were a few critical moments where someone a bit more talented or with a bit more gift for reading the enemy's intentions would have been very helpful.

That said, I like this idea and will, as you say, subscribe to your newsletter?

[like seriously I'd be happy to help brainstorm and set this up]

And Manticore would loose Honor.

For instance: Imagine a Basilisk Station where Pavel Young is still in charge of the picket and a Honor-analogue is one of the officers on the other side?

Also: the image of a possible Thomas Theisman husbando amuses me greatly (Tom Theisman is my favorite Honourverse character. I'm gay, but damn it, I love me some Tom Theisman)



Gib Tom. <3
 
And Manticore would loose Honor.

For instance: Imagine a Basilisk Station where Pavel Young is still in charge of the picket and a Honor-analogue is one of the officers on the other side?
Honestly, you wouldn't need an Honor-analogue on the other side, just having Pavel in charge would make the whole thing a disaster for Manticore by default. :D

Also: the image of a possible Thomas Theisman husbando amuses me greatly (Tom Theisman is my favorite Honourverse character. I'm gay, but damn it, I love me some Tom Theisman)

Gib Tom. <3
I can place this exact moment. This is right before Cordelia Ransom walks in his door in In Enemy Hands, forcing him to take a emergency sober-up shot and then suppress even more nausea than usual.
 
I've actually considered using my copy of Saganami Island Tactical Simulator and the PRH fleet sourcebook to make an AU Honourverse quest where Honour's mother married a Havenite doctor instead. Name her Valour Villenueve to maintain the same style and alliteration. I'd probably call the quest "Valour Villeneuve: Attack on Basilisk Station" or "Something something Valour pun". Have a career arc that generally mirrors the canon one -to start anyway.

I'd be interested in this!

Serious question though: Will Haven still have their economy inexplicably crippled by EVIL LIBERALS?
 
Honestly, there's nothing fundamentally wrong with the basic, crude idea that gives you the 'blurb' version of Haven: a society where the economy is gradually collapsing, shored up by conquering the neighbors with the one thing the system is able to coordinate, its military.

It's not like you couldn't have a country experiencing severe economic problems, or even outright economic collapse. If it weren't for Weber's tendency to turn every antagonist into some kind of strawman... [sighs]
 
I've actually considered using my copy of Saganami Island Tactical Simulator and the PRH fleet sourcebook to make an AU Honourverse quest where Honour's mother married a Havenite doctor instead. Name her Valour Villenueve to maintain the same style and alliteration. I'd probably call the quest "Valour Villeneuve: Attack on Basilisk Station" or "Something something Valour pun". Have a career arc that generally mirrors the canon one -to start anyway.

Way less level of bullshit ability though, maybe just have the questers vote on one or two of Honour's array of bullshit hax as character creation. And I'd also probably just use everything up to Weber got retcon happy after War of Honour for canon; so the Solarian League and whatnot still makes sense. (I find the whole tone and quality rapidly drops around and after War of Honour.)

Valor

Because apparently space Britain doesn't use British spelling.
 
I've actually considered using my copy of Saganami Island Tactical Simulator and the PRH fleet sourcebook to make an AU Honourverse quest where Honour's mother married a Havenite doctor instead. Name her Valour Villenueve to maintain the same style and alliteration. I'd probably call the quest "Valour Villeneuve: Attack on Basilisk Station" or "Something something Valour pun". Have a career arc that generally mirrors the canon one -to start anyway.

Way less level of bullshit ability though, maybe just have the questers vote on one or two of Honour's array of bullshit hax as character creation. And I'd also probably just use everything up to Weber got retcon happy after War of Honour for canon; so the Solarian League and whatnot still makes sense. (I find the whole tone and quality rapidly drops around and after War of Honour.)

For that matter just sticking with the earlier books removes a lot of the wacky stuff. And limiting it to missile pods and maybe the LAC carriers but none of those 3 drive missiles that can attack across the entire system. Also getting rid of the Illuminati... I mean Mesan Conspiracy would help a ton. That seemed to just be trying to add a cartoon villain to have an enemy to fight. I had actually liked how it was shifting from obvious bad guy to two sides that are both good and bad that are drawn into conflict with each other. I think that type of story line is just not done enough.

If you do have her in Haven then we can get a lot of internal politics going and part of it can be which faction does she end up joining.

I'd be interested in this!

Serious question though: Will Haven still have their economy inexplicably crippled by EVIL LIBERALS?

It kind of makes sense, they went the equality then bread and circus route and by the time they realized they screwed up it was too late to fix without making hard decisions that no one would make. I really loved how we got some Haven POV from the ruling elite on how their economy was dictating their expansion and how some systems were a money sink to invade and control.
 
Totally unrelated:

@Void Stalker, can you (or anyone else) definitely categorize what our diplomacy roll bonuses are, including non-tech sources (I can easily search the tech sources)? And confirm that the roll itself is still 2u10?

Thanks
 
Totally unrelated:

@Void Stalker, can you (or anyone else) definitely categorize what our diplomacy roll bonuses are, including non-tech sources (I can easily search the tech sources)? And confirm that the roll itself is still 2u10?

Thanks
I have not heard it change from 2u10 and based on annual rolls it still seems to be that. Our only non tech source to rolls is our chief of staff who gives a +4 to all rolls. What is interesting with our techs is that some state annual roll and others diplo roll which implies some do not work on diplo pushes.
2u10+10 - base (-10 to 30, avg is 10)
All Rolls:
+4 Diplomacy Results- Vice Admiral Shey ch'Tharvasse Chief of Staff
+1 to all Diplomacy Rolls- Extended Profiles - 2310's Diplomacy

Annual Rolls:
+5 Improve Annual Diplomacy Rolls- Diplomatic Analysis 1, Early Xenospychology
+2 Improve Annual Diplomacy Rolls- Diplomatic Analysis 2, 2300 Xenospychology
+2 to the -Annual- Diplomacy Rolls- Diplomatic Analysis 3, 2310s Affiliate Research

Annual Rolls:
2u10+24 (4 to 44, avg is 24)
Probabilities
Diplo Pushes:
2u10+15 (-5 to 35, avg is 15)
Probabilities


Note: 2320 Diplomacy has a tech that boosts diplo pushes.
Comms also has some techs that give boost to diplo rolls (none researched)
 
I have not heard it change from 2u10 and based on annual rolls it still seems to be that. Our only non tech source to rolls is our chief of staff who gives a +4 to all rolls. What is interesting with our techs is that some state annual roll and others diplo roll which implies some do not work on diplo pushes.
2u10+10 - base (-10 to 30, avg is 10)
All Rolls:
+4 Diplomacy Results- Vice Admiral Shey ch'Tharvasse Chief of Staff
+1 to all Diplomacy Rolls- Extended Profiles - 2310's Diplomacy

Annual Rolls:
+5 Improve Annual Diplomacy Rolls- Diplomatic Analysis 1, Early Xenospychology
+2 Improve Annual Diplomacy Rolls- Diplomatic Analysis 2, 2300 Xenospychology
+2 to the -Annual- Diplomacy Rolls- Diplomatic Analysis 3, 2310s Affiliate Research

Annual Rolls:
2u10+24 (4 to 44, avg is 24)
Probabilities
Diplo Pushes:
2u10+15 (-5 to 35, avg is 15)
Probabilities


Note: 2320 Diplomacy has a tech that boosts diplo pushes.
Comms also has some techs that give boost to diplo rolls (none researched)

Thanks for the info. Given the average Yrillians diplomacy rolls being pretty high and on par with the snakepit annual roles, I think it is likely that those techs affect all rolls.

Also the anydice formulas are a bit off since they don't include the individual dice outcomes of 0. Proper formula is: 2d{-10..10}+x

edit: stupid autocorrect
 
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Valor

Because apparently space Britain doesn't use British spelling.
Space France doesn't use British spelling, so she's Valor and no question. :D

But yeah, Manticore turning into Space Britain is supposed to just be parallel evolution I guess? The original colonists don't seem to have actually come from England, they just used mutant forms of some English social structures as a way to reorganize their civilization after it all fell apart in a massive plague. They needed to bring in a swarm of new colonists, pronto, and they 'needed' a way to make sure that the pre-existing colonists and the most powerful investors in the rebuilding effort would be on top of the new social order. So they came up with the idea of creating a hereditary aristocracy.

For that matter just sticking with the earlier books removes a lot of the wacky stuff. And limiting it to missile pods and maybe the LAC carriers but none of those 3 drive missiles that can attack across the entire system. Also getting rid of the Illuminati... I mean Mesan Conspiracy would help a ton. That seemed to just be trying to add a cartoon villain to have an enemy to fight. I had actually liked how it was shifting from obvious bad guy to two sides that are both good and bad that are drawn into conflict with each other. I think that type of story line is just not done enough.

If you do have her in Haven then we can get a lot of internal politics going and part of it can be which faction does she end up joining.
Keeping the MDM but having it introduced more gradually would be good. I actually have a lot of ideas about this spawning hella fast, but I think I'm gonna save most of them for @AKuz.

It kind of makes sense, they went the equality then bread and circus route and by the time they realized they screwed up it was too late to fix without making hard decisions that no one would make. I really loved how we got some Haven POV from the ruling elite on how their economy was dictating their expansion and how some systems were a money sink to invade and control.
The way I figure it, Haven makes most sense if you look at it as the combination of a status quo that was deliberately created and enforced, PLUS the unintended side effects of that status quo.

It's like, you have to begin by assuming the first generation of Legislaturalist politicians meant to create a permanent oligarchy with themselves and their cronies at the top, and intentionally distorted the political process in order to do so. They may have honestly thought they were making Haven great and all, but they did it in a way that they had to know would lead to self-aggrandizement, and that created massive long-term problems.

To make matters worse, all the major decisions that turned the PRH into what it "is" as of the start of the series were made by pre-prolong politicans; I suspect that none of the key responsible parties lived long enough to perceive and remedy their own fuckups. The system got worse over a period of something like 150 years, and each new layer of fuckup was added on, incrementally, by a generation of leaders who thought of the pre-existing level of fuckuppery as "the new normal."
 
Thanks for the info. Given the average Yrillians diplomacy rolls being pretty high and on par with the snakepit annual roles, I think it is likely that those techs affect all rolls.

Also the anydice formulas are a bit more off since they don't include the individual dice outcomes of 0. Proper formula is: 2d{-10..10}+x
Ah, I took u10 as being a 1 to 10 with a random + or - in front of it.
 
Honestly, you wouldn't need an Honor-analogue on the other side, just having Pavel in charge would make the whole thing a disaster for Manticore by default. :D

I can place this exact moment. This is right before Cordelia Ransom walks in his door in In Enemy Hands, forcing him to take a emergency sober-up shot and then suppress even more nausea than usual.

Yes! It's literally my favorite scene in the entire series.

I'd be interested in this!

Serious question though: Will Haven still have their economy inexplicably crippled by EVIL LIBERALS?

If I had to address it I'd probably turn to French Revolution era stuff to really dig into the supposed source era. Aristocracy sucking up wealth for themselves and a fixation on not taxing the people with the money. Have all sorts of interior and external trade limitations that benefit only the nobles on the ground. Add the BLS onto the bottom... very few people actually pay wealth into the system.

Instead of the origin being EVIL LIEBRALS, I'd take Weber at his word on Haven's origin being in the modern US and say that the system got hit by regulatory capture from companies with the corporate bigwigs and the politicians becoming one and the same. On the other hand before the system became entrenched reformers managed to get a lot of liberal policies in place but political/capital class still kept the obsession with constantly lowering taxes in place causing the whole project to end up constantly underfunded and the corporate monopolies now fused with the state using regulation to strangle competition and any attempt at reform. So you get things that look like the government stepping in to regulate trade and force people to use certain services, but the real issue is that a Huge corp Legislaturalist scion used that regulation to make for everyone on Smallwerld to use their services or go to jail a hundred years ago and now Huge corp is now the People's National Huge Service and they don't give a shit about providing services and have the Mental Hygiene Police poke you with a taser if you don't use PNHS services.

So you can't change the system from the bottom because the BLS and what social security net there is is all that keeps the average man on the street from dying of poor and there is not will to change on the top because they have everything they want (And the crippling fear of it ending and taking them with it)

Of course I'll have to think on it some more.
 
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@AKuz

I actually like the idea that Haven is different in that their political class sort of turned on, nationalized, and effectively cannibalized their corporate power structures, rather than going down the usual (Solarian-esque) route of selling out to them. It makes Haven noticeably different from, say, revolutionary-era France in that there was already a promised Revolution, and it went sour, and now people are trying to figure out what went wrong. Was the whole revolution a misguided idea? Should they violently double down on it? Would just resetting the whole system from scratch work somehow?

The Legislaturalist system hasn't just "existed forever" the way the ancien regime did; Haven was in fact different a few hundred years ago. We know this. Exploring how things went to hell in a handbasket strikes me as part of the fun of trying to reimagine Haven.

I also have my own notions about how the welfare state and citizenship work in Manticore, to the extent that it seems like Manticore and Haven are both failed democracies- only in Manticore very few people have votes but the votes matter quite a bit, while in Haven everybody votes and the votes hardly matter at all.

But I said a lot about this in my PMs and maybe we can work on it. :)
 
@AKuz

I actually like the idea that Haven is different in that their political class sort of turned on, nationalized, and effectively cannibalized their corporate power structures, rather than going down the usual (Solarian-esque) route of selling out to them. It makes Haven noticeably different from, say, revolutionary-era France in that there was already a promised Revolution, and it went sour, and now people are trying to figure out what went wrong. Was the whole revolution a misguided idea? Should they violently double down on it? Would just resetting the whole system from scratch work somehow?

The Legislaturalist system hasn't just "existed forever" the way the ancien regime did; Haven was in fact different a few hundred years ago. We know this. Exploring how things went to hell in a handbasket strikes me as part of the fun of trying to reimagine Haven.

I also have my own notions about how the welfare state and citizenship work in Manticore, to the extent that it seems like Manticore and Haven are both failed democracies- only in Manticore very few people have votes but the votes matter quite a bit, while in Haven everybody votes and the votes hardly matter at all.

But I said a lot about this in my PMs and maybe we can work on it. :)
Respectfully, Manticore's average citizens do have some voice; they can vote for the House of Commons. Said House had/has several powers that the House of Lords lacks, and by the time of the later books (I did have to look this up to remind myself), much of the financial power/rights ("the power of the purse") of the House of Lords was actually being transferred to the House of Commons.
So....I mean, I'm not sure how that's a "failed democracy, where very few people have votes"? :???:
 
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