To Boldly Go... (a Starfleet quest)

CyberFemme · Apr 8, 2017

[X] Plan Iron Lady
-[X] Retired Admiral Vitalia Yukiko Kahurangi - Personal Diplomatic Consultant (5pt cost for Starfleet, gain Special Asset)
-[X] Federalise Auxiliary Units from Tellar: One Cargo Ship (2 Cost from Tellar)
-[X] Federalise Fleet Units from Vulcan: 1 Oberth (1 cost from Vulcan)
-[X] Federalise Fleet Units from Rigel: 1 Oda-Gach (1 cost from Rigel)
-[X] Dhara Heavy Industry Park - Heavy Industry (5 Cost to Andoria, gain Heavy Industry asset)
-[X] UESPA Deep Space Engineering - Engineering Team (10 Cost from United Earth, gain Engineering Team with 2 Engineering Ships, 3 Cargo Ships, 1 Freighter)
-[X] Vulcan Survey Corps - Recon team (3 cost for Vulcan, gain +1 to outpost and starbase atttempts to detect incoming ships, gain 1 Civilian Research Cruiser)
-[X] Andorian Orbital Guard Runabouts (3 cost for Andorian Guard, gain +1 to outpost and starbase atttempts to detect incoming ships)

SynchronizedWritersBlock · Apr 8, 2017

Simon_Jester said:
They almost certainly lack the context to understand subtleties that the courtiers would notice. The courtiers are members of the same species raised in that culture from birth for several decades. They're a bunch of foreign aliens, not fully trusted by anyone, who didn't even know the Licori species existed five years ago. How could they POSSIBLY deduce enough to know everything the rest of the court knows?

It depends. In the actual novel Dune, the great houses make a very good show of public obeisance to the Emperor even while at least some of them secretly work behind the scenes to subvert his commands or even overthrow him. Why would you expect anything different here? There have been many societies throughout history where the nobility loudly protested their loyalty to a monarch right up until the moment their daggers literally entered his back. It would take quite a bit of observation and analysis to tell who's honestly loyal to the king and who's faking it.

Maybe they assume he doesn't need to. Maybe all those secret meetings between the Emperor and his senior nobles are him privately dictating to them without humiliating them in public by ordering them around like commoners. At best, all that this would prove is that the Emperor isn't an absolute god-king who rules with such utter tyranny that his most powerful subject is like a mouse compared to him. There's a big gap between "not an absolute god-king" and "first among equals." Even historical kings we imagine as absolute monarchs, like Louis XIV, were often very careful about how they went about ordering around the most powerful of their 'subjects,' who were princes in their own right and treated with all the honors of their rank.

But how would a Martian arriving at the court of Louis XIV, with no prior personal experience of feudal monarchy and only a vague concept of how it works, figure out what fraction of the fancy talk at Versailles is just noise and propaganda about the "Sun King," and what fraction is serious, and what fraction is Louis pretending to have more direct control over things than he really does, in hopes of one day turning the illusion of power into the reality?

Very much this.

The Licori don't have computers as we know them, remember? There's not much evidence that they HAVE an Internet. Even if they did, it could very easily be full of pro-Great-House firewalls and bugs, plus loyal adherents of the Houses and the Emperor who genuinely believe in the political fictions that underlie their society.

Would a Martian visiting Earth be able to use the Internet as a reliable tool for deducing the true nature of the regimes running Earth's largest countries? Which blog posts would they ignore?

Closed societies do not explain how things really work in their high school civics textbooks. I mean seriously, what the heck?

I like almost everything about this post. But if we really do need to figure out more about the houses and which ones we can favor and talk to, why don't we get an External Diplo team so we can find out?

Simon_Jester · Apr 8, 2017

Because we also urgently need physical security in case some Licori (possibly a madman or renegade) decides to force the pace of events. We're going to have to strike a balance.

Remember, even if war is declared, we don't have to launch an immediate, devastating, all-out attack. Especially not if we've got side channels to the noble houses explaining to them what we really want and that we're willing to leave them every bit of power they now have, if they'll stop their reckless experiments.

EDIT:

The difference between Starfleet and the FDS isn't so much that the FDS does diplomatic work and Starfleet doesn't. It's that Starfleet negotiates with its weapons ready to hand, and can make it *very* clear it will not tolerate aggression or provocation. The FDS has more trouble accomplishing that.

In this case, handling these negotiations the Starfleet way means talking but also fortifying Betazed and Gaen.

Briefvoice · Apr 8, 2017

SynchronizedWritersBlock said:
I like almost everything about this post. But if we really do need to figure out more about the houses and which ones we can favor and talk to, why don't we get an External Diplo team so we can find out?

Because other stuff is more important.

SynchronizedWritersBlock · Apr 8, 2017

Simon_Jester said:
Remember, even if war is declared, we don't have to launch an immediate, devastating, all-out attack. Especially not if we've got side channels to the noble houses explaining to them what we really want and that we're willing to leave them every bit of power they now have, if they'll stop their reckless experiments.

We won't have those side channels if we don't have enough External Diplo teams to actually do the talking. Either we can get working on them now, when we've told the President both that we should talk to the houses and that we should delay, or we'll be behind when we do decide we want to be able to hold side-channel talks.

Basically, if you want talks, you need this diplo team. There's no excusing it at this juncture.

Simon_Jester said:
In this case, handling these negotiations the Starfleet way means talking but also fortifying Betazed and Gaen.

But we aren't talking.

We have thirty-five starships sitting there for security purposes. A handful more at this juncture won't do much, because we aren't using the others for warfare yet.

Briefvoice said:
Because other stuff is more important.

As above, we aren't even using the assets we already have yet.

AlphaDelta · Apr 8, 2017

Briefvoice said:
Because other stuff is more important.

After war is declared, we can still mobilize. We don't actually have to go on the offensive. We can park our fleets and have them flood the quarantine zone with a patrol. We can still mobilize. However, after war is declared, diplomatic options are limited.

Until the last minute, I'd like to try to avert war.

Simon_Jester · Apr 8, 2017

SynchronizedWritersBlock said:
We won't have those side channels if we don't have enough External Diplo teams to actually do the talking. Either we can get working on them now, when we've told the President both that we should talk to the houses and that we should delay, or we'll be behind when we do decide we want to be able to hold side-channel talks.

Basically, if you want told talks, you need this diplo team. There's no excusing it at this juncture.

If we want to hold talks, and we just told the president so, the FDS is at least going to try. If they fail, they fail, but it buys time. We're not the only ones who can do diplomacy, but we ARE the only ones who can build fortifications.

We have thirty-five starships sitting there for security purposes. A handful more at this juncture won't do much, because we aren't using the others for warfare yet.

As illustrated by the T'Mir exercise, starship patrols are good but don't fully replace having functioning starbases and fixed sensor networks in place. We need both, and as soon as practical.

SynchronizedWritersBlock · Apr 8, 2017

AlphaDelta said:
After war is declared, we can still mobilize. We don't actually have to go on the offensive. We can park our fleets and have them flood the quarantine zone with a patrol. We can still mobilize. However, after war is declared, diplomatic options are limited.

Until the last minute, I'd like to try to avert war.

Exactly. Simon, you yourself are arguing to slow mobilize the war:

Simon_Jester said:
Remember, even if war is declared, we don't have to launch an immediate, devastating, all-out attack. Especially not if we've got side channels to the noble houses explaining to them what we really want and that we're willing to leave them every bit of power they now have, if they'll stop their reckless experiments.

That means we will be able to hold TF1, TF2, and TF3 as patrol forces until we choose to use them. Meanwhile, people will tend to listen to you better if you don't declare war on them. We need that diplo team now, not later.

As you've seen, the FDS isn't exactly on top of the situation. More resources are needed. e: And the EC ships alone are just as good as a starbase sensor-wise. e2: And I'm still voting to get a heavy industry asset to rush that Betazed starbase.

Simon_Jester · Apr 8, 2017

Suffice to say, I'm arguing that we need both physical and diplomatic preparations and am offering a plan that (combined with last fortnight's plan) splits the difference. You're offering something much closer to 'all diplomacy all the time' as an option. At this point I think I'd be doing a disservice to the people who voted for my plan by abandoning it, though I don't think it's a question of right or wrong as such which one they choose to vote for.

SynchronizedWritersBlock · Apr 8, 2017

Simon_Jester said:
Suffice to say, I'm arguing that we need both physical and diplomatic preparations and am offering a plan that (combined with last fortnight's plan) splits the difference. You're offering something much closer to 'all diplomacy all the time' as an option. At this point I think I'd be doing a disservice to the people who voted for my plan by abandoning it, though I don't think it's a question of right or wrong as such which one they choose to vote for.

There's no diplomacy there, though. That's what baffles me. You're saying to continue the course, but you do realize our only external diplo team is locked on a "begin to build support" option that will take multiple turns? There's no splitting happening.

People who namevoted you gave you the right to change their vote. There's no disservice there at all. There were plan names available for them.

Anyway, I'm heading to bed, but I'll say this for anyone undecided.

We need to obtain an external diplomatic team, and the only plan that does that is
[ ] Plan 11th hour diplomacy

Otherwise we are reliant on the FDS, who will be focused on the talks happening with the Emperor's representatives. I will note that our existing team is on a "begin to build support" option for the Gaeni which is very necessary, so we can't rely on having it either. Even if the FDS comes through for us and we're confident we can leave things in their hands, we still need that second external team so we can "build support" with the Gaeni and Ked Paddah at the same time.

Not getting an external diplomacy asset is saying we don't want to direct diplomacy, which we very much want to do.

lbmaian · Apr 8, 2017

SynchronizedWritersBlock said:
That means we will be able to hold TF1, TF2, and TF3 as patrol forces until we choose to use them. Meanwhile, people will tend to listen to you better if you don't declare war on them. We need that diplo team now, not later.

As you've seen, the FDS isn't exactly on top of the situation. More resources are needed. e: And the EC ships alone are just as good as a starbase sensor-wise. e2: And I'm still voting to get a heavy industry asset to rush that Betazed starbase.

Hmm, this is a pretty good argument as long as we know that the task forces are operational right now, instead of still in the process of being mustered. If all the task forces are focused on patrolling the LBZ and everything is basically still within Fed territory, then we can delay extra runabouts and patrol ships and auxiliary ships until later.

Basically, just focus on the stuff that's very likely to be important to get moving as early as possible: diplomacy, starbase building, doctrine.

I'm still unsure about an extra external diplomacy team being really needed, or that diplomacy to avoid war is even realistic at this point though.

edit: oops posted too early, finished thoughts

SynchronizedWritersBlock · Apr 8, 2017

lbmaian said:
Hmm, this is a pretty good argument as long as we know that the task forces are operational right now, instead of still in the process of being mustered. If all the task forces are focused on patrolling the LBZ and everything is basically still within Fed territory, then we can delay extra runabouts and patrol ships and auxiliary ships until later.

Basically, just focus on the stuff that's very likely to be important to get moving as early as possible: diplomacy, starbase building, doctrine.

Exactly. Which is everything I'm voting to do.

It would also be nice to get our EC ships on detached duty up until the wardec, but I don't know if @OneirosTheWriter will give us that option.

e: even if diplomacy to avoid the war fails, we will still develop channels and obtain information needed when it's time to end the war. Or even direct our fleets if we know which houses seem receptive

Simon_Jester · Apr 8, 2017

SynchronizedWritersBlock said:
There's no diplomacy there, though. That's what baffles me. You're saying to continue the course, but you do realize our only external diplo team is locked on a "begin to build support" option that will take multiple turns? There's no splitting happening.

People who namevoted you gave you the right to change their vote. There's no disservice there at all. There were plan names available for them.

We drafted diplomats last turn, we can draft more next turn- it's about whether we spend two straight turns almost entirely on diplomacy, or whether we combine diplomacy and fortifications. The overall picture is about more than one week at a time.

Not getting an external diplomacy asset is saying we don't want to direct diplomacy, which we very much want to do.

Me, I disagree. I think it's me saying we can afford to wait two weeks to start.

lbmaian · Apr 8, 2017

Alright, finally catching up with all the latest posts.

Assuming that the task forces are at least partially formed by now and are all pretty much on patrol duty while waiting for war to be declared, we should have sufficient patrol forces around the LBZ area that we can delay adding more runabouts and patrol ships.

Still not quite sure about the external diplomacy team now as opposed to later, but I can see the synergies behind focusing more on diplomacy if that's what we're telling the president.

Fortunately, despite coming up with the Grey Lady plan (itself a revised version of the Iron Lady plan), no one's delegated their vote to me, so I can change to:

[X] Plan 11th hour diplomacy

fitzgerald · Apr 8, 2017

[x] Plan 11th hour diplomacy
-[x] Generate Generic External Diplomacy Team from United Earth (10 Cost to Starfleet, 5 Cost to Member World, gain External Diplomacy Team)
-[x] Retired Admiral Vitalia Yukiko Kahurangi - Personal Diplomatic Consultant (5pt cost for Starfleet, gain Special Asset)
-[x] Dhara Heavy Industry Park - Heavy Industry (5 Cost to Andoria, gain Heavy Industry asset)
-[x] Retired Vice Admiral Heidi Eriksson - Doctrine Specialist (5pt Cost to Starfleet, gain Doctrine Specialist)

kyuden · Apr 8, 2017

[x] Plan 11th hour diplomacy

OneirosTheWriter · Apr 8, 2017

Okay, so my football team lost to the team Ford Prefect follows.

So everything sucks atm :C

Aside from that, vote closes in four hours. I'll try to get together the captains log post this evening.

Simon_Jester · Apr 8, 2017

The big problem I see with "11th hour diplomacy" is that there's no room in it for engineering detachments. Consequently, there are a lot of projects we'd be giving up on, that we might otherwise want to start moving next turn. Such as large-scale sensor networks so we can secure not only the homeworld star(s) but adjacent stars.

Basically, we're deferring our capacity to build physical defenses, to maximize our diplomatic options and deploy them as fast as possible. Instead of getting engineers now and diplomats two weeks from now, we do it the other way around.

I'm not really comfortable with that because it seems to me that NO ONE will even be trying to do the engineers' job if we don't do it, while the civilian government WILL at least make an effort to engage in diplomacy along the lines we're pretty clearly going to recommend to the president. By themselves they may not be successful but surely they'll at least buy us a couple of weeks.

"Plan Iron Lady" for this specific week doesn't hire more diplomats this week, but if it wins I'm going to be pushing for diplomats next turn precisely to keep the scales balanced. I'm basically hoping to get teams in a broad selection of areas, so that we can meet a broad array of needs, rather than hyperfocusing on one strategy we hope will prove effective at resolving the crisis and hoping we won't need other approaches.

lbmaian · Apr 8, 2017

I wouldn't say it's hyperfocused on diplomacy to the point it's ignoring other long-term projects.

Like all the plans, the heavy engineer team is going to be allocated for the Betazed starbase. It's also getting a doctrine team that the Iron Lady plan lacks. It's particularly that lack of doctrine team that's a dealbreaker for me with that plan. For me, it's either a choice between the Grey Lady or 11th hour diplomacy plans.

The primary reason I'm going for the 11th hour diplomacy plan is that the swamping of the LBZ with all the mustering task forces gives us time to get more patrol ships or recon runabouts later, before the majority of those task forces move out and prosecute the war. If not for that, I'd revert back to the Grey Lady plan.

Regarding the engineering team: we know that listening posts normally take about a quarter to build, given how we started them in Q2 and they started being narratively mentioned as producing results by Q3. It's the outposts that I'd expect to take longer to build, given the example in GBZ, but I also suspect we'd need 2 heavy industry teams to work on both the Betazed starbase AND a new outpost at once.

I've already voiced my objections to the extra cargo ship in the Iron Lady plan, and the latest logistic network details that Oneiros just posted only reinforce that opinion (8 cargo ships and 3 freighters are overkill for the force, engineering teams for outposts come with their own auxiliary ships). But arguing over a single cargo ship is quibbling at this point.

edit: grammar

Simon_Jester · Apr 8, 2017

Hm.

I'm tempted at this point, honestly, to vote "Grey Lady." A lot of information has been revealed about cargo and logistics that I either didn't know 24 hours ago,

Furthermore, caucusing the votes proxied to me along with the existing "Grey Lady" votes would give a very solid majority/plurality to the "Grey Lady" plan. And I really am concerned that two straight turns of focusing primarily on diplomacy at the expense of physical defenses could cost us if things get, for lack of a better term, physical.

But I feel like that would be an underhanded trick, so I'm going to refrain. If "11th Hour" can build up an honest ~~majority~~ plurality at, well, the eleventh hour... it's an interestingly different strategy and maybe it will work.

[Hell, I've been in the same position of trying to argue with a bandwagon that started rolling hours before I arrived; I don't envy SWB the task of trying to change things and would be a real louse if I did something sneaky to snatch a victory away from him- if he manages to earn it]

For reference, my own plan vote (buried several pages ago) is:

[][PRESIDENT] Seek Individual Diplomatic Contact with Major Licori Houses
[][PRESIDENT] Need to focus on the Ked Paddah
[][PRESIDENT] Addressing Council Division

[] Plan Iron Lady
-[] Retired Admiral Vitalia Yukiko Kahurangi - Personal Diplomatic Consultant (5pt cost for Starfleet, gain Special Asset)
-[] Federalise Auxiliary Units from Tellar: One Cargo Ship (2 Cost from Tellar)
-[] Federalise Fleet Units from Vulcan: 1 Oberth (1 cost from Vulcan)
-[] Federalise Fleet Units from Rigel: 1 Oda-Gach (1 cost from Rigel)
-[] Dhara Heavy Industry Park - Heavy Industry (5 Cost to Andoria, gain Heavy Industry asset)
-[] UESPA Deep Space Engineering - Engineering Team (10 Cost from United Earth, gain Engineering Team with 2 Engineering Ships, 3 Cargo Ships, 1 Freighter)
-[] Vulcan Survey Corps - Recon team (3 cost for Vulcan, gain +1 to outpost and starbase atttempts to detect incoming ships, gain 1 Civilian Research Cruiser)
-[] Andorian Orbital Guard Runabouts (3 cost for Andorian Guard, gain +1 to outpost and starbase atttempts to detect incoming ships)

As I write this, "Plan Iron Lady" is currently leading 14-13-9, with SynchronizedWritersBlock's "Plan 11th hour diplomacy" replacing the bulk of this material with an external diplomacy team, and "Plan Grey Lady" replacing the Andorian runabouts and the cargo ship with Vice Admiral Erikson.

JesseJ · Apr 8, 2017

[X][PRESIDENT] Seek Individual Diplomatic Contact with Major Licori Houses
[X][PRESIDENT] Need to focus on the Ked Paddah
[X][PRESIDENT] Addressing Council Division

[X] Plan Iron Lady

lbmaian · Apr 8, 2017

"Need to focus on the Ked Paddah" and "Need to hold off and investigate further" votes are now tied.

Simon_Jester said:
I'm tempted at this point, honestly, to vote "Grey Lady." A lot of information has been revealed about cargo and logistics that I either didn't know 24 hours ago,

I'm curious to know what new information there would've changed your mind. The stuff that reinforced my decision is more about confirmation of known logistics details that are apparent from the GBZ status post. There's a lot of useful details there, including an outpost that's being constructed for reference!

nocarename said:
Now, some analysis.
Assuming that we started at ~50% capacity on our cargo network, which seems fair, we were originally using 2 freighters and 6 cargo ships.
Since we are in the hole for 5 freighters and 8 cargo ships at the moment, over the course of the game (call it 14 years since we're in 2314Q4) demand has grown by 7 freighters and 14 cargo ships. To bring things, assuming no further growth, back under 50% would require 14 freighters and 48 cargo ships.
Um.
Yeah.
(For those keeping score at home, this is more than the Licori shipping capacity at our highest estimates by at least 50% in our nearest class. So there's your relative scale right there.)

How are you getting 14 freighters and 48 cargo ships? I think you might have flipped some numbers around.

Starfleet likely has had 12 cargo ships and 4 freighters since at least mid 2300s, assuming none were constructed since Rogers was forcefully retired, and has been federalizing auxiliary ships to keep up with demand, resulting in growing Development faction dissatisfaction that culminated in the 2310 snakepit deal that led to the Amarki auxiliary shipyard being constructed.

We're definitely a max capacity. I'm not sure if the logistics capacity is explicitly including all the stuff we're constructing (3 colonies, 1 starbase, 2 shipyards, helping 1 Apiata outpost), some of which is exposed in the GBZ status page - if it is, than "normal" capacity that's just colony and fleet upkeep is lower than this.

But let's assume that our current capacity is going to be the normal upkeep capacity in the near future that should comprise 50% of total capacity to remove all logistics strain. Then we need a total fleet capacity of 40 cargo ships and 18 freighters. Or 28 more cargo ships and 14 more freighters.

edit: That said, it may be normal for Starfleet to be closer to 100% logistics capacity than the member nations, relying on the ability to draw on member merchant marine. So maybe only need 20% or so more than current capacity to avoid annoying member fleets?

Algalon · Apr 8, 2017

[X][PRESIDENT] Addressing Council Division
[X][PRESIDENT] Need to hold off and investigate further
[X][PRESIDENT] Seek Individual Diplomatic Contact with Major Licori Houses

[x] Plan 11th hour diplomacy

UberJJK · Apr 8, 2017

OneirosTheWriter said:
Okay, so my football team lost to the team Ford Prefect follows.

So everything sucks atm :C

Aside from that, vote closes in four hours. I'll try to get together the captains log post this evening.

It's been 4.5 hours so this should be the final tally:
Vote Tally : Sci-Fi - To Boldly Go... (a Starfleet quest) | Page 1681 | Sufficient Velocity
##### NetTally 1.7.4

[X] Plan Iron Lady
-[X] Retired Admiral Vitalia Yukiko Kahurangi - Personal Diplomatic Consultant (5pt cost for Starfleet, gain Special Asset)
-[X] Federalise Auxiliary Units from Tellar: One Cargo Ship (2 Cost from Tellar)
-[X] Federalise Fleet Units from Vulcan: 1 Oberth (1 cost from Vulcan)
-[X] Federalise Fleet Units from Rigel: 1 Oda-Gach (1 cost from Rigel)
-[X] Dhara Heavy Industry Park - Heavy Industry (5 Cost to Andoria, gain Heavy Industry asset)
-[X] UESPA Deep Space Engineering - Engineering Team (10 Cost from United Earth, gain Engineering Team with 2 Engineering Ships, 3 Cargo Ships, 1 Freighter)
-[X] Vulcan Survey Corps - Recon team (3 cost for Vulcan, gain +1 to outpost and starbase atttempts to detect incoming ships, gain 1 Civilian Research Cruiser)
-[X] Andorian Orbital Guard Runabouts (3 cost for Andorian Guard, gain +1 to outpost and starbase atttempts to detect incoming ships)
No. of Votes: 15

Plan: ◈Iron Lady
Aeondrac
Chaos Blade
Crazy Tom
Deathbybunnies
Driven by Apathy
Gingganz
JesseJ
Jrin
Mr Tebbs
Muramasa
Night
pheonix89
Simon_Jester
tryrar
UbeOne

[x] Plan 11th hour diplomacy
-[x] Generate Generic External Diplomacy Team from United Earth (10 Cost to Starfleet, 5 Cost to Member World, gain External Diplomacy Team)
-[x] Retired Admiral Vitalia Yukiko Kahurangi - Personal Diplomatic Consultant (5pt cost for Starfleet, gain Special Asset)
-[x] Dhara Heavy Industry Park - Heavy Industry (5 Cost to Andoria, gain Heavy Industry asset)
-[x] Retired Vice Admiral Heidi Eriksson - Doctrine Specialist (5pt Cost to Starfleet, gain Doctrine Specialist)
No. of Votes: 14

Plan: ◈11th hour diplomacy
aeqnai
Algalon
AlphaDelta
ctulhuslp
Erandil
fitzgerald
Gnarker
Godwinson
kyuden
lbmaian
MTB
Steven Kodaly
SynchronizedWritersBlock
Theunderbolt

[X] Plan Grey Lady
-[X] Retired Admiral Vitalia Yukiko Kahurangi - Personal Diplomatic Consultant (5pt cost for Starfleet, gain Special Asset)
-[X] Retired Vice Admiral Heidi Eriksson - Doctrine Specialist (5pt Cost to Starfleet, gain Doctrine Specialist)
-[X] Dhara Heavy Industry Park - Heavy Industry (5 Cost to Andoria, gain Heavy Industry asset)
-[X] UESPA Deep Space Engineering - Engineering Team (10 Cost from United Earth, gain Engineering Team with 2 Engineering Ships, 3 Cargo Ships, 1 Freighter)
-[X] Vulcan Survey Corps - Recon team (3 cost for Vulcan, gain +1 to outpost and starbase atttempts to detect incoming ships, gain 1 Civilian Research Cruiser)
-[X] Federalise Fleet Units from <Vulcan> (5 cost for explorer, 2 cost for cruiser, 1 cost for frigate, paid against member world you are calling up fleet units from): Oberth (1 cost)
-[X] Federalise Fleet Units from <Rigel> (5 cost for explorer, 2 cost for cruiser, 1 cost for frigate, paid against member world you are calling up fleet units from): Oda-Gach (1 cost)
No. of Votes: 9

Plan: ◈Grey Lady
Ato
Briefvoice
ClawClawBite
Glassware
Kyushiro
Nervos Belli
pbluekan
Random Member
UberJJK

[X] Plan Diplomacy and Planning
-[X] Generate Generic Internal Diplomacy Team from Earth (10 Cost to Starfleet, 5 Cost to Member World, gain Internal Diplomacy Team)
-[X] Retired Vice Admiral Heidi Eriksson - Doctrine Specialist (5pt Cost to Starfleet, gain Doctrine Specialist)
-[X] Retired Admiral Vitalia Yukiko Kahurangi - Personal Diplomatic Consultant (5pt cost for Starfleet, gain Special Asset)
-[X] Vulcan Survey Corps - Recon team (3 cost for Vulcan, gain +1 to outpost and starbase atttempts to detect incoming ships, gain 1 Civilian Research Cruiser)
-[X] Federalise Auxiliary Units from Tellar (3 cost for freighter, 2 cost for cargo ship, 3 cost for other auxiliary units) : 1 cargo ship
No. of Votes: 1

Plan: ◈Diplomacy and Planning
Nix

[X] Plan "Spread the Love"
-[X] UESPA Deep Space Engineering - Engineering Team (10 Cost from United Earth, gain Engineering Team with 2 Engineering Ships, 3 Cargo Ships, 1 Freighter)
-[X] Shorc Xurth Resource Combine - Heavy Industry (5 Cost to Tellar, gain Heavy Industry asset)
-[X] Andorian Orbital Guard Runabouts (3 cost for Andorian Guard, gain +1 to outpost and starbase atttempts to detect incoming ships)
-[X] Retired Admiral Vitalia Yukiko Kahurangi - Personal Diplomatic Consultant (5pt cost for Starfleet, gain Special Asset)
-[X] Federalise Fleet Units from Vulcan - their Oberth (1 cost for frigate, paid against member world you are calling up fleet units from)
-[X] Federalise Auxiliary Units from Betazed - Freighter(3 cost for freighter)
-[X] Federalise Auxiliary Units from Rigil - Freighter(3 cost for freighter)
-
No. of Votes: 1

Plan: ◈"Spread the Love"
Goat

[X] Plan "Smart, Not Hard"
-[X] Retired Admiral Vitalia Yukiko Kahurangi - Personal Diplomatic Consultant (5pt cost for Starfleet, gain Special Asset)
-[X] Retired Vice Admiral Heidi Eriksson - Doctrine Specialist (5pt Cost to Starfleet, gain Doctrine Specialist)
-[X] Generate Generic Internal Diplomacy Team from Earth (10 Cost to Starfleet, 5 Cost to Member World, gain Internal Diplomacy Team)
-[X] Generate Generic External Diplomacy Team from Earth (10 Cost to Starfleet, 5 Cost to Member World, gain External Diplomacy Team)
No. of Votes: 0

Plan: ◈"Smart, Not Hard"

——————————————————————————————————————————————
Task: PRESIDENT

[X][PRESIDENT] Addressing Council Division
No. of Votes: 32

[X][PRESIDENT] Seek Individual Diplomatic Contact with Major Licori Houses
No. of Votes: 28

[X][PRESIDENT] Need to hold off and investigate further
No. of Votes: 18

Ato
aeqnai
Algalon
AlphaDelta
Chaos Blade
chriswriter90
ctulhuslp
Erandil
Gingganz
Gnarker
Godwinson
MTB
pbluekan
pheonix89
Steven Kodaly
SynchronizedWritersBlock
Theunderbolt
Nix

[X][PRESIDENT] Need to focus on the Ked Paddah
No. of Votes: 17

Simon_Jester
Aeondrac
Briefvoice
chriswriter90
ClawClawBite
Deathbybunnies
Driven by Apathy
Glassware
JesseJ
Jrin
Mr Tebbs
Muramasa
Nervos Belli
Night
tryrar
UbeOne
Nix

[X][PRESIDENT] Insufficient Exit Strategy
No. of Votes: 9

Goat
Ato
Briefvoice
ClawClawBite
Erandil
Glassware
Nervos Belli
Random Member
UberJJK

[X][PRESIDENT] Request Diplomatic Summit with all Major Licori Houses
No. of Votes: 3

Driven by Apathy
Mr Tebbs
Nix

[X][PRESIDENT] "Fire and replace the FDS top brass."
No. of Votes: 1

Leila Hann

[X][PRESIDENT] Chance for further diplomacy
No. of Votes: 1

Goat

Total No. of Voters: 42

Steven Kodaly · Apr 8, 2017

Simon_Jester said:
The big problem I see with "11th hour diplomacy" is that there's no room in it for engineering detachments. Consequently, there are a lot of projects we'd be giving up on, that we might otherwise want to start moving next turn. Such as large-scale sensor networks so we can secure not only the homeworld star(s) but adjacent stars.

Basically, we're deferring our capacity to build physical defenses, to maximize our diplomatic options and deploy them as fast as possible. Instead of getting engineers now and diplomats two weeks from now, we do it the other way around.

I'm of the opinion that we need lots of diplomatic teams, both internally and externally focused. There are several Arcadian Great Houses that will need to be diplomatically maneuvered either simultaneously or in quick succession; we also need to shore up internal support across several Federation member populations. We need to begin shoring up that internal support before going whole-hog on the industrial and engineering push.

I think we need a diplomatic team and some sort of infrastructure-related team every turn from here on.

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