Really? You would think the Vulcan govt have an issue since its their space that got experimented on.
Its logical to ask why they felt the need to enter without gaining permission.
To Boldly Go... (a Starfleet quest)
- Thread starter OneirosTheWriter
- Start date
- Sci-Fi
-
- Tags
- star trek exploration fully automated luxury gay space communism top level canon (canon) #hashtagcontent all-encompassing space amoeba cardassian boy bands cardassian magical girls darkest bureaucracy debate makes the qm cackle like palpatine hoh is an empire quest it has to be foreign infiltrators more ships ship happens singers delenda est starfleet this is not an empire quest ur waifu is collective?
Really? You would think the Vulcan govt have an issue since its their space that got experimented on.
Its logical to ask why they felt the need to enter without gaining permission.
- Location
- Mid-Atlantic
Given the attitude the Federation has shown historically, the mentat had a right to be there, but not a right to ignore navigation or traffic regulations, and not a right to poke a quantum filament without permission.
Actually, Romulans took considerable pains to arrange a reciprocal agreement involving both themselves and the Federation not allowing each other freedom of navigation.
But it's okay. Y'all can stop paranoiding. If you want, we can all start flying our spaceships around again and not smack into a Neutral Zone like a bird into a windowpane. Because it's okay. We loves youse, and your green paint.
- Location
- California
Huh. All three of our first wave EC captains are back together again.
I'm sure this promises to be suitable epic.
AKuz
Been Better
- Location
- A Rising Tide of Horrors
- Pronouns
- She/Her
Given the attitude the Federation has shown historically, the mentat had a right to be there, but not a right to ignore navigation or traffic regulations, and not a right to poke a quantum filament without permission.
Actually, Romulans took considerable pains to arrange a reciprocal agreement involving both themselves and the Federation not allowing each other freedom of navigation.
But it's okay. Y'all can stop paranoiding. If you want, we can all start flying our spaceships around again and not smack into a Neutral Zone like a bird into a windowpane. Because it's okay. We loves youse, and your green paint.
Romulan always still go where Romulan wants!
Romulan just not let Human know!
> : V
- Location
- Mid-Atlantic
It took you guys like 100 years to invent the cloaking device so you could do that.
You could have saved sooo much time. Time better spent on painting things green.
You could have saved sooo much time. Time better spent on painting things green.
- Location
- Mid-Atlantic
Well, if the Sydraxians give up on the Expanse entirely, then we've won a really, really big strategic victory- bigger than I expect and bigger than I think Ainsworth was aiming for.
If they don't, we'll have plenty of opportunities to pound on their ships later.
If they don't, we'll have plenty of opportunities to pound on their ships later.
- Location
- Patriarchova
I'm having trouble getting a read of the Sydraxians. They're supposedly all about glory and heroism, but at this point they've consistently behaved like cowardly opportunists who bully civilians into acting as bait for their ambushes and turn tail at the first sign of a powerful enemy.
They like any other govt with factions inside and they're not united.
- Location
- Austria
I fail to see a contradiction.
Well they stood their ground and fought when our armoured fist came for them, with equal numbers though greater weight and not retreating until their heavy units were in danger (mostly because the lighter units were no longer there to distract our gunners)
Sure they fled the second time - but that time we had weight, numbers, initiative and they were still able to withdraw in an orderly fashion leaving nothing moveable of value behind and getting all their non combat vessels out cleanly. How much of that was their skill and how much of it was our Admirals being just as happy to see them off, cannot tell from the report.
- Location
- Mid-Atlantic
I think Leila is more talking about the overall strategic posture and their raiding behaviors from a few years back. They did a lot of hit and run, and a few incidents of high profile treachery. Hm...
...
Maybe there's a popular subset of Sydraxian 'warrior-singer' culture that is basically gangsta rap, in which you gain status by boastfully singing of all the objectively horrible things you do to people? And where the Sydraxians have words that a Federation universal translator renders as 'honor' to describe your social standing as a dangerous fighting individual... but where those terms might more accurately be rendered as 'street cred.'
And what we've been dealing with is basically the Sydraxian gangster subculture running completely out of control, using a petty provocation as justification for a violent overreaction that allows them to hijack their society, establish political control, and get the Hierarchy into a war it can't win.
...
Sort of like plantation aristocrats in the antebellum South in the US, too- where, similarly, you had this very toxic culture of violence (look at the dueling customs of the era if you don't believe me) that was founded on an essentially hollow and oppressive system. As soon as something happened to give them an excuse to freak out and fight a war, they went for it- but showed no particular sign of being more 'honorable' or otherwise impressive and noble after that time.
Honor cultures can very easily use their 'values' as an excuse for horrible behavior, rather than as the gold standard for what constitutes good behavior.
...
Maybe there's a popular subset of Sydraxian 'warrior-singer' culture that is basically gangsta rap, in which you gain status by boastfully singing of all the objectively horrible things you do to people? And where the Sydraxians have words that a Federation universal translator renders as 'honor' to describe your social standing as a dangerous fighting individual... but where those terms might more accurately be rendered as 'street cred.'
And what we've been dealing with is basically the Sydraxian gangster subculture running completely out of control, using a petty provocation as justification for a violent overreaction that allows them to hijack their society, establish political control, and get the Hierarchy into a war it can't win.
...
Sort of like plantation aristocrats in the antebellum South in the US, too- where, similarly, you had this very toxic culture of violence (look at the dueling customs of the era if you don't believe me) that was founded on an essentially hollow and oppressive system. As soon as something happened to give them an excuse to freak out and fight a war, they went for it- but showed no particular sign of being more 'honorable' or otherwise impressive and noble after that time.
Honor cultures can very easily use their 'values' as an excuse for horrible behavior, rather than as the gold standard for what constitutes good behavior.
I understand where @Leila Hann is coming from -- part of the reason I was concerned about the Amarki not piling in is because I expected the Sydraxians to make Deva IX their Thermopylae, their Bastogne, their Battle off Samar. A glorious last stand against a superior foe, a battle where victory can be gained and even defeat can inflict terrible losses on the enemy. I expected Operation Ten-Go shit where they crashed a crippled battleship into a moon or something.
Instead they pack bags and leave. Weird. Watch as the Dylaarians fight us tooth and nail if we ever get up there.
Instead they pack bags and leave. Weird. Watch as the Dylaarians fight us tooth and nail if we ever get up there.
- Location
- Austria
Yep. Vocally and loudly "honourable" and "glorious" cultures are neither more honourable nor more glorious than those who do not boast so loudly about it. Amarkians being more honest and not-shallow about it are more surprising to me, and even they killed prisoners out of petty revenge, which far from honourable.
2313.Q3 - Master of Orion
- Location
- Australia
Alukk Daily News
The promotion of Rear Admiral Uhura to Vice Admiral has left an opening at the pinnacle of the Federation Task Force in Orion Space. The new Federation commander among our stars will be Rear Admiral Eaton, formerly in command of their space-going task force. Rear Admiral Eaton has been responsible for a number of successful operations against the Syndicate, though they were also aboard the USS Kearsage when it was attacked and crippled.
The Union President addressed the executive and wished the outgoing Vice Admiral well, thanking her for her service. She then wished Rear Admiral Eaton well, and called on her to continue Uhura's work protecting the local citizenry. The leader of the opposition suggested that this should have been taken as a chance to review the continued necessity of Federation involvement, which is seen in many quarters as clearly no longer relevant.
Commentators wonder if this disruption in the command structure of the Federation representation will disrupt the upcoming Constitutional Convention.
-
Anti-Slvery Task Force Progress Report
A campaign of assassinations is being waged, if only to middling success. The arrival of Argyle Bench Detectives has done much to punish the kingpins of these campaigns by swiftly cutting through their attempts at double-blinds and misdirection. Even so, a number of notables are deceased or injured, and many others are starting to feel concerned about appearing in public.
With four separate investigative bodies, plus the CFP, there have been a number of jurisdictional disputes. In particular, the Vulcan Central Inspectorate has a hard time coming to terms with the intuitive approaches of the Indorians and Betazoids. Commodore T'Lorel is doing her best to keep everyone pushing in the same direction, going so far as to carpet the head of the VCI delegation. I've never seen a Vulcan look rattled before, but whatever T'Lorel said to that detective, it had teeth.
The constitutional convention will be concluding shortly before the end of the year. This should give the Rigellian aid packages a chance to properly bolster the government against the economic fallout. We have high hopes that this will spell the end of the Syndicate as an alternative state, even if not as a criminal organisation.
[Total: +30 Impact, +15 Cost]
-
The promotion of Rear Admiral Uhura to Vice Admiral has left an opening at the pinnacle of the Federation Task Force in Orion Space. The new Federation commander among our stars will be Rear Admiral Eaton, formerly in command of their space-going task force. Rear Admiral Eaton has been responsible for a number of successful operations against the Syndicate, though they were also aboard the USS Kearsage when it was attacked and crippled.
The Union President addressed the executive and wished the outgoing Vice Admiral well, thanking her for her service. She then wished Rear Admiral Eaton well, and called on her to continue Uhura's work protecting the local citizenry. The leader of the opposition suggested that this should have been taken as a chance to review the continued necessity of Federation involvement, which is seen in many quarters as clearly no longer relevant.
Commentators wonder if this disruption in the command structure of the Federation representation will disrupt the upcoming Constitutional Convention.
-
Anti-Slvery Task Force Progress Report
A campaign of assassinations is being waged, if only to middling success. The arrival of Argyle Bench Detectives has done much to punish the kingpins of these campaigns by swiftly cutting through their attempts at double-blinds and misdirection. Even so, a number of notables are deceased or injured, and many others are starting to feel concerned about appearing in public.
With four separate investigative bodies, plus the CFP, there have been a number of jurisdictional disputes. In particular, the Vulcan Central Inspectorate has a hard time coming to terms with the intuitive approaches of the Indorians and Betazoids. Commodore T'Lorel is doing her best to keep everyone pushing in the same direction, going so far as to carpet the head of the VCI delegation. I've never seen a Vulcan look rattled before, but whatever T'Lorel said to that detective, it had teeth.
The constitutional convention will be concluding shortly before the end of the year. This should give the Rigellian aid packages a chance to properly bolster the government against the economic fallout. We have high hopes that this will spell the end of the Syndicate as an alternative state, even if not as a criminal organisation.
[Total: +30 Impact, +15 Cost]
-
- Location
- Australia
Seeing the fleet come back at them with two Excelsiors and two Connie-Bs, same as the last time, was very disheartening.
"NUTS!"
Shortly after sending this message, Sydraxian Admiral Kolketh mysteriously fell down an elevator shaft and was disintegrated by a phaser lying at the bottom.
Deva Outpost:
Sir, we have Federation forces on an approach vector!
Can we id the ships yet?
Yes, the scanner crew believes it is two Explorers, two Cruisers and two Escorts.
Impossible, that is the same as the last fight and we crippled an Explorer and an Escort then! Our Federation experts estimate they need a full year of yard time!
Scanner crew has confirmed their readings. Ships do not appear to be damaged at all.
Sir, they must have bought in fresh ships to replace their losses.
...
Retreat plan Alpha. Get the engineers out of here.
- Location
- Patriarchova
Basically, I expected the Sydraxians to behave like Klingons. What we're actually seeing is more like an incompetent version of the Romulans, at least when it comes to war.
Forgothrax
Not Going Gently
- Pronouns
- He/Him
Sooo, 33 impact this quarter. Ibmaian's post here indicates we were up to 368 +/- with yearly income added. This puts us at 401, albeit with 28 not yet applied until EOY. I feel confident in estimating an EOY total in the 430s.
After that, well, we've been averaging 30 Impact per MoO. Add in 15 from Captains Logs as an average, and 37 from the Anti-slavery Act, and we will reasonably apply around 172 per year. Syndicate Resilience is now 8, so... 160-170 at least. Given that, I feel reasonably confident that we will have finished them by 2316q2. With Impact from other sources (such as this new legislation) maybe EOY 2315.
After that, well, we've been averaging 30 Impact per MoO. Add in 15 from Captains Logs as an average, and 37 from the Anti-slavery Act, and we will reasonably apply around 172 per year. Syndicate Resilience is now 8, so... 160-170 at least. Given that, I feel reasonably confident that we will have finished them by 2316q2. With Impact from other sources (such as this new legislation) maybe EOY 2315.
If correct, and if the Orion government is able to ram through the major constitutional changes they want to, and if nothing else goes wrong in Orion space, we can add the Orions as soon as Development stops putting the block on additional members. (I know there was emergency ratification work done, but that was if Celos went to the Cardies and we needed more pretext to counter invade, so won't apply to a normal ratification.)
- Location
- Germany
- Pronouns
- He/Him
There's going to be media/political pressure to tone done the engagement, while we know that the Snydicate got severely hurt, but, I think, not eradicated. What's left of the Syndicate are those that are good at surving - exactly the people we don't want to recover.
I think that will need some seriouse politicking with the Union government - perhaps deals like lending Betazoid 'rehabilitation' workers etc.?
Alastor Mobius Toth
***** ***
- Location
- Neon Ghetto
Well, well, Sun Tzu would be proud.
I'm as surprised as anyone that Sydraxians had simply retreated and let us destroy the base for free, although I won't look a gift horse in the mouth. Why did it happen? Speculating, I can see several different reasons:
- The Sydraxians may have misidentified the ships in Ainsworth's task force as the same ones that took part in Battle of Deva, coming to conclusion that Starfleet's damage was superficial at best. In that event, their new commander might have decided to be in overwhelming disadvantage against a force that blooded them once, and chose retreat as better part of valor.
- Alternatively, the Sydraxians knew the ships were different, but seeing fresh ships of the same class they managed to remove from the field might have given them the idea of true depth of the Federation and its ability to throw ships at the problem, prompting same reaction as above.
- The pessimist version would be that Sydraxian admiral chose a new strategy, and opted to preserve his mobile offensive force at cost of undeveloped outpost to strike at us later. I imagine the concept of "bearing the shame now to earn victory later" is not unknown to them.
- The unlikely version is that war is starting to have serious repercussions on Sydraxian leadership; I wouldn't be surprised if there's a faction among them that decided to cut their losses now and preserve their fleet for home defense, along with asking themselves why they're fighting a war with one of the biggest power on the block that they share a direct border with.
On off note, the Sydraxians aren't a warrior species in strict sense of the word. As T'Lorel (I believe?) had outlined during first contact, they're a species that glorifies violence, but doesn't normally seem to commit much of. That makes them different from species like Klingons or your typical Honorbound Warriors/Evangelising Zealots/etc who put more stock in violence itself and are ruthless/fanatical enough to defend their positions to death.They are Space Bards; it should have been obvious their strongest point would be talking the Talk, but not actually going through with it.
Either way, I doubt it's the last we see of them, but for now we're clear to take on Cardassians.
I'm happy to see Orion doing well, though I have no doubt that upcoming Congress will be an occasion for spontaneous assault or a crisis. I can only hope Eaton prevails to give Orion one more boost.
I'm as surprised as anyone that Sydraxians had simply retreated and let us destroy the base for free, although I won't look a gift horse in the mouth. Why did it happen? Speculating, I can see several different reasons:
- The Sydraxians may have misidentified the ships in Ainsworth's task force as the same ones that took part in Battle of Deva, coming to conclusion that Starfleet's damage was superficial at best. In that event, their new commander might have decided to be in overwhelming disadvantage against a force that blooded them once, and chose retreat as better part of valor.
- Alternatively, the Sydraxians knew the ships were different, but seeing fresh ships of the same class they managed to remove from the field might have given them the idea of true depth of the Federation and its ability to throw ships at the problem, prompting same reaction as above.
- The pessimist version would be that Sydraxian admiral chose a new strategy, and opted to preserve his mobile offensive force at cost of undeveloped outpost to strike at us later. I imagine the concept of "bearing the shame now to earn victory later" is not unknown to them.
- The unlikely version is that war is starting to have serious repercussions on Sydraxian leadership; I wouldn't be surprised if there's a faction among them that decided to cut their losses now and preserve their fleet for home defense, along with asking themselves why they're fighting a war with one of the biggest power on the block that they share a direct border with.
On off note, the Sydraxians aren't a warrior species in strict sense of the word. As T'Lorel (I believe?) had outlined during first contact, they're a species that glorifies violence, but doesn't normally seem to commit much of. That makes them different from species like Klingons or your typical Honorbound Warriors/Evangelising Zealots/etc who put more stock in violence itself and are ruthless/fanatical enough to defend their positions to death.
Either way, I doubt it's the last we see of them, but for now we're clear to take on Cardassians.
I'm happy to see Orion doing well, though I have no doubt that upcoming Congress will be an occasion for spontaneous assault or a crisis. I can only hope Eaton prevails to give Orion one more boost.