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It's somewhat concerning that the Newton is at an A+ cost rating despite only being four points more expensive than us. @Sayle I assume this is intended to reflect more of a qualitative read of where each design is likely to end up in the long run? Because it seems like only four points should not produce that big of a difference. Actually @Sayle, could we get some indication of what the different options will do to our final ratings?

I'm personally tempted to go for basic shields (we already have two new technologies on this design) and four phaser banks. The fifth one is unnecessary gold-plating, but I think having this ship be able to defend itself adequately when we're heading into a war where we know deep commerce raids into our territory will feature heavily is only prudent. At a certain point we have to consider the lives of the crew we will be sending out on these ships.
 
Cold Dust said:
The way we're going, we'll give this backline ship maximum armament and shields and give our next-gen warship a couple of rusty phase cannons with Ferengi for "surplus stage props" stenciled onto the sides.

I'm thinking standard shields and either base or +2 phasers would be best? What do people think?
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I'd like to test the new shields but we've already got enough new tech on this I think

And having more coverage on a ship this big might be a good idea, just two phasers could lead to some pretty big blind spots with how bulky and oddly shaped this is, and pirates will be a concern for a ship visibly carrying cargo like that.

Leaning towards:
[ ] +2 Phaser Banks (1 Fore, 1 Aft) [4 Phaser Banks, 2 Launchers] [Cost: 14]
[ ] Type-1 Shield System [Mature] [-25% Cost] [Cost: 9]
 
I think we should provide minimal weaponry but prototype shields. This seems like the choice to advance technology - The ship isn't in significant danger in terms of combat between it's superior thrust and shields so it can afford to skimp on weapons. I'd argue that this would provide equivalent protection to a heavy-weapons loadout plus mature shields.

[ ] 2 Phaser Banks, 2 Torpedo Launchers [Cost: 10]
[ ] Type-1 Covariant Shield System [Prototype] [+25% Cost] [Cost: 8]
 
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Shard said:
I think we should provide minimal weaponry but prototype shields. This seems like the choice to advance technology - The ship isn't in significant danger in terms of combat between it's superior thrust and shields so it can afford to skimp on weapons.
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I think you're very much overestimating how maneuverable this thing is going to be if it doesn't drop it's cargopod.

Shields might be able to take hits, but if someone comes from the right angle and this only has two phaser arrays, I could see it being hammered to dust, while they keep in a blind spot.
 
NavySeel said:
I think you're very much overestimating how maneuverable this thing is going to be if it doesn't drop it's cargopod.

Shields might be able to take hits, but if someone comes from the right angle and this only has two phaser arrays, I could see it being hammered to dust, while they keep in a blind spot.
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This ship is one of the logistics-type, however. It's not going to be fighting enemy ships often, and most frequently it will be probably dealing with what's most likely an alpha strike type of situation, not a prolonged harassment into oblivion type of situation. At least, that's what I think the situation will probably cough up.
 
Looks like the cost here is going to be between 47 and 58, so the range we're deciding between is up to 11 points of additional cost.

So far, we have next-gen hull plating and next-gen thrusters. And here we have the opportunity to get next-gen shields. Since we have major conflict with the Klingons on the horizon, I say we should get the prototype shields so that the first Warp-8 ship we make has a full set of no-longer-prototype next-gen military tech avaliable to it.
 
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Derpmind said:
So far, we have next-gen shields and next-gen thrusters. And here we have the opportunity to get next-gen shields. Since we have major conflict with the Klingons on the horizon, I say we should get the prototype shields so that the first Warp-8 ship we make has a full set of no-longer-prototype next-gen military tech avaliable to it.
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Wow, double Next-gen shields, truly the most shielded ship in Starfleet. :p
 
[ ] +2 Phaser Banks (1 Fore, 1 Aft) [4 Phaser Banks, 2 Launchers] [Cost: 14]
@Sayle is there any reason why the 5 phaser turret couldn't go on the bottom of the orb instead of the engineering hull? That would eliminate most of the blind spot.

[ ] Type-1 Shield System [Mature] [-25% Cost] [Cost: 3]
I agree that for a non combat ship the extra shield costs aren't justified.
 
I really want to get the shields for running away purposes but at the same time I really want to keep the cost of our logi / engi ship low.
 
Moist Bread said:
I really want to get the shields for running away purposes but at the same time I really want to keep the cost of our logi / engi ship low.
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It's doable, just as long as we stick with the basic weapons fit rather than going for the enhanced one, only difference is like a point compared to basic shield and extra phasers.

Edit; Yeah, 52 points for Cov and 2xBanks/2xTorpedoes and 51 points for mature and 4xBanks/2xTorpedoes. If ive done the maths right.
 
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[] 2 Phaser Banks, 2 Torpedo Launchers [Cost: 10]
[] +2 Phaser Banks (1 Fore, 1 Aft) [4 Phaser Banks, 2 Launchers] [Cost: 14]

I'm fine with both of these options, but If we're ejecting the cargo bay, we should be Running, not fighting. That last +1 is absolutely too niche.

[] Type-1 Shield System [Mature] [-25% Cost] [Cost: 3]
[] Type-1 Covariant Shield System [Prototype] [+25% Cost] [Cost: 8]

Bleh, I'm really torn on this one. On one hand, we've not put much into our shields, building largely armor-ships. But shields are good. A hit on shields is a few hours of engineering fixing coils that got overheated. A hit on armor is several weeks in drydoc. Or well, maybe this ship can fix itself given its specialty. Same point.

The configurations I see are;

Economy (2 Phasors+ Basic shields ): We keep cost down as low as possible. Will need rescuing by actual combat ships.
Porcupine (4 Phasor+ Basic Shields) : Nasty enough to require enemies to commit to attack.
Lizard (2 Phasors+ New shields) : It runs away hopefully with extra time, possibly ejecting cargo pod "tails" to do so.
Midas (4 phasors+ New shields): We ignore our briefing, and secretly make a combat-engineering ship.

I'm in favor of the Lizard configuration. Getting new shields helps us going forward, and we don't want this thing to fight anyways. We did the same with our science ship. Non-combat ships are great for pushing technology forward.
 
Basic shields, and the 4 phaser option, that phaser blind spot will be obvious which means the Klingons will be predictable in where they're going to try and attack from, and predictable raiders are dead raiders.
 
Sayle said:
Edited the table to be more transparent that the prices are per 100kt of ship. Also halved the weapon cost and brought shield costs in line with hull costs because weapons/shields being half the cost of a ship is silly. Now a substantial portion, but not most of the budget.
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If Starfleet procures weapons systems the way the USN does expendable munitions then they very well could be half the cost of the ships…
 
If we want to RP really hard the choice is the economy build of no more than necessary weapons and standard shields. However if we want to use meta knowledge the way to go is the minimalist weapons compliment and the new shields as we know a war is coming.

I'd say the economy option is the best because even during a war cheap but effective ship that can be produced in numbers is better than an expensive highly effective ship that you can only have one of.
 
Sayle said:
Unfortunately the cargo pod still leaves a major blindspot, and the final effort you can make on that front would be to add a largely useless phaser bank beneath the main shuttlebay.
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Couldn't we have a phaser bank that covers that blind spot by placing it on the south pole of the orb and pointing backwards? Something like this:
 
Skippy said:
It's somewhat concerning that the Newton is at an A+ cost rating despite only being four points more expensive than us. @Sayle I assume this is intended to reflect more of a qualitative read of where each design is likely to end up in the long run? Because it seems like only four points should not produce that big of a difference. Actually @Sayle, could we get some indication of what the different options will do to our final ratings?
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The Newton plans for 17 cost of weapons/shields. It's just they've installed an extra engine and extra super-structure, so even with your heavier weight they're quite close to you in cost.

NexusEye said:
Couldn't we have a phaser bank that covers that blind spot by placing it on the south pole of the orb and pointing backwards? Something like this:
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The navigational array is in the way. It always ends up on the lowest point of the saucer section on Starfleet ships.
 
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[ ] +2 Phaser Banks (1 Fore, 1 Aft) [4 Phaser Banks, 2 Launchers] [Cost: 14]

Extra cost is worth it for a reasonable tactical ability.

[ ] Type-1 Shield System [Mature] [-25% Cost] [Cost: 3]

But the covariant is a bridge too far.
 
Not sure why people are phrasing things like us adding Phasers is wanting it to get into fights. They make it a less tempting target and harder to ambush, which is what anyone attacking a cargo ship would want to do. If anything I'd assume they'd make it get into less fights.

The entire point of Phasers to me is to make people want to attack it less.

Saying we don't want it to get in a fight so it doesn't need more phasers could just as easily be applied to shields too.

Also adding the phasers is less expensive than going to the prototype shields, which have the risk of rolling badly on the result.
 
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