Voted best in category in the Users' Choice awards.
A friendly reminder to new questers to read the Informational threadmarks and FAQ specifically before asking a question. Links below:

Frequently Asked Questions
Here is the Detailed Rune List
Discord.

On Thread Etiquette:

I'm not going to weigh in on the logic of either side's arguments, but I will ask that everyone read over what they write and really consider if the words they used are polite and won't be inflammatory intentionally or not. You cant account for people's tolerances perfectly but at least try to say your piece without saying things that can be easily construed as overly dismissive of the other side of the argument, thank you.

Please endeavour to be cordial. :^)
 
Last edited:
[X] [Karstah:] Yes. Apprentice Vote in next Turn Results. (Taking apprentices will lock minimum 1 action per turn for 12 turns)
[X] [Snorri:] Yes. Apprentice Vote in next Turn Results. (Taking apprentices will lock minimum 1 action per turn for 10 turns)
 
By force or something. I don't remember exactly what counts as Sorcerer in Warhammer Universe but there is a reason Khorne hates them, besides magic.

Khorne Is fine with people doing rituals (i.e. sorcery) because they are not stealing the powers of the gods but essentialy begging for It, magic/psyker steal the power and so It think they are cheating/disonorable.

But we are collating lore from 40k aos and whf to say this and knorne Is perfectly allowed to change Is mind/being and hipocryte.

In teory evrybody can do sorcery, not evrybody can do magic, normal humans can not cast spells they have to be born with the ability.
Maybe all elfes can, but they were made to be the magical race.
 
Are we talking about the same thing though? Yeah gods do teach magic. But are they able to take an entirely mundane person not capable of magic at all and turn them into a potential wizard?
Because the only thing I can think of that is like that is whatever enabled Runesmithing.

Alright, while I think that logic sequence you've presented is getting the horse and cart in the wrong order, having specific mindstates is part of speaking the Anoqeyan word, not that speaking the Anoqeyan word gives you that mindset.
However we may also be able to find Anoqeyan words that move the winds in the same way that having the correct mindset would have, therefore I'm willing to entertain the possibility that its possible to either make a new family of runes that use a chants in Anoqeyan rather than Khazalid or find coincidentally the identical sequence of effects to precisely reproduce a rune.
The reason that I brought up that Anoqeyan allows people to manipulate the winds with more nuance than more mundane languages is that I'm even willing to consider that we could define a new family of runes with effects that are not possible without it (I don't think this is likely but I'm willing to consider it).

If the way we do this with an alternate chant is by precisely replicating the movements of the winds when doing it chantless or with Khazalid then I'd expect the result to be precise replica of the rune we are attempting to imitate.

Therefore these solutions don't explain why we would expect this category to be more powerful which was my main issue with the statement. Not the nebulous 'is it or is it not possible.'.
A position that I notice you're not defending... so I don't know why you're starting this?
The sentence I was specifically quoting in response to was taking as a granted that Anoqeyan would improve runesmithing. And you're saying that it may do nothing or less than nothing. So... these aren't the positions I was disagreeing with.


I dunno there are a lot of ifs and assumptions there that aren't really justified. It just feels like of many possible explanations you're just proceeding with the argument that is most favourable to your prior beliefs.

However even if we table that for a moment. We also know of a runic artifact that is "Basically be a wizard" and unless for some reason it far far simpler than its contemporary divine relics it should be in the 5-7 rune range as its Thungni's primary runestaff.
Saying that maybe one rune is all we need to fill in the gap just strikes me as extremely wishful thinking for a problem that probably requires 2 Mrunes and at least 3 minors.

I think you are also getting the cause and effect wrong, if we got a gramaphone and started playing a record of an arch mage speaking spells I wouldn't expect it to start casting spells because it doesn't have a soul and the soul is at least half of the spell. Thereby I think the danger of learning Anoqeyan is not spontaneously casting spells when you were previously fully mundane its spontaneously casting spells because you had an unrecognised and untrained talent for magic. However if you can point me to a specific instance to correct me then I think that would be exactly what I want to clarify the discussion I'm having with Gabrial so you could kill two of my arguments with one stone?

Anyway the right way to move winds in order to forge a rune is the way that they are naturally moved when forging. Thats the purpose of the rote systemetisation. To make sure it always works as best as possible.
In the anoqeyan lessons with Menlinwen, she mentions the risk of accidental magic is low since Snorri has a natural anti magic field while elves need their teachers around to dispel screw ups as they're learning. So yes, I do think the danger is because a mage could accidentally cast something dangerous because they said something wrong. Even a dwarf apparantly has a chance of causing a miscast. Reading off a script instead of a voice recording should cast the spell.

Anvils of Doom are as close as canon dwarfs get to Gormwand and that only takes the rune of sorcery. Gormwand is definitely the easier of the two to surpass. A MRune version that allows direct soul manipulation of the winds combined with the rune of windsight to see what you're doing is most of the way there already. I don't think you'd need 5 runes to manage it.
 
In the anoqeyan lessons with Menlinwen, she mentions the risk of accidental magic is low since Snorri has a natural anti magic field while elves need their teachers around to dispel screw ups as they're learning. So yes, I do think the danger is because a mage could accidentally cast something dangerous because they said something wrong. Even a dwarf apparantly has a chance of causing a miscast. Reading off a script instead of a voice recording should cast the spell.

Anvils of Doom are as close as canon dwarfs get to Gormwand and that only takes the rune of sorcery. Gormwand is definitely the easier of the two to surpass. A MRune version that allows direct soul manipulation of the winds combined with the rune of windsight to see what you're doing is most of the way there already. I don't think you'd need 5 runes to manage it.
Elves are universally capable of magic by default... Dwarves are probably not.

I don't even know what to say about that Gormwand comment. Have you considered that it would be equally easy to surpass KKR if we just had one rune that did everything it did anyway.
 
Runesmiths can cast magic.
That isn't debated.
Obviously.

E:Just to catch up the argument for you. This started as me disagreeing that Anoqeyan chants would make better runes. And right now we're focused on is Anoqeyan inherently magic or does it require some degree of natural magic talent in order to do something.
Even if it is proven that Anoqeyan is so, that still wouldn't answer most of my actual arguments about why I don't think it would make better runes but thats the nature of internet arguments, they never stay on the actual topic.
 
Last edited:
Sorry then I mistook the meaning of your phrase.

Yea I agree with you then.
We have no proof that Anoqeyan could help runesmiths.
Granted we have no proof It can not either.
we are quite outside any Canon precedent now.
 
Last edited:
Alright, while I think that logic sequence you've presented is getting the horse and cart in the wrong order, having specific mindstates is part of speaking the Anoqeyan word, not that speaking the Anoqeyan word gives you that mindset.
Yes and that's what I meant as well even if I worded it poorly.
 
Last edited:
I do agree that character bloat is getting really ridiculous. And I don't care what anyone says, it is absolutely an issue since for a lot of us it's because we care about the apprentices that a lot of us hate the idea of them getting less and less screen time because it's just impossible to give so many characters proper screen time. And it's not just our apprentices, there are other numerous characters in the story that make it an even bigger issue

Let's be real, after say another dozen apprentices I can see people just stop caring about most of them since it's really obvious that they are just going to be forgotten in the background with at most getting a line or two. Which is missing the reason that people care so much about the apprentices in the first place, which is that they get good amount of screen time.
Then we should probably avoid giant mega-projects that eat up turns and result in things like Khazagar that eat up narrative real estate that our apprentices, dragons and Hearth Guard apparently need. They're much easier to stop caring about.
 
[X] [Snorri:] Yes. Apprentice Vote in next Turn Results. (Taking apprentices will lock minimum 1 action per turn for 10 turns)
 
[X] [Snorri:] Yes. Apprentice Vote in next Turn Results. (Taking apprentices will lock minimum 1 action per turn for 10 turns)
[X] [Karstah:] Yes. Apprentice Vote in next Turn Results. (Taking apprentices will lock minimum 1 action per turn for 12 turns)
 
[X] [Snorri:] No.
[X] [Karstah:] Yes. Apprentice Vote in next Turn Results. (Taking apprentices will lock minimum 1 action per turn for 12 turns)
 
Master Rune of WanderingLorna DernasdottirInt. Gathering
(Rising)
G,R: Select
L: Select+
Moderate

Rune of PlaguebaneKarstah SnorrisdottirFull Classroom
(Rising)
G: Known
R: Well-Known
L: Universal
Moderate, Novel

Oh! Just noticed that both of these classes have an increasing attendance as of this turn. Good good! I was kinda worried Lorna's would stay very small and that wouldn't do. Master Rune of Wandering is a fun rune.
 
[X] [Snorri:] No.
[X] [Karstah:] Yes. Apprentice Vote in next Turn Results. (Taking apprentices will lock minimum 1 action per turn for 12 turns)
 
Back
Top