Brockton's Celestial Forge (Worm/Jumpchain)

A thought came to me. Are there any "scientific magic" powers in this Celestial Forge? Like, To Aru Majutsu no Index or something? Because in the anime Index was able to explain magic pretty scientifically, which could help with MC's understanding that "Shard Magic" is quantum shenanigans akin to Esper AIM field, while his "Wizard Magic" is another thing altogether. (That will also explain to the MC why Agent abilities are categorized as "magic" and not any other effect).

Well, there is this perk in the Magitech Constellation, from the Chrono Trigger jump:
Guru (600CP) Back in the glory days of Zeal, "Guru" was a title reserved only for the most skilled and knowledgeable of their mages and scientists. You might not be there yet, but when I'm done with you, you'll be well on your way to deserving the title. Magic is akin to a science to you, letting you delve into the secrets of sorcery the same way a physicist would unlock the secrets of the atom. This also includes learning how to apply magical knowledge like an engineer does the sciences, letting you come up with breathtaking magical wonders. The Blackbird, the Mammon Machine, the Ocean Palace - who knows what you'll add to that list of legends.

Does that sound like what you are looking for?
 
A thought came to me. Are there any "scientific magic" powers in this Celestial Forge? Like, To Aru Majutsu no Index or something? Because in the anime Index was able to explain magic pretty scientifically, which could help with MC's understanding that "Shard Magic" is quantum shenanigans akin to Esper AIM field, while his "Wizard Magic" is another thing altogether. (That will also explain to the MC why Agent abilities are categorized as "magic" and not any other effect).
Hard Science [Raildex Science] (600):
You have knowledge of Academy City's science and technology to rival a scientist with a doctorate and several years of experience under his belt. you are much more intelligent, analytical, and can easily keep your cool under pressure and rein in your emotions. You also gain a Doctorate's worth of Regular Scientific knowledge in the discipline of your Choice. You know the inner workings of recoil mitigating systems and powered armor, but your true specialty is the Esper creation and development process. Given enough time, you might just figure out a way to get rid of the randomness inherent in the process and give x person y ability. Training an Esper to help them reach their maximum potential is child's play.Quote: One random Esper power from the Jumpdoc will be rolled when this perk is obtained.
 
That's a very strange interaction of magic systems and abilities you're talking about, but from Joe's perspective it'd likely be draining his literal soul before anything else. Devils are born from humanity's fear, so they tend to act on the metaphysical level before the physical one, at least for abilities which work with esoteric qualities like 'lifespan' or such.
Perhaps it would drain his soul, however even when it comes down to even his soul stuff it gets weird, like with some souls being finite and some being infinite. As well, despite their metaphysical nature they do still need biological blood and all that. Say Joe needed to give out blood, he could give practically an infinite amount of it, but it wouldn't drain his soul no?
 
So almost a day left, what does everyone think/want is going to be rolled?

I personally have a good feeling about the megaman perk. No idea why.

I'm hoping we finish off clothing constellation and get capstone.
 
"Anything built in one of those workshops is fiat backed to be restored to its original condition within 48 hours if damaged or destroyed."
Nothing about "built by you" or any other restrictions. So, I'd say yes, everything that Garment will create in that workshop will restore itself.

Before people could jump to conclusions (at least from that fact), they'd need to find out the fact that Garment's clothes can restore itself, and know how tech produced by Apeiron, the Enigmatic Artificer, restores when broken.
Currently, only Undersiders know that Apeiron made tech restore itself. Well, and Coil, most likely. Coil know that other pieces disappears, but I don't sure if Undersiders know about it. So, I doubt that'll be easy for people to reach the point from where they can jump (to the conclusion, I mean).
Dragon and Armsmaster also know it vanishes after a certain interval, and indeed during the Weld conversation:
Chapter 25 Search and Rescue said:
"So, Armsmaster told me about the knives you made." I nodded along. "Samples he had disappeared right from his lab. He was convinced they were some kind of projection."

This was getting closer to a transparent attempt to extract information, but I just shrugged along. "Yeah, the broken ones do that."
I think they also got a transcript out of Weld, but I don't recall. This doesn't guarantee anything, but the Undersiders showed off their knives fully intact less than a week later at the storage yard. It is a possible hypothesis that might be floating around, and the interval might alert certain tinkers or thinkers. At that point though, what are they gonna do? Arrest Garment for questioning?? This will just make Garment more popular, since you never have to worry about cuts or burns or shrinkage or anything.
Actually, could there be NEPEA-5 concerns with her opening a Tinkertech Boutique?
 
It's so much worse than them being "karens". It isn't just about entitlement, although that is a factor of it. His parents don't care for Joe, they want a doll that achieves things for them and makes them feel special, to fulfill their image of a perfect family, to carry on their legacy. Joe isn't a person, he is their son; That is his role in life, that is all he exists for to them. And yes I'm including his shitty enabler dad in this, because from my experience, individuals like him "not getting involved" in stuff isn't about disagreeing but not wanting to vocalize it, but rather not wanting to engage in conflict because it transgresses on that dream of perfection.
As long as he refuses to obey and play along, as you said, he'll be constantly nagged. Heck, he could be perfect for them and still get nagged, based on his childhood and that Alena and Natalia both worked to get as far away from their parents as they could.
Hmmm, they way I see it the only way Joe could get any peace is to distance himself from his family. But that would ostracizing him from his family and he still has some attachments so he doesn't want to go that far.
 
Hmmm, they way I see it the only way Joe could get any peace is to distance himself from his family. But that would ostracizing him from his family and he still has some attachments so he doesn't want to go that far.
Yeah. Almost as if he blocked everyone's numbers and went no contact whatsoever. He mostly just doesn't wanna cut Alena off, since allegedly she is better than Natalia, and a couple of other reasons.
 
So, those are expensive offerings. Without another heated conflict and\or a period of unconsciousness to build more points, MC will get to them nowhere soon.

Well, for the first roll of the next chapter he will already have 400 pts, and more than half of the remaining perk slots have 600 or more pts, so it is quite likely that he will be getting more 600pt perks soonish. The problem with Hard Science is that it is stuck in the Knowledge Constellation, which has around 18 perk slots, so it has a lot of competition even if LordR has 600pt available and rolls on the Constellation. Guru is slightly better, in a Constellation with 8 slots, but it unfortunately is a twinned perk, so even if by some chance LordR rolls that very slot there is still only a 50/50 chance to get Guru. The ever popular and speculated on Girl Genius perk Strong Spark, on the other hand, is a 600pt perk in a Constellation with only 2 perk slots, so is much more likely to be rolled despite being a 600 pt perk.
 
Given the range only those with mover Capabilities would be able to reliably dodge them (like Glory Girl, Vista or the New Kid Win) and considering what she has already shown a ridiculous wide range of effects you can bet that neither the mobs (aka the unpowered trash called the police) or the average Parahuman would risk finding out up close what are truly dangerous for them. I think it's a case of implication, fire 2 Tinker Bombs during the start of the battle and only normal ones for the rest and the Enemy Combatants will be hard pressed to rush in on you even if their mostly immune to normal explosive because the high chance exists you (the ABB forces) are just waiting to get the right Shot in with an annihilator effect.
Given that original point was comparision of how easier it would be for Apeiron, the Enigmatic Artificer, to deal with E88 compared to ABB, I think we got sidetracked.
For Apeiron, countering grenades way easier than, let's say laser rifles of Coil's mercs. Bakuda's bombs can harm him, while rifles can't, sure. But when the goal is to wreak havoc and harm as much as possible, he can shot grenades out of the air, but block a laser shots? It'd be way harder to him.
Or something like Famine Engine from canon. Before he'll find and destroy or shut down it, he'd have a hard time trying to protect civilians ftom the swarms of bugs.

Shaped Charges sounds like a wet dream for someone who is defined by having barely any control over what they make, so I don't think it I a matter of Bakuda's Incompetence but rather that such a modification would only cost even more time (something we both agree on she had preciously little of).
Indeed. Exactly (well, I don't really sure if that's lack of time or lack of time and inexperience, but that isn't the point) . That's why I said that he didn't faced high level tinkertech.

1) I think that was more a combination of both Apeiron would directly finding the weakness that going for the showmanship angle would create (unless your are Enigmatic enough to artifice such a thing with the help of a specific Power), it is more likely that they only got overconfident in the perceived End of Apeiron and only when the Camera started rolling did they turn the Showmanship on full force.
2) Yeah that makes the final Version only far more terrifying to consider and comparing the E88 playing around to a full on near S-Class City wide Catastrophe only shows the difference in the strength between the 2 gangs. Also Joe's Tech only got better, finding out those Messages between the E88 is going to be child's play compared to finding the logistics dumpster fire of the ABB now that he has a proper Computer (due to finally having Cybertronium).
3) Given the fact that they actual are Nazis and believe in the ideology of White Supremacy they would not specifically attack densely populated areas like markets because of all the fellow race members.
1) No, I mean their original plan, that Apeiron, not yet Enigmatic Artificer, wrecked. Sure, destruction was one of the goals, but only second to showmanship, at least as far as I can tell.
2) That's depend from how far he willing to pry into privacy. Because he can ask Survey to read evary text message in the city and eavesdrop each call. He could've even before latest upgrades. But I doubt he willing to go that far. And without something on that scale, it'll be still harder to notice the right patterns in communications between people who know what they are doing.
3) Oh please, those who actually believe in that shit would be fine with killing "race traitors".

They would never do such a thing because they know that will get the wrath of Apeiron upon them.
Yet, they can threaten Apeiron, the Enigmatic Artificer, with that possibility.
That was the original point - threat of rampage, to stop Apeiron from going after them. After that I just explained why such a threat will be seen as significant, even after the events of Thursday.

Tinkertech is at it's strongest when it is personally made for a certain person or one use like a certain Bombergirls work. I think Coil and his professional troops show what having Tinker Tech without a Tinker looks like in terms of strength (not overtly strong, but in the hands of a professional a not forgettable threat against an average Parahuman) not to mention that more powerful tech would mean spending days to maintain it's quality when you use it more than a few times in a day.
I agree. That's why E88 didn't purchased anything in canon, IMO. Yet, even if it can't be an ace in the hole, trump jack in the hole is still very nice to have, when you need to surprise your enemy.

Additionally I doubt that Toybox would want the heat of being associated with what would essentially be a reenactment of a Slaughterhouse 9 Visit.
Why would Kaiser tell them his plans? Unless he'd ask for something like "I need something to destroy the couple of city blocks at once", I doubt there will be any questions.

Also when I mentioned Tinker Tech I meant something that was actually capable of hurting Apeiron. Something that allows the Damsel greater Control would not make her a serious threat (more likely the opposite considering her unpredictability is her greatest strength against Apeiron, even with his near precognitive Algorithm and his insane Speed) and Annihilator Tinker Tech IS at least somewhat rare.
Nah, that's silly. You don't need "annihilator tech" as force multiplier. Personal forcefield for Damsel, for example, would significantly raise her threat level. Teleportation is also very valuable both for offense (to get in range) and defense (to get the fuck out of dodge).

Dragon and Armsmaster also know it vanishes after a certain interval
Indeed. And, I'm sure, not only they but PRT as a whole (not each member, of course). But they don't know the reason.
As I said, currently only Coil (outside of Workshop Crew) have something close to the full picture for the repairing process. He can, if he'll notice how Garment's clothes restore itself, identify it as Apeiron, the Enigmatic Artificer, branded self-repair.
Anyone alse can jump to conclusion, of course, but for everyone aroun it would looks like a wild guess without any real foundation (and it will be, until anyone alse get more info).
 
Given that original point was comparision of how easier it would be for Apeiron, the Enigmatic Artificer, to deal with E88 compared to ABB, I think we got sidetracked.
For Apeiron, countering grenades way easier than, let's say laser rifles of Coil's mercs. Bakuda's bombs can harm him, while rifles can't, sure. But when the goal is to wreak havoc and harm as much as possible, he can shot grenades out of the air, but block a laser shots? It'd be way harder to him.
Or something like Famine Engine from canon. Before he'll find and destroy or shut down it, he'd have a hard time trying to protect civilians ftom the swarms of bugs.

He can still shoot the Rifles or other weapons out of their hands and the Famine Engine could easily be dealt with through the Acidic Mist Potion (what he used when Taylor called her bugs after the epileptic Bomb) or something similar.

1) No, I mean their original plan, that Apeiron, not yet Enigmatic Artificer, wrecked. Sure, destruction was one of the goals, but only second to showmanship, at least as far as I can tell.
2) That's depend from how far he willing to pry into privacy. Because he can ask Survey to read evary text message in the city and eavesdrop each call. He could've even before latest upgrades. But I doubt he willing to go that far. And without something on that scale, it'll be still harder to notice the right patterns in communications between people who know what they are doing.
3) Oh please, those who actually believe in that shit would be fine with killing "race traitors".

1) Taking into account that the original plan was never finished I would rather not say what was or was not the main goal. March clearly loves Showmanship, but Lung is rational enough to not let it limit his goals and would probably want to finally assert his Power in the Gang again by stopping Bakuda's and March's attempt to draw out the showmanship/torture angle. The Power they displayed in the attack was enough for their Reputation.
2) Given how Survey already pried into the Talk with his Sister, the Wards meeting with Garment and probably something else combined with her recently shown worry for a repeat of the Rise of the ABB event, I would give it not an insignificant chance that she is already dedicating a good portion to scan and searching for the Communication Patterns a coordinated Strike requires.
3) Keeping in Mind that it was never canonically stated to what degree each E88 Member (except Kaiser just using it for support) believes in their unifying ideology I'd say that it would at least be mentioned and weighed in before an all out attack.

Yet, they can threaten Apeiron, the Enigmatic Artificer, with that possibility.
That was the original point - threat of rampage, to stop Apeiron from going after them. After that I just explained why such a threat will be seen as significant, even after the events of Thursday.

Yes but a threat only works if you follow up on it and Joe knows how to swiftly take them out in the case they attack. Their not really convincing with "if you don't leave us alone we will mildly inconvenience you" (the rest of the world still does not know how much Joe wants to protect Human Life).

I agree. That's why E88 didn't purchased anything in canon, IMO. Yet, even if it can't be an ace in the hole, trump jack in the hole is still very nice to have, when you need to surprise your enemy.

Yeah because Apeiron the unflappable sure is going to be surprised by some less than stellar Tinker Tech.

Why would Kaiser tell them his plans? Unless he'd ask for something like "I need something to destroy the couple of city blocks at once", I doubt there will be any questions.

He wouldn't, but Toybox haven't survived this long by assisting a dying gang with highly dangerous tech for a last slaughter against a force they couldn't possibly beat. Toybox is tolerated because it is NOT made out of amoral Psychopaths, yes pretty much anyone can acquire their services, but they do not want the heat that such high profile events will draw on them and primarily focus on profits.
The only Tinker Tech support I can imagine is some desperate/idiotic Tinker trying to prove themself and gaining Infamy by making something that beats Apeiron (given that this IS Worm there is probably more than one of such "unique" specimens worthy of a Darwin Award).

Nah, that's silly. You don't need "annihilator tech" as force multiplier. Personal forcefield for Damsel, for example, would significantly raise her threat level. Teleportation is also very valuable both for offense (to get in range) and defense (to get the fuck out of dodge).

But you kind of do (against Joe at least). Apeiron showed his ability to subvert enemy Tinker Tech in the Aisha Rescue, showes his durability in pretty much every fight and has ridiculous fire power to boot. Do you really think that some shitty force field is going to stop the Motoroid's Weaponry (Uber and Leet only survived because they layered like 4 to 5 of them and even then were not hit with the Magitech Canon), additionally Apeiron's Speed was quick enough to keep up with a Teleporting Parahuman, why would anyone think that going up close is a good idea ..... never mind I just remembered that Brockton Bay is NOT the land of the sane and rational. So your point is right.
By the Way IIRC Damsel was affecting herself with her power (white hair etc.) so it is possible that wearing Tinker Tech is not going to work out for her.
 
Friendbringers #2 (Mojave Courier)
Omake: Friendbringers #2

The addition of the... Friendbringers hadn't really changed much around the Warehouse. Oh sure, they were probably the least tasteful things the Forge had given him, including the necromancy, the souls from hell, and the copious amount of wet tinkering, but the three of them were honestly not that bad.

Behemoth was like a little puppy, always performing cute tricks and trying to help him and his duplicates out in the Warehouse, giving him his tools and more. Although, Behemoth did seem to have attached itself to Aisha and Aisha liked him back, even if things between them were still a bit awkward as she tried to get used to the idea of a friendly Endbringer, even if Chibi Behemoth was far smaller than its counterpart.

Leviathan on the other hand, seemed to have taken more of a liking to Garment. In fact, Leviathan could always be seen dressed in one of Garment's newest creations, whether it be a fancy little suit or the "Barbarian Chic" she had wanted him to wear for weeks now. Joe wouldn't be surprised to find Chibi Leviathan working in Garment's shop sometime in the future. He'll have to make a few disguises for Leviathan before that though. He might be fine with the… Friendbringers but that doesn't mean everyone else would be.

The PRT was already watching and analyzing his every move. Heavens know how they would react if they found out that he had miniature versions of the Endbringers and he was letting them roam free.

The Simurgh was a bit different from the rest. Unlike the rest of the Friendbringers, she only stood at six inches tall, compared to the two-foot-tall Behemoth and Leviathan. Although, much like the original Simurgh, she had taken to flying everywhere, like Tinkerbell from Peter Pan. And much like little Tinkerbell, Chibi Simurgh had taken to following him around everywhere in the Warehouse. There wasn't a single minute where little Ziz wasn't by his side. Everywhere he went, she went. Hell, he went to sleep for a bit and when he woke up, she was right by his side, or more specifically, right on top of his head.

It was kind of cute how clingy she was. Thankfully she knew that she couldn't go outside just yet. She knew that he had to make a lot of stuff before the Friendbringers could safely go out in public.

Hopefully she didn't try and follow him out of the Warehouse. He wouldn't put it past her. She is awfully clingy.

-----

Joe was dealing with the Friendbringers surprisingly well, Aisha noticed. He was dealing with it far than better than she was, that was for sure. She still had a hard time with them. She trusted Joe a lot and she knew that she didn't really have any room to not have faith in Joe. But the… Friendbringers were almost too much.

She was panicking too much. She didn't need to worry. As long as the three of them knew to stay in the Warehouse, things would go just fine.

Ah crap. Aisha probably jinxed herself there. Hopefully nothing goes wrong with those three.

-----

The small angel flitted around the Warehouse, never straying too far from her master, always staying within his vision. Her master was kind, worthy of her and her sibling's love. It was her duty to protect him. To serve him. She understood his misgivings, his worries. But he need not worry.

She was nothing like her original counterpart. She was his angel and his angel alone. Her power, her might paled in comparison to the original but in time, and with her master's help, she would grow.

Her siblings would be much the same. They knew their purpose and they would fulfill it to the very best of their abilities.

Glory to Jozef.
 
funny thought occur about typos in power giving weird effects. How about instead of a power that let's you sprout bare arms, it instead got a typo saying you could sprout bear arms? :V
 
If your willing to provide clarification, I would be interested to know what you feel the crucible wouldn't be able to break down. The text says most items, but I'd like to know what you feel would fall outside that category. My assumption was items that are indestructible by the standards of a specific universe or otherwise fundamentally powerful in some way, but I'd like to hear your thoughts on the matter.
Again, a long time ago so I don't quite recall my thought process but I agree about the indestructability. A minor artifact that has extreme durability would be able to be melted down without a problem but Lord Camelot, the noble phantasm made from the legend of the round table and designed to withstand almost any attack, would probably be resistant. To add to the list my best guess would be anything that isn't biological but that still counts as 'alive', so sentient swords or magical AI or anything like that. I'd also say anything being protected like a unique artifact blessed by a god is also resistant. After that point its up to you really, a 500 point item is pretty powerful so I would er on the side of leniancy.
 
@Daym, when I wrote the post below, I realised one important thing. I kind of messed up things a little. Here and earlier, I mixed arguments about "what Empire can do", "what Joe may suspect they can do" and "what Empire can threaten Apeiron with". Sorry, I don't have energy to rewrite that post, but I'll try to make it more clear in the future.

He can still shoot the Rifles or other weapons out of their hands and the Famine Engine could easily be dealt with through the Acidic Mist Potion (what he used when Taylor called her bugs after the epileptic Bomb) or something similar.
Why of course! Definitely that's possiblt. But before he can counter something, he need to know what he have to counter. Against Bakuda he knew what he going to face, at least in outline. Without any hints it'd be very hard for him to counter it before any damage is done. He's fast, and powerful, and versatile. But even if he'll manage to block or destroy whatever it'll be in mere seconds (and that mean he need to get to the area, at the very least) , those seconds may be enough for it to kill who know how many people.

Btw, about Corruption formula from Evermore alchemy. Can anyone explain what limitations it have? No limit for number of targets, ok. But do he need to see each target, of there's limited range, or anything else?

1) Taking into account that the original plan was never finished I would rather not say what was or was not the main goal. March clearly loves Showmanship, but Lung is rational enough to not let it limit his goals and would probably want to finally assert his Power in the Gang again by stopping Bakuda's and March's attempt to draw out the showmanship/torture angle. The Power they displayed in the attack was enough for their Reputation.
2) Given how Survey already pried into the Talk with his Sister, the Wards meeting with Garment and probably something else combined with her recently shown worry for a repeat of the Rise of the ABB event, I would give it not an insignificant chance that she is already dedicating a good portion to scan and searching for the Communication Patterns a coordinated Strike requires.
3) Keeping in Mind that it was never canonically stated to what degree each E88 Member (except Kaiser just using it for support) believes in their unifying ideology I'd say that it would at least be mentioned and weighed in before an all out attack.
1) I agree that we can't know for sure if that was "maximum showmanship with as much destruction as possible along the way" or other way around. That just the feeling I got from reading.
But since we both agree that March loves showmanship, I have to point that Bakuda clearly wanted to showoff too. And Lung... March is social Thinker too, or she was before the Thuesday. Social Thinkers, basically, more or less equal to low-tier human controlling Master. In her case - more like mid-tier. Nowhere near Heartbreaker, but more than enough to talk Lung into accepting her plan.
2) As I said, I don't know how far into "personal privacy" he willing to pry.
3) Indeed. But most gang members of E88 fall into one of three categories:
* fanatics, who really believe in Nazism,
* assholes, who don't really give a fuck about the Nazism and just wants power that membership gives,
* desperate, who don't have other options.
Fanatics will be fine with killing "race traitors". Assholes will be fine with killing period. Desperate may try to bail out, or may not - depends from the many factors.

Their not really convincing with "if you don't leave us alone we will mildly inconvenience you" (the rest of the world still does not know how much Joe wants to protect Human Life).
Yes. But they don't really have anything more impressive than that and "we have one person that can maybe hurt you if she'll got lucky". :whistle:
(they saw the translation, though, and know that he willing to accept death of people if he need to, but also they saw how he tried to save as much as possible anyway, so they know that he valued human lives)

Yeah because Apeiron the unflappable sure is going to be surprised by some less than stellar Tinker Tech.
Yes. Without any irony or sarcasm - yes. Impressed he may be not, but taken by surprise? Pretty possible.

He wouldn't, but Toybox haven't survived this long by assisting a dying gang with highly dangerous tech for a last slaughter against a force they couldn't possibly beat.
Yes, they'll almost certainly reject his requests if they'll suspect E88 will try to "cosplay S9". They may reject if the'll know E88 will attack Apeiron, but they may not, depends from a couple of factors including Shards' nudging.
But "Due to recent events, I would like to have a few surprises up my sleeve" they'll, IMO, likely to see as completely valid reason to buy their tech. See examples below.

But you kind of do (against Joe at least).
You think so? Let's see... Personal teleporter. Reasonable purchase for anyone who want to be able to get the fuck out of dodge, right? Right. But Damsel may use one to close distance with Apeiron, the Enigmatic Artificer, to gen in range when she can use her power.
You said that forcefield not going to help against a level of strenght Apeiron, the Enigmatic Artificer, uses? Likely. But even a part of a second it can buy matters in a fight. Especially if combined with aforementioned teleporter: use teleporter to close distance, and forcefield to buy time to use power against possible automated point-defense system Apeiron may have. With Thuesday Apeiron that could've worked, you know. Of course, that not going to achieve much against Apeiron, the Enigmatic Artificer, since he have displacer field. But nazis don't know that. :rolleyes:

By the Way IIRC Damsel was affecting herself with her power (white hair etc.) so it is possible that wearing Tinker Tech is not going to work out for her.
Well, that would make things... more complicated, yes. Although, I don't sure Joe know that, so he, with his caution, likely to think she can.
 
@Daym, when I wrote the post below, I realised one important thing. I kind of messed up things a little. Here and earlier, I mixed arguments about "what Empire can do", "what Joe may suspect they can do" and "what Empire can threaten Apeiron with". Sorry, I don't have energy to rewrite that post, but I'll try to make it more clear in the future.

It's absolutely no problem. but I think we have been covering every point in the Difference in Power between the "Return of the ABB" and a possible Empire 88 Rampage along with the different power mechanics at play that lead to different levels of confidence with the limited Data we have. One of the next 3 updates will likely show a great deal more insight from our Lords Perspective that will reveal who will be forever shamed by being somewhat wrong (Oh Nooo) in this illustrious internet discussion.

Why of course! Definitely that's possiblt. But before he can counter something, he need to know what he have to counter. Against Bakuda he knew what he going to face, at least in outline. Without any hints it'd be very hard for him to counter it before any damage is done. He's fast, and powerful, and versatile. But even if he'll manage to block or destroy whatever it'll be in mere seconds (and that mean he need to get to the area, at the very least) , those seconds may be enough for it to kill who know how many people.

Again this seems extremely unlike Max. Canon was mostly Purity being a complete idiot. Though yes that scenario would produce a regrettable amount of injured to near casualties (given Joe's Advancement in medical technologies I don't think there is a normal mortal disease or wound he can't cure in a few seconds) which either way is something the Enigmatic Artificer would like to try to avoid.

1) I agree that we can't know for sure if that was "maximum showmanship with as much destruction as possible along the way" or other way around. That just the feeling I got from reading.
But since we both agree that March loves showmanship, I have to point that Bakuda clearly wanted to showoff too. And Lung... March is social Thinker too, or she was before the Thuesday. Social Thinkers, basically, more or less equal to low-tier human controlling Master. In her case - more like mid-tier. Nowhere near Heartbreaker, but more than enough to talk Lung into accepting her plan.
2) As I said, I don't know how far into "personal privacy" he willing to pry.
3) Indeed. But most gang members of E88 fall into one of three categories:
* fanatics, who really believe in Nazism,
* assholes, who don't really give a fuck about the Nazism and just wants power that membership gives,
* desperate, who don't have other options.
Fanatics will be fine with killing "race traitors". Assholes will be fine with killing period. Desperate may try to bail out, or may not - depends from the many factors.

1) Low-Tier to Mid-Tier Masters mostly rely on something that is already in the mastered head unlike High-Tier Master who can just override.
In light of the fact that the past weeks events where solely created and orchestrated by Bakuda and March and NOT him the actual leader of ABB to the point that Joe just leaves him (at least from his perspective) Lung would likely go against logic and rational and just command his own way as long as he makes it clear that HE is in charge not Bakuda or March. At the End I believe he let Bakuda and March play out the End of Apeiron to finally wrap this Shit-Show up and then break some literal Bones as a Power Play (though at that Point March would have already "broken the Ice" with a still active administrator, I don't know what would happen after that but Lung seems kind of inconsequential compared to it).
2) To be honest given Joes adherence to the unwritten rules even to the spirit of them I think it would go more towards No invasion of personal privacy.
3) I think the term Race Traitor is only applied to those who are actively against the ideology and help "lesser/inferior" races and not just white people who simply are ambivalent towards it (though the more extreme they are the less forgiving they become towards those not like-minded).

Yes. Without any irony or sarcasm - yes. Impressed he may be not, but taken by surprise? Pretty possible.

There is a difference between not expecting something and Surprise. So no definitely no surprise (maybe Tinker Tech on the level of Flechette would suffice) more not expecting a specific tactic or Hookwolfs aggression against someone he is just useless against (again he still has his precognitive algorithm actual surprise will be very hard).

Yes, they'll almost certainly reject his requests if they'll suspect E88 will try to "cosplay S9". They may reject if the'll know E88 will attack Apeiron, but they may not, depends from a couple of factors including Shards' nudging.
But "Due to recent events, I would like to have a few surprises up my sleeve" they'll, IMO, likely to see as completely valid reason to buy their tech. See examples below.

Pretty much the whole USA is following Brockton Bay or more specifically Apeiron the Enigmatic Artifiers moves at this period of time. Anyone out of Brockton Bay ordering Tinker equipment will be scrutinized and considered if they are worth the risk. Having your Tinker Tech pride and joy systematically and publicly disassembled and mocked is not a fun thought for most Tinker's who like their own reputation.
 
I'm sure we are all thinking of the most hilarious/awkward perk he could get during his phone call with his sister--I'm sure Strong Spark is in lots of people's minds, and if he misses a couple of rolls before he hits a perk there is actually a 1 in 24 chance he could get that. He could get the perk with 24 Kerbals running around the workshop on his first roll, but that might be right before the call and would just give him an excuse to delay it until he dealt/met with them. And then maybe delay even further. They would be fun to show up during the call though, as he tries to pay attention to his sister and the Kerbals start to try to build space ships. (Why does he have this
Imulsion (Gears of War) Free:
Upon completion of this jump, you gain a small pump in your Warehouse that can supply you with fifty gallons worth of Imulsion per month. Do be careful when handling this, especially around other biological organisms.
locked up behind this barrier? Can we get it down?)

I'm sure you all have your own hilarious ideas.

Edit: And, do we think LordR will get to the beginning adventures of Fleet: Shardspace Knight, or will that be in the next chapter? What time exactly did the Motoroid get damaged, and what time is it in story now? I'm thinking it was somewhat later in the day for the damage part..

Speaking of which, if an object is repeatedly damaged, does the repair fiat not kick in until two days after the final bit of damage is done? Could the fiat be subverted is someone subjects the tech to low levels of continuous damage, say by immersing it in acid?
 
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I'm sure we are all thinking of the most hilarious/awkward perk he could get during his phone call with his sister--I'm sure Strong Spark is in lots of people's minds, and if he misses a couple of rolls before he hits a perk there is actually a 1 in 24 chance he could get that. He could get the perk with 24 Kerbals running around the workshop on his first roll, but that might be right before the call and would just give him an excuse to delay it until he dealt/met with them. And then maybe delay even further. They would be fun to show up during the call though, as he tries to pay attention to his sister and the Kerbals start to try to build space ships. (Why does he have this
Imulsion (Gears of War) Free:
Upon completion of this jump, you gain a small pump in your Warehouse that can supply you with fifty gallons worth of Imulsion per month. Do be careful when handling this, especially around other biological organisms.
locked up behind this barrier? Can we get it down?)

I'm sure you all have your own hilarious ideas.

Edit: And, do we think LordR will get to the beginning adventures of Fleet: Shardspace Knight, or will that be in the next chapter? What time exactly did the Motoroid get damaged, and what time is it in story now? I'm thinking it was somewhat later in the day for the damage part..

Speaking of which, if an object is repeatedly damaged, does the repair fiat not kick in until two days after the final bit of damage is done? Could the fiat be subverted is someone subjects the tech to low levels of continuous damage, say by immersing it in acid?
I think it's from when it starts getting damaged is when the timer starts. Also I think the motoroid will pop back up during therapy.
 
given Joe's Advancement in medical technologies I don't think there is a normal mortal disease or wound he can't cure in a few seconds
Good point. Even current medics can (at least in theory - skilled medics, with the right equipment, and so on and so forth) "revive" people so long as brain intact, for four minutes after the heart stops work (after that brain begins to die due to lack of oxygen, and no matter previous state brain no longer can counts as "intact"). So Joe with all his medical knowledge and nanites definitely can do at least same. Likely better.

In light of the fact that the past weeks events where solely created and orchestrated by Bakuda and March and NOT him the actual leader of ABB to the point that Joe just leaves him (at least from his perspective) Lung would likely go against logic and rational and just command his own way as long as he makes it clear that HE is in charge not Bakuda or March.
Point. Presenting your idea to your boss like that his idea - not a new trick, though. And I think if March wanted, she could've played it without any problem.

To be honest given Joes adherence to the unwritten rules even to the spirit of them I think it would go more towards No invasion of personal privacy.
No invasion at all? :thonk: Just tracking things like "person A sent a message to person B" is already a pretty deep intrusion, even without looking at the contents of that message.
But even if he'd be willing to go all most the way down with eavesdropping every call and reading every message, I doubt it'll be easy for him and Survey to figure what's up before the start. Because people, today, constantly calls and exchange messages. Including things like "I'm ready" and "Where the John?".
Everyone who saw the record of his "dialogue" with March and Bakuda know that he can track "mundane" communications, and willing to do it at least when he need too "dumpster fire of logistic" and so on). So they won't discuss their plans over the phone or Internet (at least I'd won't do something so stupid if I'd have any option to avoid it).
Joe and Survey can notice that something is up, shortly before said "something" would start, but I doubt more than that... Unless they willing to go even furher (though even that not really all the way down) - with hacking every device in the city to remotely activate microphones to listen to what is happening nearby. Although, on that point, swarm of stealth spy drones would be more convenuent.

There is a difference between not expecting something and Surprise. So no definitely no surprise (maybe Tinker Tech on the level of Flechette would suffice) more not expecting a specific tactic or Hookwolfs aggression against someone he is just useless against (again he still has his precognitive algorithm actual surprise will be very hard).
Well, that seems a language/sense thing. For me, something like meeting a friend you didn't expect to be (wherever we accidentally meet) can be called surprise. Something like "a person who can't teleport suddenly can" - definitely counts as one. Do your native language have different words for different grades of surprise unexpected situations?

Having your Tinker Tech pride and joy systematically and publicly disassembled and mocked is not a fun thought for most Tinker's who like their own reputation.
That's fair point. But on the other hand, money and chance to say something like "our tech allowed our client to successfully fled the Apeiron, the Enigmatic Artificer, himself"! Not a bad advertisement.


I ask you to consider "Funny" reaction of mine as "Screams In Horror" that SV lacks for some obscure reason. :V

I'm sure Strong Spark is in lots of people's minds
Well, yes. I even wrote "not really an omake" about it:
Maybe. Or by getting the Strong Spark... Like that:

"..."
"Jozef?"
"..."
"Jozef! Are you ignoring me?"
"Yes."
"What?! :rage: "
"Yes, let's do it! "
"What? "
"Ok, you may tell mother that she'll get the ideal son back tomorrow."
"What with your tone? Are you drunk, or what? "
"Only with the prospect to leave it all behind and finally move forward, dear sister!"
"Jozef, I worry about you. What happened?"
"Nothing but a little realization. And now bye, I need to create a mindless android that will replace me in the household!"
" :???: "
"Mindless part is most difficult and important, of course! I'm not that cruel to send sapient being in that hell, you know."
*beeps*
Although, Cybertronian Forge would be something too: "Everything fine, I just accidentally dropped several cabinets at the same time, honest!" :V
 
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Can someone please tell me what an EVO is? I have been seeing it a lot in regards who what Joe can build, but I have no idea what it is and what world it's based on.
 
Is there a chapter this week?

Also poor joe having to deal with family drama.

And the glove reminds me of that old movie idle hands only hopefully less homicidal.
 
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