Brockton's Celestial Forge (Worm/Jumpchain)

[AntaeusTheGiant]

Getting hired by Danny probably isn't very likely at this point - the man has enough trouble finding work for his dockworkers as it is. Joe needs to find (or fake) some minor work elsewhere. He just need a tiny income for the books..

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Apeiron could hire the dockworkers to clean up the bay, both the devastation from the ABB fight and the longer term issues with the Ship Graveyard. Then the dockworkers could hire Jozef.

So what talents does Joe have that can be used for a small job? He did engineering at college, could he spin that to make it look like he is good with computers? Have Survey write some simple software and sell?

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Set up a booth in one of the city markets and sell jewelry and other trinkets. I understand there might be a buyer in Boston for anything he might make.

Edit: Even better, he could sell a line of clothing there in competition with Garment. He might even be able to actually call it "Natural Puppy" if TWEWY isn't a thing on Earth Bet or Aleph. This would be an even more hilarious, or awkward, way for him to meet Parian than thru Garment.

 

[Leafy503]

Honestly, I'm kinda wanting to see the absolute breakdown Armsmaster would have, once he theoretically found out just how Joe's power works, as well as explores Joe's workshop

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That's a whole 50 chapter arc by itself.

And then he gets another power that makes his previous enlightenment seem shallow. Kicking off the process yet again.

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What are the odds the next chapter he gets some power that makes all the previous ones irrelevant?

After a while I was thinking if nothing happens to advance the plot again I'm gonna scream.

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I mean he made a phone call. A single small step, but a step forward regardless.

 

[Koraan]

Weld is a hero. The Undersiders are villains. There is a difference.

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Really? Weld can't even dream to save in a day as many people as Apeiron can in a hour. That mean, saving him is a waste of time.

they really aren't good people. Weld is shown to be a good person.

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And yet, as your previous post states:

That isn't the point.

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You said, that your point not about your dislike for Taylor and Undersiders.
That mean, your point is that he could help more people instead of only five.
That mean, your new post contradicts your own previous stance.

does one life worth more than another? I mean, if you are looking at purely a Hero vs Villain standpoint, the hero's life is worth more.

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they won't even be "useful" for saving the world. It's cynical, but this is Worm.

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could mean the death of several more innocent people.

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Chen:
Civilian against other civilians.
Before Apeiron gave him Aura and equipment, he was totally worthless in the term of power.
One life against many. Unlike Undersiders - not figuratively like "he could do something more productive, I don't know what, but anything other will be better", but literally, because of Bakuda's bombs.
Go on, say that. Say that Joe should've abandon him.

Weld is a hero.

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Chen wasn't. And yet, you didn't said anything about the Joe who chose him ower a bunch of unnamed people who his duplicate could've saved instead.
No, that's not about the difference, that's, as much as you try deny it, about the personal preferences. You don't like undersiders, so you don't want Joe to interact with them. You like Weld, so you say that spending time with him is worth it.

 

[Subrosian_Smithy]

Apeiron could hire the dockworkers to clean up the bay, both the devastation from the ABB fight and the longer term issues with the Ship Graveyard. Then the dockworkers could hire Jozef.

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man, our boy's out here playing 5D chess with multiverse time travel while we're still stuck on tic-tac-toe

 

[gammelatad]

Weld is a hero, hands down….

 

[Kraftykidd]

Really? Weld can't even dream to save in a day as many people as Apeiron can in a hour. That mean, saving him is a waste of time.


And yet, as your previous post states:

You said, that your point not about your dislike for Taylor and Undersiders.
That mean, your point is that he could help more people instead of only five.
That mean, your new post contradicts your own previous stance.




Chen:
Civilian against other civilians.
Before Apeiron gave him Aura and equipment, he was totally worthless in the term of power.
One life against many. Unlike Undersiders - not figuratively like "he could do something more productive, I don't know what, but anything other will be better", but literally, because of Bakuda's bombs.
Go on, say that. Say that Joe should've abandon him.


Chen wasn't. And yet, you didn't said anything about the Joe who chose him ower a bunch of unnamed people who his duplicate could've saved instead.
No, that's not about the difference, that's, as much as you try deny it, about the personal preferences. You don't like undersiders, so you don't want Joe to interact with them. You like Weld, so you say that spending time with him is worth it.

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You're completely ignoring the fact that saving Weld was both a morally correct action same as Chen, which as shown in story Jozef is a really moral person. He's not gonna ignore people who he can in fact save if doing so doesn't directly put into jeopardy others as a direct result. Also saving Weld fucking helps extend an olive branch abit to the PRT as a whole and shows him to be less Villain
Mercenary and more neutral with a tint to wanting to save people from shit, like he did during the boning of the last major action arc. It's a move that would generate goodwill inside of the organization and hopefully help battle their negative assumptions about him.

 

[SoulShdw]

It is Joe, the normal unemployed college dropout guy, that is short on cash. Or more specifically: cash that he can explain where it came from. I mean, he could easily make money in his cape identity and use it in his civilian life, but that might rise questions and pull attention to Joe if he isn't careful.

X chapters back he mentioned that he thought that as long as he only used a small amount of "unexplained cash" it would simply look like he had some sort of under the table work. That wouldn't be unusual with BB being what it is - but if he started to do big purchases, like moving to a better apartment or owning up to having that awesome restored bike, then it clearly looks like he is involved in something criminal. It's the most likely way to get that much money fast after all.

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This.

This kind of goes back to the point where it sometimes feels like Joe is more a vehicle for the Forge than a character. This type of stuff gets lost in the shuffle. While many of his needs have dropped significantly since he obtained his powers (at this point, the only reason he needs his apartment at all is because he needs a safe place to open the door to his workshop from), he still requires some form of legal tender that Jozef Duris can obtain, rather than Apeiron can sell. Even if he doesn't need to buy food/water/clothing anymore, he still needs to pay rent for the apartment (even if he has all utilities cut to it, but that would draw attention), he still needs random cash for things like gas money for his car and stuff like that when he goes out (which seems to be getter rarer, but whatever).

Honestly, the easiest way to do this is to start with Garment's shop. Aisha could play grapevine and get one of the gym guys to ask Joe to help Garment out with some re-wiring at her boutique before it opens. It gives Joe and excuse to be there, and he can later spin that he used the experience in watching Garment and her lawyer get things set up to start up his own business.

The easiest thing Joe could do would be to get a hold of an area he could start as an auto garage, and then just find old wrecks (and I'm sure there's plenty in the bay) and spend time fixing them up, remastering some of them even depending on the model, and selling them off. It's something people already do for a living, and it would fit with what his social circles are aware of what he's capable of. He'd have to be slow, and likely would need help getting loans or something (although if Garment's store takes off, this could be spun as her thanking him for his help in the past) to get started, but Joe doesn't particularly need to pull a huge profit. He likely would once works of his cars got around, but since he'd be keeping it to a one-man show, he likely have to be slow about how many he fixed. And since he needs so little time to actually fix them (or improve them, etc.) He could use all the time that would normally be spent on repairing the vehicles for other things. Like he fixed that truck in like 15 minutes, from what it sounded like, where it likely would have taken days/weeks at an actual auto-garage to do so.

Bam, legitimate employment and business that doesn't draw too much attention if he's smart about it (i.e. not getting the urge to turn a wrecked Toyota Corolla into something with the performance of a Lamborghini Diablo). Hell, he's keeping a Ford Pinto running. That basically proves his car chops to anyone

Edit: To the original point that I wanted to address, the gym guys already think Joe is involved in some shady stuff. They get that impression from looking at his bike and some of the things he's said to them. They don't hold it against him.

 

[CircleTheSkies]

It is Joe, the normal unemployed college dropout guy, that is short on cash. Or more specifically: cash that he can explain where it came from. I mean, he could easily make money in his cape identity and use it in his civilian life, but that might rise questions and pull attention to Joe if he isn't careful.

X chapters back he mentioned that he thought that as long as he only used a small amount of "unexplained cash" it would simply look like he had some sort of under the table work. That wouldn't be unusual with BB being what it is - but if he started to do big purchases, like moving to a better apartment or owning up to having that awesome restored bike, then it clearly looks like he is involved in something criminal. It's the most likely way to get that much money fast after all.

An amusing solution to this going forward would be to have Joe be officially employed by Garment once she get her shop up and running. He could be put down as a part timer and that small income would be enough to explain how he can pay his rent and so on - plus it would confirm the gym guys idea that he's doing henching in a completely unexpected way (does it count as henching if the cape is a rogue?).

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Well, he *can* have an occasional side job - like the truck he fixed up. It's probably hazardous now to take any job that involves repairing or making something, of course, and it needs to be something that doesn't actually occupy much (if any) of his time... since he'll be wanting to use as much of his waking time as possible on Getting Other Things Done (and periodically generate more duplicates).

He dropped out as an engineering student - he could perhaps get a job doing some form of engineering consulting. While actually *building* things would trigger all those aesthetic (and non-aesthetic) powers, blueprinting out new designs or quality assurance on hire might well be able to avoid those issues if he's careful. And it wouldn't take too many jobs per year to explain a fairly frugal lifestyle.

Or he could select some small but valuable mundane improvement or invention in some lucrative area (that fits his focus in school), patent it and sell the patent to a large company working in that area. That should give him enough "explained" income to last a while, and he could either repeat (in the same general area) or shift between invention and consulting as desired.


Of course, "legal income" is a long-term concern. In all honesty, things are going to get to an absurd point long before he's paying taxes - and he might well decide it's best that Joe simply disappeared. Cover it up with a flight to someplace, a couple messages indicating a desire for a new start away from his past and the like and Joe become Apeiron full-time.

 

[SoulShdw]

he might well decide it's best that Joe simply disappeared. Cover it up with a flight to someplace, a couple messages indicating a desire for a new start away from his past and the like and Joe become Apeiron full-time.

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In my personal opinion, this would be the absolute worst thing that could happen, both for Joe as a character and person, and in the long-term, this story. If he completely pulled himself away from normal life... well, his mindset will start to break down. He already does the quarter thing which started as a joke, but he's even admitted that he's uncomfortable with the amount of mental money that jar now has. He needs normal interactions, like with the guys at the gym, the interaction he'd get from living a normal life, etc. In addition, that would mean he was basically running from all his personal problems.

I think if he did that, I'd drop this story in a heartbeat. The Forge is not interesting to me. Apeiron and his shenanigans are interesting, but Joe and his struggles to still live a somewhat normal life when outside his lab are far more.

 

[gammelatad]

SNIP

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ANOTHER SNIP

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I see a lot of text, but weld is still a hero

 

[SoulShdw]

That...is true? But somewhat irrelevant to both posts you quoted, so I'll admit I'm a bit confused. I might be missing somethign.

 

[Koraan]

That should only be relevant if tinkertech crosses border. Which means there are at least two workarounds:

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Will only work when laws are interpreted independently. But the thing is - if government will be on his side, any problems will be ignored, and if government will be against him, no matter how closely he adheres to the laws, in court he will be found guilty.

What are the odds the next chapter he gets some power that makes all the previous ones irrelevant?

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Probability tends to zero, because perks stacks.

You're completely ignoring the fact that saving Weld was both a morally correct action same as Chen

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Yes, I am. Mostly because my post was aimed to refute RogerDodger's arguments.
Also because "morality" is vague concept and have different meaning for different people. So, that argument would've only fuel the arguing.

About the rest of your post - people already tried to explain to RogerDodger how Undersiders can be useful to Apeiron, and he continue to say that they wouldn't be useful enough to justify spending Apeiron's oh so valuable time. So, I'm going to do the same (in regard to that dispute).

It's probably hazardous now to take any job that involves repairing or making something

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Actually, with new Lego perk (Efficiency), he might be able to tune down his fiat-backed effects at least somehow. If so, that's be not so dangerous to him.

 

[LuxPurplishGreen]

Going Aperion full time might be tempting but it is also an awful idea for Joe's mental health. Plus he would basically be giving up his previous life and all the effort he has spent on getting better - basically admitting a personal defeat. He really need that human interaction that he gets trough the gym.

Admittedly the cover job thing is a problem for later, but making a Joe-bot doing pizza-delivery would be an easy solution - especially if a robot-double or butler-bot counts under SSS. It's simple work with minimal social contact that can be handled by an VI. Fleet would love to have a bot that dives around all the time and it can do double duty as a rowing scanner if Joe crams it full of sensors, which might be useful once Dragon shows up and starts her own surveillance.

 

[SoulShdw]

He really need that human interaction that he gets trough the gym.

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Not even just the gym. I mean, it's unlikely to happen, but I genuinely think it'd be hilarious if he and Hannah actually ended up crossing paths in their civilian identities. Or honestly the interaction he'd have with customers in either his occasional repair job, or just other people in general. Hell just making a decision of 'You know what, I'm going to walk to coffee shop A and have a cup of coffee there at 9 am every day. Yes, I know I can make better, but that's not the point' and having to interact with others, or at least seeing how non-capes are reacting to all the BS in the bay would be healthy for him.

I mean, he's now all super fashionable and always looks his best. I just imagine one of the gym guys dragging him out to a bar or club and being suddenly surprised from the attention he'll be receiving from the ladies (while the gym guys just either get annoyed at his luck or amused at his surprise.)

 

[Kraftykidd]

Yeah. Joe really needs to start going out more. Also I think to help this would be if the circular descriptions of Joe's new forge perks and his old ones combining were cut down to chaff. Like really be more succinct and just give the quickest description of how it improves everything together with others without going on a paragraph per perk in depth explanation of all his perks and the new one and how they combine.

Use instead that time that'd be wasted and build up some slice of life scene to help keep Joe a person instead of a puppet for the Forge.

Also, yeah. Joe should come up with either a patent for a invention or something that isn't too super futuristic but still very cutting edge and can be made by others. He could get money from that, and also set up a company making said things while keeping incognito and have his AI help him manage the business.

That or he could do the auto shop idea. Maybe have him using different cars as a basis make a brand new model that looks sleek and nice? Like super sportscar that he can say he worked on restoring and making from scrap, and sell it as a new brand model? And then use the money earned from that to make a company producing those new cars.

Another idea is he could become a designer like someone said for engineering things, where his perks wouldn't come into play design wise. Maybe have Garnent "Outreach" to the community and he comes up with it for her shop remodeling fully, and it's a huge success when it's worked on? Maybe even use a duplicate and Joe to have Apeiron in the same place so Joe can hand it off to him who Garment contracted for the super fast remodeling based on the design but improved by a tinker? I dunno.

 

[The Shallow]

Joe's already considered abandoning everything for safety/practicality before:

The only way I could leave this with a true sense of safety would be to abandon my non-cape identity. Go dark, cut all ties to my civilian life, and live on the run. I could probably hack in a new set of ID without too much trouble and relocate to somewhere else in the city for the duration of the current crisis, then to somewhere else in the country after that. My family might be at risk, but with only Aisha's word for people to go by they would probably be safe in the long run.

That thought horrified me more than I expected. I didn't have the best situation in my civilian life, but I had put a huge amount of effort into pulling myself back together over the last two years. Walking away made it feel like all that progress, all that effort, was for nothing. I didn't want to burn the identity I'd grown up with and start fresh, no matter how good an idea it would be.

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Also yeah, the Gym is great.

Once again I thanked God for the consistent indifference of that place. There was something refreshing about a location where people literally did not care if you were in organized crime, a villain henchman, tied up with side hustles, or concealing horrible personal secrets. As long as you showed up, paid your dues, and didn't cause trouble they couldn't care less.

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Jozef Duris dissapearing is not gonna happen. Him running a repair service, whether under the table or not, is the best solution for him. The initial cash he got from the Undersiders is gonna run out eventually. Joe could hack the local bank, but WEDGD looks out for this shit, not to mention the intense book-keeping, and the fact that they were robbed very recently.

EDIT: ALSO let me just say, Joe should really avoid meeting heroes/capes in civilian form. Aisha is observant, but like...

"Right, so after that I tried to figure out what I could do, if there was anyone who could see me. I saw the broadcast from last night." She looked straight at me. "That was you."

There was no question or request for confirmation. I didn't doubt that she was certain of things even before she had seen my costume in the entryway. Aisha was an annoyingly observant girl in a way that made her a pain to deal with.

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If the PRT ever questions him about the repairs to the truck or anything, he might get figured out. The recent illusion system is a very good, important step. Potions felt a bit less finicky, but I shall trust in the Power Of The Fox.

 

[CircleTheSkies]

In my personal opinion, this would be the absolute worst thing that could happen, both for Joe as a character and person, and in the long-term, this story. If he completely pulled himself away from normal life... well, his mindset will start to break down. He already does the quarter thing which started as a joke, but he's even admitted that he's uncomfortable with the amount of mental money that jar now has. He needs normal interactions, like with the guys at the gym, the interaction he'd get from living a normal life, etc. In addition, that would mean he was basically running from all his personal problems.

I think if he did that, I'd drop this story in a heartbeat. The Forge is not interesting to me. Apeiron and his shenanigans are interesting, but Joe and his struggles to still live a somewhat normal life when outside his lab are far more.

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It'd not be healthy, no. And would probably weaken the elements of the story that attract me the most as well - but it *is* an option for the question as stated. And something that I could see Joe actually trying to do - especially if the next family interaction goes poorly (and/or he starts blaming himself for things that happen to those he knows).

Actually, with new Lego perk (Efficiency), he might be able to tune down his fiat-backed effects at least somehow. If so, that's be not so dangerous to him.

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It's possible - in which case, yes, something like a car or appliance repair service is almost ideal for him. He could either do it on hire or buy up old ones and refurbish them (or some mixture) - and as long as he keeps things toned down and the repairs don't get unbelievable he could manage to eke out a decent 'legal' living.

He could have a closet in the shop be 'set' to the Workshop, even. Duck in every hour or so to refresh the duplicates, perhaps be doing some virtual work while he's manning the counter. He doesn't even need to take that many real customers if he has a source to launder from; he could pad it out with a few fake entries easily enough.

But it comes down to if he can be fixing things up without revealing supernatural craftsmanship.

 

[Kraftykidd]

Joe's already considered abandoning everything for safety/practicality before:

Also yeah, the Gym is great.

Jozef Duris dissapearing is not gonna happen. Him running a repair service, whether under the table or not, is the best solution for him. The initial cash he got from the Undersiders is gonna run out eventually. Joe could hack the local bank, but WEDGD looks out for this shit, not to mention the intense book-keeping, and the fact that they were robbed very recently.

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Hmmm... Jozef's Juryrig sounds nice. A place that fixes up cars, and fixes up junk heaps into nice remodels to sell for profit. He could also still have his Apeiron's Assorted Appurtenances and Accoutrements. Have a VI and his blackboard super tech to defend it and his crafted everything goods. Make a lot of bank AS Apeiron that way, so he could use said money when needed for actions that would be helped by it. Like uplifting the economy by making jobs he can pay, or other shit.

Edit: Also Garment's shop should be called Garment's Gala. Alliteration shop names are great and I don't care what anyone else says

 

[Alwaysnice2cu]

Joe could just pull a. Number man (hacking) to fix his civilian ID money problem. He doesn't even need to do much just make a normal or even spotty payment record to pay taxes. The only problem I would see him having is dragon finding out.

 

[The Shallow]

Joe could just pull a. Number man (hacking) to fix his civilian ID money problem. He doesn't even need to do much just make a normal or even spotty payment record to pay taxes. The only problem I would see him having is dragon finding out.

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The numberman doesn't do much hacking, mostly just running predictions and making moves through his power. He also knows what WEDGD uses to track down financial crime, making it easy to dodge them. Similar to what March and Lisa did. Joe could be subtle, but again WEDGD and Dragon are sniffing around. It would be difficult.

 

[SoulShdw]

With Numberman I think it's less hacking and more embezzling, in a sense. He's handling the money for a lot of villains, or so it's claimed, so he's probably just skimming what Cauldron needs off the top, and if someone needs something from an account he runs, he can always take it from another villain with them being the wiser.

 

[PinkShadowReader]

Really? Weld can't even dream to save in a day as many people as Apeiron can in a hour. That mean, saving him is a waste of time.



And yet, as your previous post states:


You said, that your point not about your dislike for Taylor and Undersiders.

That mean, your point is that he could help more people instead of only five.

That mean, your new post contradicts your own previous stance.





Chen:

Civilian against other civilians.

Before Apeiron gave him Aura and equipment, he was totally worthless in the term of power.

One life against many. Unlike Undersiders - not figuratively like "he could do something more productive, I don't know what, but anything other will be better", but literally, because of Bakuda's bombs.

Go on, say that. Say that Joe should've abandon him.



Chen wasn't. And yet, you didn't said anything about the Joe who chose him ower a bunch of unnamed people who his duplicate could've saved instead.

No, that's not about the difference, that's, as much as you try deny it, about the personal preferences. You don't like undersiders, so you don't want Joe to interact with them. You like Weld, so you say that spending time with him is worth it.

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I agree with RogerDodger123 to a certain degree.

I disliked Aisha because of her inablility to follow guidelines and her recklessness. That she's someone that couldn't be trusted.
That changed when she realised that she was out of depth for Apeiron problemsTM and strives to be someone that can be depended on.
She tries to be responsible with both her actions and Apeiron tech. She has Fleet and Survey that can help her with her tech responability if she needs help. She and Joe talk to each other. No big miscommunication. It also helps Joe that she hadn't robbed any banks in broad daylight. Only small stuff like warcrimes is something she could be charged with.
No matter, she hasn't hurt people.

I dislike Taylor because of her inablility to talk. Her shortsightness. That she mixes her depression with her self imposed mission so it becomes something like a death mission.
These flaws results to a person who can't be trusted.
When confronted with a possible solution that she was meant to do some things she grabbed it hard and never looked back.
Never mind she then ignores this same person that insists she is wrong about what he meant. A plausable misunderstanding that only be sustaned as long as she refuses to talk about it.
She did not use her tinkertech knife responsible. It might just have been adrealine or teenager brains in high pressure situation but it happend and it can't be undone.
Alright, best to cut here about Taylor so I don't rant too much. It's hard to try to be neutral.

I dislike Lisa because she's playing three sides. She plays Coil(knows to a large degree), Taylor(have no idea) and Joe(he thinks so to a small degree).
She tries to hack Apeiron's watches that they were given for a different purpuse. I don't trust her hunger for Apeiron tech. She's not responsible with her loaned tech watch. I'm excluding her gun in the bankjob.


I don't dislike Brian, Alec and Rachel to the same amount as the others in Undersiders. I certainly don't like them but I have no dislike over them.
Brian is upfront with Joe even if he has gotten no reasurrances when he called.
Alec is a sociopath and not a good person but I'm pretty neutral about him because he makes minimal trouble for Apeiron's rep.
Dispite Rachel having murder on her rap sheet am I not upset about her. She doesn't cause troubles for Apeiron as she respects him as an alpha or a top dog.
This could change drastically when she goes against E88 for dogfighting rings but as she has done that before it shouldn't be laid on Apeiron's feet.
All three of them used their bankjob weapon somewhat okay. Hostages are not okay ofcourse but that's besides the point.


Chen is an fully grown adult. He's fully capable of judging his action and determine what he should do.
He's also a married man that knows how to be responsible outside of just his own actions. He has the experience and a fully devoloped brain that can make sound decisions.
Chen is also a person Apeiron has meet. They talked even however brief. A personal connection is always stronger than faceless masses. Even more than that, Apeiron feels like he can trust him with his gear and not fear that he'll go to the Protectorate. Ofcourse its personal preferances.

 

[Kraftykidd]

I agree with RogerDodger123 to a certain degree.

I disliked Aisha because of her inablility to follow guidelines and her recklessness. That she's someone that couldn't be trusted.
That changed when she realised that she was out of depth for Apeiron problemsTM and strives to be someone that can be depended on.
She tries to be responsible with both her actions and Apeiron tech. She has Fleet and Survey that can help her with her tech responability if she needs help. She and Joe talk to each other. No big miscommunication. It also helps Joe that she hadn't robbed any banks in broad daylight. Only small stuff like warcrimes is something she could be charged with.
No matter, she hasn't hurt people.

I dislike Taylor because of her inablility to talk. Her shortsightness. That she mixes her depression with her self imposed mission so it becomes something like a death mission.
These flaws results to a person who can't be trusted.
When confronted with a possible solution that she was meant to do some things she grabbed it hard and never looked back.
Never mind she then ignores this same person that insists she is wrong about what he meant. A plausable misunderstanding that only be sustaned as long as she refuses to talk about it.
She did not use her tinkertech knife responsible. It might just have been adrealine or teenager brains in high pressure situation but it happend and it can't be undone.
Alright, best to cut here about Taylor so I don't rant too much. It's hard to try to be neutral.

I dislike Lisa because she's playing three sides. She plays Coil(knows to a large degree), Taylor(have no idea) and Joe(he thinks so to a small degree).
She tries to hack Apeiron's watches that they were given for a different purpuse. I don't trust her hunger for Apeiron tech. She's not responsible with her loaned tech watch. I'm excluding her gun in the bankjob.


I don't dislike Brian, Alec and Rachel to the same amount as the others in Undersiders. I certainly don't like them but I have no dislike over them.
Brian is upfront with Joe even if he has gotten no reasurrances when he called.
Alec is a sociopath and not a good person but I'm pretty neutral about him because he makes minimal trouble for Apeiron's rep.
Dispite Rachel having murder on her rap sheet am I not upset about her. She doesn't cause troubles for Apeiron as she respects him as an alpha or a top dog.
This could change drastically when she goes against E88 for dogfighting rings but as she has done that before it shouldn't be laid on Apeiron's feet.
All three of them used their bankjob weapon somewhat okay. Hostages are not okay ofcourse but that's besides the point.


Chen is an fully grown adult. He's fully capable of judging his action and determine what he should do.
He's also a married man that knows how to be responsible outside of just his own actions. He has the experience and a fully devoloped brain that can make sound decisions.
Chen is also a person Apeiron has meet. They talked even however brief. A personal connection is always stronger than faceless masses. Even more than that, Apeiron feels like he can trust him with his gear and not fear that he'll go to the Protectorate. Ofcourse its personal preferances.

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Id say with Taylor she at least has the excuse of her entire situation leading up to her trigger to help explain her bad choices. Like it's still not good and she's too stubborn about it, but honestly it makes sense she wouldn't trust what an adult says considering how no adult ever helped her when she still deigned to ask for it, or it happened in front of their faces.

Alec, his issues stem from his nurture not his nature. Which was compounded when he triggered. Honestly he should hopefully be getting better due to how Apeiron healed him fixing his fucked up brain chemistry. So while he might act the same he might be feeling more than ever.

Lisa... I dislike her for many reasons, and a big one is how she's vindictive and constantly poking at shit when she should know better.

 

[gammelatad]

That...is true? But somewhat irrelevant to both posts you quoted, so I'll admit I'm a bit confused. I might be missing somethign.

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Yeah I did post wrongly….
weld is still a hero, no?

 

[SoulShdw]

I was more confused why you were quoting me about Weld when nothing in my response had anything to do with Weld.