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Puella Magi Adfligo Systema

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Kaizuki said:
Please Godwinson. Please. No more.

I wouldn't have accepted the first one if I could have prevented it. I won't accept another one. I was prepared at most to stand by while they spoke, not while they came to blows. And there was no vote to do less than that, not by anyone. You're projecting.
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Alright, but... they've already come to blows. I'd say this moved past speaking already. This conversation is toxic and needs to end.

Edit: Slapping is one thing, already a pretty not okay thing in most circumstances but a separate thing from a super powered slap that sends someone sprawling. The rest of the conversation will take place with the silent threat that she could do it again. We need to prevent that.
 
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So, trying to calm down the situation is all well and good, but what exactly do you guys want to say to Niko?

Also what about the others coming in? They're also likely to be angry right now. Perhaps ask Mami to talk to them while Sabrina deals with what's going on with Niko and Kanna?
 
Yeah, I definitely agree with Godwinson that this is not acceptable behavior. Hijiri's life is her own. She has the right to live it as she wishes regardless of whatever motive she was created for. And slapping her when she's this scared and miserable is very much not good.
 
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[x] Godwinson

I usually don't vote, but this is wtf enough that I had to.
 
Agent Whiskers said:
So, trying to calm down the situation is all well and good, but what exactly do you guys want to say to Niko?

Also what about the others coming in? They're also likely to be angry right now. Perhaps ask Mami to talk to them while Sabrina deals with what's going on with Niko and Kanna?
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Hm. Possibly immediately stepping in between the two of them, and reminding Niko that Hijri is her own person, and she has no right to be telling her how she should be living her life?

You know, on top of the admonishment for beating a defenseless prisoner.
 
[x] Godwinson

So uh. Hey. Someone with a professional occupation of helping abused kids? It looks like this Hijiri/Niko situation quite often. We need to step in, this is so unacceptable we should have stepped in an update ago.

Also god dammit take away that fucking memory device so we can cleanse both of these fucking girls, jesus. Smash the damn thing.
 
*sighs*

I'm tempted to vote Godwinson, but...

I don't know. Both sides present good points, and I'm paralyzed with indecision.

One part of my brain is yelling at me to step in right now, while another is screaming that we don't know the full situation, and need to observe.

The fact that the pro-intervening bandwagon doesn't specify how to intervene doesn't help. Nor does the salt, which rivals some threads on the official World of Warcraft forums.

(Emphasis on some threads. All the other threads are salter than the Dead Sea. Seriously, the Blizzard Forums make SB/SV look positively reasonable by comparison. I quit WoW for a reason.)

Anyway, my little internal argument has resolved itself in favor of intervening while I was typing this, but the fact that Godwinson's vote doesn't say how we do so is something of a turn-off.

I was going to bite the bullet and finally whip up my own vote, but first, I need at least two more hours of sleep.

Until then,

[X] Null
 
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Gadjo said:
Hm. Possibly immediately stepping in between the two of them, and reminding Niko that Hijri is her own person, and she has no right to be telling her how she should be living her life?

You know, on top of the admonishment for beating a defenseless prisoner.
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While that's true, the way she's living her life right now is kind of dumb and also happens to be a threat to the safety of several people.:V

Also, again, she's not beating her. While I appreciate how several people are very much not okay with people getting slapped in the face, everyone needs to kind of chill out a bit. I can't help but feel that some of you are really projecting here.
 
Agent Whiskers said:
While that's true, the way she's living her life right now is kind of dumb and also happens to be a threat to the safety of several people.:V

Also, again, she's not beating her. While I appreciate how several people are very much not okay with people getting slapped in the face, everyone needs to kind of chill out a bit. I can't help but feel that some of you are really projecting here.
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Firnagzen said:
the force of the blow sending Hijiri spinning to the ground.
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I'm sorry?
 
Agent Whiskers said:
While that's true, the way she's living her life right now is kind of dumb and also happens to be a threat to the safety of several people.:V

Also, again, she's not beating her. While I appreciate how several people are very much not okay with people getting slapped in the face, everyone needs to kind of chill out a bit. I can't help but feel that some of you are really projecting here.
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It's not a slap in the face if it sends you "spinning across the rooftop". That's assault.

Also, I meant more in the sense that she's specifically saying what she should be doing with her life instead of saying she shouldn't be doing this. Either way, she has no right to say that to her with the constantly looming threat of further assault. Which she can't defend herself from. From someone who has no need to attack her.
 
Vebyast said:
They're still fighting, loudly enough that Sabrina doesn't want to have to yell over them to talk to Saki standing right next to each other.
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Kaizuki said:
@Firnagzen is this the case? Or is the "shouting match" line occurring simultaneously with the dialogue we got from them?

Er, to clarify, is it "the dialogue is the shouting match" or is it "the shouting match is following the dialogue"?
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They are yelling at each other still, yes. I've edited somewhat for clarity.
"No!" Niko snaps. "You were supposed to live like I never could!"

Saki taps you on the shoulder, gesturing backwards and away from the confrontation. She points upwards at another growing speck in the sky, this one much harder to make out with its sky-coloured camouflage. Kazumi incoming, then.

"Yeah, right!" Hijiri spits back. "You just- you just wanted to throw away your guilt! Pretend you could be happy!"

You shake your head, rather than try and make yourself heard over the shouting match, and you jerk your head back towards them. You need to watch Hijiri.

"You could have been happy!" Niko snarls.

Saki grits her teeth, grabbing you by the shoulder and trying to drag you away. "Niko can handle herself," she snaps.
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Vebyast said:
@Firnagzen, seconding request juuuust to be sure.
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Can do.
 
@Godwinson

Having a line to intervene is good, but I do believe we should have an addition to push where we want this conversation to go.

i.e [] We really need everyone to calm down now. This anger is toxic.
 
Vebyast said:
We should probably make sure to keep Niko cleansed, as a side note.
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We can't as long as she's inside the memory field, which gives us yet another reason to put some distance between her and Hijiri.

Something like this:
"Niko, you need to step back. I can't clean your gem while you're inside the field."
"My gem doesn't need cleaning!"
"Well, clearly it does, because you just struck a restrained, defenseless prisoner, and you wouldn't do that if you were thinking clearly."
 
[X] "It's not Niko I'm worried about right now, it's the person she's treating like a thing."
[X] Intervene.
[X] Get rid of memory device. Physically separate. Cleanse.
[X] Hitting someone who can't do anything about it, otherwise your friends beat them down? In what world is that acceptable? Is that the sort of person you want to be? You want her to be happy, and you do this?

Added actual stuff for intervening.
 
aeqnai said:
I'm sorry?
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Gadjo said:
It's not a slap in the face if it sends you "spinning across the rooftop". That's assault.

Also, I meant more in the sense that she's specifically saying what she should be doing with her life instead of saying she shouldn't be doing this. Either way, she has no right to say that to her with the constantly looming threat of further assault. Which she can't defend herself from. From someone who has no need to attack her.
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I know I have a habit of understating things and being pedantic, but can you guys please not jump down my throat? It feels like you guys are upset at me for not frothing at the mouth in rage. I'm afraid I just don't usually emote that much.

Firnagzen said:
They are yelling at each other still, yes. I've edited somewhat for clarity.


Can do.
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Well, crap. Yup, that requires immediate intervention. Also, WTF Saki?o_O
 
We can't even say that we promised that Hijiri would be treated like a person because we never got to that part of the last vote. And we we can't actually stop them or cleanse Niko's gem because we didn't get Hijiri to drop the memory device on the floor. What a shitshow this is.

[] Intervene.

[] Thread 1a: Immediately:
-[] Command Niko out of the memory field so you can cleanse her gem.
--[] Ask Mami to do it if you need more presence.
-[] Once Niko's out, use utility fog to keep her away from Hijiri.
-[] Move to stand to support Hijiri.
-[] Announce that everyone needs to calm down.
-[] Cleanse soul gems, especially Niko's.

[] Thread 1b: Immediately:
-[] Telepathy Saki: Niko is not in control. And she's not the person you're worried about in the first place.
-[] Use utility fog to remove Saki's hand from your shoulder and keep her from interfering.

[] Thread 1c: Immediately:
-[] Telepathy Sayaka and Mami: Keep eyes on everyone. The Pleiades are losing control and might need some Peacekeeping.

[] Thread 1d: Immediately:
-[] Telepathy Kazumi and get her to let you handle it. Niko's lost it, Hijiri's digging in, more shouting won't help, and Hijiri will see Kazumi as an opponent coming in on Niko's side and the situation will deteriorate even further.
-[] If she continues despite your arguments, break to voting.

[] Thread 2a: When 1a finishes:
-[] Get rid of the memory device.
--[] Subtly, so it doesn't interrupt anything else - use utility fog to compress it or something.
-[] Cleanse Hijiri again.

[] Thread 2b: When 1a finishes:
-[] Start talking.
--[] Hijiri would have a much better chance of finding a happy life if Niko would stop hitting her.
--[] Niko did wish for Hijiri to be able to be happy, however awful she is at saying that.
--[] But Niko needs to let Hijiri live her life, whatever Hijiri chooses that life to be. She's a person just as much as Niko is.
-[] Offer Hijiri sanctuary in Mitakihara. You can't guarantee she'll live a peaceful life, but you can provide a situation where she can choose or make one for herself.
 
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Godwinson said:
[X] "It's not Niko I'm worried about right now, it's the person she's treating like a thing."
[X] Intervene.
[X] Get rid of memory device. Physically separate. Cleanse.
[X] Hitting someone who can't do anything about it, otherwise your friends beat them down? In what world is that acceptable? Is that the sort of person you want to be? You want her to be happy, and you do this?

Added actual stuff for intervening.
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You don't want try and explain Kanna's perspective on her situation? Because it looks like Niko really isn't getting it right now. Then again, tempers are high right now, and it may not be a good time. And I'm also not sure if that vote specifically helps calm things down by itself. It certainly looks cathartic, though.
 
Okay, so I've had time to digest and... yeah, everything about this Asunaro expedition sucks. Oriko's never going to let us hear the end of it and that troll Kirika's liable to buy Mami a leash to "help keep us in line" when this is over.

That said, I'm willing to take a crack at salvaging a shitty situation.

[x] Don't even dignify Saki with a response. If she doesn't see how wrong she is, it's not worth it.
[x] Brainmail Kazumi: "Hopefully be with you in a few but things are way toxic down here and we've let it go too far already."
[x] Enlist Mami and Sayaka's help to separate them and deescalate. Again. Jerry Springer is not a model to emulate!
-[x] Fuck it, Sayaka, antimagic. This paranoia over memory bullshit and what precisely the device does has gone far too long. It can be rebuilt.
-[x] Quiet down, don't make me get the spray bottle.
-[x] Saki will probably interfere more insistently. "I'm sure you mean well, Saki, but I will NOT allow this to become a lynching."

I'm not quite sure where to go from here, but I also rather don't expect we'd get through more than this in the next update.
 
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