Remove ads

Puella Magi Adfligo Systema

Reader mode
Want to offer my opinion that we shouldn't just be blindly rushing to include all meguca-parents, or even MOST of them, for reasons exactly like the Mikuni's. Potentials seem selected for negative life situations, many of those will naturally relate to troubles with family, and really it is not at all clear that merely being the parent of a magical girl is any indication that you'd be especially competent or useful in dealing with issues of the masquerade or the sudden anti-equality aspect of some having reality breaking power and most not. And while Clear Seeds may eventually mitigate or eliminate the issue of emotional-stability being prioritized, if we want Witches to get hunted without abusing our poor clone-makers theres still the issue of sorta NEEDING the meguca to continue their child-soldiery against Witches so that generic humans don't die (at least until Witches are eliminated by ubiquitous clear seeds and/or getting the Incubators to change strategy). Add in the parents that will try to exploit their childs sudden power (imagine if Kyouko's Dad had asked her to enhance his sermons, instead of freaking out over it, or any of the parents who already do things like pressure child-stars and prodigies) , the parents who will violently repress it for one reason or another (Witch! Burn/Harvest the Witch!) , the parents who will freak out over things like Lichbomb generally and potential-immortality specifically, the way that normal conflict from parental authority and normal teenage rebellion will be greatly magnified by the power imbalance and the potential of things like flight/don't-need-food/teleporting to nullify punishments, the way that abusers will see it as Christmas to learn their child can easily heal and won't break..... yeah.

Basically I'd rather see the handpicked "Trusted Non-Contractee" system of the MSY in To the Stars, even if Clear-Seeds in the Witch System make their solutions less of a requirement than Cubes in the Demon system. We can look into a general drop of the Masquerade once we've first revolutionized and improved the Meguca systems and culture, and once theres a better opportunity to do so (revealing the advantages of organized meguca's in space colonization, or intervening in an out of control war even if it isn't aliens, etc).

So yeah, I don't want us rushing to involve Sayaka's parents we know nothing at all about, when they have personal motivation to disrupt the fragile stability of our group and 'successes' like the Kures.
 
Sayaka's dad seems pretty normal, OK adult, strict but chill enough to tease his daughter about having a girlfriend.

Still, while there's special reasons to involve the Mikis, the first step to that will be having that talk with the Shizukis, which we have scheduled for the weekend.
 
Racoras said:
Want to offer my opinion that we shouldn't just be blindly rushing to include all meguca-parents, or even MOST of them, for reasons exactly like the Mikuni's. Potentials seem selected for negative life situations, many of those will naturally relate to troubles with family, and really it is not at all clear that merely being the parent of a magical girl is any indication that you'd be especially competent or useful in dealing with issues of the masquerade or the sudden anti-equality aspect of some having reality breaking power and most not. And while Clear Seeds may eventually mitigate or eliminate the issue of emotional-stability being prioritized, if we want Witches to get hunted without abusing our poor clone-makers theres still the issue of sorta NEEDING the meguca to continue their child-soldiery against Witches so that generic humans don't die (at least until Witches are eliminated by ubiquitous clear seeds and/or getting the Incubators to change strategy). Add in the parents that will try to exploit their childs sudden power (imagine if Kyouko's Dad had asked her to enhance his sermons, instead of freaking out over it, or any of the parents who already do things like pressure child-stars and prodigies) , the parents who will violently repress it for one reason or another (Witch! Burn/Harvest the Witch!) , the parents who will freak out over things like Lichbomb generally and potential-immortality specifically, the way that normal conflict from parental authority and normal teenage rebellion will be greatly magnified by the power imbalance and the potential of things like flight/don't-need-food/teleporting to nullify punishments, the way that abusers will see it as Christmas to learn their child can easily heal and won't break..... yeah.

Basically I'd rather see the handpicked "Trusted Non-Contractee" system of the MSY in To the Stars, even if Clear-Seeds in the Witch System make their solutions less of a requirement than Cubes in the Demon system. We can look into a general drop of the Masquerade once we've first revolutionized and improved the Meguca systems and culture, and once theres a better opportunity to do so (revealing the advantages of organized meguca's in space colonization, or intervening in an out of control war even if it isn't aliens, etc).

So yeah, I don't want us rushing to involve Sayaka's parents we know nothing at all about, when they have personal motivation to disrupt the fragile stability of our group and 'successes' like the Kures.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
Already on it?
"selective restoration of parents" and " Not every parent can handle a task like this," are meant to allow room to get it right. Unlike consensus reality, Sabrina CAN exercise a veto power here, and it's really effective.
I expect that to become unnecessary, because we should try to use the founder effect for it's full worth. If our adult supporters self-select well, and they have more motive and ability to do so than Urobuchi illustrated, bad actors will get excluded.

One family at a time is a good way to start, because they will need extraordinary proof. As in, we get all hands on deck, create support gear to armor them up, and take them out into a witch barrier. They watch, most everyone else bodyguards, they watch the witch die, they see a Grief seed. As rough as it sounds, they will give us an honest assessment of emotional development, and become completely able to listen to our lecture the following day. Yes, upending history, physics, and all their assumptions is better done with a boot camp.

Agree?
 
What is the possibilty, considering where Sayaka's family lived and the values they appeared to have passed on to Sayaka, that Sayaka's family was one of those who lost money to Oriko's dad's fraud?
 
I am normally for science.
But I think it would be best if we did not, while using our soul as a device that fills with grief as we use it, has a finite capacity, and kills Mami when we are full, ask it to perform uncountably infinite calculations per second and witch us out instantly before we can react with the infinite rate of grief from the infinite power draw we just asked it to do.

And... I would say "let's start smaller than uncountably infinite and work our way up," except that for the very reason that makes it uncountable we can't do that.

Also holy fuck, do NOT let Kyubey find out we had this idea. The prospect of infinite grief right now is surely to adfligo his systema in a way we won't like.
 
Last edited:
... You know, the TVTropes page for this quest really needs to be updated.
 
Roomba said:
Regarding Homura's and Sayaka's attitude towards lessening some of the restrictions on Oriko and Kirika, I think the fact that not much time has passed in the quest world since our conflict with them is a major problem. Maybe it'd be more worthwhile to frame the discussion in terms of conditions and timeframes? How long does Sayaka want to keep them under house arrest? What would they need to do in order to demonstrate they can do their own shopping?
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...

On the list of the things that I'd wanted to recall when we got to this bit of conversation...

Pursuant to that and @rkyeun's good point:

[X] Mami
-[X] How does she feel about Oriko and Kirika?
-[X] Don't take Mami for granted.

[X] Telepathy Masami & Hiroko: Ono, Kuroki.

[X] Science session per vote in abeyance.
-[X] And try moving Grief though a higher dimensional axis.
-[x] Nothing potentially requiring hypothetically uncountably infinite computation.

[X] Homura and Sayaka
-[X] Talk about O&K:
--[X] Positive approaches; validate feelings.
--[X] Ask what they think about them, and what should happen with them.
---[x] Specifics of the conditions and timeframe of their punishment, whether it's continued house arrest or something else
--[X] Talk about everything that complicates the situation, good and bad.
---[X] Such as the eventual involvement of adults
----[x] Which has other complications we'll need to think about
----[x] Whatever decisions we make will have wider consequences
----[x] But most immediately: The Miki and Kure adults

I don't know, this is mostly Onmur's vote but with added bits. Feel free to point out which bits are of more dubious value.
 
So, on re-read, I have to make some corrections to my previous post about Oriko's side manga:

One: I don't know why I thought Oriko was three at the time her mom died. She was a child, but her age wasn't stated anywhere that I know.

Two, and I found most terrifying, it is heavily implied in the manga that the one to arrange Oriko's mom 'car accident' was none other than Oriko's dad.

Back when I was first reading this, I was completely tired and barely staying awake, so I completely missed it, but I can see it clearly now.
 
Last edited:
rkyeun said:
I am normally for science.
But I think it would be best if we did not, while using our soul as a device that fills with grief as we use it, has a finite capacity, and kills Mami when we are full, ask it to perform uncountably infinite calculations per second and witch us out instantly before we can react with the infinite rate of grief from the infinite power draw we just asked it to do.

And... I would say "let's start smaller than uncountably infinite and work our way up," except that for the very reason that makes it uncountable we can't do that.

Also holy fuck, do NOT let Kyubey find out we had this idea. The prospect of infinite grief right now is surely to adfligo his systema in a way we won't like.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...

I don't think it's quite as bad. Our Griefhax has an apparent maximum computation speed; more complex things take us longer to make. I'd assume they generate proportionally more Grief in our Soul Gem as well, though I don't recall us ever testing this.

So, if the rules apply, and our hax tries to produce the impossible, the result should be us falling into a neverending trance and eventually witching out. Considering we've tried (very recklessly) to make all sorts of unusual objects, and achieved no worse than a headache, I expect that there is some kind of safety measure in place.

Maybe that's what it means when Sabrina feels like a particular item is out of reach. That it's possible to make it using Griefhax, but doing so would generate enough Grief to witch her out while entranced. Instead, a safety measure kicks in, short-circuits the process, and she gets a headache as a result.

As for QB , we've discussed it over telepathy this update, so he already knows... However, this is a kind and gentle quest, so the world probably won't end next update as a result.
 
Last edited:
We need to add:
[] make a Clow Card joke to Sayaka

Annnnyways

@Firnagzen I've been meaning to ask whether or not the events in Asunaro were going to be this situation in particular we fell into, or if things were following a definite timeline, once the day there was over.

(IE: whether we might have preempted events like Yuuri's witchout or Hijiri's contract had we shown up early enough)
 
Last edited:
The Phoenixian said:
@Firnagzen I've been meaning to ask whether or not the events in Asunaro were going to be this situation in particular we fell into, or if things were following a definite timeline, once the day there was over.

(IE: whether we might have preempted events like Yuuri's witchout or Hijiri's contract had we shown up early enough)
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
It was on a definite schedule! I set Yuuri's Witchout prior to canon, but Hijiri's contract was entirely preventable had you interceded early enough. The original plan, had you guys not interfered, would have been Kazumi calling Mami in a blind, desperate panic, sometime early next week, pinning her hope on a bunch of strange rumours she'd heard (about Sabrina, naturally). Because at that point, Yuuri and Hijiri would be coordinating a nasty guerilla campaign involving Evil Nuts Asunaro Almonds and pressing them hard.

Unrelated, I have a genius idea for you guys: [x] Convince Homura and Sayaka to let Kamijou Kqweuoski to be Oriko and Kirika's parole officer. Any manipulations Oriko tries to pull will simply slide right off his impregnable shield of obliviousness.

It's genius, I tell you. :V
 
Last edited:
Firnagzen said:
It was on a definite schedule! I set Yuuri's Witchout prior to canon, but Hijiri's contract was entirely preventable had you interceded early enough. The original plan, had you guys not interfered, would have been Kazumi calling Mami in a blind, desperate panic, sometime early next week, pinning her hope on a bunch of strange rumours she'd heard (about Sabrina, naturally). Because at that point, Yuuri and Hijiri would be coordinating a nasty guerilla campaign involving Evil Nuts Asunaro Almonds and pressing them hard.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
So noted! I had been wondering.

Firnagzen said:
Unrelated, I have a genius idea for you guys: [x] Convince Homura and Sayaka to let Kamijou Kqweuoski to be Oriko and Kirika's parole officer. Any manipulations Oriko tries to pull will simply slide right off his impregnable shield of obliviousness.

It's genius, I tell you. :V
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...

Hmm... On the one hand Kwijibo Kyousquared would become relevant. On the other, we're treating Oriko and Kirika to the music of Erich Zhan.

I refuse to say which of these is positive and which is negative.
 
Firnagzen said:
It was on a definite schedule! I set Yuuri's Witchout prior to canon, but Hijiri's contract was entirely preventable had you interceded early enough. The original plan, had you guys not interfered, would have been Kazumi calling Mami in a blind, desperate panic, sometime early next week, pinning her hope on a bunch of strange rumours she'd heard (about Sabrina, naturally). Because at that point, Yuuri and Hijiri would be coordinating a nasty guerilla campaign involving Evil Nuts Asunaro Almonds and pressing them hard.

Unrelated, I have a genius idea for you guys: [x] Convince Homura and Sayaka to let Kamijou Kqweuoski to be Oriko and Kirika's parole officer. Any manipulations Oriko tries to pull will simply slide right off his impregnable shield of obliviousness.

It's genius, I tell you. :V
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
Better idea!
[X] Have Kamijou Queso serve Nagisa all the cheese she wants.
 
Also, more votes? :p
Adhoc vote count started by Firnagzen on Mar 22, 2018 at 11:01 PM, finished with 134648 posts and 6 votes.
  • [X] Mami
    -[X] How does she feel about Oriko and Kirika?
    -[X] Don't take Mami for granted.
    [X] Telepathy Masami & Hiroko: Ono, Kuroki.
    [X] Science session per vote in abeyance.
    -[X] And try moving Grief though a higher dimensional axis.
    [X] Homura and Sayaka
    -[X] Talk about O&K:
    --[X] Positive approaches; validate feelings.
    --[X] Ask what they think about them, and what should happen with them.
    --[X] Talk about everything that complicates the situation, good and bad.
    --[X] Introduce the idea of adults being involved.
    [x] Hug Mumi
    -[x] Be unhappy that you forgot to ask Yuki if you could hug her.
    [X] Mami
    -[X] How does she feel about Oriko and Kirika?
    -[X] Don't take Mami for granted.
    [X] Telepathy Masami & Hiroko: Ono, Kuroki.
    [X] Science session per vote in abeyance.
    -[X] And try moving Grief though a higher dimensional axis.
    -[x] Nothing potentially requiring hypothetically uncountably infinite computation.
    [X] Homura and Sayaka
    -[X] Talk about O&K:
    --[X] Positive approaches; validate feelings.
    --[X] Ask what they think about them, and what should happen with them.
    ---[x] Specifics of the conditions and timeframe of their punishment, whether it's continued house arrest or something else
    --[X] Talk about everything that complicates the situation, good and bad.
    ---[X] Such as the eventual involvement of adults
    ----[x] Which has other complications we'll need to think about
    ----[x] Whatever decisions we make will have wider consequences
    ----[x] But most immediately: The Miki and Kure adults
    [X] Have Kamijou Queso serve Nagisa all the cheese she wants.
    [x] Task Kyousuke Kamijo with seducing Oriko to our side.
    -[x] Get Sayaka to distract Kirika while this happens.
Click to expand...
 
[X] Mami
-[X] How does she feel about Oriko and Kirika?
-[X] Don't take Mami for granted.
[X] Telepathy Masami & Hiroko: Ono, Kuroki.
[X] Science session per vote in abeyance.
-[X] And try moving Grief though a higher dimensional axis.
-[X] Make Card Captor Sayaka jokes.

[X] Homura and Sayaka
-[X] Talk about O&K:
--[X] Positive approaches; validate feelings.
--[X] Ask what they think about them, and what should happen with them.
--[X] Talk about everything that complicates the situation, good and bad.
--[X] Introduce the idea of adults being involved.
 
Last edited:
I'm trying of some re-wording.

[] Mami
-[] How does she feel about Oriko and Kirika?
-[] Don't take Mami for granted.

[] Telepathy Masami & Hiroko: Ono, Kuroki.

[] Science session per vote in abeyance.
-[] And try moving Grief though a higher dimensional axis.

[] Talk with Homura and Sayaka about O&K.
-[] Positive approach; validate their feelingss; err on the side of caution.
-[] Ask what they think should happen with O&K.
-[] Put the house arrest into question. Bring up:
--[] Complications.
--[] Justice: Oriko actually facing her crimes and making up for them.
--[] Alternatives: Relocation, restricted freedom with chaperones/tracking devices.
-[] Propose involving the adults, specially the Mikis, who were also hurt by Oriko. (After you talk with the Shizukis).
 
Reader mode
You must login or register to reply here.
Remove ads
Back
Top