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We don't have a choice not to assault here.
We actually do if we find an underway to the gate and/or to Und Uzgar. If there is a reasonably secure one then our priority would be Karagril.

I'm not all that keen on going back to being someone else's advisor, beholden to a ruler, where they get to set half or more of our agenda.
Emancipated liberated self-motivated protagonist Mathilde has been very interesting!
Yeah, I'm thinking about a few possibilities. After K8P I'd take a year or two of study and research, and then I think we need to do something ambitious. Like, open a whole new field of magic study to Imperial mages (tenebromancy/borrow dwarven runes/magic juice fueled). Get Sylvania under Imperial control. Return Marienburg back. Start a Dame Weber's Imperial Bureau of Investigation (that one appears to me for some reason). Start a Skaven civil war or two. Start a venture capital fund for Imperial entrepreneurs (Mathilde is kitted ridiculously good for that kind of thing). Establish a college chapterhouse in dwarven lands.
 
i wouldn't mind sticking around for a bit but really Dwarves don't have anywhere near as much need for intrigue other than in a scouting role.
 
This is pretty much dead on. She can tug the leash and say 'no!' but that's pretty much the limit of her control unless she dedicates a significant chunk of concentration solely to it.

Is this something that we could expect to improve with practice?

In general, can Arcane Marks in general be something that a wizard can learn to master/leverage?

I'd much rather just go home, moving all our stuff down here will be a pain, we have an estate we have to manage and abandoning the peo0le there seems wrong to me.

Not to mention I don't want to be half the world away when something goes wrong and have everything Vanhal did be for nothing.

Mathilde is truly remarkably good at long distance travel in an emergency. As advisor to a dwarf king she may well get even better at it, if that gives her free access to the gyrocopter transportation network.

Yes, it would be a bit of work to move everything, but it shouldn't be prohibitively difficult given the options she has.

And just because Mathilde gets a new job doesn't mean she's abandoning her old friends. They all quit as well. In terms of help, as the advisor to an important dwarven king she will be tremendously influential. She won't need to personally intervene so much, as she can instead use that influence to get other people to act on her behalf.

i wouldn't mind sticking around for a bit but really Dwarves don't have anywhere near as much need for intrigue other than in a scouting role.

They're surrounded by skaven and night goblins. They have an incredible need for intrigue, they're just bad at it and usually won't do it.

Fortunately Belegar is more flexible, and would be happy with Mathilde assassinating bosses and chieftains, sabotaging their workshops, and such like. Along with gathering intelligence on their politics and internal divisions that he can then exploit.

Karak Eight Peaks would never run short of work for Mathilde.
 
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i wouldn't mind sticking around for a bit but really Dwarves don't have anywhere near as much need for intrigue other than in a scouting role.
Belegar might become an exception. I expect him to work a lot on sabotage and offensive diplomacy, also he'll get more than a few human and halfling subjects that will need a watchful eye.
 
I'm not all that keen on going back to being someone else's advisor, beholden to a ruler, where they get to set half or more of our agenda.
Emancipated liberated self-motivated protagonist Mathilde has been very interesting!

Well there's always going all in with the Liber Mortis.

Studying it should be done anyways because that book might be the best source on learning how magic and general warp stuff works overall other than ridiculous stuff like personal tutoring from Teclis or Nagash. Actively applying stuff is where things get tricky, but as long as Mathilde wants to not go rogue and generally toe the line she will be to a certain extent beholden to the Grey Order.
 
Personal power can be leveraged into political power when you're a wizard, and something like an adapted Rune of Brotherhood combined with dwarven tuition is a gift that would keep on giving - particularly as Mathilde could lend the learning talisman to other people when she wasn't using it, which would be incredibly useful for training apprentices or passing on what she's
been taught. Things like advanced dwarven mathematics, history, cultural studies, along with things like Greenskin or Skaven Lore could all boost Learning.
I suspect the problem runs deeper. The Rune of Brotherhood is a runic symbol of "All Dwarves are Brothers", extending it to work on humans isn't quite that simple, and very likely would be a completely different rune altogether, with different qualities.
I'm not all that keen on going back to being someone else's advisor, beholden to a ruler, where they get to set half or more of our agenda.
Emancipated liberated self-motivated protagonist Mathilde has been very interesting!
Eh, given the Grey Order's restrictions, advisor is actually one of the 'freer' options.
Look at the long term options:
-Advisor - Commitment of 1-2 actions per turn(approximately expected to be 1/5th commitment or so) to job. We spent more, but thats partly due to Mathilde being a workaholic patriot, partly due to SV being bad at delegation, and partly due to Stirland being nearly constantly in crisis. In exchange she more or less as free rein to interpret her magic use as being in the advancement of her job and being the subordinate of an Elector Count means that anywhere within the country she has tacit 'permission' so long as its not abused.
--Social prospects are high, an advisor gets to interact with a lot of people in a position where they can't just avoid you out of inherent distrust.

-College Academic - Commitment of half or more actions per turn to pure research, and half of the remainder to lecturing, which is something people want for a time, but not indefinitely. Expected longer term deployment missions to be assigned intermittenly as well. Adventuring and general gallivanting are strictly limited.
--Social prospects are limited mainly to other wizards while at College.

-Tower Magister - Requirement of bare minimum 1-2 actions per turn managing an apprentice...considerably more initially if you want to be sure they won't explode, which might take a while. Commitment of remainder to research. Freedom of movement is limited, we'd mainly travel on expeditions like this one, apprentice in tow on hire, effectively.
--Social prospects are somewhat more flexible, we could probably just build a tower at Eight Peaks(risk of apprentice getting Goblin'ed or Skaven'ed for a long while) or at our own fief(which we got a lot of freedom on, but requires more actions sunk into fief improvement to make it worthwhile)....but frankly people are likely to stay away for a bit.

I wouldn't mind becoming Advisor again. Its good for our dating scene :p
Except dwarf advisor, a bit of a lack of date-able prospects.
 
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Personally I am all in favor of taking up an Advisor position again, with our reputation and experience we should be able to secure a pretty decent one. Preferably I would like it to be for a province near Sylvania and Stirland because we can make use of our old connections there if need be.
 
A bit of a note that Grey Wizzard are not usualy this effective or deadly in a fight. Even in Warhammer-verse.

This time we see a lot of her securing her position through strength. In time her contacts and intrique alone should be enough to secure the same.
 
Belegar might become an exception. I expect him to work a lot on sabotage and offensive diplomacy, also he'll get more than a few human and halfling subjects that will need a watchful eye.

The question of how many humans are going to stick around has occurred to me. I could easily see one or more of the knightly orders creating a chapter house here.

I suspect the problem runs deeper. The Rune of Brotherhood is a runic symbol of "All Dwarves are Brothers", extending it to work on humans isn't quite that simple, and very likely would be a completely different rune altogether, with different qualities.

On the other hand, Mathilde is perhaps becoming an informal adopted sibling. I asked BoneyM about this, and I think he confirmed it might be possible. We've seen Kragg modify the application of runes, so it seems hopeful.

Advisor - Commitment of 1-2 actions per turn(approximately expected to be 1/5th commitment or so) to job. We spent more, but thats partly due to Mathilde being a workaholic patriot, partly due to SV being bad at delegation, and partly due to Stirland being nearly constantly in crisis. In exchange she more or less as free rein to interpret her magic use as being in the advancement of her job and being the subordinate of an Elector Count means that anywhere within the country she has tacit 'permission' so long as its not abused.

I'd say that the Belegar advisor (perhaps technically imperial ambassador), while technically fitting under this, is really a separate option.

One thing that I think people underestimate is how many humans there are likely to be at Karak Eight Peaks. It's likely to be a magnet for adventurers and mercenaries for many, many years, as the long war with the skaven and Greenskins rolls on.

The other thing that can't be underestimated is how much better for Mathilde's mental health it must be to be around dwarves who treat her with the respect due to a skilled craftsmanling, not as a pariah as most humans do. It must be a great relief from the low level social stress that comes with being a wizard. That should in turn bleed over to the humans and halflings that settle here, eroding their prejudices.

Plus, of course, that staying at Karak Eight Peaks should mean the ability to continuously generate dwarf favour for lessons and then launder much of that into College Favour as well

What would it take to be an adviser to a Dwarf King of a recently liberated lost hold? Coz that could be pretty cool.

I think Belegar basically extended the offer last update.
 
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Yeah, so far dwarves are bros to us in a way only some humans were.
Plus, again, dwarven honour. If we don't fuck with them, they are not going to fuck with us.

That's an unorthodox but very reliable employer right there.
 
In general, can Arcane Marks in general be something that a wizard can learn to master/leverage?

No, an Arcane Mark is not so much a magical effect that can be controlled as it is a change in the nature of Mathilde's soul, and as a result how the natural world reacts to her. The very slight amount of control she has over her shadow is because of the nature of her shadow, not because of the nature of Arcane Marks.
 
Well, that got a lot of response.

I don't think those are the only options. Go Rogue, College Wizard, Teacher, Advisor...

Given how many problems there are, and how few wizards by comparison, I'd be surprised if 'Roving College Troubleshooter' isn't a common Grey Wizard role, too. Dead drops telling you where Suspicious Things are afoot- investigation in matters of great import was one of the things we said we'd do for the College in our test for Magister.

Very few Agents of G.R.E.Y. could get somewhere faster than Mathilde.

If anything it seems Regimand spends a good chunk of time in this manner...? Or that was my impression. He's not a regular college teacher for sure.
@BoneyM how would you characterise (what Mathilde knows) of Regimands career/service to the college, and would it be a viable path for Mathilde?
 
@BoneyM how would you characterise (what Mathilde knows) of Regimands career/service to the college, and would it be a viable path for Mathilde?

An enormous amount of it is classified, but of what she does know, during her apprenticeship there were four years he spent working with the Emperor's spymaster to root out a particularly well-connected cult (he never said what sort) and another three spent trying to track down herdstones built by a particularly canny Bray-Shaman that were resonating in worrying ways with the local leylines. For the former he spent about ten hours a day out of the College, for the latter he was gone for quite long periods. After the first few years most Apprentices can be given a direction and left for a period of a month or so, and for more prolonged absences other Magisters can take over temporarily.
 
Mercenaries will keep coming for a long time after all other participants go back, I think.

They will, and with mercenaries will come camp followers, and before you know it, there'll be a crime-ridden human town just inside the East Gate if preventative steps aren't taken.

This could be another opportunity to rehabilitate Ranald the Protector. The god in general is likely to be popular amongst adventurers and mercenaries who we'd be policing. The wider cultural background of mercenaries might make it easier to find those willing to accept a police force dedicated to him. It would almost certainly be much easier than anywhere in the Empire, as dwarves are unlikely to care much about non-proscribed human gods one way or the other. Certainly many Elector Counts would object to institutionalising the worship of Ranald.
 
One thing that I think people underestimate is how many humans there are likely to be at Karak Eight Peaks. It's likely to be a magnet for adventurers and mercenaries for many, many years, as the long war with the skaven and Greenskins rolls on.

The other thing that can't be underestimated is how much better for Mathilde's mental health it must be to be around dwarves who treat her with the respect due to a skilled craftsmanling, not as a pariah as most humans do. It must be a great relief from the low level social stress that comes with being a wizard. That should in turn bleed over to the humans and halflings that settle here, eroding their prejudices.

Plus, of course, that staying at Karak Eight Peaks should mean the ability to continuously generate dwarf favour for lessons and then launder much of that into College Favour as well
Depending upon the numbers settling in Karak Eight Peaks, it's worth remembering that where there are humans there are mages. At any time some random teen might start having magical manifestations; in the Empire this is generally cause to alert the nearest watchman or priest, who sees them either executed or shuffled off to the Colleges in short order as befits the local preference, but a dwarf hold is a really long way from home and has no established clergy or governance. If there are ten or twenty thousand potentially mage-producing settlers here then someone needs to establish an appropriate set of procedures for getting them all to Altdorf for training in a timely fashion, before they cause harm or become tainted. Having a trained Magister (or at least a journeyman) around could be important for that reason alone.
 
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They will, and with mercenaries will come camp followers, and before you know it, there'll be a crime-ridden human town just inside the East Gate if preventative steps aren't taken.
That actually happens a lot in Karaks, with human towns forming up around the Karak itself. Karak Kadrin had one, as Gotrek and Felix saw...it got demolished as a stopgap against the Chaos invasion against it. They're not necessarily "crime ridden" though, and tend to be under the nominal authority of the local Dawi king.
 
I think, um... Those posts about the future possibilities, which talk up things like infrastructure and wealth and chapter houses (or directly serving as a Court Wizard to a Dwarf -- more on that later)... kind of alarm me because, well... We should probably remember one main thing, very important thing:

Mathilde is a Wizard, of the Empire... and from the Grey College at that.

Land? Titles? Lots of money? A "Witch-hunter-like organization, except run by the Grey College" or knightly chapter houses or new wizard college campuses? She is a Wizard. ((That we already have the first 3 is kind of... unusual, IIRC, or otherwise a little bit odd. As I understand it?))

Mathilde can do a lot of things and we can take her in a lot of different ways. But I think we should remember what kind of society we're working with here.

I feel like if Mathilde took the path of the more standard protagonist of an Empire quest (btw, is that "this is not an empire quest" tag on the thread still valid or just kept there out of habit and lack-of-change? I didn't want to use that in my argument as a gotcha, only to later get told "Actually that's just there by habit/tradition" and have egg on my face.), or quest that emphasizes 'building up' power and infrastructure in a certain way, that we might have some trouble with that.

And as for serving as a Court Wizard to a Dwarf, as a part of his court and government -- frankly, I don't want to inflict that malus on King Belegar.

Why? Well...

Just think of what Dwarfs think of Wizards. And then consider what their opinions will be of King Belegar if he openly keeps a court wizard.

Guys, he would have trouble with dwarf approval and politics and respectability. =/

I don't want to increase the reasons that Longbeards will have issues with Belegar as a king, in the future. It's one thing being and acting like a Hero Unit for a campaign. Or becoming a Dwarf Friend to him and/or Ulthar, and remaining as an ally he can call on. It's another thing to outright move to something officious or official. Hell, even if it's not official, even if people will bring up the idea of all the ways we could weasel around it and make it 'not count' and so on? Guys, just -- remember. Dwarfs. We would be doing that delicate stratagem/lifestyle, while living among people who are very traditional and honorbound.
 
I'd say that the Belegar advisor (perhaps technically imperial ambassador), while technically fitting under this, is really a separate option.

One thing that I think people underestimate is how many humans there are likely to be at Karak Eight Peaks. It's likely to be a magnet for adventurers and mercenaries for many, many years, as the long war with the skaven and Greenskins rolls on.
Not underestimating, but its fundamentally different from being the court advisor of a human ruler, where there are people who permanently live there who have no choice but to interact with you regularly.

Adventurers tend to drift in and out, so its harder to forge a connection. As for a permanent human town near the Karak...I'm not sure if its a good idea. Its just waiting for some dumbass to spoil the good thing isn't it? And as the above post mentions, its not exactly working for the Empire, though its heh, grey enough, to work.
An enormous amount of it is classified, but of what she does know, during her apprenticeship there were four years he spent working with the Emperor's spymaster to root out a particularly well-connected cult (he never said what sort) and another three spent trying to track down herdstones built by a particularly canny Bray-Shaman that were resonating in worrying ways with the local leylines. For the former he spent about ten hours a day out of the College, for the latter he was gone for quite long periods. After the first few years most Apprentices can be given a direction and left for a period of a month or so, and for more prolonged absences other Magisters can take over temporarily.
That'd be the Agent of the Empire route career huh?
I dare say the social prospects are pretty dead while in deep cover though. :p
 
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An enormous amount of it is classified, but of what she does know, during her apprenticeship there were four years he spent working with the Emperor's spymaster to root out a particularly well-connected cult (he never said what sort) and another three spent trying to track down herdstones built by a particularly canny Bray-Shaman that were resonating in worrying ways with the local leylines. For the former he spent about ten hours a day out of the College, for the latter he was gone for quite long periods. After the first few years most Apprentices can be given a direction and left for a period of a month or so, and for more prolonged absences other Magisters can take over temporarily.
Leylines? The very idea of such a things is most intriguing. When you have the opportunity, if you could expand on what these are in Warhammer (because my mind automatically links it to the Geomantic Web) given how magic comes from the Winds and where they are/settle/concentrate and not generally the earth (making the Lizardmen and he Geomantic Web that much more unique), that's extremely interesting to me, at least as far as Mathilde herself can know.
 
(btw, is that "this is not an empire quest" tag on the thread still valid or just kept there out of habit and lack-of-change? I didn't want to use that in my argument as a gotcha, only to later get told "Actually that's just there by habit/tradition" and have egg on my face.)

I'm only responsible for the 'Warhammer' one. There might be societal reasons that some paths are better than others, but I'm not putting a thumb on the scale in any direction.
 
Theres nothing wrong with camp followers.

They provide the services such as entertainment (whores), food and drink (ale and slaughterhouse) as well as things we took for granted in the modern military, such as general store and barbers, doctors, apotechary, pesary and more.

Yes there will be crime, crime uncommon to the dwarven city, but crime and vice.. those are the sign of a thriving city. 'Pure' dwarven city have less population because they are so straight lace and proper.

And you can conscript the lawbreakers and thieves into a foreign legion.

It will be a very long time until it is wise to close their door to any non green skin..
 
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