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Warhammer Fantasy: Divided Loyalties - an Advisor's Quest

Voted best in category in the Users' Choice awards.
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DocMatoi said:
oh sorry i didn't realize you were BoneyM's sockpuppet, with final say on how the quest mechanics work.
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That's unnecessarily hostile. This question came up during K8P.
Darth. said:
Only if you want them reporting to you every turn. If you say do what you've been told to do I'll check back with you later, I'm pretty sure you get that AP back. Only reason Hochlander cost a constant upkeep is because we asked him to keep feeding us reports every turn. You'll notice he is still employed but it didn't cost us AP on the expedition.
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Uh, what are you talking about? We paid the AP cost for the EIC intel network last turn same as always. And remember how we let Max and Johann prep for the expedition for a year and a half without telling them what specifically to do? We didn't get those AP back.
 
kingreaper said:
3 AP handling councillors still means 3 personal AP to get involved in whatever messes we wish. At least 1 a turn is going to go to the "actual ground work" and it's not like the AP for the councillors vanishes, we'll be available when needed for them.
  • There's some new lore guaranteed regarding:
    1. The Swamp Gods, and local gods in general
    2. Vampires and necromancy
  • We get to spread the word of Ranald to folks who need it
  • We get to spread the myth of the Dammerlichtreiter
  • Building defensive infrastructure can be awesome - see the Sword of Gazul
  • Getting back to Intrigue roots a bit more
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We'd also likely be spending an ap each turn on the research institute. we plan to set up in K8P. Having two flex actions per turn that we're always going to be tempted to spend actually governing is going to be even worse ap hell, which I am utterly uninterested in.
 
Darth. said:
Only if you want them reporting to you every turn. If you say do what you've been told to do I'll check back with you later, I'm pretty sure you get that AP back. Only reason Hochlander cost a constant upkeep is because we asked him to keep feeding us reports every turn. You'll notice he is still employed but it didn't cost us AP on the expedition.
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We have been explicitly told this is not the case by Boney. If you have a subordinate, they take up 1/2 AP each turn, period. If you want the AP back, fire them.
 
[X] Markgraf of Eastern Stirland
[x] Loremaster-at-Large of Karak Eight Peaks
[X] Bodyguard and Tutor to Prince Mandred

I was planning not to vote at first. Even though the options above were really interesting, and Waystones sounded boring, I have no ability to see the future to tell which storyline I would actually enjoy reading the most. I still don't, but I finally figured out why those options were so appealing. It's because they're about helping others and hopefully making their lives better. Waystones can do that too, but it's a bit less direct about it and feels more like it's about pulling off a major scholarly achievement. I get if other people feel differently, but I figure that I have as much right to vote as anyone else so why not.
 
Darth. said:
Only if you want them reporting to you every turn. If you say do what you've been told to do I'll check back with you later, I'm pretty sure you get that AP back.
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You don't. Explicitly and repeatedly confirmed by Boney, as well as happening on screen.

Only reason Hochlander cost a constant upkeep is because we asked him to keep feeding us reports every turn. You'll notice he is still employed but it didn't cost us AP on the expedition.
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Actually, it did. It costs us half a turn-AP per 6-month turn. And that got charged this turn.

Expedition Actions are completely different from the AP we get on turns - 16 expedition actions is roughly equal in time spent to 1 AP; a total of 1 month.
 
On a meta level though, will Boney really lock us in with APs like that. Given that the current mechanics are insufficient to managing an entire province, won't Boney will give us the tools to actually do it? Maybe the entire council costs 1 or 2 AP and the rest are free for ruler specific actions and/or research?
 
Thomasfoolery said:
Her advisors are running Stirland, that impacts Sylvania inasmuch as it's part of Stirland. But it's not really the same thing.
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Right now they're running both. There is no separate Martial advisor for Sylvania yet.

She'd like to have her advisors be able to solely focus on eastern Stirland, but if it takes us a year to find a worthwhile one she'll most likely be willing to keep using hers for Sylvania a little longer.
 
Darth. said:
On a meta level though, will Boney really lock us in with APs like that. Given that the current mechanics are insufficient to managing an entire province, won't Boney will give us the tools to actually do it? Maybe the entire council costs 1 or 2 AP and the rest are free for ruler specific actions and/or research?
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Why wouldn't he? I don't understand your point.
 
Darth. said:
On a meta level though, will Boney really lock us in with APs like that. Given that the current mechanics are insufficient to managing an entire province, won't Boney will give us the tools to actually do it? Maybe the entire council costs 1 or 2 AP and the rest are free for ruler specific actions and/or research?
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AP means something gets written on the screen, if the work is being done then either it costs AP or Mathilde doesnt hear from it.
Markgraf is a rulership position, if you dont want to be stuck ruling pick something else.
 
Lightwhispers said:
Everyone who has the interest can pull up the most current tally by going to the Thread Tools menu at the top. This is effectively a content-free post. Please don't.
If you want to say something about the current vote totals, actually say them, don't just post the tally.
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Not everyone knows how to use the Tally post, and it both marks the vote at time of discussion and serves as a handy refrence for people skimming the thread. I've preferred it while binging old quest threads, and it simplifies things for new voters.
 
Darth. said:
On a meta level though, will Boney really lock us in with APs like that. Given that the current mechanics are insufficient to managing an entire province, won't Boney will give us the tools to actually do it? Maybe the entire council costs 1 or 2 AP and the rest are free for ruler specific actions and/or research?
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Why on earth would this be the case? Having a council of six people cost Abelheim 3 of his actions per turn to manage.
 
Darth. said:
On a meta level though, will Boney really lock us in with APs like that. Given that the current mechanics are insufficient to managing an entire province, won't Boney will give us the tools to actually do it? Maybe the entire council costs 1 or 2 AP and the rest are free for ruler specific actions and/or research?
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Unlikely. This is what Boney has said on the topic:
BoneyM said:
There's already an underling management system in the quest that IMO is working fine, I don't see a reason to switch over to some new system.
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And
BoneyM said:
it costs one action to manage two organizations, to a maximum of six; the ultimate conclusion of this is having six subordinate branches of your demesne and three personal actions, or to put it another way, your default CK2 quest.
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So, we should assume that if we have a full council, we will spend 3 AP on the six subordinates and have 3 AP left over. If we want more personal AP than that, our options are "have fewer advisors" or "don't take this job."
 
Darth. said:
On a meta level though, will Boney really lock us in with APs like that. Given that the current mechanics are insufficient to managing an entire province, won't Boney will give us the tools to actually do it? Maybe the entire council costs 1 or 2 AP and the rest are free for ruler specific actions and/or research?
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Of course he would. There is a reason he keeps insisting that Ruler AP is limited.
 
Darth. said:
On a meta level though, will Boney really lock us in with APs like that. Given that the current mechanics are insufficient to managing an entire province, won't Boney will give us the tools to actually do it? Maybe the entire council costs 1 or 2 AP and the rest are free for ruler specific actions and/or research?
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I don't see what's wrong with the mechanics of having the council cost 3 AP for 6 subordinates?

I mean, some rulers might have a nice trait akin to Collegiate that reduces that down to 2 AP (3 councillors per AP) but it's hardly necessary - having 9 actions with 6 of them locked in to work via a councillor (who'll put in 2-4 AP of effort each) seems like plenty to be getting on with.
 
Darth. said:
On a meta level though, will Boney really lock us in with APs like that. Given that the current mechanics are insufficient to managing an entire province, won't Boney will give us the tools to actually do it? Maybe the entire council costs 1 or 2 AP and the rest are free for ruler specific actions and/or research?
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On a meta level, definitely. AP isn't just some gameplay abstraction. It represents a division of BoneyM's writing time and creative energy. Simulating advisors and their actions is work. AP sets an upper limit on the amount of words they have to write. I doubt Boney will allow us to effectively gain more actions, and increase their burden for free.
 
Waystones is pretty baller, honestly.

It has us seeing the most diverse selection of places - and we will almost certainly have adventures there to help convince people to help. This may include Wissenland, for those who like skavenanigans.

It has free time for research and personal favors (kill vampires!), and puts making that research institute into our job description!

It has elf-times and dorf times and empire times and deep lore!

It's something that only Mathilde with her wide-reaching friendships, expertise, and windsight can do. If she does not do it, it won't get done.

We will choose under which aegis we will pursue this project - we can absolutely choose to resign our loremaster post if we think that's the best thing to do, though Belegar makes a good case for us still being in his employ.

The project has the potential to soothe the tensions that have been building between Belegar and Thorgrimm, and reduce the risk of dwarven civil war.

And as boney has said many a time, it is the best option for doing waystones - not some other option first followed by waystones, but waystones right now. The best time to start was 4500 years ago, the second best time is today.

I like the loremaster and bodyguard positions too - but waystones has a lot of what I like about those positions. It's not merely a research project or a scholarly thing - it's diplomacy, adventure, and lots of other things besides. I'm more than happy to vote for it, not because I want to avoid something else winning, but because I like The Waystone Project for itself.

[X] The Waystone Project
[X] Loremaster-at-Large of Karak Eight Peaks
[X] Bodyguard and Tutor to Prince Mandred
 
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