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Warhammer Fantasy: Divided Loyalties - an Advisor's Quest

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Wait, wait, wait.

Belegar's keeping us on the current project (as expected) even though local Skaven got wiped out because we still haven't officially produced any tangible and permanent result of our research.

This means we should write the damn dictionaries, not learn spoken Queekish.
 
Horium said:
Wait, wait, wait.

Belegar's keeping us on the current project (as expected) even though local Skaven got wiped out because we still haven't officially produced any tangible and permanent result of our research.

This means we should write the damn dictionaries, not learn spoken Queekish.
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No, he's keeping us on the project because translating Queekish is a global strategic good.
The Skaven are enemies of all.

Every bit of Queekish, written, spoken, etc, helps to solve them as a threat.
 
We should really make AV an official project.

In any case, after what Belegar said, I'm convinced we should take an extra turn to try and work out spoken queekish. Just because we aren't with a war in our backyard it doesn't mean the Karaz Ankor and the Empire stopped being at war with the Under-Empire.

This is like cracking the Enigma machine. It's well worth sixth months of Mathilde's time.
 
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As Mathild said, one of the most valuable things she could do is create a way of translating Queekish, but while it may be AP selfish, but considering that teaching a verbal language means direct teaching, I'm not enthused to spend the AP needed to... open up another AP drain. So get the dictionaries out asap, and don't bother with the spoken language. The other point is that researching Skraven-Tech and writings is inefficient until after we get the dictionaries done, so i'm indulging in my black gem and shrooms curiosity.

I am of course entirely open to changing elements of this in light of good arguments :)

[ ] Plan Non Verbal, no Decipt (pelim)
- [ ] MAX: Receive dictation: Queekish-Reikspiel Dictionary Actions 1 + 2

Frankly, we have a gem. It looks snazzy, Johann may as well wait untill after we write the dictionaries before working on his Skraven-tech projects. Having those schematics be understandable will be invaluable in terms of time saving. And I am deeply curious about the gem

- [ ] JOHANN: Study an artefact: Unknown black gem, stolen from the Skaven.

The shrooms would be best imo - Johann can wait until the dictionaries are done, Panoramia's trials are not urgent, the Rat-wolves got a good roll before and are doing well enough imo ("friendly little fluffballs" is optimal outcome), and I find the ranged practice room more appealing than the melee training, but both pale compared to the shrooms

[ ] DUCK: Work with Panoramia for her to finally get around to investigating the greenskin mushrooms she found.

EIC: one of the two below, I'd have to reread arguments for which one to do first before I can pick tbh (Leaning strongly to rumor)

-[ ] Put policies in place that local news should be collected and sent to you (rumour mill).
-[ ] Start hiring handlers who can then start hiring informers and begin to collect non-public information.

Task: I'm not interest in spoken and my preferred gambit is (AFAIK) not a lie:
-[ ] Seek to build a stronger rapport with Qrech, and provide enough sources of mental stimulation that you can turn your attention elsewhere.
-[ ] Convince Qrech that the Under-Empire has no way of knowing he's even alive, and that he should prioritize the comfort with which he will live the rest of his life.

Self Improvement
[ ] Travel to the Grey College - Waystones 101 (1 College Favour per class)

[ ] Travel to the Grey College - Powerstones (1 College Favour per class) (For future AV and better enchantments) OR Dipomacy (100 gold)

Papers:
[ ] Dictate papers: Queekish-Reikspiel Dictionary Actions 1 + 2 (Coin)
[ ] OVERWORK: Write a paper: Queekish-Khazalid Dictionary 1
[ ] SERENITY: Write a paper Queekish-Khazalid Dictionary 2

Penthouse - For the life of me, I'm not sure where the list of current tower options are, so while I'm leaning towards the landing pad being added in as people were arguing for that here when arguing against putting one in our rooms, I don't wanna forget there might be something more worthwhile until I check :)

[ ] Have a gyrocopter landing pad built into your balcony.
or
[ ] Have a tower built atop Karag Nar: -100gc for 1 room, bonus to room's purpose. (Wanna check what towers might be useful)

Coin:
[ ] The Gambler: Dictate papers: Queekish-Reikspiel Dictionary Actions 1 + 2
 
Abhorsen said:
It's time to help Panoramia with her Magister application. We know the pain of having not enough time to improve oneself (remember how long it took for us to get around to solving the Mirror Snek? Just taking the time to work with Panoramia here is time well spent. She deserves to be a Magister, and just needs to take the time to study.

As for the Johann action, I don't know if Skaven use cartridges, but if they do, that's about the most useful thing Johann can do. Even bullets are an improvement over balls. Sometimes small, simple things are most important.

For the Personal Actions, we do Khazalid before Reikspiel because we can't end the project thist turn without getting that dictionary out. We finish up next turn with the Reikspiel. I used Wolf as the overaction because teaching him to speak would be huge, and allow him to do independent actions. Also, it seems like a step that would help learn how to speak Queekish, for those interested in that. Ideally, Wolf would learn how to speak Queekish at some point, depending on how he feels about that.

@BoneyM: Mathilde is somewhat familiar with firearms, using some herself. Do skaven bullets look (just from a surface glance) very different than her ball and shot? I figure Mathilde wouldn't bother if they looked exactly the same as human bullets, but I wanted to be sure.

[ ] PLAN WOLF
-[ ] JOHANN: Study an artefact: Skaven bullets
-[ ] MAX: Receive dictation: Queekish-Khazalid Dictionary
-[ ] EIC: Put policies in place that local news should be collected and sent to you (rumour mill).
-[ ] DUCK: Panoramia's about ready to test for Magister, but she's putting it off because she doesn't have a lot of free time to prepare. Work with her to help make the most of every spare minute.
-[ ] TOWER: Have a tower built atop Karag Nar: -100gc for 1 room, bonus to room's purpose.
-[ ] SERENITY: Queekish-Reikspiel Dictionary, part 1/2
-[ ] P1: Dictate papers: Queekish-Khazalid Dictionary
-[ ] P2: Seek to build a stronger rapport with Qrech, and provide enough sources of mental stimulation that you can turn your attention elsewhere.
-[ ] P3: Travel to the Grey College and attend lessons there: Waystone Class
-[ ] P4: AV: Investigate the exact circumstances required to induce a transformation.
--[ ] The Gambler
-[ ] OVERWORK: Wolf is fully grown and a Very Good Boy. Train him. (increases his intelligence, he may learn to speak Praestantia)
-[ ] COIN: The Gambler
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nice to see new people making plans but your format is a bit wonky.
 
Rakaziel said:
Better organized than my own plan. Ratling Gun can wait until we have the dictionary
[X] Plan: Spoken Queekish Ver Lupercal
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Moratorium
Thomasfoolery said:
"My efforts in destroying Mors should have won me a great position and much prestige, unfortunately due to bypassing them the people who should be teaching me to speak the language (a prerequisite for the position I deserve.) are stonewalling me. They can't afford to do so forever but every day the luster of my victory fades. If I could go over their heads and speak it on my own though..."
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For those who are doing plans fir spoken Queekish you should consider this gambit....

Edit: I have added my plan here so it appears whole in the tally

[X] Spoken Queekish with better gambits
-[X] Contains one Overwork action
-[X][MAX] See if you can find more Queekish within those books: All Under-Karagril Clan Moulder books not bound in leather or written on vellum or parchment. Awaiting translation.
-[X][JOHANN] Study an artefact: Unknown black gem, stolen from the Skaven.
-[X][DUCK] Johann's investigation into the ratling gun has hit a wall. See if you can help
-[X][EIC] Put policies in place that local news should be collected and sent to you (rumour mill).
-[X] Seek to build a stronger rapport with Qrech, and provide enough sources of mental stimulation that you can turn your attention elsewhere.
--[X] Convince Qrech that the Under-Empire has no way of knowing he's even alive, and that he should prioritize the comfort with which he will live the rest of his life.
-[X] Try to convince him outright to teach you spoken Queekish.
--[X] Deceiver: "My efforts in destroying Mors should have won me a great position and much prestige, unfortunately due to bypassing them the people who should be teaching me to speak the language (a prerequisite for the position I deserve.) are stonewalling me. They can't afford to do so forever but every day the luster of my victory fades. If I could go over their heads and speak it on my own though..."
-[X] Travel to the Grey College and attend lessons there: Waystones and Waystone maintenance
-[X][AV] Investigate the exact circumstances required to induce a transformation.
-[X] Wolf is fully grown and a Very Good Boy. Train him. (increases his intelligence, he may learn to speak Praestantia)
-[X][PENTHOUSE] Have a gyrocopter landing pad built into your balcony.
-[X][SERENITY] Translated Eshin correspondence on the Skaven Civil War (TIMELESS)
-[X][COIN] The Deceiver: Skaven Gambit
 
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Redshirt Army said:
For the ducklings, I was divided between the target practice choice and PanPan, but all indications are that she's in no rush to graduate, so something that helps all our students is probably better - and I like continuing to build up facilities for Wizards in general to use.
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I think looking at the Waaghsoak Mushrooms might be more useful.
BoneyM said:
They're all spherical, if that's what you mean.
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Thanks, basically that.
 
veekie said:
Timeless means its not going to fade from memory(coz we got hardcopy), not that its strategic relevance remains constant.
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Does it still have strategic relevance? The action is about writing a paper on the stuff, not on deciphering its code for use or whatever. I'm pretty sure Mathilde already skimmed most of the relevant parts during the war in question.
BoneyM said:
It was in the cards, but I rolled a d6 for it and the result was LODS OF EMONE.
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I assume that no matter which result the d6 would have had, it would still have been three vaults with a roll for each, right?

Would be cool to know what a natural 100 would have meant for options 4-6 in the various vaults. Or, for that matter, one or multiple natural 1s on said d6 results. Like, a nat 1 B O O K result must be much worse than no books. What could it be? A bad copy of a Tome of Nagash, being perpetually read by a crazed ghost? A secret book of Grudges that implicates the whole Karaz Ankor?
 
@Redshirt Army - I propose that you switch
[ ] JOHANN: Have him teach Adela what he knows of engineering.
[ ] DUCK: Magical target-shooting is rough on normal targets. Set up a specialized target range for your ducklings, and for any other wizards at Eight Peaks.

To
- [ ] JOHANN: Study an artefact: Unknown black gem, stolen from the Skaven.
- [ ] DUCK: Work with Panoramia for her to finally get around to investigating the greenskin mushrooms she found.

Because the gem is interesting, and the shrooms have the chance to be something that helps a bunch of people with something new, rather than a martial training facility which helps fewer people

@Abhorsen - Panoramia is in no real rush, on a personal level; being Magister won't make her better at making better soil, but if the shrooms turn out useful, those could be a feather in her cap when it comes to her trials. Also, I'm curious about them and they could also be useful. Might you consider changing that action?

@Jyn Ryvia I argue that all Skraven-tech (and skraven-writing) actions will be more successful/efficient if they are done after the dictionaries have been written, so with that in mind, I do not support a significant part of your plan, and advocate against those elements at this time.
 
Rafin said:
I assume that no matter which result the d6 would have had, it would still have been three vaults with a roll for each, right?

Would be cool to know what a natural 100 would have meant for options 4-6 in the various vaults. Or, for that matter, one or multiple natural 1s on said d6 results. Like, a nat 1 B O O K result must be much worse than no books. What could it be? A bad copy of a Tome of Nagash, being perpetually read by a crazed ghost? A secret book of Grudges that implicates the whole Karaz Ankor?
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There were five vaults and I rolled a d100 for each - Hall of Ghosts was single digit, Karag Rhyn civilian vaults were in the teens, and Vault of Ancestors and the Treasure Vaults were each thirty-something. I rolled another d100 for each just for a high-low for money versus useful goods, and both resulted in money, which became valuable but functionally useless antiques for the Vault of Ancestors. Then the Grand Urbaz got the natural 100, so I rolled a d6 for what that could be in the thread. 3 or 4 would have resulted in me digging out the Tomb King army book and picking something, 5 would have had me generate a list of possible topics for B O O K, and 6 would have been one of those 'sit out on the balcony and think for a while' situations.
 
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Redshirt Army said:
[ ] Plan Redshirt v1
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Very solid plan.

Travler66 said:
I'm uncertain about this part @Redshirt Army as Qrech is unlikely to believe this unless we set our coin to the Deceiver.
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Dwarfs don't take Skaven prisoners. All the local ninja rats are dead or fled. He has no reason to think rescue or assassination is coming.
Also the coin only works when you are lying.

Jyn Ryvia said:
[] Plan: Spoken Queekish and AV preliminary research done. V2
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Not bad but not great.

Two actions on Skaven tech, which is not actually helpful for queekish. This is Johann's pet project, not Mathilde's.

Doing the Eshin Sorcery just because it is fresh really grates on me. We have more important stuff to write about than some Dhar based mockery of an existing spell.

Abhorsen said:
[ ] PLAN WOLF
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Solid plan.
What tower are you planning to get? Because unless you have something specific in mind the landing pad or fortified door would be better.

BeepSmile said:
[ ] Plan Non Verbal, no Decipt (pelim)
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Solid preplan and good arguments.

I would prefer powerstones to diplomacy.

Don't like the gem action though. We don't need to add more Faded papers to the pile.
 
I so wanted to see the 6th option and what would have made Ranald so happy. All this means is we need to go on more adventures to get that option someday.
 
The fact that the dragon doesnt have grudges is great so further diplomacy is certainly possible wich people havent mentioned much and we dont really have to drive it off and it has already been mentioned that we will need centuries to repopulate the karak anyway.

Still think that trading for any dwarf relics and stuff that the dragon has in his hoard is thing to pursue with glut of wealth at hand currently is a thing to consider.
And it might be relied upon as a defense mehanism of sorts atleast and might be hireable for campaigns for ruinous cost as a option aswell.


For the next campaign that retaking karak azgal wich should be a pretty minor campaign since it doesnt have any major greenskin or skaven clans based there and just regular infestation asfar i can tell . And it probably wasnt retaken when they killed the dragon that occupied it cause it wasnt connected to rest of dwarfdom wich we have restored by our campaign is my best guess for not doing the retake back then so immigrants are possible now. We should do this probably after the capital dwarfs leave for the timeframe and we can just take the royal clan , azul throng and mercenarys i imagine. My hope is that there is a connection with azul to make the campaign easier and more realistic and to drive the dwarfs on their reconquest campaigns even further. It can also be sold to high king as reconnecting more of the network hopefully like we did with eightpeaks maybe .


Since alot of dwarf problems is their knowledge of their decline and the race wide depression wich i imagine holds them down of sorts is a thing atleast in my headcanon. Taking two dwarf holds in 5 years and planning to take further ones after that might reignite something in dwarfs hopefully and might help with the eightpeaks and highking split hopefully after the azgal retake belegar trys to persuade highking to do a retake of his own. At either silverpeak or ungor , i prefer ungor first since the empire can help.

After that like in a decade , launch retake of karak ungor with highking and empire and mercenary help . Altough if people arent super interested in participating in another big campaign like that then atleast we can help maybe organize it and have it run in the background like the current sylvania retake. And my proposal for doing ungor first is that it has a surviving royal clan wich is very similar to belegar before the expedition but bigger actually when that isnt the case asfar i can tell for black crag,silverpeak and gunbad.
 
Horium said:
What? No, he didn't. Not spoken Queekish.
He gave us a big project a turn ago, and he said, well carry on. It's still important.

@BoneyM Maybe I am misunderstanding, Has Belegar asked for spoken Queekish?
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He said he wants Queekish. He gives Mathilde a lot of latitude, and it's up to her to decide what she can reasonably deliver. He won't complain if what arrives on his metaphorical desk is just the written language, but nor will he consider it an overreach if he gets the spoken language too.
 
Lupercal said:
To be fair most of the plans presented so far have had at least two actions on Queekish. If only because they are based on the same base plan.
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I'm pretty sure TNE's talking about people arguing against the utility of us learning spoken Queekish (Correct me if I'm wrong).

Like, I think spoken Queekish is not hugely useful tbh, but feel Horium may have worded their position poorly when they did not different between having all Queekish and having only written Queekish.
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I'd be up for seeing alternative plans that have spoken (+wolf training) but that would, I feel, result in my position of "Skraven-tech and writings are more efficient if we have the dictionaries" will lead to mild headaches when it comes to next turns study actions.
 
I've made a variant on my Spoken Queekish that postpones learning about Waystones and does instead learn Diplomacy because we do not need the Waystone Knowledge yet and more Diplomacy will be helpful in the times to come.

[] Plan: Spoken Queekish v3 Diplomacy version
-[][MAX] See if you can find more Queekish within those books: All Under-Karagril Clan Moulder books not bound in leather or written on vellum or parchment. Awaiting translation.
-[][JOHANN] Study an artefact: Breathing apparatus, stolen from Clan Skryre
-[][DUCK] Johann's investigation into the ratling gun has hit a wall. See if you can help
-[][EIC] Put policies in place that local news should be collected and sent to you (rumour mill).
-[] Seek to build a stronger rapport with Qrech, and provide enough sources of mental stimulation that you can turn your attention elsewhere.
-[] Try to convince him outright to teach you spoken Queekish.
--[] Deceiver: Continue with the Gambit that teaching you Queekish continues to cause discontent in the Grey Order and of course the Grey Order itself already has Queekish...
-[] Travel to the Grey College and attend lessons there: Practical Diplomacy
-[] Investigate how the Vitae reacts to Dwarven magic-dampening Runes. (2 Dwarf favours)
-[] Wolf is fully grown and a Very Good Boy. Train him. (increases his intelligence, he may learn to speak Praestantia)
-[][PENTHOUSE] Have a gyrocopter landing pad built into your balcony.
-[][SERENITY] Translated Eshin correspondence on the Skaven Civil War (TIMELESS)
-[][COIN] The Deceiver: Skaven Gambit

[] Plan: Spoken Queekish v3
-[][MAX] See if you can find more Queekish within those books: All Under-Karagril Clan Moulder books not bound in leather or written on vellum or parchment. Awaiting translation.
-[][JOHANN] Study an artefact: Breathing apparatus, stolen from Clan Skryre
-[][DUCK] Johann's investigation into the ratling gun has hit a wall. See if you can help
-[][EIC] Put policies in place that local news should be collected and sent to you (rumour mill).
-[] Seek to build a stronger rapport with Qrech, and provide enough sources of mental stimulation that you can turn your attention elsewhere.
-[] Try to convince him outright to teach you spoken Queekish.
--[] Deceiver: Continue with the Gambit that teaching you Queekish continues to cause discontent in the Grey Order and of course the Grey Order itself already has Queekish...
-[] Travel to the Grey College and attend lessons there: Waystones and Waystone maintenance
-[] Investigate how the Vitae reacts to Dwarven magic-dampening Runes. (2 Dwarf favours)
-[] Wolf is fully grown and a Very Good Boy. Train him. (increases his intelligence, he may learn to speak Praestantia)
-[][PENTHOUSE] Have a gyrocopter landing pad built into your balcony.
-[][SERENITY] Translated Eshin correspondence on the Skaven Civil War (TIMELESS)
-[][COIN] The Deceiver: Skaven Gambit
 
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