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Warhammer Fantasy: Divided Loyalties - an Advisor's Quest

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[X] The best counterspell is, in fact, a blackpowder projectile to the face.

[X] The Empire is a morass of self-interest, to the point of becoming a millstone around the neck of humanity.
[] Sigmar abandoned his most worthy follower in his hour of need.

To reiterate:
As far as the damages go, i think "The Empire is a morass of self-interest, to the point of becoming a millstone around the neck of humanity." Is the most fitting. It resonates every stage of the campaign and many events throughout the quest (the first martial adviser, Kasmir's bullshit, wizard chic) and the campaign (the lack of assistance, the way the company of honor folded like tissue paper, the failed healers, and the wizard explosions). The empire is supposed to be a network of support that can keep functioning when one component fails, but here everyone up to and including the Empire's GOD committed the bare minimum of effort, and from the empire's perspective this is a satisfactory result, because they got their purged Sylvania and Van Hal is replaceable to them.

I also prefer this option because it fits with her existing belief in Ranald, which provides both a basis for this path. Finally, it gives the potential for lateral character development. Most of the other options will probably resolve somewhere along the spectrum of "and then we got over it eventually" to "and this weighed on us forever" but this trauma is one that could drive us to action. That's true for the "the colleges failed us" option as well, but that option has none of the other reasons I like the imperial millstone option.
 
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Drucchi said:
Can we get to throw a bitchfit at the Grand Theogonist for sending us a useless priest? Because seriously our priest is one or two steps over less than useless.
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There's the Sigmar has abandoned us and Gods are useless votes for that.

Also not a big fan of the "Lots of little guys working in concert" learning personally, unless you by that mean dwarves.
 
Many of the options seem fine to me. If it is okay, I'd rather approval vote for now.

[X] Dwarves are the greatest ally of humanity.
[X] If such rank amateurs could rival the strength of an entire Province, imagine what a skilled hand could do with Dhar.
[X] The best battle is one where the enemy never gets a strike in.
[X] Magic is unreliable, gods are doubly so: always have a mundane solution.
[X] It's not a great hero who carries the day, but a lot of small men working in concert.
[X] The fog of war is a bitch, to all involved.
[X] Expertise matters. And Stirland has precious little of it.

[X] The Empire is a morass of self-interest, to the point of becoming a millstone around the neck of humanity.
[X] Sigmar abandoned his most worthy follower in his hour of need.
[X] Humanity is the most flawed of the races of Order.
 
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[X] Mathematics is universal.
[X] Sigmar abandoned his most worthy follower in his hour of need.

I think the main things for me. Math WORKED.
And the Sigmarites did not. The Sigmarites have not, through the entire campaign

@BoneyM
Did we find out any more about what happened on the initial charge on the way back?
 
[X] Mathematics is universal.
[X] In the confusion of battle, even the greatest warrior can lose their life pointlessly.
 
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[X] Magic is unreliable, gods are doubly so: always have a mundane solution.
[X] In the confusion of battle, even the greatest warrior can lose their life pointlessly.
 
[X] The fog of war is a bitch, to all involved.
I also like the expertise-one and maths, but I'm putting aside my personal admiration of all things math to go with this.

[X] Sigmar abandoned his most worthy follower in his hour of need.
I like getting something quite absolute and personal in this 'flaw', but I'm also good with the Ranaldite one and several others.
 
[x] Sigmar abandoned his most worthy follower in his hour of need.
[X] If such rank amateurs could rival the strength of an entire Province, imagine what a skilled hand could do with
Dhar.
 
[X] If such rank amateurs could rival the strength of an entire Province, imagine what a skilled hand could do with Dhar.
[X] The Empire is a morass of self-interest, to the point of becoming a millstone around the neck of humanity.
 
veekie said:
@BoneyM
Did we find out any more about what happened on the initial charge on the way back?
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The fourth wave suffered horrendous casualties and couldn't penetrate the enemy line, unlike you and Van Hal, so you were isolated until the dwarves saw what was going on from the walls and came down to extract the two of you.

Apart from the vagaries of chance and fate, the problem seems to be that the most experienced men were in the fourth wave: that is, everyone that had spent a year killing 'wild' skeletons in the Hills. The skeletons under the control of the Elector Countess' forces acted differently and were more durable, so all of their experience became a handicap.
 
[X] The fog of war is a bitch, to all involved.
[X] The Empire is a morass of self-interest, to the point of becoming a millstone around the neck of humanity.

Reminder that @BoneyM said something, I vaguely remember but it was recently, about the Fog of war being in-theme for manipulation using Ulgu. This is a positive option for a reason.
 
[X] Expertise matters. And Stirland has precious little of it.
[X] I, personally, failed to protect Abelhelm.
 
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What exactly do people see in [] In the confusion of battle, even the greatest warrior can lose their life pointlessly? It certainly fits as a concept, but it doesn't really lead anywhere except avoidance of battle.
 
The fog of war is a bitch, to all involved
In the confusion of battle, even the greatest warrior can lose their life pointlessly.

Edit vote changed
 
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[X] Magic used recklessly has catastrophic effects; great care must be taken in it's handling.

I choose this because we've seen multiple times throughout this campaign what happens when someone screws up using magic or pokes something they shouldn't.

[X] In the confusion of battle, even the greatest warrior can lose their life pointlessly.

Because a great man died when it could have been easily avoided.
 
racnor said:
What exactly do people see in [] In the confusion of battle, even the greatest warrior can lose their life pointlessly? It certainly fits as a concept, but it doesn't really lead anywhere except avoidance of battle.
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It does have a reinforcing effect with the learning that regular people working together is what saves the day. If heroes can die at any moment and rank'n'filers are the key to victory, you rely a lot less on heroes.

I am not fond of that combo, partly because I feel like it dimishes Abelheim's contributions and because in Warhammer heroes very much can carry the day, as Asarnil showed handedly.
 
[X] If such rank amateurs could rival the strength of an entire Province, imagine whata skilled hand could do with Dhar.
[X] Mathematics is universal.
[X] Sigmar abandoned his most worthy follower in his hour of need.
[X] I, personally, failed to protect Abelhelm.
 
Inserted tally
Adhoc vote count started by Sinsystems on Mar 12, 2018 at 9:12 AM, finished with 8519 posts and 25 votes.
  • [X] In the confusion of battle, even the greatest warrior can lose their life pointlessly.
    [X] The fog of war is a bitch, to all involved.
    [X] Sigmar abandoned his most worthy follower in his hour of need.
    [x] The Empire is a morass of self-interest, to the point of becoming a millstone around the neck of humanity.
    [X] It's not a great hero who carries the day, but a lot of small men working in concert.
    [X] If such rank amateurs could rival the strength of an entire Province, imagine what a skilled hand could do with Dhar.
    [X] Artillery is the King of Battle
    [X] Magic is unreliable, gods are doubly so: always have a mundane solution.
    [X] I, personally, failed to protect Abelhelm.
    [X] Expertise matters. And Stirland has precious little of it.
    [X] Dwarves are the greatest ally of humanity.
    [X] Mathematics is universal.
    [X] Dwarven ale is a valid coping mechanism.
    [X] The Colleges of Magic act in their own interest, rather than that of the Empire.
    [X] Gods will not help us.
    [X] I will never meet a man as worthy as Abelhelm was.
    [X] Complex problems, simple solutions.
    [X] The best battle is one where the enemy never gets a strike in.
    [X] Humanity is the most flawed of the races of Order.
    [X] If such rank amateurs could rival the strength of an entire Province, imagine what a skilled hand could do with
    [X] Expertise matters. And Stirland has preciousp little of it.
    [X] Magic used recklessly has catastrophic effects; great care must be taken in it's handling.
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[X] Magic is unreliable, gods are doubly so: always have a mundane solution.
[X] In the confusion of battle, even the greatest warrior can lose their life pointlessly.
:mob:
 
[X] The fog of war is a bitch, to all involved.
[X] In the confusion of battle, even the greatest warrior can lose their life pointlessly.
 
Sinsystems said:
[X] In the confusion of battle, even the greatest warrior can lose their life pointlessly.

Because a great man died when it could have been easily avoided.
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But that's not what the damage means? If even the greatest warrior can lose their life pointlessly in combat, the only way to avoid dying in battle is to avoid being in battle at all. Which Abelheim as a result of his station could not.
It doesn't matter that circumstances isolated Mathilde and Abel from the rest of the army, because even if they hadn't a skeleton with a stick could've still gotten lucky.

If you want "This could've been avoided" as a lesson, pick something like the Empire/Colleges/Sigmar/Mathilde failed Abelheim. Those are all "If only X did what they were supposed to, things would've gone better" options.
 
BoneyM said:
Red for controlled directly by the Elector Count, blue for a County, light blue for a Barony, yellow for Free Towns, green for the Black Guard of Morr, and brown for Here Be Monsters. A lot of brown got erased off the map in this campaign.
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Interesting. Thats a shitload of prime grazing land belonging to the Elector only.
BoneyM said:
The fourth wave suffered horrendous casualties and couldn't penetrate the enemy line, unlike you and Van Hal, so you were isolated until the dwarves saw what was going on from the walls and came down to extract the two of you.

Apart from the vagaries of chance and fate, the problem seems to be that the most experienced men were in the fourth wave: that is, everyone that had spent a year killing 'wild' skeletons in the Hills. The skeletons under the control of the Elector Countess' forces acted differently and were more durable, so all of their experience became a handicap.
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Ah...as different from wild skeletons as fighting wild apes would be to beastmen.
 
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