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Warhammer Fantasy: Divided Loyalties - an Advisor's Quest

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Question - why isn't the highly recognized grey magister receiving a large number of grey journeyfolk? Does she not have a positive reputation and a lot to teach? More scouts/assassins/spies would be rather useful.
 
DragonParadox said:
On the other hand, from the same source:

"Your lives to ours are as brief sparks to raging fires, yet some of you dance in the darkness with such grace that I cannot help but notice. I have seen wonders flow from the forges of the Dwarfs, the skill of the Elves, and even from the courage of Men. I suspect the admiration is quietly mutual. I've observed the images that adorn the shields of your mightiest warriors and grace your standards. I think that when my kind are gone, you will miss us."
– Tinairath The Wind, dragon

Dragons vary greatly in how they see the other races.
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Like any other sapient race, they vary in personality. Not even the Orcs or the Slann all hold identical views.

Elorie said:
Question - why isn't the highly recognized grey magister receiving a large number of grey journeyfolk? Does she not have a positive reputation and a lot to teach? More scouts/assassins/spies would be rather useful.
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Because she's also really intimidating? Because she's in a dangerous place and most Greys aren't fighters? Because there are fewer of them? Because they're busy? Mathilde doesn't know, probably largely because she hasn't been looking for answers.
 
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BoneyM said:
The mountains south of Ulrikadrin and as far south as Karak Azgal are absolutely riddled with caves and tunnels, both natural and otherwise. The northern part of the caldera features what greenskins and human scholars call an 'endless pit', though the Dwarves say 'we measured it like three weeks after our ancestors got here, it only goes down a few kilometers'. The area gets rain, it just goes straight down instead of into rivers, and the only reason Dwarves aren't bringing it straight back up is there's Skaven down there and them poisoning that water is a big part of why K8P fell the first time.
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Ooo...thats the former primary Magma chamber?!
BoneyM said:
Giving him other Skaven to talk to when you can't understand the language would be a gamble.
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IMO a pet(as a reward for good performance/cooperation) is both good for psychology AND generates additional leverage, since he'd also be keenly aware you could eliminate the pet without at all reducing his value.

Theres a horrifyingly broad variety of ways to fuck with a captive's mind without doing any damage to them.
 
Elorie said:
Question - why isn't the highly recognized grey magister receiving a large number of grey journeyfolk? Does she not have a positive reputation and a lot to teach? More scouts/assassins/spies would be rather useful.
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The more adventurous ones probably want to make their own way without riding on someone else's coattails. The smarter ones look at someone so famous, deduce that she probably also has a lot of enemies, and decide to stay far away from any fallout of that.
 
NuclearConsensus said:
The more adventurous ones probably want to make their own way without riding on someone else's coattails. The smarter ones look at someone so famous, deduce that she probably also has a lot of enemies, and decide to stay far away from any fallout of that.
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Also to be fair, if you were a Grey Journeyman, going to where a Grey Magister lives is kind of the opposite of Journeying and pushing your limits. If there was Grey stuff to do they'd do it better than you after all.
 
veekie said:
IMO a pet(as a reward for good performance/cooperation) is both good for psychology AND generates additional leverage, since he'd also be keenly aware you could eliminate the pet without at all reducing his value.

Theres a horrifyingly broad variety of ways to fuck with a captive's mind without doing any damage to them.
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I think i stand with Boney on that one. Not good idea to introduce other, absolutely and completely uncontrolable elements. Fuck knows what they would talk about. Work him when he is alone, he will feel more impetus to talk about just about anything if he has noone else to have conversation with.
 
pucflek said:
I think i stand with Boney on that one. Not good idea to introduce other, absolutely and completely uncontrolable elements. Fuck knows what they would talk about. Work him when he is alone, he will feel more impetus to talk about just about anything if he has noone else to have conversation with.
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As in, get him a hamster, if he performs adequately for the translation.
 
pucflek said:
I think i stand with Boney on that one. Not good idea to introduce other, absolutely and completely uncontrolable elements. Fuck knows what they would talk about. Work him when he is alone, he will feel more impetus to talk about just about anything if he has noone else to have conversation with.
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In this instance I think they mean an animal or some other creature.
 
BoneyM said:
Dwarves live in a world where everything outside their mountainhome is basically a horror movie. Rangers are the ones that go into them as a vocation. Encountering a situation that if it was trying to kill them, they didn't notice it, was basically a vacation.
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That's awful.
BoneyM said:
That sort of detailed calculation will require another set of eyes. The Rangers were more concerned with keeping their eyes peeled so they don't end up adding to them than doing an age survey of the bones.
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Ah, well... Erm. Would asking how long the rangers spent in Karag Mhonar at any given time, and what times of day/night they explored it in (i.e. "only during the day" "during any time, really") be asking for too much detail? Did they spend a night in Mhonar itself?
 
Regarding Mhonar, we should capture a few Skaven (maybe when we go out with Johann) and see if whatever's in there reacts to it.
Sure, it's a war crime, but worth trying.
 
veekie said:
Do keep in mind that full fledged Eshin Assassins are about as rare as Grey Magisters proportionally. I don't expect more than a pair.
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I wouldn't go that far. I'd expect Eshin sorcerers to be about as common as Imperial Wizards, if not more prevelant thanks to Clan Eshin not having the superstitions about magic users that the Empire's peasants do.

Assassins are a (mostly?) non-magical mundane hero unit, so I'd expect them to be as common as the Empire's experienced heroes, say one in a thousand in the military.

If there's an expeditionary force of ten thousand Eshin here, it might be plausible to expect a couple of sorcerers and say ten assassins. If this is a particularly important front, we could easily see twice or three times as many of each here though, and perhaps a Master or Lord Sorcerer, as a basic sorcerer is on the same magical grade as a Journeyman, IIRC.
 
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Hmmm. I wonder if we can get a token or pass with a rune on it that says "the bearer of this is cool in the eyes of the dwarves, ghost dwarves", incase any hypothetical dwarven ghosts are angry at what they might see as another interloper?

Just incase the peak is infact filled with non-hostile dwarf ghosts
 
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So what project were we thinking of tackling next? I was originally thinking cartographer or Queekish, but I'm coming around to Aethyric Vitae. I'm fairly certain we can finish it up in an IC year if we focus on it and then we can pursue other stuff.

I'm also fairly certain Belegar would love it (I'm Mathilde Weber and I can recharge Ancestor Runes!) and honestly, the credit situation seems increasingly less important as it seems like picking it as a project may be the only way we'll ever do the damn thing.

Queekish is also attractive but the skaven definitely seems like a more long term asset. We probably want to deepen our relationship before pursuing him as a focused project.
 
Alratan said:
I wouldn't go that far. I'd expect Eshin sorcerers to be about as common as Imperial Wizards, if not more prevelant thanks to Clan Eshin not having the superstitions about magic users that the Empire's peasants do.

Assassins are a (mostly?) non-magical mundane hero unit, so I'd expect them to be as common as the Empire's experienced heroes, day one in a thousand in the military.

If there's an expeditionary force of ten thousand Eshin here, it might be plausible to expect a couple of sorcerers and say ten assassins. If this is a particularly important front, we could easily see twice or three times as many of each here though, and perhaps a Master or Lord Sorcerer, as a basic sorcerer is on the same magical grade as a Journeyman, IIRC.
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Hmm, I agree in general but I think you are underestimating the ratio slightly. Assassins are non-magical though and looking at both tabletop and RPG stats Sorcerers are about equivalent to a magister (a level 1 wizard in tabletop terms) but more likely to know battle magic due to skaven not valuing the lives of subordinates as a culture.

On the train right now so I can't provide sources, sorry. Of course BoneyM is the final arbitrator of quest canon.
 
Quest said:
So what project were we thinking of tackling next? I was originally thinking cartographer or Queekish, but I'm coming around to Aethyric Vitae. I'm fairly certain we can finish it up in an IC year if we focus on it and then we can pursue other stuff.

I'm also fairly certain Belegar would love it (I'm Mathilde Weber and I can recharge Ancestor Runes!) and honestly, the credit situation seems increasingly less important as it seems like picking it as a project may be the only way we'll ever do the damn thing.

Queekish is also attractive but the skaven definitely seems like a more long term asset. We probably want to deepen our relationship before pursuing him as a focused project.
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Inclined to say Mhonar Mystery, Dragon Recon or Cartographer are most relevant to Belegar's concerns for the moment.
 
veekie said:
Inclined to say Mhonar Mystery, Dragon Recon or Cartographer are most relevant to Belegar's concerns for the moment.
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I'm fairly sure that Dreng(?) is still working on that. None of the councillors gained any new tasks so we'll probably get more detailed information next turn.

Mhonar Mystery and Cartographer might be useful things to present Belegar, but I'm definitely against the dragon. Ice Dragons focus on Hysh which is a perfect counter to ulgu. I'm definitely against poking the dragon so soon.

We might also want to look at this:

[ ] PROJECT: Defence
Though Clan Mors is unlikely to attack, Skaven are never entirely predictable and they might not remain your neighbours on all fronts. Magic might be able to amplify the underground defences, both your own and that of other Colleges.

If we can enhance the defences of the current fronts, Belegar may feel comfortable pushing further.
 
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Lupercal said:
Hmm, I agree in general but I think you are underestimating the ratio slightly. Assassins are non-magical though and looking at both tabletop and RPG stats Sorcerers are about equivalent to a magister (a level 1 wizard in tabletop terms) but more likely to know battle magic due to skaven not valuing the lives of subordinates as a culture.
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I don't think Clan Eshin sorcerers have developed battle magic out of concern about the Grey Seers' reaction. We certainly don't know of a battle magic version of the Lore of Stealth.

I think one of the exit careers of Sorcerer is Master Wizard, and Master Wizard is what Imperial Magisters are. That means that regular sorcerers are Journeyman equivalents.
 
Quest said:
I'm fairly sure that Dreng(?) is still working on that. None of the councillors gained any new tasks so we'll probably get more detailed information next turn.

Mhonar Mystery and Cartographer might be useful things to present Belegar, but I'm definitely against the dragon. Ice Dragons focus on Hysh which is a perfect counter to ulgu. I'm definitely against poking the dragon so soon.

We might also want to look at this:

[ ] PROJECT: Defence
Though Clan Mors is unlikely to attack, Skaven are never entirely predictable and they might not remain your neighbours on all fronts. Magic might be able to amplify the underground defences, both your own and that of other Colleges.

If we can enhance the defences of the current fronts, Belegar may feel comfortable pushing further.
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What are the general ideas regarding tge Defense option? AV benefits are an obvious hook, and Queekish can be used to keep a finger on the pulse of the Skaven civil war situation. But what are the ideas for Defense?

This is not intended as a call out, but BoneyM tends gives better options if we already have a general direction.
 
SITB said:
What are the general ideas regarding tge Defense option? AV benefits are an obvious hook, and Queekish can be used to keep a finger on the pulse of the Skaven civil war situation. But what are the ideas for Defense?

This is not intended as a call out, but BoneyM tends gives better options if we already have a general direction.
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Enchantments with magical alarm to give forewarning to the defenders when something comes. May have to be fine tuned so a normal sized rat doesn't trip it.

Having enchantments with illusion to create false walls and thus just hide away a section of the tunnel so the skaven don't march down it but leave it open for the dwarfs to strike from.

Celestial order, ew, enchantments that give precog warnings of incoming attack.
 
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