Somic
It's meow or never
- Pronouns
- She/Her
We'll make him cool silk armor-robes and someone can enchant them with Aethyric Armor. Imagine.
Warhammer Fantasy: Divided Loyalties - an Advisor's Quest
- Thread starter Boney
- Start date
- Fantasy Users' Choice!
-
- Tags
- warhammer warhammer fantasy fantasy be gay do crimes (gay) female protagonist pansexual protagonist ck2 quest divided loyalties mountain vietnam ranald is real this is a dwarf quest (dwarfs) this is maybe an elf quest this is not a vampire quest this is not an empire quest try it and find out open voting
Voted best in category in the Users' Choice awards.
I'm approaching this from the perspective of what would help Mandred the most: sure it is great that he'd be well viewed by the Bright Order but he's going to be positively viewed by any Order if he's even mildly competent.
We kind of recommended being a wizard to Heidi on the basis that being a wizard is a big part of what a person is.
I don't think Mathilde would recommend being merely serviceable.
She's an immense overachiever: so it makes the most narrative sense for her to push the angle that Mandred should be both and excellent Elector Count and an excellent wizard... as a bare minimum.
Last edited:
- Location
- Somewhere on Earth
So why are you campaigning for the Greys? Mandred doesn't have much appreciation for intrigue, he will inevitably be an atypical Grey, and he'll face more difficulties breaking through the inherent assumptions about his role. Brights meanwhile thrive on the battlefield, the same place he has both the talent and passion for. Unless he secretly has a stockpile of talent in Ulgu exclusively then he'll be facing more roadblocks to get to the same level of self-actualization and fame he could have as a Bright, who will absolutely put more weight on his personal skills when considering promotion.
Edit: Are you talking about which Wind will give him the most personal combat ability? Aqshy is still #1 there, maybe competing with Chamon.
Last edited:
- Location
- North Wales
- Pronouns
- He/Him/His
As an elector count, Mandred could afford to buy ithilmar armour if he really wanted protection on the battlefield and didn't pick the Golds as his college of choice. It's tens of thousands of crowns for such a suit, yes. So is hiring a single regiment of mercenaries for a year or two.
Personal budgets get fucky that high up in a feudal system.
Personal budgets get fucky that high up in a feudal system.
I'll just swing my bat against the Jades by noting that it just wouldn't be a good environment to grow up in. Even if the Druids are unable to do anything serious. They can still treat him like shit and be assholes and try to poison the well. I don't think any other college has a major faction that actively wants the worst for Mandred.
Somic
It's meow or never
- Pronouns
- She/Her
To be specific, Mathilde recommended against crippling a child and forever stripping him of an entire sense. (And against making him a priest of a barely tolerated God, which in hindsight was a great decision with these rolls...)
She's immensely pragmatic. Imo, there's no way she'd demand him to achieve more than is realistic for him to achieve within the limitations of his circumstances and talents.
Sure, it would be great if Mandred was made of pure awesome when it comes to one Wind, but in reality, his options are 1) turn Reikland into a breadbasket because prince of Reikland, 2) be cool metal man because he is very talented at elemental Chamon, 3) be burning warrior wizard because he's a good warrior and everybody loves a leader, 4) learn intrigue from Mathilde.
Only one of these actually puts emphasis on his magical suitability, and it's the Wind he's great at half of.
And as Boney said, the Bright College doesn't consider pure suitability to Aqshy the most important part of being a good Bright Wizard.
Greys can and do absolutely thrive on the battlefield. For the matter Greys are also explicitly noted to be diplomats which is another thing Mandred has talent for.
We know that being atypical is not a barrier for promotion because Mathilde is as atypical as they come - not to mention that in the Grey Order LM Mathilde will have a really heavy say on promotions (particularly since she's a shoe in to take the top spot when Algard retires).
- Location
- Somewhere on Earth
Honestly I do think it's kind of a shame Jade just doesn't really feel like it fits him. Maybe if he'd gotten a better Stewardship I would be campaigning for it, but as is it's a wonderful dream of a flourishing land that doesn't super stack up to the other options.
Greys thrive on the battlefield as ambushers as assassins, not as inspiring champions. Not even Mathilde does that. And Mathilde is as atypical as they come while still achieving success because she's absurdly successful. There is no universe in which Mathilde's development should be used as proof that any atypical Grey can manage it, she singlehandedly saved an entire Karak. And saying she's atypical does miss the part where she's only atypical in the application of her talents. In every other way Mathilde is a master infiltrator and manipulator constantly juggling different viewpoints and perspectives, something Mandred just doesn't particularly care about. It's more likely that Mandred would be Johann-level atypical than Mathilde-level atypical.
You know from most people this sounds kind of silly, maybe ever a little cute... From one who has read the Liber Mortis it sounds almost like a threat. Stay out of my business Morr or I might not stay out of yours. 💀
Last edited:
- Location
- Washington
Not just you, this is more addressed to a lot of people and this is just what finally got me to post it, but the druids are not a monolith. A particular subset of the druids may elect to treat him like shit (though I think they'd be far more likely to just ice him out if they try anything at all.)
The Tochter Grunfelds of the world will probably instead mostly be trying to set him up with their nieces and daughters.
- Location
- Utrecht
Boney's comment about the Bright's symbology being locks and keys, and their lack of focus on affinity is a good sign for Mandred's longevity.
An affinity for Aqshy probably translates to someone exceedingly passionate, and the implication of locks and keys is that the Bright order is focused on self control. Keeping a tight leash on that passion, and unleashing it only when necessary.
They are not concerned with making the most destructive wizards possible (i.e. with the highest affinity), because Aqshy applied correctly is still the most destructive of the winds.
They're not focused on making "average" wizards: they're focused on making wizards with good self control.
Notably: the Aqshy wizards we've worked with have all been rather temperate, now that I think about it.
Doubt it, they would not want to introduce countervailing power into their matrilinial lines, it would inherently dilute their long term influence over that line. These are not nobles who view their children as pawns to play in marriage alliances, they are a hereditary cult whose primary goal is the maintaining of tradition
- Location
- Somewhere between the stars
- Pronouns
- She/Her
It seems to be a case of "Mandred will be a great Bright Wizard", and "Mandred might be a Good Jade/Gold/Etc". And the thing is that this needs to go well. Every one of the collages needs this to work out, and the bright wizard is the option that will work out.
He might not become a kick-flipping skateboard Teclis reborn figure as it, but it's the one that is going to work for Mandred. And if Mandred happens to actually be a really amazing wizard, that would make him a great Jade/Gold/etc, that would also apply to a Bright Version of him.
He might not become a kick-flipping skateboard Teclis reborn figure as it, but it's the one that is going to work for Mandred. And if Mandred happens to actually be a really amazing wizard, that would make him a great Jade/Gold/etc, that would also apply to a Bright Version of him.
- Location
- Somewhere on Earth
Brights have never done us wrong but Sunscryer the Light wizard went up like a fuckin' nuke pretty much on contact with the enemy, what a legend.
Sinsystems
Patron Librarian
Personally I am in favor of Grey here.
Also him being a Grey Knight would be fairly simple thanks to things like Dread Aspect giving him the fear bonus and if he is skilled enough, plus if we get him some custom gear to make it easier, he could have a bodyguard of one of our riders and could use Rite of Way to lead a cavalry charge.
Also him being a Grey Knight would be fairly simple thanks to things like Dread Aspect giving him the fear bonus and if he is skilled enough, plus if we get him some custom gear to make it easier, he could have a bodyguard of one of our riders and could use Rite of Way to lead a cavalry charge.
Somic
It's meow or never
- Pronouns
- She/Her
To be fair, he has exceptional affinity for elemental Chamon, so you can add Gold to the left column. Agree on Jade and Grey though.
Gonna be honest, I want Mandred to be Grey simply so we can yoink him as an apprentice.
The benefits are many and manifest:
Thank you for coming to my TED talk - I'm sure there are some that I've missed, but I feel this covers the most important priorities.
The benefits are many and manifest:
- Big Sister Eike
- Being apprentice to Ms. 'Second Only to Sigmar in the Eyes of the Dwarves' puts the Sigmarites in a very funny and awkward position.
- We sword good, he wants to sword good and will have access to a very, very good sword.
- We can get him a cat. A giant cat, upon which he can ride into battle.
- We can teach him when to stab people from the front, when to stab from behind and when convenient accidents should be arranged.
- He will learn the patented Mathilde's Mysterious Mischievous Mockery, accept no substitutes.
- Big Sister Eike.
Thank you for coming to my TED talk - I'm sure there are some that I've missed, but I feel this covers the most important priorities.
- Location
- Australia
Correction:
Mandred is very interested in Intrigue, he's just not gifted at it.
What the literal 10 year old actually isn't interested is the subtle aspects of statecraft. Why would anyone hold that against him.
Somic
It's meow or never
- Pronouns
- She/Her
Idk, there are plenty of things that sound awesome to me in stories and I wish I were good at, but actually studying them is an exercise in frustration.
I'm not saying Mandred can never ever get gud at Intrigue, but he is relatively ungood at it right now, and there's no guarantee that he'll overcome this and not instead find out that he is no sneaky hero of a tale.
Also, Heidi straight up said it's fine if he doesn't. Everybody loves a martial kind of hero, and he can delegate the subtleties to trusted advisors.
- Location
- Somewhere on Earth
I mean the fundamental problem is you're bringing up a Fiendishly Complex spell that requires Magic 5 to learn, then Battle Magic in order to express how he can be a good Grey Knight. Meanwhile, just from the spellbook of Chamon we're given in this quest, we have shit like Fault Of Form, Curse Of Rust, Guard Of Steel, all three of which are simple, Law Of Age, Armour Of Lead, Trial And Error? For the same complexity as Dread Aspect, he could get both of these:
And I don't even need to express how Aqshy could be useful for kicking ass. If you want a Grey Mandred, that's fine. But it's not for the sake of him becoming the best version of himself as he could be, it's for the sake of it being kind of rad because Mathilde's also grey.
Andres, those are scenes of a child taking his first steps into basic media literacy while hearing cool stories about gods, not the signs of a driven intrigue expert. His own mother doesn't even defend him on this, she just says they can be careful to only let the right people become his advisors.
Last edited:
The reputation of the Greys could actually be a great asset to a ruler who isn't that intrigue-ish. If everyone expects him to be great at that stuff they won't test his mediocre actual skills. It's kinda like an inherent bluff.
This, the kid is not very interested in 'intrigue' for the same reason he is not very interested in 'diplomacy' or for that matter 'martial', he is 10, he does not understand what those concepts are. He is likable, interested in swords and tales of valor and not at all sneaky.