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Warhammer Fantasy: Divided Loyalties - an Advisor's Quest

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reignonyrparade said:
Honestly kinda it sounds like early on in her reign, people mostly just didn't care. She basically was Kislev's equivalent to "The Vampire Wars," beforehand they don't seem to have much of a negative experience with vampires so it was almost like Van Hal's "hey this dude is a vampire, how strange" reaction to The Vampire Yet To Be Known As Vlad Von Carstein.
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It's stated in Night's Dark Masters that they were familiar with Necrarchs and Strigoi, so they knew about vampires as obvious monsters, but they did not have any experience with Lahmians.

reignonyrparade said:
Do we actually even definitively know that said notable massacre was vampire-related and not because a bunch of people were complaining about taxes or something? :V
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It's stated to be the first time she lost control to the Hunger. So yes, Vampire-related.
 
Boney said:
Kislev is extremely decentralized - 'the Gods are high above, and the Tzar is far away' - so tyranny isn't currently a problem, and when it is most Kislevites are capable of just upping stakes and moving away, leaving the tyrant to rule over nobody. And the Kislevites are generally fatalistic in nature, making a God of Luck a hard sell.
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That's an interesting contrast to real life. IIRC the Russian feudal system forced serfs to stay in one place for a very long time, like it was a foundational part of the tsardom and a "right" the tsar had to grant to local nobility so they wouldn't rebel/withhold taxes etc.. and it stayed part of their system for a long time (like much longer than the rest of Europe comparatively)

I wonder what caused the difference between Kislev & Russian society!
 
Deamons invading every once in a while probaly incentivises to an degree, "Pack up everything and leave now!" If you don't want everyone to constantly die, they need to be able to move and move quickly.
 
Threnodist said:
That's an interesting contrast to real life. IIRC the Russian feudal system forced serfs to stay in one place for a very long time, like it was a foundational part of the tsardom and a "right" the tsar had to grant to local nobility so they wouldn't rebel/withhold taxes etc.. and it stayed part of their system for a long time (like much longer than the rest of Europe comparatively)

I wonder what caused the difference between Kislev & Russian society!
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I think the fact that... they are not really Russians, they do not have the experience of being conquered by the Mongols as a settled people and then as said settled agrarian people marching and colonizing east. The Kislevites, the Gospodar in particular are the Mongols, or at the very least they are nomads newly settled in these lands from the east. I think to get something like the Duchy of Muscovy and its particular political goals a bunch of Ungols would have had to rebel successful and then start expanding east, but

A) That did not happen
and
B) Even if it did the geopolitics east of here is not what it would be in our world.
 
Yeah it's been awhile since I took that history class so I'm gonna have to dig out that $80 textbook to have any input on what the academic consensus is on the originating force of that law.

I definitely agree that with periodic Chaos invasions there's a lot of incentive to for the nobility to "give" peasants more freedom of movement. Both for pure expediency (you try being the retainer having to tell the mob of angry peasants they have to wait to be slaughtered by literal demons 😝) & for defensive reasons (defense in depth, attrition, other stuff?).

But I'm also remembering that one of the reasons those laws were repealed in Western Europe was post-Black Death peasants had a lot more bargaining power and nobles would have the narrow interest of competing with one another for the limited pool of labor with incentives & expanded rights. I'm guessing there might be similar thing happening after each "Great War Against Chaos"
 
Threnodist said:
Yeah it's been awhile since I took that history class so I'm gonna have to dig out that $80 textbook to have any input on what the academic consensus is on the originating force of that law.

I definitely agree that with periodic Chaos invasions there's a lot of incentive to for the nobility to "give" peasants more freedom of movement. Both for pure expediency (you try being the retainer having to tell the mob of angry peasants they have to wait to be slaughtered by literal demons 😝) & for defensive reasons (defense in depth, attrition, other stuff?).

But I'm also remembering that one of the reasons those laws were repealed in Western Europe was post-Black Death peasants had a lot more bargaining power and nobles would have the narrow interest of competing with one another for the limited pool of labor with incentives & expanded rights. I'm guessing there might be similar thing happening after each "Great War Against Chaos"
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There was an actual Plague analog in Warhammer, literally called the Black Death because... GW, just GW :V
 
Sinsystems said:
From how I understand things the Tzar seemed like a classic case of a ruler who got the position but had no interest in actually ruling. He was the type of guy who would be good to have in a war, leading the army and inspiring the people while fighting against the enemy but in peace time he couldn't care less about doing all that stuff.

Hell historically in our own timeline we don't even have to look that far to find a Tzar even worse. Just look at Peter Ulric, the guy was infamously incompetent at ruling Russia.
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Peter III was also deposed by his wife (Catherine the Great, who is a Kattarin prototype with very uncomfortable connotations) after half a year of rule. Vladimir is closer to Nicholas II, the last Russian Tzar. He was long-reigning but weak ruler and in the end was overthrown partly due to his unwillingness/inability to reform the country.
 
...Speaking of Kattarin, I really have to wonder what the canonical Boris was thinking when naming his daughter Katarin.
 
Parabola said:
...Speaking of Kattarin, I really have to wonder what the canonical Boris was thinking when naming his daughter Katarin.
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My assumption is there have in fact been a great many Kattarins and Katarins besides just the bloody. She's the one WE hear about from the outside all the time but, well, presumably in world there's a reason they refer to her as "Kattarin the Bloody" instead of Just "Kattarin."
 
reignonyrparade said:
My assumption is there have in fact been a great many Kattarins and Katarins besides just the bloody. She's the one WE hear about from the outside all the time but, well, presumably in world there's a reason they refer to her as "Kattarin the Bloody" instead of Just "Kattarin."
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Much like Elizabeth II naming her son "Charles". Was it after the monarch who ruled as a tyrant and got his head chopped off by Parliament, or the monarch who dissolved Parliament and then ruled as a tyrant?

The answer is probably 'neither'. Charles is just a popular name.
 
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Boney said:
After that, you feel an urgent need to clear your head, so you make your way to the countryside.

It occurs to you, as you ride into Biderhof, just how far you've come. Just over a decade ago, you were a peasant child running around in a homespun frock, collecting frogs and throwing mud at the boy next door, occasionally roped in to do some poorly-understood task out in the fields but mostly running around freely and getting underfoot. Only a fascination with storms hinted at what was to come.

Then, one day, the poorly-carved wooden horse that had been mildly entertaining bored children for generations neighed, and your life was never the same again.
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Boney said:
"I don't know if I can gift him intangible concepts," you say with a smile, "though, ironically, I could gift him with intangibility itself. Once he's grown up I might end up teaching him or arming him or guarding him or something, but for now my gift is rather more modest." From a pocket, you produce a small, carved piece of wood, and hand it over to Heidi.

"A little horse," she says, with slightly unsure cheer.

"Imprint," you say in Lingua Praestantia, and a sliver of Ulgu writhes in confirmation. "Neigh at it."

She gives you a flat look, then turns back to the horse. "Neigh," she says, and the horse replies with a soft but convincing whinny that brings a smile to your face.

"It will only respond to you or Mandred," you assure her, "and it's completely safe, there's less magic in it than a dandelion."
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I was just rereading this story when I stumbled over this Brick Joke two years in the making.
 
Andres said:
Was Mathilde best attuned to Azyr before she went to the Grey College?
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picklepikkl said:
Pretty sure the Mathilde fascination with storms tying her to Ulgu is based on this:
realms of sorcery said:
It is most affected by the mortal winds that blow across the earth, and it rears into mighty clouds beneath the influence of storms or gales, which is when Grey magic is at its strongest.
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Emphasis mine. Grey magic is strongest, not at dawn or dusk, but during periods of high mundane wind.
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Boney said:
Weather in general and lightning specifically are Azyr. The coming of a storm turning day into night the sudden illumination of a flash of lighting are Ulgu. There are those that argue that nurturing rains are of Ghyran and savage roiling tempests are of Ghur. If you really wanted to you could make an argument that electricity could be of Chamon, or the sudden unleashing of pent-up energy is of Aqshy, or the calm after the storm is of Hysh.

No matter which College she ended up in, Mathilde would probably have found reasons for why it was the 'right' school in her childhood. It's rather common for wizards to look past on their pre-magical selves and interpret everything through the lens of it being foreshadowing for their magical inclination.
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Boney said:
"And everyone comes running with promises. Well, here is Kislev's promise. You say there might be ways to push back Dewastacja? Restore Praag? Push back Troll Country? I say: to make this happen, all of Kislev will move mountains. You need gold? Kislev has gold. You need Ice Witch? They want make friends with me after father ignores them, they want me to take Ice Witch wife, I can make them cooperate. The Hag Witches? The kossars know they are mine, you can have Hag Witches. Ursun knows me, His priests will cooperate. If Elves in Erengrad want to stay in Erengrad, they must help. There is nothing I would not make happen if it means more Kislev and less Za. Do you understand?" You nod. "Good. I have gone to the returned Dwarves, spoken to them of you. You tore them from the grip of the Za after all had given up on them. After they had given up on them. Do the same for Kislev, and there would be no reward too great."
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Doing a re-read and reached this point.

Now the bolded bit was as part of his offer to us, but we might be able to prevail upon him to put pressure on the elves in Erengrad to generally help with any Asur coming and shouting at us/causing problems.

[The main BOOK idea being discussed reads to me as mutually beneficial, so I don't see much issue with asking for both things]
 
BeepSmile said:
we might be able to prevail upon him to put pressure on the elves in Erengrad to generally help with any Asur coming and shouting at us/causing problems
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They haven't come and shouted at us yet, so I think that'd be premature. And regardless, I think we're in a pretty good position? Most Asur won't be able to do much but grumble. Teclis is the only one the Colleges would definitely listen to, and he's happy and proud. (Until he finds out that this is a joint project involving a dwarf, elf separatists, Kislev witches... but we'll explain that bridge when we get to it).
 
Glau said:
Yeah, you want the Ur-weapon in this setting, I think you have to go for widowmaker.
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Letter rankings are a manifestation of cosmic weight rather than actual usefulness at the end of the day. There's D-rank NPs that have more impact on the narrative than A-rank ones.

That said, potential EX rank NPs in Warhammer, though they can be argued to be A with a plus or two: Widowmaker, The Throne of Power, Fozzriks Flying Fastness (part of its legend is how it's gathered up thousands of years worth of magical artifacts, so as an NP it'd be be the Warhammer equivalent of UBW or Gate), the Six Gifts of Chaos collectively (individually they're strong, but collectively they're more than the sum of their parts) and finally maybe the Nemesis Crown if it actually worked.

The Axes of Grimnir, Ghal Maraz or the Spear of Tlanxla are cool, but they're not the kind of thing that would be EX.

The Fellblade would be C-Rank, but would have more power than most higher ranked noble phantasms.
 
Ghal Maraz could be argued to be EX, not because of the magic in its forging but because it is the symbol of the empire as a whole and has been for a couple of thousand years. That's a lot of time to gather a lot of Mystery.
As a result, the Noble Phantasm may have abilities complete distinct from the runic magic that the physical one has.
 
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