Voted best in category in the Users' Choice awards.
So, what would be better? There are a few crit results in the book where you have to save to not die from bleeding IIRC; giving you a bonus on those seems on point for gilding your heart. And I'd probably add immunity to injury poisons and bloodborne diseases, much like how gilding your lungs gives you immunity to inhalation poisons and airborne diseases.
Honestly I think the emotional numbing works if it's in regard to like, opposing mental spells or dhar/chaos corruption. That's not what the description actually says, of course, but I like the idea that in this one case the typically literal and direct Chamon focuses on metaphor for the purification and hardening of one's heart, that it guards the user against 'changing their heart'.
 
Just to really hammer the point home of it being a bad idea regardless of how utilitarian the Gold Order is or the effect of gilding one's heart, it's worth pointing out that while this is bad enough if it's one Gold Wizard at a time deciding not to go quietly, it's particularly bad if the Gold Wizard happens to be someone like Johann or Max, who has friends. Consider the thread's reaction if our punchbuddy or the nice friendly guy who helps make our papers amazing winds up in Frederheim and then six months later we go to visit, only to find they've been dragged out for some sort of experiment. Consider, also, the thread's reaction if we know that people who go to Frederheim get dragged off for horrible experiments and then we find out that Johann or Max are hiding something that would get them sent to Frederheim.

Now consider that Johann and Max aren't the only ones who know other mages.

A policy which encourages Grey Wizards to start assassinating Gold Wizards they suspect of knowing their friend is hiding something, Brights to declare that the local area is a fire now because someone dropped by unannounced to have a chat with their colleague, Jades and Ambers to disappear into the wilderness forever with their unstable wizard buddy, and so on, is not a good policy for one's personal best outcomes or those of society.
 
So, what would be better? There are a few crit results in the book where you have to save to not die from bleeding IIRC; giving you a bonus on those seems on point for gilding your heart. And I'd probably add immunity to injury poisons and bloodborne diseases, much like how gilding your lungs gives you immunity to inhalation poisons and airborne diseases.

As long as I'm on the subject, the book doesn't have rules for gilding your stomach at all for some reason, but I'd say it should give you the ability to survive indefinitely without eating or drinking and immunity to ingested poisons and diseases.
It doesn't sound like gilding your lungs REMOVES the need to breath it just means you don't suffer any other effects of things-that-aren't-oxygen getting into your lungs, so that wouldn't seem to be what it'd do to the stomach, but also just as a matter of principal my understanding that gilding, as gold is "the perfect metal" gilding turns an organ into a perfect version of that organ. A perfect stomach isn't a stomach that doesn't need to eat, a perfect stomach is rather one that digest EVERYTHING.

So, I'd say a "lower" tuned gilded stomach would be one that "merely" manages to get every calorie out of anything you eat, or if that's not good enough one that start's letting you digest literally anything, letting you get nutrition out of rocks or whatnot in addition to the "immunity to ingested poisons and diseases" which I do agree with you on.
 
Actually what would it take to higher an elf healer to help the wizards at Frederhiem. Because if it is just money that is doable.
Do the elves have much more experience than humans in treating the clinically insane? Genuine question - jokes about Druchii aside, I'm not sure whether or not elves really end up with insanities of the kind that requires constant care very often.
 
Do the elves have much more experience than humans in treating the clinically insane? Genuine question - jokes about Druuchi aside, I'm not sure whether or not elves really end up with insanities of the kind that requires constant care very often.
Maybe, elves can spend centuries learning by to heal and can probably diagnose better than a human healer. It be something to look into if Mathilde comes back from elfcation with money.
 
Actually what would it take to higher an elf healer to help the wizards at Frederhiem. Because if it is just money that is doable.
Before we even start to think of hiring someone with Qhaysh (I assume that's what you mean) to possibly heal the Gold wizards at Frederheim, we'd need to ask whether they would actually be any help when it comes to magically-caused mental problems.

Last time something like this came up, Boney coached it in terms of 'theoretically possible but you don't know enough about Qhaysh to really know for sure'.

The issue with Johann's failed gilding, for instance, is that there's lingering Chamon in his eyes, and theoretically a very skilled and careful caster could weave the lingering Chamon into a High Magic healing spell. And that's just for his eyes. A Gold wizard who is at Frederheim due to casting Breach the Unknown or Tale of Metal will have something happen to their brains, and it would be lucky if that left only lingering Chamon instead of permanent brain damage.

Hm, perhaps Quash healing spell would work.

@BoneyM Does Quash in general plays nice with the separate winds?
Not normally. It seems theoretically possible that someone very skilled and very careful might be able to weave the lingering Chamon into a High Magic healing spell.
So Qhaysh theoretically would able to heal a wizard's brain without side effects?
Theoretically could, rather than theoretically would. But yes.
 
"Rest in a calm environment for two to three centuries and it should clear up" probably isn't very applicable to human medicine.
No but the damage done to the cerebral cortex can be repaired here and mister gold wizard can go back to experimenting after some recovery time. Elves can do magic that humans can not and have centuries to orati e their skills . All I am saying it is something to look into.
 
Extremist sect of the Cult of Ulric that believes that the world will soon enter an apocalyptic endless winter. The most extreme parts do things like burn down granaries and firewood storages to 'force people to withstand the cold and grow stronger'
It should be noted that the apocalyptic winter isn't some random thing, it's Ulric's way to finally win against Chaos. They're basically preppers who think their God is going to nuke their enemies.
...now that I think about it, taking down Chaos even if it means taking the rest of the world with it is actually in line with what Cd-2 was trying to do in the sidestory...
 
I don't think remaking the Old Ones Language is even close to those other projects.

The languages one step removed from the Old One's Tongue are:

  • High Nehekaran: Mathilde can learn it written or spoken for 1 AP, so at most learning it will be 2 AP.

  • Arcane Khazalid: We can learn it now and if we're successful with the Sevirscope we might even be able to get Kragg to teach it to us, emphasis on the "might". Most likely we will just need 1-2AP to learn it.

  • Grumbrath: The language of Ogres is also 1 step removed from the Old One's Tongue. We can learn it at the Colleges. Most likely we will just need 2-3AP to learn it.

  • Saurian: unlikely we can learn it unless we can get it from the Asur note, the White Tower or the Druchii (and even then I am not sure those 2 would have a lexicon).

  • Albionese: unlikely to learn unless we wait until 2518-2519 when the mists start to fall, and that is assuming they start to fall.

  • Daemonic: No.

  • Anoqeyån: we could try to make a deal with someone in Tor Lithanel to learn it, in fact, we could even try to get classes on it for the Colleges in exchange for the Fog Path. I feel because of its completely it'll most likely take Mathilde 2-3AP to learn it


So what do we have? That it would take Mathilde around 10 AP or less to learn all the languages she can that are one step removed from the Old Ones.

After learning those we'd most likely just need to take the action to try to reconstruct the language.


So although it'd most likely take us a long time to do so, it'll be because we focus on other things instead of because it's something "super long term" by nature like Ulgu Ascension.

Boney's comment suggests that we might only need to learn three languages to start reconstructing the old one tongue—Anoqeyån, High Nehekaran, and Arcane Khazalid.

Of course, knowing more languages would make it more accurate, but we can learn more languages later if we hit a road block or something.

If we learn High Nehekaran (from the colleges) Arcane Kazhalid (swearing not to pass it except to our apprentices) and Anoqeyån (maybe as a reward after completing the Waystone Project). Could Mathilde try to reconstruct the Old Ones Tongue, or at least partially, since all those languages are just one step removed from it?

Yes, she could try.
 
Nurgle chiming in to help brainstorm medical practices? What next, Khorne talking about anger management? :p
Honestly, it makes a certain amount of sense. In order to most comprehensively break something, it helps to have a deep knowledge of how it works. Vice Versa, specializing in breaking things is a route to learn some of their inner workings.

So a Nurglish guide to good health or a Tzeentchian guide to political stability does make a certain amount of sense, even if they might not know as much as the people who actually specialize in fixing problems.

Basically the exact opposite of the "I'm a healer, but..." meme

It is theoretically possible, it's just...


Not very likely. And not practical at all compared to eight wizards using eight different spells of their own Winds reliably.

I'd consider it a huge win if Egrimm and Mathilde manage a simple Hysh-Ulgu collab spell that can be done reliably with both at once, rather than having to roll the dice each time to see if their spell works. That's one reason why there's a lot more interest in enchantment-based Windherding than anything else.
Looking at the quote, it does feel like the requirements for casting high magic would fit with slotting eight precisely measured and constructed enchantments together. Of course, that requires eight wizards with some experience working together in windherding projects. At least the failure state of eight simultaneous miscasts sounds like something much more survivable when said miscasts occur outside any participant's body.
 
I know the discussion has already moved on but regarding the supreme matriarch discussion.

Mathildes career track so far, from an out perspective, looks like something planned out by some over eager university student who was intending to show they had all the necessary skills before becoming the youngest in the job ever. Only for them to be surprised that the job interview hasn't changed in 180 years, "Can you cast Pit of Shades, how fast? How big? How reliably?" and if your answer isn't "Yes, very, very, very" they aren't interested.

Frankly the fact that a multi disciplinarian like Mathilde is in many ways unfavoured for the post compared to Battle Wizard Bob who's never organised a thing and can't go outside if its too bright or foggy lest he explode, but damn the man can cast fireballs like a machine gun...
Well it feels like an unsubtle in universe satire of how the Empires policy of using Wizards as human canons actually overlooks the unique utility that magic can bring to the table and the opportunities that its missing out on.
Rite of Way is a great spell that does something no amount of artillery could replace, but its never going to be used in a duel so...
 
I know the discussion has already moved on but regarding the supreme matriarch discussion.

Mathildes career track so far, from an out perspective, looks like something planned out by some over eager university student who was intending to show they had all the necessary skills before becoming the youngest in the job ever. Only for them to be surprised that the job interview hasn't changed in 180 years, "Can you cast Pit of Shades, how fast? How big? How reliably?" and if your answer isn't "Yes, very, very, very" they aren't interested.

Frankly the fact that a multi disciplinarian like Mathilde is in many ways unfavoured for the post compared to Battle Wizard Bob who's never organised a thing and can't go outside if its too bright or foggy lest he explode, but damn the man can cast fireballs like a machine gun...
Well it feels like an unsubtle in universe satire of how the Empires policy of using Wizards as human canons actually overlooks the unique utility that magic can bring to the table and the opportunities that its missing out on.
Rite of Way is a great spell that does something no amount of artillery could replace, but its never going to be used in a duel so...
Well, it is going to be used. But your right. The main point of the colleges is to make battle wizards that can stand up to chaos and other enemies of the empire.
Their a research facility purely secondary.
No one's gonna stop you from researching but as the leader of the colleges your expected to lead your wizards into battle.
 
Boney's touched upon this before, but there's a growing disconnect between the Orders of Magic, who exist to create weapons to destroy the Enemies of Man, and the Colleges of Magic, who exist to study and research magic, and train new wizards. Without the Colleges, there would be no wizards, no spells, no enchantments at all. Without the Orders, the Colleges would be illegal and Kislev would be part of the Chaos Wastes.

That's why the the leadership selection leans towards the Orders' philosophy, rather than the Colleges' philosophy.

There's sort of two sides to Imperial wizardry: there's the Orders of Magic, the eight military institutions that exists to defend the Empire and support its armies, and there's the Colleges of Magic, the eight academic institutions that seek to study and understand the magical phenomena of the world. The fact that both are the same institutions leads to some friction, which is only partly alleviated by the separate Battle Wizard versus Magister career tracks. That the best ass-kicker gets to be the Supreme Patriarch, which these days is an administrative and advisory role, is a point of contention to those who see their role as being in libraries and laboratories. But Magnus didn't sign the Articles of Imperial Magic into law because he wanted more contributors to academic journals in the Empire, he did it because Kislev was burning and the Empire was going to be next. Whatever a Wizard might want to be, the fact that they are legally allowed to exist is because of their military applications, and every paper written during times of peace is paid for by a fireball thrown during times of war.

The Supreme Patriarch is decided based on martial puissance because the next time an Everchosen strides out of the Chaos Wastes and marches on the Old World, it is the Supreme Patriarch that will lead the Orders of Magic to war.

I imagine that if we were more involved in College/Order politics, we'd see more evidence of this conflict.
 
And even then we did do service to both the order and the college. We killed plenty of enemies for the empire and its allies and we did and do plenty research to further our understanding of magic.
You can do both.

Yeah, but we also endlessly argue over how to spend our AP, and we have a free paper writing action each turn. Imagine how little research we would actually do if we didn't have the Room of Serenity to churn out papers, or how much more streamlined our turns would be if we focused on just research.

I imagine many wizards chafe at having to pick between being a weapon and being a scholar, especially since the former is what gets you into leadership positions. Mathilde being able to exist in both of those roles is the exception, not the rule.
 
I think if we got that sword spell we were looking at and maybe some more battle magic Mathilde would have a chance at the job of Supreme Matriarch.

That said... yeah I don't really see why we would want it.

The only thing I can think of is if Gelt shows up and trys to win by transmuting his opponent to gold like he did in canon.

I could very easily see Mathilde stepping in then, on the grounds of. "I'm not letting this asshole run things."

The best part would be when Mathilde expects someone to fight her so she can throw the fight and get out of it, only for no one to do so.

Her looking around the room for anyone about to step in only to slowly realize she's now stuck with the job.
 
The only thing I can think of is if Gelt shows up and trys to win by transmuting his opponent to gold like he did in canon.
He explicitly didn't complete the transformation and as such his opponent (Bright Patriarch Thyrus Ghormann) survived the duel with no long term consequences. Gelt is an asshole but not that much of an asshole.
 
He explicitly didn't complete the transformation and as such his opponent (Bright Patriarch Thyrus Ghormann) survived the duel with no long term consequences. Gelt is an asshole but not that much of an asshole.
He only didn't complete it because Ghormann yielded. I've read the duel, no part of it made me think Gelt wasn't about to go through with it otherwise.
 
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