- Location
- yorkshire
tower fells less fun for me
Warhammer Fantasy: Divided Loyalties - an Advisor's Quest
- Thread starter Boney
- Start date
- Fantasy Users' Choice!
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- warhammer warhammer fantasy fantasy be gay do crimes (gay) female protagonist pansexual protagonist ck2 quest divided loyalties mountain vietnam ranald is real this is a dwarf quest (dwarfs) this is maybe an elf quest this is not a vampire quest this is not an empire quest try it and find out open voting
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tower fells less fun for me
SuperSonicSound
Shadowmancer of the Shadow Cabal
Okay now tell me what magical runes that dont actually exist do you think will be put on this gun to achieve it because runed cannons are pretty much the only runic ranged weapons the dwarves have.
You guys are throwing down counter factuals with literally no in setting lore basis, Garlak suggesting we simply learn Ulguu battle magic spells to kill with when there basically arent any i m ignoring the AoE spell because casting that is decent odds for suicide.
- Location
- his hidden lair
First of all, building our personal army, let alone a wing of gyrobombers is even more stupid- and second of all, why does everyone seem to think we'll have an option to avoid picking any risky fight?
Who's going to scout out this vampire's army so that our allies have the best information to act on? Oh wait, probably Mathilde if we want it to succeed. What are the odds of an ancient undead abomination having supernatural senses or Mathilde getting a bad roll to sneak at any point? What are the odds the voters will want to sit being a glorified cheerleader as our allies or liege have to deal with the enemy's murderhobos? What if we want to try and kill one of the enemy's murderhobos in secrecy and favorable conditions? Like we did with both warbosses?
If you had your way we'd have to give up on every unique way Mathilde can contribute in fighting besides being a generic Grey Magister (if that because Battle Magic is incredibly regulated) once a certain risk threshold has been reached. Or use absurd logic to rationalize the Dwarfs giving us a fleet of bombers we can use at will to destroy our foes, nevermind the fact Belegar would be more suited to having said wing of bombers, does in fact have some bombers, and that there's fairly limited sources of said bombers. All this is just more idle complaints that don't propose a viable alternative, and in case it's not apparent I'm losing my patience for those.
Like I can think of theoretical extreme long term alternatives, but the fact the people constantly dumping on the idea of a rune weapon can't is just obnoxious.
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How would they know? The Empire barely knows we exist. And if your worried about that, the belt and the seed are both already super good.
- Location
- yorkshire
and this is a good reason for the op sword as a OH SHIT butten to aid our escape
- Location
- Australia
I'm pretty sure they also have rune handguns. I checked Dwarfs 8th Edition and Realms of Sorcery and their weapon runes don't mention anything about being restricted to melee weapons.
Nix's Warden
Welcome to Hades
- Location
- United States
Then we should really stop participating on the front-lines in just about every major battle we get into...which the Thread won't do. The Citadel fight doesn't count because we didn't get a vote on where to go.
We're a Grey Wizard living in the middle of a fucking Dwarf Karak. I won't say its impossible for us to get mugged but good fucking luck catching us alone or breaching the defenses to get at us. The Chaos Champions, Ork Warlords, Skaven Assassins ect would be coming after us regardless because of our wizardry and pisition as Belegar's Spymaster.
chocolote12
A Penguin Flailing Against The Keyboard Of Life.
'Killy-ness' is our default mode of interaction for approximately half of everything we ever run into on the character level, and the half where we absolutely can't afford to mess up; if we're not murdering things, or getting ready to, we're doing year-long turns. We can use the peace we buy by surviving battles to get to do the rest of everything we want to, but we can't take a Wizard's Tower with us on an adventure, unless it's the one built by that one crazy guy that goes around stealing people's neat magical items and only lands once a few centuries or something, but I don't think we can spend favor on having the dwarves wrangle that for us, so my statement mostly stands.
Battle magic is fine, but it's got a coin-flip's chance of causing us to explode every time we try it, and it will never be safe to use.
We already are an indomitable tower of strength, except for the bit where we can't give nearly as good as we can get, so fighting in the thick of things just means we spend a while longer getting stabbed before we go down.
Battle magic is fine, but it's got a coin-flip's chance of causing us to explode every time we try it, and it will never be safe to use.
We can't have rune armor, but we have a +3 armor save from our spell, which is already plate armor, if I recall correctly, and the horse as a damage soak, and if we survive a round of combat we can heal back to our full three wounds four times a battle (and if they're not expecting to need to hack us to pieces we can get away with doing that even if we don't survive), and every time somebody touches us they get hit right back.
We already are an indomitable tower of strength, except for the bit where we can't give nearly as good as we can get, so fighting in the thick of things just means we spend a while longer getting stabbed before we go down.
Kragg knocked open the doors of Karag Lhune with a single swing, but nobody's showing up to take his hammer. How is anybody on the battlefield going to be able to notice the difference between something like that and something like what we'd get? Victims of both would die spectacularly, but I would not imagine informatively.
It has actually come up rather a lot.
- Location
- his hidden lair
Doesn't a 25 pt. Wizard tower just paint a giant target on our back?
As far as I understand the system, this will be one of the greatest loci of power in the world. Once news gets out, everyone will want it, and a lot of people won't ask nicely.
Expect visits from Necromancers, Vampires, Chaos Sorcerers, etc.
SuperSonicSound
Shadowmancer of the Shadow Cabal
They dont but they also dont need to pretty much all of the effects only work with melee weapons as they do things like increase weapon skill, give you more attacks increase your personal strength. Which in the game system only effects melee. Besides which youd need to enrune the bullets not the gun for that.
- Location
- The Surface Of A Hostile Planet
Personally, I'm looking at the 10-15 favor range for our sword.
We almost certainly are going to want to assassinate hardened targets in the future, so knowing that when we strike they won't laugh off our attack would be quite nice.
Beyond that, more defenses are always good. We can't get armour, since that'll interfere with our casting. But you know what won't? Defense oriented weapon enchantments, which absolutely do exist.
More than 15 favours really is getting pretty absurd, but I fully expect us to get a ton of use from our weapon for basically the entire rest of our career.
Putting the same level of effort into it as our belt would get us a similar result - which is to say, something that's likely to remain unsurpassed for the rest of our life - and it leaves plenty of favor available to use on other things, such as our tower and training.
We almost certainly are going to want to assassinate hardened targets in the future, so knowing that when we strike they won't laugh off our attack would be quite nice.
Beyond that, more defenses are always good. We can't get armour, since that'll interfere with our casting. But you know what won't? Defense oriented weapon enchantments, which absolutely do exist.
More than 15 favours really is getting pretty absurd, but I fully expect us to get a ton of use from our weapon for basically the entire rest of our career.
Putting the same level of effort into it as our belt would get us a similar result - which is to say, something that's likely to remain unsurpassed for the rest of our life - and it leaves plenty of favor available to use on other things, such as our tower and training.
Alectai
Speaks Words of Wisdom... On occasion
Well, no, because the problem is that the very problem you're presenting here already demands a worst case scenario, and establishes that we either cannot or will not cede ground in a pinch.
Which is to say, we've been maneuvered into Death Ground and the only way out is through.
The correct solution to this is to have backup plans ready. A superior weapon at this point would be nice but also only helps us get into greater trouble, as it'll make us take greater risks because we think we can take it. I would rather make an investment into our position to ensure we have more pieces to maneuver to prevent us from getting into Death Ground in the first place--a top class tower will allow us to entice a great deal of subordinate Wizards to use as agents, which means we can lean on those interlocking specialties to create new options that hopefully let us avoid needing to walk into Death Ground in the first place.
When a plan goes sideways, the correct plan is to disengage and write it off as a bad one. Not hulk out and go full Conan the Barbarian. Our skillset is much better suited for cheesing it than it is taking the direct and shortest route out. And Mathilde is very good at disengaging.
For a ridiculous tier runeweapon to be our optimal choice, we're looking at a situation where she has a target that needs to die immediately, that can shrug off any harm less than a cannon ball, and that Mathilde is alone and has no capacity to flee after she's made her play. It doesn't need a direct rebuttal because the situation itself already requires a near Abelheim's Last Day series of disasters to exist in the first place.
I can support a 10-point Rune Weapon with ease, that would be very strong and serve all reasonable purposes. I might be talked around to a 15-pointer, but more than that is ridiculous unless we're getting a Magic Staff baked in, and that's outside the scope of what Runesmiths can really do, probably.
I'd rather spend a pile of favors to effectively turn the penthouse area and above into the tower, and fill it with the precision tools we need to do research.
Which is to say, we've been maneuvered into Death Ground and the only way out is through.
The correct solution to this is to have backup plans ready. A superior weapon at this point would be nice but also only helps us get into greater trouble, as it'll make us take greater risks because we think we can take it. I would rather make an investment into our position to ensure we have more pieces to maneuver to prevent us from getting into Death Ground in the first place--a top class tower will allow us to entice a great deal of subordinate Wizards to use as agents, which means we can lean on those interlocking specialties to create new options that hopefully let us avoid needing to walk into Death Ground in the first place.
When a plan goes sideways, the correct plan is to disengage and write it off as a bad one. Not hulk out and go full Conan the Barbarian. Our skillset is much better suited for cheesing it than it is taking the direct and shortest route out. And Mathilde is very good at disengaging.
For a ridiculous tier runeweapon to be our optimal choice, we're looking at a situation where she has a target that needs to die immediately, that can shrug off any harm less than a cannon ball, and that Mathilde is alone and has no capacity to flee after she's made her play. It doesn't need a direct rebuttal because the situation itself already requires a near Abelheim's Last Day series of disasters to exist in the first place.
I can support a 10-point Rune Weapon with ease, that would be very strong and serve all reasonable purposes. I might be talked around to a 15-pointer, but more than that is ridiculous unless we're getting a Magic Staff baked in, and that's outside the scope of what Runesmiths can really do, probably.
I'd rather spend a pile of favors to effectively turn the penthouse area and above into the tower, and fill it with the precision tools we need to do research.
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- Location
- yorkshire
I think us having the 20 point runic sword could help in our assassination missions
Mathilde is not actually that fast though? We almost got run down by freaking goblins once. If they'd been anything more killy than random goblins we'd have been in deep shit. Ending up on killing ground is much easier that you'd think, specially when most of the things that count as such for our purposes are exactly the sort to stop us from just running away.
To be clear, I don't advocate for some 20+ point monstrosity, but I am in favor of some kind of greatsword, and this is why.
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Alectai
Speaks Words of Wisdom... On occasion
She almost got run down by bloodhound goblins on berserker drugs, and she still ultimately got away before they could do serious harm to her. I would argue this was very much a sign of how good Mathilde's disengage game is.
- Location
- Germany
Maybe, but we could get a 10 point sword, a 10 point tower and use the rest of the points for training or our library. That way we would have several powerful things, but nothing of legendary power.
- Location
- yorkshire
I think everyone has said there piece and its time to step away from this topic as much as I like it
Now imagine when we get run down by something that is a berzerkering bloodhound, but has a body worth a damn, like a high tier undead or a monstrous unit, rather than some piddly goblins that happened to be on drugs.
SuperSonicSound
Shadowmancer of the Shadow Cabal
We have obscenes amounts of gold to get tools from the dwarves to assist with our research, gold on the other hand can never be spent on runic items, just that alone means we shouldnt be spending favour on our lab unless its explicitly for runic enhancements and outside of the valya rune we already have i cant see anything else that would help.
Also frankly Alectai i think you drastically underestimating the importance if being able to slaughter your way out of a scrum and seriously over estimating Mathildes ability to disengage.
Also frankly Alectai i think you drastically underestimating the importance if being able to slaughter your way out of a scrum and seriously over estimating Mathildes ability to disengage.
Kornet
Quite possibly a sloth abomination
- Location
- Mother Russia
Runefangs at 10 are based on BoneyMs rule of a thumb: 1 favour equals to about 10 points of wargear. Runefangs are 100 point wargear.
- Location
- The Surface Of A Hostile Planet
The way I see it, a 10 point weapon is basically something that follows regular tabletop weapon rules, as it's something that (with difficulty and effort) can be made by "merely" talented runesmiths.
By spending over 10 points, we get the personal attention of a living legend like Kragg, with his innate ability to say "screw the rules" - and as we saw with the belt, that can lead to some amazing things.
So as I see it, if we're spending 10 favors anyway, spending the extra 2 or 3 or 5 to get something truly unique and irreplaceable is well worth it... but it very rapidly reaches diminishing returns, since, well, many of your points are valid. We may well go weeks at a time without drawing our sword.
It's a question of opportunity cost - the difference between a 10 and 12 favor weapon is much larger than the difference between a 15 and 17 favor weapon.