To Boldly Go... (a Starfleet quest)

Forgothrax · Mar 2, 2018

Derpmind said:
However giving +10% evasion to explorers has over giving it to escorts in the combat engine I don't really know, but Lone Ranger relies the least on fleet composition while Combined Fleet relies on it the most, leaving Swarm somewhere in the middle.

10% Evasion is enormous. It basically means 1/10 shots miss. When you give it to escorts that have baseline 20-24% Evasion already... Watch a Comet evade a third of all the fire coming it's way.

For Explorers... A lot of them will have 5% Evasion at most and the Amby, iirc, has 0. Even with their S scores helping with that 10% is very nice indeed.

LR basically does nothing for combat. +1L is pretty mediocre since it requires being outnumbered. +5% is also meh.

+4% shield pen is pretty amazing too.

lbmaian · Mar 2, 2018

I bit the bullet and am (hopefully temporarily) taking over @Nix's mapping even though I'm a complete amateur*.

Added:

Labeled Orion major world Broken Chains @ -3b
Add Caldonian major world Lomay at -5B (just spinward of Caldonia) with a shipyard (Durint Orbital Docks) (since first shipyard report on them)
Add Caldonian minor world Ichitha at -4B (just coreward of Caldonia) with a minor shipyard (since at latest 2320.Q1) and mining colony (since at earliest 2314.Q2 + 1yr?)
Add Risan minor world Third Risa @ -6b (just spinward of Risa, below galactic plane) with a minor shipyard (since at latest 2320.Q3, colony existed at latest 2316.Q4)
Add Risan research colony Fourth Risa @ -6c (just tailward of Risa, below galactic plane) (since 2322.Q1 + 1yr?)
Add Tauni major world Noas @ 4C (just rimward of Kelowna) with a minor shipyard (since first shipyard report on them) and outpost
Add Laian minor world Bidva @ 3C (just core-tailward of Laian) with shipyard (since first shipyard report on them)
Add Laian minor world Lattad @ 2C (just spinward of Laian, above galactic plane) with shipyard (since first shipyard report on them)

Changed:

Partitioned the removed Themis Border Zone @ [-4f to -4c] to extensions to the Cardassian Border Zone, Apinae Sector, Alukk Sector, and Ferasa sector
- Note: Gamma Canidae and its starbase ends up in Apinae Sector
Slightly extend Tauni fuzzy borders to include Noas
Slightly extend Laio fuzzy borders to include Lattad and Bidva

Shipyard updates:

Add repair symbol to legend
Revise definition of major shipyard to be: have either >=2.5mt berth or >=5mt total tonnage or >=5 berths
Revise definition of non-minor (and not necessarily major) shipyard to be: have either a >1mt berth or >1mt total tonnage
Add Starfleet auxiliary major shipyard (Unity) to Matixx (Betazed moon) @ 1B (since 2322.Q2)
Add Starfleet pin to Starfleet auxiliary shipyard at Amarkia (Lasieth Craft Yards) @ -2d
Add Starfleet pin to Starfleet auxiliary shipyard at Ferasa (MEOW) @ -4b
Add Starfleet repair yard to Collie @ 1f (since 2315.Q4)
Add Starfleet repair yard to Tellar @ -2a (since 2315.Q4)
Upgrade Starfleet auxiliary shipyard (Lasieth Craft Yards) at Amarkia @ -2d to major shipyard since it has >=5 berths and >=5mt total tonnage (since 2318.Q2)
Upgrade Human shipyard (Luna Orbital) at Earth's Moon @ 0a to major shipyard since it has >=2.5mt berths (and >5mt total tonnage anyway) (since 2316.Q3)
Add Vulcan minor shipyard (Colonial Yard?) to 82 Eridani @ -1B (since at latest 2316.Q1)
Add Vulcan shipyard (Hanath-Cho) to Atatan @ -1B (since 2315.Q1)
Upgrade Amarki shipyard (Akoun Lariel) at Tales Har @ -1c to non-minor shipyard since it has >1mt total tonnage (since 2319.Q1)
Add Caitian auxiliary shipyard (S'Harrhr) to Ferasa @ -4b (since 2315.Q1)
Add Rigellian shipyard (Danad Nashad) to Laudon @ 3a (since 2315.Q3)
Upgrade Apiata shipyard Hive of Alrizzine @ 0e to non-minor shipyard since it has >1mt total tonnage (since first shipyard report on them)
Upgrade Apiata shipyard Hive of Burrizz @ -1f to non-minor shipyard since it has >1mt total tonnage (since first shipyard report on them)
Add Indorian major shipyard (Orion Imperial Yards) near Indoria @ -3f (either spinward of Indoria or was towed to Indoria) (since 2322.Q1)
Add Indorian major repair yard at Indoria @ -3f (since 2323.Q1?)
Downgrade Indorian shipyard at Indoria @ -3f to non-minor non-major shipyard since it has 1mt < total tonnage < 5mt and has no 2.5mt+ berths
Add Orion shipyard (Colhane Gennet Yards) to Alukk @ -3c (since first shipyard report on them)
Upgrade Orion shipyard (Union Fleet Yards) at Alukk @ -3c to major shipyard since it has >=5 berths (since first shipyard report on them)
Add Gaeni shipyard (Colonial Yard) to Gaen VI @ 0C (since first shipyard report on them)
Add Gaeni shipyard (Colonial Yard) to Thunti II @ 0C (since first shipyard report on them)
Add STO shipyard (Larcasis Senate Yard) to Larcasis @ -5d (since first shipyard report on them)
Upgrade STO shipyard at Carnin Quel @ -5e to non-minor shipyard since it has >1mt total tonnage (since first shipyard report on them)
Upgrade STO shipyard at Fiiral @ -5e to major shipyard since it has >=2.5mt berths (since 2322.Q1)
Downgrade Honiani shipyard (Saiya Exultant Yard) at Becarra @ 6A to non-major shipyard since it has 1mt < total tonnage < 5mt and has no 2.5mt+ berths (since first shipyard report on them)
Downgrade Honiani shipyard (Forge of Wonders) at Ucuta @ 4a to non-major shipyard since it has 1mt < total tonnage < 5mt and has no 2.5mt+ berths (since first shipyard report on them)
Mark Honiani/Yan-Ros major shipyard (Soulforged Yards) at Vail @ 4b as complete (since 2319.Q1)
Add Honiani/Obar shipyard at Obar @ 6a (since at latest 2319.Q1)
Upgrade Ked Paddah shipyard at Ashira @ 2E to non-minor shipyard since it has >1mt total tonnage (since first shipyard report on them)
Add Ked Paddah repair yard at Paddah @ 3E (since first shipyard report on them)
Add Tauni minor shipyard (Shayanne) at Kelowna's moon Nia @ 4B (since first shipyard report on them)
Add Ashidi major shipyard at Kretas @ -6f (since at latest 2319.Q1 but probably existed at first contact)
- Note: They have two other major shipyards, but their locations are unknown
Downgrade Sydraxian shipyard (Ballad of Artisans) at Kar Akar @ 1d to non-major shipyard since it has 1mt < total tonnage < 5mt and has no 2.5mt+ berths (since first shipyard report on them)
Downgrade Sydraxian shipyard (Ballad of Valour) at Lox Matar @ 1d to non-major shipyard since it has 1mt < total tonnage < 5mt and has no 2.5mt+ berths (since first shipyard report on them)
Downgrade Sydraxian shipyard (Ballad of Labourers) at Nax Degar @ 1d to non-major shipyard since it has 1mt < total tonnage < 5mt and has no 2.5mt+ berths (since first shipyard report on them)

2323 map album

Added:

Barradus IV research colony site @ -2B (in Vulcan sector)
XK-821 mining "colony" @ -6b (in Ferasa sector, below galactic plane somewhat due to map space reasons)
Mortuary Expanse research colony site @ 3a (between Rigel sector and Vermillions)
Neath Nebula @ 1G/1H (between Breen and Romulan territory)
Outpost to Lapruzziz @ -1g (indicated to exist in 2322.Q4 AoTO update)
Outpost to Apruzza @ 1g (indicated to exist in 2321.Q3 GBZ update)

Harmony of Horizon ~~retcon~~ update after piercing initial HoH disinformation campaign:

Made territory about 3 times larger
Moved Horizon from 7C to 10C
Moved Haven from 5D to 10B
Moved Tahlan from 8a to 10a
Moved Starfoam from 6C to 8C
Moved Jafa from 8E to 5D and renamed to Japha (Tauni colony world that remained in HoH)
Moved Mist from 6B to 8B and noted it as Moy homeworld
Moved Sanctuary from 6D to 9D
Moved Iskut from 5E to 11A
Moved Tiriad from 8A to 11G and noted it as Lintrid homeworld
Moved the lone unnamed major world from 7B to 9F (random other location that doesn't conflict with prior AoTO reports)
Added Stickine to 12B and noted it as Tseskiya homeworld

Klingon-Romulan aftermath:

Adjusted Klingon-Romulan borders according to WTT
Changed hands from Romulans to Klingons:
- Vinum @ -4D - starbase was captured rather than destroyed by the Klingons
- Iberius @ -4D - removed destroyed shipyard (since wasn't listed in the WTT)
- Levoc III @ -4D - removed presumably destroyed outpost
- Alixros @ -4E - noted as a major Romulan colony, so added a major colony symbol; Klingons heavily fortified it after its capture, but Romulans cleared them before war ended
- Mothidum @ -4E - Romulan outposts destroyed, but were rebuilt before war ended, assumed handed over to Klingons
- The Latch @ -4F
- Aniak @ -4F - although research colony was destroyed, assume it was/will be rebuilt by Klingons
- Ocutis @ -4F - removed destroyed starbase, assumed now a minor colony
- Jarok's Beacon @ -4F - was "destroyed", assumed now a minor colony
- Old Red Eye @ -4F - still assuming it has its research colony, since wasn't mentioned as destroyed
Additional Romulan infrastructure changes:
- Removed destroyed shipyard at Terix II @ -3F
- Removed destroyed shipyard at Rator III @ -3D
- Upgraded Pompara minor shipyard to mid-sized shipyard @ -4E (2x1mt shipyard)
Added to Klingons per WTT report and subject races omake:
- Nausicaa, homeworld of Nausicaans @ -5B
- Novalla, major world of Orion diaspora @ -7D
- Mirak, homeworld of K'zinti @ -6A
- Phaedus, homeworld of Phaedans @ -7A
- Lethea, homeworld of Letheans @ -6D
- Mempa Prime, homeworld of Mempans, major shipyard @ -6G
- al'Hmat, homeworld of Al'Hmatti @ -6E
- H'atoria, homeworld of Selsseress, major shipyard @ -5C
- Payora, homeworld of Arin'Sen @ -8E
- Torath, minor world of Gorn @ -8C
- note: still unknown locations for: Ty'Gokor, Donatu V, Beta Lankal, Beta Thoridar, Raktuk, Korvat, Hitora, Maranga IV
Added to Romulans per WTT report:
- (Another) major shipyard to Romulus @ -2D
- (Another) shipyard to Remus @ -2D
- Shipyard to Pompara @ -4E
- note: still unknown locations for: Glintara, Scipine, Devoras, Xanitla, Chak, Hfihar, Virinat, Vussran, Khazara
Made Klingon and Romulan territory colors brighter to represent more well-known territory

Changed:

Expanded map two subsectors corewards (now includes 12<x> and 13<x> subsectors)
Split Romulus/Remus ala Earth/Mars
Expanded Breen fuzzy borders down a bit toward Neath Nebula
Rename Adazzi Gulf to Adrazzi Gulf (Deployment Vote updates consistently spell it as Adrazzi, but the AoTO updates and TF updates always spell it as Adrazzi, and when it was first mentioned, it was Adrazzi)
Legend states "Ashalla Pact" instead of "Card. Client"
Moved the Compass Rose over toward the Legend card to avoid overlapping with HoH territory

Also, a bonus:

Total territorial area sizes of each great power

United Federation of Planets*: ~6800 ly2
Ashalla Pact: ~6000 ly2 (rough estimate)
- Cardassian Union: ~3700 ly2
Harmony of Horizon: ~5000 ly2
Klingons: ~4000 ly2 (rough estimate)
Romulans: ~2500 ly2 (rough estimate)

Note that the Romulans lost ~500 ly2 of territory to the Klingons, so before the war, they were much more even in territorial area.

* including the enveloped Honiani, Laio, and Tauni territory, and excluding all other affiliate territory

Added:

Now-known borders, worlds, and infrastructure (starbases, shipyards, etc.) of the Interstellar Commonwealth (aka Padani)
- Defined borders that covers subsectors: 4e (top-right of GBZ) to barely 7c (one subsector spin/rimward of Felis space), and includes the Talarian Empire at 3d/3c
- 1 homeworld (Chara), now a minor world because "it got nuked to shit"
- 6 major worlds that have the capital is rotated between them
- 19 minor worlds
- 15 starbases, including one around each major world and the homeworld and 8 border ones
- 27 outposts, including one around each minor world (excluding the GBZ colony) and 7 border ones
- 2 deep space stations
- 6 major shipyards (total tonnage 2.5mt+), one around each major world
- 6 minor shipyards (total tonnage <2.5mt or can't build Pathfinders), each of which is around a named minor world
- Major trade routes in a hub-and-spoke model between the major worlds and homeworld, and to the Jorona of the Talarians, along with a minor trade/supply route to their GBZ colony
- A healthy dose of paranoia!
Falling Down BR colony site @ -6d (location confirmed in discord)
CA-113 SR colony site @ 1c (location confirmed in discord)
71 Apizza V SR colony site @ -1g
77 Azzadi IV-3 SR colony site @ -1f
19 Itztli BR colony site @ -1g
101 Arrazziz listening post site @ 0g
Coreward fuzzy borders/territory for Harmony of Horizon - this is a placeholder until we get more info on HoH major worlds and borders
Fuzzy borders/territory for Ashalla Pact
Cardassian major world Todamak @ -4j with starbase and shipyard (QM confirmation in discord)
Non-major shipyards totalling >=1mt and <2.5mt to Cardassia, Karadoc, Galundun, Trangot, and Balagot according to 2317.Q4 Cardassian shipyard intel update (Nix used to have a policy where only the largest shipyard was shown, but that hasn't seem to have been followed in his later updates)
Label for Gaeni minor colony world Agat (wasn't clear whether it was Agat or Idaran until QM confirmation in discord)

Changed:

Made all symbols except world ones about 1/3 smaller to make room in the dense ISC space
Downgraded Bajor's shipyard down from major status since its total tonnage <2.5mt
Talarian Empire colors to lighter shades of violet as an ISC client instead of the bright pink of neutrals
Minor border cleanup for Federation, Cardassian Union, Harmony of Horizon, Ked Paddah, Licori
Adjusted Ashidi fuzzy borders to be more centered on their homeworld Kretas
Some misc symbol cleanup

Technical changes:

As part of border cleanup, deleted duplicate nodes, reversed backward nodes that resulted in weird loops, smoothed all nodes
Technical: created own layers for infrastructure symbols, and mining/research symbols
Technical: reduce png dpi by ~15% to try to keep image file size < 4MB

Added:

H subsectors (tailward)
- Adjusted Klingon, Romulan, Breen tailward fuzzy borders
PLY-5000 BR colony site @ 7H
23 Levar SR colony site @ 3e
Sigma Cthon III BR colony site @ 3D/4D right on HBZ border, slightly adjusting HBZ border to make room for it
41 Arrazziz BR colony site @ 0g in the middle of the Badlands
Eye of Chaos nebula @ 7b (first mentioned in Q1)
OSA Starbase to Akaikan @ 4D (per discord conv)
Amarki Starbase to Leas Akaam @ -2d (supposed to have started construction in 2319.Q1 according to MWCD vote and finished by 2320.Q1, confirmed not handled by Starfleet per discord conv)
STO Starbase to Fiiral @ -5e that started construction in 2322.Q1 (was supposed to be in 2322.Q1 MWCD per discord conv, also confirmed not handled by Starfleet per discord conv)
STO Stocis outpost @ -4f (just above Sarcissa Belt, between Gandei and Rethelia, noted as found and fortified in 2320.Q4 AoTO)
Label for Interstellar Commonwealth (although a major power, we don't know of their major planets, which could have been used to quickly grasp which nation this is without a label)
Labels for Adazzi Gulf (note: was accidentally renamed by QM from Adrazzi) and the Straits of Themis

Changed:

Made Vermillions (Teutida III) @ 3b Federation affiliates
Made OSA (Muuyozoi) @ 4D Federation affiliates, including all their outlying colonies
Known Bajoran Diaspora colonies (Hajatar, Unbroken Faith) @ -4f made Federation affiliates
Pushed up Federation borders in KBZ up to Klingon borders, since that space was originally just a "neutral" zone around Caldonia (see 2304-2305 maps)
Returned Lora and Deva @ 2e to Sydraxian control, with supply lines to Moskar (happened in 2319.Q3)
Extended Sydraxian territory to encompass Lora and Deva and slightly adjusted the SBZ and GBZ borders with regards to the Sydraxians

Technical changes:

Added tiny fuzzy borders around the Bajoran Diaspora colonies (Hajatar, Unbroken Faith) @ -4f to help make them stand out
Made labels of nebula and other stellar features look "embedded" within their nebula, small caps, and faded somewhat into the background
Cleaned up Harmony of Horizon borders a bit
Reduced font size of name labels for outpost-only sites: Tipperary, Claystock, Celesipos
Made some name labels on the edge of Federation territory a bit clearer

Marked as complete:

Kappa Tau starbase @ 1C
3 Miele Amarki mining colony @ 1e (should've been marked done by 2321.Q4)
Kohl II mining colony @ -4a (should've been marked done by 2317.Q2!)
Ruby Eyes' Folly mining colony @ -8d (shared between Federation and Dawiar, shaded accordingly)
Dark Shoal mining colony @ -6e

Marked as construction in progress:

Ke'luur starbase @ 4B
Sael II mining colony @ -5e
Sigma Delphi mining colony @ 2C
Pure Intent Array research colony @ 2b
Ariya Minor research colony @ -3d

Added Sigma Delphi (20 (30) br/yr colony site) @ 2C
Added Fr'rba IV (15 (25) br/yr colony site) @ -4c
Added Morgana-1321 (+5(8) rp/yr colony site) @ 3f
Added Ur'razzi (minor power) @ -4f
Added Chrystovian Confederacy (minor power) and th'Eathor Nebula @ -8k (confirmed in Discord)
Made 26 Enio shared between Cardassians and Federation (ala Athos V between Romulans and Federation)
Made 21 Dorsata and 30 Dorsata colony sites more visible against the Cardassian yellow territory
Labeled Yrillian territory
Labeled Vermillion Connectivity's homeworld (Teutida III)
Made Gretaria colored as the "Other" magenta color to free up the green malachite color
Made Dawiar colored as their own green malachite color to represent the Dawiar moving away from Ashalla Pact and into the Gorn (which aren't on the map yet)
Added Federation territory around Ruby-Eyes' Folly since it now has its own sector - currently fuzzy borders since I don't know its boundaries (and it's probably mostly focused on the colony itself anyway)
- Once Ruby-Eye's Folly colony finishes construction next quarter, I'll change it so that it's shared with the Dawiar per the 2322.Q1 agreement.
Made supply lines darker and add more colonies to be cropped from the supply lines to improve contrast
Technical: For compatibility reasons, changed "sans-serif" font used in Unix's to the equivalent Arial font since I use Windows; also had to redo the Klingon occupation of Romulan space striped pattern because of this
Added Gorn territory
- Fuzzy territory extending to -9A since Gorn are diverting ships away from the center of that subsector
- Added homeworld Gornar with starbase and large shipyard @ -10B
- Added major world Ghidar with starbase and large shipyard @ -10A
- Added minor holy world Centotaph @ -9B
Darkened Gorn/Dawiar green a bit to try differentiating from Romulan green (apparently the closest name for the new color is "Fruit Salad")
Added Shanpurr territory @ 5g
- Added homeworld Shan with starbase and shipyard (three "sprawling orbital complexes containing a mixture of communal family habitats, agricultural orbitals, and space factories built around a large starbase like structure")
- Added major world New Home with outpost (one of the above orbital complex)
- Added "child" homeworld Naendia (home to Naendians) with outpost (one of the above orbital complex)
- Added "child" homeworld Billoniar (home to Esthesians and Billoniars) with outpost (one of the above orbital complex)
Added Breen (fuzzy) territory @ 3G,4G
Added Felis homeworld @ 8b
Split OSA (Muuyozoi) Wumei system into homeworld Ikeigenoi and major world Akaikan @ 4D (like Earth and Mars both in Sol system)
Labeled Yizgisi over homeworld Nigim for clarity @ -3c (technically, they have a government called "Azsi Popular Democratic Mandate" but that area is way too overcrowded)
Added Unbound Gaeni (fuzzy) territory around Deepport Station @ 11m
Labeled homeworld Trillius Prime @ -8c
Labeled Bolians around homeworld Bolarus @ 1F
Made Dylaarian labels clearer @ 4j,5i,4h

2322 map album

Link to wiki (which is barebones and links back to this post)

Link to Nix's maps up to 2321 and mapping notes

Link to latest source SVG

* Excluding MS Paint, the last graphics tool I used was GIMP half a decade ago, and Paint Shop Pro back when I was a kid. I'm learning Inkscape from the ground up.

chriswriter90 · Mar 2, 2018

I would not mind the GMs doing away with the Combat Cap and giving the Lone Ranger Tree a rebuild.

Glassware · Mar 2, 2018

rimwards is just gonna be a gosh-dang mess when those borders solidify, isn't it.

Hazard · Mar 2, 2018

Briefvoice said:
Here is what last year's Steering Committee had to say. Anywhere "Bonus roll passed/failed" I interpret to mean that we have listening posts which are being rolled for.

... Where's the actual reports?

And there's nowhere I can find on Starfleet Infrastructure about what resources the intelligence division has, nor anything about what BZs have Listening Posts, nor if those Listening Posts are the Improved variant. I can't find it Current Fleet Status post either, which appears to not have been maintained properly since game year 2215 at the latest, going by the list of 'Completed Federal Projects.'

Any googledocs/spreadsheets that could in theory be tracking this are also untraceable from the thread; they aren't linked in Current Fleet Status, not in the State of Play/Research Megapost, Starfleet Infrastructure & Resources nor in Starfleet Command Departments and Staff.

@OneirosTheWriter et al. This Quest's documentation is a mess, and more's the pity because if it weren't for the fact that what limited documentation there is is often unreliable (Research Megapost excepted) you'd have more players able to engage properly informed with this quest. I'm enjoying it because the Captain's Logs and TF reports are entertaining, but every time I want to try and engage with the quest's policy decisions I run into 'fuck you, trawl through the archives hoping to find the actual records you need.'

And there's a lot of information being tracked on unfindable google sheets. Which, you know, is a fair way to resolve the problem if it wasn't for the unfindable part.

fasquardon · Mar 2, 2018

The combat cap has been something of a failed mechanic. How long would it take to build up to the cap at this point?

One of the big issues that inclines me towards swarm doctrine is that right now we are in desperate need of hulls and escorts take less time to pump out and less time to go from the drawing board to new ships flying between stars. And we can make some excellent frigates now - both for combat and event response. So a doctrine that boosts escorts acts as a multiplier on spamming the things we need to spam anyway.

fasquardon

Goat · Mar 2, 2018

It would take many game years to change doctrines.

As for Frigate build time, between heavy industry and upcoming techs, apparently we will soon start running into the minimum build time for frigates at 6 quarters, in Sol at least.

Briefvoice · Mar 2, 2018

Hazard said:
... Where's the actual reports?

Generally in a post labeled, "Well they Try" in Q4 of every year.

SWB also keeps an updated General Intelligence post which is under Informational Bookmarks as "SWB's Intelligence Tracking Sheets".

And there's nowhere I can find on Starfleet Infrastructure about what resources the intelligence division has, nor anything about what BZs have Listening Posts, nor if those Listening Posts are the Improved variant.

That information is nowhere, correct.

Any googledocs/spreadsheets that could in theory be tracking this are also untraceable from the thread; they aren't linked in Current Fleet Status, not in the State of Play/Research Megapost, Starfleet Infrastructure & Resources nor in Starfleet Command Departments and Staff.

The above linked posts has a list of links at the end.

@OneirosTheWriter et al. This Quest's documentation is a mess, and more's the pity because if it weren't for the fact that what limited documentation there is is often unreliable (Research Megapost excepted) you'd have more players able to engage properly informed with this quest. I'm enjoying it because the Captain's Logs and TF reports are entertaining, but every time I want to try and engage with the quest's policy decisions I run into 'fuck you, trawl through the archives hoping to find the actual records you need.'

Most of this stuff is player-generated.

fasquardon said:
One of the big issues that inclines me towards swarm doctrine is that right now we are in desperate need of hulls and escorts take less time to pump out and less time to go from the drawing board to new ships flying between stars. And we can make some excellent frigates now - both for combat and event response. So a doctrine that boosts escorts acts as a multiplier on spamming the things we need to spam anyway.

And yet we still build way more Explorers, percentage of fleet-wise, than anyone else does. If you just looked at our ship output then if Starfleet doesn't qualify to use Lone Ranger, no one does.

I want to see Lone Ranger fixed, but on point of principle I'd rather take the mechanically inferior, thematically correct option. Honestly I'd take Lone Ranger over Swarm if the slide for Lone Ranger opened up to a huge middle finger and the words, "YOU GET NOTHING... NOTHING!" and the sldie for Swarm opened up to, "WIN".

fasquardon · Mar 2, 2018

Goat said:
It would take many game years to change doctrines.

Sure. But that doesn't change that Lone Ranger as it stands is (as I see it) basically obsolete because of games rule changes. So it's not cost effective to get rid of and it's not really effective.

Briefvoice said:
And yet we still build way more Explorers, percentage of fleet-wise, than anyone else does. If you just looked at our ship output then if Starfleet doesn't qualify to use Lone Ranger, no one does.

Personally, I'd like to see Lone Ranger support exploration and spreading hulls thin better. Exploration is the key reason why Starfleet favours massive battleships - because the unknown is dangerous and doing lots of exploration tends to result in hulls being spread thin because, well, the frontier keeps being pushed back.

It makes sense to me that the Federation should, up to the 2370s, not just have a habit of running around poking everything interesting with a stick, but also have a doctrine that emphasises and supports poking all the interesting things at once.

fasquardon

lbmaian · Mar 2, 2018

Hazard said:
... Where's the actual reports?

Intel reports are in the annual "Q4 Well, They Try" updates. This is admittedly not stated in the outdated Quest Mechanics post on the front page. There really should be an updated outline of the annual/quarterly phases of the game. Some of the problem is that quest mechanics are often updated, like the new Q1 Deployment Vote which started in 2320.

And there's nowhere I can find on Starfleet Infrastructure about what resources the intelligence division has, nor anything about what BZs have Listening Posts, nor if those Listening Posts are the Improved variant. I can't find it Current Fleet Status post either, which appears to not have been maintained properly since game year 2215 at the latest, going by the list of 'Completed Federal Projects.'

This is indeed missing, and AFAIK only tracked by player memory and whatever spreadsheets/docs the QMs use themselves.

Any googledocs/spreadsheets that could in theory be tracking this are also untraceable from the thread; they aren't linked in Current Fleet Status, not in the State of Play/Research Megapost, Starfleet Infrastructure & Resources nor in Starfleet Command Departments and Staff.

It would be helpful if the following two important posts were put at the top of the Information threadmarks:
Public Spreadsheet Index (although this may need a new page since Nix is no longer around... then again, maybe the links at the end of the following Intelligence Tracking Sheet suffices)
Intelligence Tracking Sheet (also includes known ship stats)

Hazard · Mar 2, 2018

Briefvoice said:
Most of this stuff is player-generated.

Which is, you know, fine.

But that it has to be tracked by players means that the GMs are not properly keeping all information in line for the players. And this is as I noted before a very rules heavy game with a large scope, which means a lot of values to keep track of.

I wouldn't mind nearly as much if the posts tracking those sheets aren't buried among several dozen others, not all of which are useful, nevermind useful in the immediate sense.

ClawClawBite · Mar 2, 2018

I could certainly see the Task Force mechanics being a reason to modify doctetine trees, as that mechanic post-dates the doctrines. However, the push to not have single ship task forces does not work well for lone ranger...

chriswriter90 · Mar 2, 2018

fasquardon said:
The combat cap has been something of a failed mechanic. How long would it take to build up to the cap at this point?

Without Doctrine Bonuses, ~~around 2328~~ passed it. With Bonuses, 2322.

Briefvoice said:
I want to see Lone Ranger fixed, but on point of principle I'd rather take the mechanically inferior, thematically correct option. Honestly I'd take Lone Ranger over Swarm if the slide for Lone Ranger opened up to a huge middle finger and the words, "YOU GET NOTHING... NOTHING!" and the sldie for Swarm opened up to, "WIN".

Same here.

lbmaian · Mar 2, 2018

chriswriter90 said:
Without Doctrine Bonuses, ~~around 2328~~ passed it. With Bonuses, 2322.

?? What numbers are you looking at?

Our combat cap is 576 right now. When Honiani+Obar+Yan-Ros join, and if threat level remains the same, that'll jump to 630. We also have 15 points worth of militarization we could use before militarization = threat level, so the combat cap could be bumped up to a maximum of 780.

Right now 2322.Q1, we have 402 total combat (including refits & repairs), and around ~295 including doctrine discounts (approximate because I'm not going to bother counting # of border zone ships). Using BV's projected build plan, we'll be at 630 total combat by 2328, and ~650 including doctrine discounts in 2330 (large jump of ~60 combat in the single quarter of 2330.Q2). The build spreadsheet doesn't even contain enough builds to get up to the 780 doctrine-discounted maximum.

That's far enough into the future that a lot can change, from ship loss to new doctrines (like T4 reveals) to new members to changed threat level.

chriswriter90 · Mar 2, 2018

lbmaian said:
?? What numbers are you looking at?

Front Page for the Cap (310), This Spreadsheet for the Fleet Combat.

lbmaian · Mar 2, 2018

chriswriter90 said:
Front Page for the Cap (310), This Spreadsheet for the Fleet Combat.

*sigh* Yeah this is what Hazard was talking about with the front page being out of date.

The most recent official combat caps are in the snakepits. But you also have to take into account changes to the combat cap after the last snakepit from new members (none since last snakepit) or threat level (+1 since last snakepit). The last snakepit lists combat cap as 560. +1 threat level since then means combat cap is now: (150+17*10)*(1+16*0.05) = 576.

Also, the combat total in Briefvoice's spreadsheet is a bit off because it's not including the pre-refit stats of any ship currently undergoing refit. They're supposed to be included. What he has is more of a "deployable combat total", if ships under repair were also excluded along with ships under refit.

I'm keeping track of fleet totals in separate spreadsheet that I'm still in the process of building.

random_npc · Mar 2, 2018

honestly, I think the combat cap did its job. It gives us a mechanical reason to avoid high C ships back when they were the best thing to build for the combat engine. It's still useful in that it keeps us "honest" long-term but frankly it's mostly a hard mechanic justification for what's mostly a soft mechanic. It's more a signpost than something we have to deal with. Which is an issue with lone ranger because it means the benefit of having more C to play with are kind of mitigated if it's not a cap that comes up much.

charysa · Mar 2, 2018

Briefvoice said:
Request Mining Colony Sael II, 7pp 20 (35) sr/year, 4 turns

Request Mining Colony Sigma Delphi, 7pp 20 (30) br/yr, 4 turns

Request Research Colony Pure Intent Array, 6pp, 5rp (8) rp/yr, 4 turns

Request Research Colony Ariya Minor, 6pp, 5rp (8) rp/yr, 4 turns

Request new Starbase I [Horizon Border Zone] 20pp

Depending on where the Starbase is placed, might want to drop a colony. I think only starbases on major worlds don't take up a Engineering Team, and none of the major homeworlds in the HBZ are members yet.

AKuz · Mar 3, 2018

I'm honestly wondering if a Wiki is the best way to go here.

Between users putting the information in and us QMs checking that and adding our own, it would be a pretty easy way to track a lot of this information for both players and QMs

Shard · Mar 3, 2018

Lone Ranger should support small, very powerful ships.

As it is the Harmony has Fleet Tenders and a swarm Doctrine that has them have better ships than us. >.>

chriswriter90 · Mar 3, 2018

The Eternal Empire supposedly had "Advanced Swarm." I wouldn't mind seeing what Advanced Lone Ranger entails.

Goat · Mar 3, 2018

Their (new) fleet tenders are 5 mt and need (from memory) 8 corvettes to be assigned to be fully capable.

They have three berths capable of building these behemoths and all are busy with what is probably a 6+ year build.

Between the probable cost and time investment, it would be disappointing if they weren't superior to anything we are currently building.

Jrin · Mar 3, 2018

Considering where Vermillion Connectivity's homeworld, are we really in a hurry to get them since the ISC have Talarian Empire lock down and watching the space with our border?
We could take our time digesting them once we have border access to unknown space secured.
Would like an equal focus on the Rimward areas to increase our space and deal with Lecarre activities before they damage our influence with Trill or Ittick-ka.

MTB · Mar 3, 2018

Could someone explain to me why combat doctrines aren't part of a toolbox the commander in place chooses from?

chriswriter90 · Mar 3, 2018

MTB said:
Could someone explain to me why combat doctrines aren't part of a toolbox the commander in place chooses from?

They're supposed to be mutually exclusive so we didn't bother researching any but our chosen Offensive and Defensive doctrines.

Even if we could switch out (and that's not likely) and use them as a sink for our near-bottomless supply of RP, they would take up Tech Teams who would be far more valuable elsewhere.

TLDR: The answer is no.

To Boldly Go... (a Starfleet quest)

Not Going Gently

a thirsty squirrel

a thirsty squirrel

Mad Engineering!

a thirsty squirrel

a thirsty squirrel

Been Better

One and Many