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To Boldly Go... (a Starfleet quest)

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To Boldly Go... (a Starfleet quest) Starfleet Ship Design Bureau, Refit ("To Boldly Go...")
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Do we have an intel on the uncommon borders of the Klingon and Romulan empires? because as weak as they seem to be now, if they have other neighbors as those might decide that today is their time...

Perhaps we should create some task force for that, should ships be available?
 
Alastor Mobius Toth said:
"It is year 1917 on Romulus, and everything's on fire."

"It is year 1929 on Quo'Nos, and even machines are starving."

"Meanwhile, in a Federation far, far away, it is Episode One and everything is proceeding exactly as we've foreseen it."
"Darth Horizon: Yes, my master."

Like wow, that was situation is a complete and utter clusterfuck. I'd make some professional armchair strategy analysis for it, but I feel like we've reached the point where it will be decided on the backs of capable officers and pure luck.
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You know, at this point, I think it is safe to say that the backs of both the Klingon and Romulan Empires have been broken by this war. The question now is what to do with the two powers upon the precipice of civil war? Shall we ride upon the chaos to unite the Alpha quadrant under the banner of the United Federation of Planets, or shall we save the two powers from the doom they brought upon themselves?
 
ThoughtMaster said:
You know, at this point, I think it is safe to say that the backs of both the Klingon and Romulan Empires have been broken by this war. The question now is what to do with the two powers upon the precipice of civil war? Shall we ride upon the chaos to unite the Alpha quadrant under the banner of the United Federation of Planets, or shall we save the two powers from the doom they brought upon themselves?
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We don't have the resources to absorb them while dealing with the Cardassian and the Horizon. We're going to need to prop then up.
 
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[X][SHIP1NAME] USS Ambassador
[X][SHIP1CREW] Explorer Corps

[X][SHIP2NAME] USS Enterprise
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TEAM RED!

If I were the Romulan commanding the position in Mothidum I would be getting very nervous right now. THe Klingons might not have the strength to batter though Neried to Romulus, but an encircling attack from their two advances could cut Mothidum, and a large portion of the remaining Romulan fleet off. So isolated they would be very vulnrable to being defeated in detail by massively superior Klingon opposition.


Considering the massive damage theis conflict has caused, I think it will ensure mutual Klingon-Romulan emnity for generations. In realpolitik terms this is good for us, since we probably don't have to worry about a Romulan-Klingon team up against.
 
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[X][SHIP1NAME] USS Ambassador
[X][SHIP1CREW] Explorer Corps

[X][SHIP2NAME] USS Enterprise
[X][SHIP2CREW] Explorer Corps
 
Random Member said:
"Hey, we've decided to integrate both the Romulans and the Klingons!"
Development: *incoherent screaming*
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Why would they be screaming? Honestly, their space is already pretty well developed (though said development has been damaged severely by the conflict.) to the point that such would be the closest to ideal form of expansion for the development faction. It may be a lot of territory, but it has had half of the work filling in the land done for us.
 
If the Licori were as strong as they were a decade ago, this would have been an excellent time for them to carve off a piece of Romulan space and ask what the Romulans are going to do about it.

Like the Gorn could easily do with the Klingons right now.
 
Weird idea.

It sort of looks like the Horizon are restructuring their diplo game to copy/integrate the Fed approach, or at least a Fedlike one. I wonder if we can use this as an opportunity to diplo the Horizon indirectly, by trying to feed them poison-pill associates, ie. seed possible affiliates with Federation ideas like political participation, anti-corruption and accountability, then keep up enough diplopressure to force them to make concessions that make them more us-like in their affiliation mechanisms. Basically play the century-long game.

Thoughts?
 
FeepingCreature said:
Weird idea.

It sort of looks like the Horizon are restructuring their diplo game to copy/integrate the Fed approach, or at least a Fedlike one. I wonder if we can use this as an opportunity to diplo the Horizon indirectly, by trying to feed them poison-pill associates, ie. seed possible affiliates with Federation ideas like political participation, anti-corruption and accountability, then keep up enough diplopressure to force them to make concessions that make them more us-like in their affiliation mechanisms. Basically play the century-long game.

Thoughts?
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Just to make sure I've got this right you're suggesting that by messing with who they're trying to diplomance, we turn them into the Federation proper?
 
[X][SHIP1NAME] USS Ambassador
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AKuz said:
Romulan Status: IT'S FEBRUARY 1917 RUSSIA AND EVERYTHING IS ON FIRE

Klingon Status: IT'S NOVEMBER 1919 GERMANY AND EVEN THE MACHINES ARE STARVING
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The real winners appear to be the Sotaw. Those miners sat out the war instead of joining the Romulans like I predicted and now they're in the perfect spot to take advantage of both Empires' vulnerability and desperation.

MonkeyTypewriter said:
Peace Conference
​
Romulan Senator: Give us back our territory!

Klingon "Diplomat": No! We gained it in honorable battle!

Romulan: :mad:

Klingon: :mad:

Sulu: How about a compromise.

Romulan: ... go ahead.

Sulu: The Klingon's return the captured Romulan territory.

Klingon: And what do we get in return?

Sulu: We cede you the Enio Subsector in the Expanse.

Klingon: ...The Enio subsector?

Sulu: Yes, we'll leave all the infrastructure in place, even give you a bit of help setting it up.

Romulan: ...This seems odd.

Klingon: isn't that a freefire zone between you and the cowardly Cardassians?

Sulu: I've even heard they're planning an attack ;)

Romulan: :facepalm:

Later:

Cardassian: Minions! Er, I mean, Valued allies! Today we begin our offensive in Enio, to drive the enemy back and claim our glorious destiny! This time we cannot fail!

Ashalla Pact: Huzzah!

Cardassian: Onwards to... wait, why do I heard chanting?

Klingons: Glory! Honor! Glory! Honor! Glory! Honor! Glory! Honor!

Ashalla Pact: :o:o

Federation: :lol

Harmony: *Furious Notetaking*
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Hilarious, but I don't think even Early TNG GloryHonorGloryHonor Klingons would fall for that.

Forgothrax said:
So the Pact is using the Goshawnar to keep the pressure on us, while the Cardassians prepare for an assault on Enio. We're going to need to probably call up some anti-raider member ships to deal with the Goshwanar and add some additional hulls to help us deal with the Cardassian offensive.
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We were planing to give up Enio anyway.

anon_user said:
Re: Imelak expansion and biotechnology
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Those guys sound fucking scary!

Briefvoice said:
So why did we vote for a diplomatic posture report on the ISC for a second year in a row instead of stats for their cruisers?
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Don't blame me! I voted for the ship report! :mad: :rage:
 
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FeepingCreature said:
Weird idea.

It sort of looks like the Horizon are restructuring their diplo game to copy/integrate the Fed approach, or at least a Fedlike one. I wonder if we can use this as an opportunity to diplo the Horizon indirectly, by trying to feed them poison-pill associates, ie. seed possible affiliates with Federation ideas like political participation, anti-corruption and accountability, then keep up enough diplopressure to force them to make concessions that make them more us-like in their affiliation mechanisms. Basically play the century-long game.

Thoughts?
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Horizon is actually a democracy so far as we can tell, with accountability and anti-corruption and a high level of political participation. There's so much we don't understand about them that this kind of ideological engineering is hard to work at.
 
Thebigpieman said:
Just to make sure I've got this right you're suggesting that by messing with who they're trying to diplomance, we turn them into the Federation proper?
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Exactly! After all, this is not an Empire quest and we are not an Empire. We aren't severely lacking for resources relative to area, we are pretty secure, we don't want to exploit them - quite the opposite, our Affiliation game is in good part to avoid them from being exploited.
If we can absorb them, we can limit the Horizon's expansion and create a new frontier. But if we can force the Horizon to compete with our unique qualities, as it looks we are doing, we have a chance to spread our values.

The Federation is not an area of space, it's a principle of coexistence.

edit: Phone so I can't quote properly. If the HoH is like us, shouldn't we be trying to diplo/intrigue them instead?
 
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Glassware said:
Horizon is actually a democracy so far as we can tell, with accountability and anti-corruption and a high level of political participation. There's so much we don't understand about them that this kind of ideological engineering is hard to work at.
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Except for the part where they are deep in the diplomatic uncanny valley because they are diplomatic, but not like us. (Social zombies, more or less.)
Honestly, as far as I can tell the Harmony is running what I like to think of as a 'Kaleidoscope Democracy'. There's lots of little, flashy moving parts and the pattern changes quickly and if we could just figure out where the [REDACTED] mirrors are we could make some actual progress understanding them.
 
Radical idea: what if, and I mean just what if - Horizon isn't actually evil, but our experience as the only sane, non-asshole polity in near space have just made us crazy paranoid?

No SV, you are the crazy lunatic hiding in mountains, ranting how Horizon the government is planning to take all your guns!

Cardassians have already won, for we became them.
 
nocarename said:
Except for the part where they are deep in the diplomatic uncanny valley because they are diplomatic, but not like us. (Social zombies, more or less.)
Honestly, as far as I can tell the Harmony is running what I like to think of as a 'Kaleidoscope Democracy'. There's lots of little, flashy moving parts and the pattern changes quickly and if we could just figure out where the [REDACTED] mirrors are we could make some actual progress understanding them.
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Somewhere earlier in the thread there's some stuff about how the Romulans and/or Cardassians think that the Federation and its ideals were originally a big political lie to pacify the plebeians, but that over time the new generations of those in power happened to genuinely believe these ideals. They can't believe that the Federation isn't ruled by lying overlords hiding in the shadows, (like all real civilizations,) so they think we must have become the mask. It'd be funny if something similar actually did happen to the Harmony of Horizon.
 
Alastor Mobius Toth said:
Radical idea: what if, and I mean just what if - Horizon isn't actually evil, but our experience as the only sane, non-asshole polity in near space have just made us crazy paranoid?

No SV, you are the crazy lunatic hiding in mountains, ranting how Horizon the government is planning to take all your guns!

Cardassians have already won, for we became them.
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Their habit of stashing fail-deadly ammo dumps in people's moons and not leaving behind any sort of warning speaks against that.

As does being the occupation side of a liberation war.
 
Alastor Mobius Toth said:
Radical idea: what if, and I mean just what if - Horizon isn't actually evil, but our experience as the only sane, non-asshole polity in near space have just made us crazy paranoid?

No SV, you are the crazy lunatic hiding in mountains, ranting how Horizon the government is planning to take all your guns!

Cardassians have already won, for we became them.
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Derpmind said:
Somewhere earlier in the thread there's some stuff about how the Romulans and/or Cardassians think that the Federation and its ideals were originally a big political lie to pacify the plebeians, but that over time the new generations of those in power happened to genuinely believe these ideals. They can't believe that the Federation isn't ruled by lying overlords hiding in the shadows, (like all real civilizations,) so they think we must have become the mask. It'd be funny if something similar actually did happen to the Harmony of Horizon.
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Hmm, whatever happened to the ISC possibly digging up some old info about the Horizon being some old enemy of theirs?
 
This was mostly written in jest, but you gotta admit that the fact we haven't actually found any hard evidence kinda makes one wonder if it really is some super seekrit master plan, or just plain "Horizon dun fucked up and is trying to spin the story away" ordinary space politics.
 
Briefvoice said:
If the Licori were as strong as they were a decade ago, this would have been an excellent time for them to carve off a piece of Romulan space and ask what the Romulans are going to do about it.

Like the Gorn could easily do with the Klingons right now.
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We should probably diplo-push the Breen, I don't want them deciding that nuking Romulus is a good way to repay decades of Romulan provocation.
 
Updating my earlier totals of Starfleet Intel's number crunching:

Summary Loss Totals of 6 years of war:

2315
Approximate Romulan losses:
5 Birds of Prey
1 Science Ship
3 D7 Cruisers

3 Civilian Ships
5 Cargo Ships
2 Freighters
1 Engineering Ship

At least 1 Heavy Warbird has been significantly damaged.

Notably, a new Romulan Escort design is reportedly under construction, designed to replace the aging Birds of Prey, which are proving too SR-intensive to produce in the required numbers.

Approximate Klingon losses:
8 Birds of Prey Mk1
4 Birds of Prey Mk2
4 K'tinga

5 Civilian Ships
6 Cargo Ships
1 Troop Transport
1 Research Cruiser

2316
Romulan Losses
1 Devoras
1 Daljerra
8 Bird of Prey
1 D7 Cruiser

5 Cargo Ships
3 Freighters
2 Engineering

Klingon Losses
4 K'tinga
10 Bird of Prey
5 Bird of Prey II

2 Cargo Ships
2 Freighters
1 Engineering

2317
Romulan Losses
1 Starbase
3 Outposts

1 Daljerra
7 Bird of Prey
2 D7 Cruiser

6 Cargo Ships
3 Freighters
1 Engineering
1 Prospecting

Klingon Losses
2 Outposts

5 K'tinga
9 Bird of Prey
7 Bird of Prey II

9 Cargo Ships
6 Freighters
2 Engineering
1 Prospector
1 Troop Transport

2318
Romulan Losses
1 Outpost

2 Devoras
2 Daljerra
8 Bird of Prey
2 D7 Cruiser

11 Cargo Ships
3 Freighters
1 Engineering
1 Super-Freighter

Klingon Losses
2 Outposts

1 Tar'chak
8 K'tinga
8 Bird of Prey
9 Bird of Prey II

12 Cargo Ships
4 Freighters
2 Engineering
1 Colony Ship
1 Troop Transport

2319
Romulan Losses
1 Outpost

1 Devoras
3 Daljerra
2 Aehallh
6 Bird of Prey
1 D7 Cruiser

12 Cargo Ships
6 Civilian Ships
6 Freighters
1 Engineering

Klingon Losses
1 Outposts

1 Tar'chak
9 K'tinga
7 Bird of Prey
7 Bird of Prey II

16 Cargo Ships
7 Freighters
1 Engineering
1 Super-Freighter

2320
Romulan Losses
3 Starbase
7 Outpost

2 Devoras
3 Khellian
4 Daljerra
6 Aehallh
6 Bird of Prey
1 Science Ship

17 Cargo Ships
12 Civilian Ships
8 Freighters
3 Engineering
1 Passenger
2 Colony Ship


Klingon Losses
1 Outposts

1 Tar'chak
14 K'tinga
18 Bird of Prey
17 Bird of Prey II

24 Cargo Ships
9 Civilian Ships
9 Freighters
2 Engineering
1 Super-Freighter
2 Passenger

In summary:

Romulan
Structures (16)
Starbases : 4
Outposts : 12

Capitals (9)
Devoras: 6
Khellian : 3

Cruisers (20)
D7 Cruisers : 9
Daljerra : 11

Frigates (50)
Bird Of Prey : 40
Science Ship : 2
Aehallh : 8

Auxiliary (117)
Civilian Ships : 21
Cargo Ships: 56
Freighters : 26
Super-Freighter : 1
Engineering Ships : 9
Prospecting Ships : 1
Passenger : 1
Colony Ships : 2

Klingon
Structures (6)
Outposts : 6

Capitals (3)
Tar'chak : 3

Cruisers (44)
K'Tinga: 44

Frigates (109)
Bird of Prey Mk 1 : 60
Bird of Prey Mk 2 : 49

Auxiliary (123)
Civilian Ships : 14
Cargo Ships : 63
Freighters : 28
Super Freighters : 2
Troop Transports : 3
Research Cruiser : 1
Engineering Ships : 8
Prospector Ships : 1
Passenger : 2
Colony Ships : 1

Total of:
22 Defensive Hard-points (Starbase/Outpost)
13 Capital Ships
64 Cruisers
159 Frigates
240 Auxiliary Ships
 
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